Hello everyone...I am so hoping that someone could shed some new light on my dilemma.

I have a 13ft Scamp Deluxe with the oak interior, full front bath/shower, roof air, TV/minidisc stereo/4 speakers, refrigerator, furnace, hot water heater, microwave, stove, and fully lined roof wrap-around cabinets. My loaded wet weight is 2480lbs. That's pretty heavy for this size trailer.

My problem is the immense difficulty this trailer poses to tow. I have towed this trailer with 4 different vehicles over the years, and regardless of horsepower or torque, the difficulty towing this trailer feels the SAME. I first purchased it in 1997 and towed it from Minnesota to Louisiana with the SCCA race version of a Dodge Neon 5spd. It towed well, but couldn't really maintain 65mph easily. I attributed that to it being a 4 cylinder, and didn't really worry about it. But, I've also towed it with a turbo VW Beetle, which did better, as it is a big fat car and breaks the wind better. I've towed it with a 315 horsepower 6spd RWD Trans Am as well...and it felt just as difficult to tow as with the Neon!!! The vehicle I'm currently towing it with is a 6 cylinder Dodge Caravan, which does fine on staight roads with no wind. The second you get the slightest bit of headwind or the smallest of hills (I mean the kind of hills you don't even SEE but for some reason you slow down) I usually have to drop it into 2nd gear and creep along at 35-40mph. Any bit of wind on top of that is excruciating. It just feels like I can't go. The van is highly modified for towing as well, including ram air cold air induuction, 2.5" dual exhaust with no catalytic converter, lightweight rims/tires, timing advanced, larger throttle body, air shocks, new wheel bearings, new struts/springs, class 3 hitch, external extra cooling fans, giant transmission cooler, etc...as a matter of fact, I evacuated from Hurricane Katrina in this van pulling the Scamp, and ended up out west in Arizona...where my engine blew up, and my transmission was rebuilt twice...until I had to purchase a NEW transmission just to get home. But, my point here is that the trailer has been pulled by 4 different cars...some less capable, some WAY over qualified for the job...and it still feels like you are pulling 4 of these trailers at once. I had a friend once pull the trailer about 4 miles for me with an F-250 truck and he commented that the trailer felt like a 30ft 80's Coachmen that he towed at one time. It doesn't matter how much torque I have in a tow vehicle...this thing just feels like there is another car attached to the rear pulling it the opposite way. Some hills had me pulling up in 1st gear at 15mph. This is a tiny trailer to cause such a strain. There is no reason for this; it makes no sense.

When I evacuated from Katrina, my first stop was in Arkansas. I had my van and trailer weighed there at the time. My Scamp weighs 2480lbs fully loaded. This isn't a lot of weight, but its alot for this size trailer. But, its not enough to be causing the towing difficulty I'm experiencing. I've towed 3500lb cars and large U-haul box trailers and can cruise at 70-75mph easily in ANY of my previously listed vehicles. My trailer, according to Scamp, should weigh about 1500-1600lbs dry. No way is my trailer that light. But, even so...the weight doesn't seem to be the culprit. Fully loaded/wet or completely empty/dry, it feels NO different. Something else has to be going on.

My wheel bearings have been serviced recently, and it made no difference whatsoever. Anytime you jack the trailer up and spin the wheels with your hands, they spin freely with no resistance whatsoever. Also, my trailer has electric brakes, and they aren't grabbing or dragging. My wheels are NEVER hot to the touch, and they don't run warm even after heavy brake use. I even replaced the wheels/tires, which may have been a mistake...my trailer originally came with 13 inch steel wheels, and I installed 14 inch steel "Smoothies" which are still very heavy (not much heavier than the originals) and Good Year Aquatred tires, which are very heavy tires. I'm thinking that the heavier wheels/tires may be giving me SOME added rolling resistance, but not really enough to cause the drastic problem I have...but anyway I'm in the process of changing the wheels/tires once again; this time with aluminum Torq Thrust rims, larger 15 inch diameter with a lower profile lighter weight radial. I figure this combinaion will give me a stiffer sidewall due to the larger rim/shorter tire, with the overall tire diameter the same as the original tire/rim combo. The aluminum rims weigh MUCH less than the steel Smoothies. It makes sense that this will contribute to less rolling resistance, but honestly...does anyone know if this will indeed make a difference? SOMETHING has to make this trailer easier to tow. I can't think of anything else to do.

I've had low-slung 4 cylinders tow this, high Caravans, fat/wide Beetles, and super powerful Trans Am's tow this trailer, and they all feel the same. So, wind resistance isn't the culprit. I've even installed a roof carrier on the Caravan to help break the wind over the trailer...no difference.

I've talked to Kent at Scamp, and he states he has NEVER heard of such a problem with towing a Scamp. He says he sold the larger 16ft Scamps to Caravan owners all the time, with fully loaded unmodified vans full of families, and never heard of a problem of the trailers being the least bit hard to tow. These trailers are reknowned for being easy to tow. Mine is NOT, and I'm not exaggerating the point whatsoever. Its a terrible chore to tow this trailer, and I hate it.

Please someone, shed some light on my situation. Once again, I've done everything I can think of to make it tow easier...both to the tow vehicles and trailer. When I evacuated, I easily had 1000 pounds of extra stuff in the van and trailer with me...and once I unloaded all that stuff, the trailer did NOT tow any better...the extra weight didn't seem to slow me down one bit compared to the unloaded weight. It felt exactly the same.

No one has been able to offer me a clue at any shop. Scamp has no clue. Could my wheel bearings (even though my wheels are always cool) be causing resistance at higher speeds, even though they spin freely by hand when you jack the trailer up? Seems like this would cause heat, which I don't have...but SOMETHING has to be going on. I know the trailer is heavy due to all the wood and accessories, but 2480lbs is not too much for this Caravan, and the Trans Am definitely has the power to pull anything (chassis not withstanding). The car which towed it the best, however, seemed to be the Beetle. Go figure...

If anyone has any helpful ideas, PLEASE let me know. I have to relocate soon with the Scamp (its now my home since Katrina) and I have to be able to pull it with less problems.

Please help.

Wow, that's a story! About my only idea is that you should be running trailer tires and not passenger tires. It's not totally clear if you are doing that. Don't know if that will help, but an idea. You didn't mention your typical towing speed but 60 is about right to minimize wind resistance, maximize mileage, and be safer. Wind resistance may be part of your issue. What does it feel like at 35 mph?

That's a heavy 13', but about the same as the 16's that people tow, so some of them may have some ideas. I can't imagine towing it with a Beetle! And I guess that transmission cooler didn't seem to help with your Dodge! What is it's official towing capacity?

And what is your tongue weight? It should be about 10% of the trailer weight, or say 250#. A mis-balanced trailer might be impacting the feel of the thing.

You need a real tow vehicle. Just kidding.

However, I didn't see you mention Chevy 350 or 454, Dodge 360 or 440, or Ford 351 or 390. I'd bet any of those would hardly notice a Scamp, whether it was hooked up or not.

Edit -- I read your post again and see that you mention a F-250. That would be a Ford 3/4 ton, which should pull a 13ft Scamp at 65 MPH with the wheels locked. I'm not good at reading long paragraphs on a computer screen, sorry.

Seriously, good tow vehicles produce lots of torque at low RPM, and have a very flat torque curve. The best way, and really the only way to effectively get this in the present technology is with cubic inches or cubic centimeters.

When my wife and I were first married, we towed a 13ft Compact Jr. with a Peugeot 404, as I remember about 1.6 ltr and 60 hp across the nation twice (saw 44 or the lower 48). It worked, but I remember an hour in low gear in the Rockies because there just wasn't enough umph to get into second. But it worked. And we had a great time.

Now we have a 16 ft Scamp. Guess what we tow with . . . . . .
A Chevy 4wd pickup with a 350 when the diesel is more expensive, and a 6.2 ltr diesel Blazer when the diesel is more reasonable.

Interestingly, the fuel economy with the Blazer is about the same as I got with the Peugeot with a similar load. The 350 gas drops about 25 percent.

Would I go back to towing with a smaller vehicle? Yes, if that were the only option.

Edit - I am wondering if the ride height of the trailer vs the tow vehicle is much different. The bottom side of Scamps aren't very aerodynamically slick, as you would know.

Edit - Another possibility is the Scamp, if not towed level may drag a lot more wind than necessary.

My two bits worth. As mentioned above, you don't speak of tongue weight and trailer orientation.

When the trailer is hooked up, does the rear of the tow vehicle sink as the weight is put on the ball?

If this happens, you have changed the weight distribution between the front and rear axles of the tow vehicle, taking weight off the front, affecting braking and steering, especially in any wind. You could affect this by redistributing moveable stuff in the trailer.

When the trailer is hooked up, is it sitting level with the ground?

Towing hitch down on the trailer is probably transferring too much weight to the tow vehicle. A single axle trailer has a design tongue weight of 10% to 15% maximum of total trailer weight. Based on your trailer weight, I get a value of 248 to 372 pounds. Most of the vehicles you mention can only be equipped with a Class II Hitch reciever, giving a trailer weight of 3500 pouinds max, fully loaded, but more importantly, a maximum tongue weight of 300 pounds without a weight distributing hitch. A weight distributing hitch would give you a maximum allowable tongue weight of 500 pounds, using a class II hitch reciever.

Towing hitch up on the trailer is almost as bad. You would likely be below to minimum 10% tongue wieght, and the trailer would behave as if it is not attached to the vehicle, skittering sideways at any road imperfection or wind.

My recommendation would be stop looking at the tires, and get a good weight distributing hitch, and consider using anti-sway devices as well.

Victor

And I'm going to give you advice that is exactly opposite of Victor's. Look at the tires. Aquatread tires are not meant for trailer use. They are wide and sticky. They also use relatively low air pressures to maintain the tread adhesion across the contact patch. In other words, they stick.

The wheels they're mounted on don't mean much in terms of towing; merely in unsprung weight. Get some Goodyear Marathons or Carlisle ST rated tires, pump them up to max air pressure, and see if that makes a difference.

There is a slim possibility that your Scamp may be "air-damming" in the slipstream of your tow vehicle. That is a real power killer. Most folks who have raised their trailers a few inches report an increase in gas mileage... but that depends entirely on the height of your tow vehicle.

And other posts have it right. There's no substitute for cubic inches when towing. It's been said that you can move a train with a sewing machine motor if it's geared properly. Although each of the vehicles you've towed with CAN obviously tow, none of them (save the F250) was designed to tow. Vehicles that are designed to tow a load handle those loads significantly better than vehicles that aren't.

Good luck figuring this one out!

Roger

Maybe the trailer axle is over its weight limit. It may only be rated for 1500lbs.

I don't know what year or power your Dodge Caravan has but I looked at the 2006 and the base model has a towing limit of 1,800#. The fact that yours slows down on even the slightest hill indicates that you are perhaps way, way over the limit.

http://www-5.dodge.com/vehsuite/TowingGuide.jsp

Thank you everyone for your fast initial replies.

As far as trailer balance, tongue weight, and orientaion...I've mastered that years ago with a plethora of tests. My tongue weight is right at 255lbs when the trailer is fully loaded. I have dual propane tanks on the hitch, adding to its weight.

The trailer is completely balanced, and the orientaion is spot-on. With the air shocks in the Caravan and Trans Am, as well as Air Ride air spring helpers in the coils on the Beetle, none of the cars sag in the rear, and the trailer is perfectly level while towing with any of the cars. It took a lot of measuring and leveling to get this all perfect. But, it didn't help with the pulling of the "brick" syndrome.

One thing I forgot to mention, is that the trailer PULLS amazingly to the point you don't know its there...until you hit wind or the slightest bit of hill. And, the problem exhibited is that it just feels like you're dragging 10 of these trailers. Foot to the floor, watching your gauges, downshifting to second, clutching the wheel, wondering when something's going to break, all at the blazing speed of 30mph. The problem doesn't lie in the the road manners of the Scamp, it tracks straight and true. I realize that an unbalanced trailer that pitches, dives, and swerves contributes significantly to towing difficulty, as your engine is trying to overpower inital powers of inertia. However, the trailer just stays straight and true behind any of the vehicles. There's no wander, definitely no sway, no fishtailing...nothing. I'm simply amazed at the ability of the air shocks to control my load. I get no nose-diving and no pitching. All road manners are PERFECT in all cars, except to a lesser extent with the Neon as its short wheelbase can bounce on uneven pavement...but its not a major concern. I had a blow-out on the trailer in Arizona on the interstate, and I had no problems with handling or getting the trailer off the road...and it was pitching violently. BTW, I wasn't over my load rating/maximum weight carrying capacity of my tires.

Regarding my Caravan, its a Caravan C/V (cargo van) with heavy duty suspension, multi-leaf rear springs, and increased towing capacity. My factory service manual lists maximum towing capability at 3375lbs, which I would never try to tow...so I'm way under that. My maximum GCWR is 7700lbs which I'm way under. I bet if I towed a 16ft heavier Scamp I would have no problems. Just a hunch; that's how my life works for some reason.

Regarding the AquaTred's...I realized after the fact that they were "sticky" tires that grab the road. Although I run them at their maximum cold pressure (44lbs) I'm nearly convinced they are adding to the difficulty to tow. Although, when I had 13 inch rims and the factory Tow Master trailer tires on the Scamp, it didn't feel any different honestly...

Sorry for omitting this info in my original post. So, does anyone have any more ideas? The 6spd Trans Am with modified suspension, 315hp, and 3.73 rear axle ratio should move this trailer NO problem. It was done in the 70's with giant box trailers. I don't buy into the notion that I need a full size V-10 turbo diesel truck to tow such a tiny trailer. That defeats the purpose. Someone has had to have experienced the difficulty I'm having and found a cure.

BTW...during one of my breakdowns and resulting tows out west (there were several, thank god for Good Sam) my Caravan was on a flatbed and my Scamp was towed behind it. The tow truck was a 5500 Chevy diesel. What amazed me is that THIS huge truck slowed down climbing the hills of Utah; usually to around 40mph (whereas I could pull them alone in the Caravan/Scamp at 20mph). My point is that this tiny trailer slowed down a GIANT truck; even the tow truck driver commented he tows giant trailers out of that area with no problems...and that my trailer felt heavy. (Oh, BTW...he didn't have the coupler on the ball properly, and the trailer fell off the ball...dragging what is now my "HOUSE" down the highway until it came within about 1/16" of wearing through the chains...its not fun when you're watching your home being dragged up a mountain with a clueless tow truck driver.)

Thanks again,
Jeff

I have never heard a better description of what it feels like to tow a trailer with an underpowered tow vehicle.

Nick

Hi Nick...

My problem is not an underpowered tow vehicle. I've towed this trailer with a 160hp 4cyl Neon, a 200hp turbo 4cyl Beetle, a modified ram-air equipped open exhaust V6 Caravan, a 315hp RWD 6spd 3.73 axle ratio suspension modified Trans Am, and a V8 F-250 Ford truck.

It feels the SAME regardless of what you tow it with. The Neon did just as good as any of the others. I'm not exaggerating my point. Something else is going on. I've towed heavier loads and bigger/square trailers with these vehicles and never once had a problem or a feeling of "not being able to go".

Jeff... are you dragging an anchor? Sorry... couldn't help m'self... off to my room now...

Roger

Hi Roger....

I would say YES, but an anchor would slide along the ground MUCH easier than my trailer. More like an anchor with big rubber feet on it grabbing the road like velcro...

Y'know Jeff... it would be interesting to meet up with someone else with another Scamp and do the mix-n-match routine; mix-n-match tow vehicles and trailers and see how much differently they tow.

FWIW, your 2400 lb 13' is roughly twice the weight of the stock stripper 13' trailers, most of which are 1200 lbs.

I was just thinking that the only problem that would cause your trailer to tow hard would be either wind resistance or friction. Friction would manifest itself in heat somewhere. Wind resistance is less likely to be "seen". A crummy, disrupted air flow around the trailer would, in fact, cause it to 'suck down' and be tough to tow. That along with twice the weight of the standard 13' trailer plus a lack of torque and rear-end axle ratio could cause that feel.

It really would be interesting to do a side-by-side tow comparison with another Scamp 13 to really see if your impressions are accurate, and if they're borne out by another person familiar with towing a Scamp 13. Without doing that, we're kind of stuck in the realm of subjective conjecture.

Roger

I fall on the side of what Nick said. I know this is NOT what you want to hear, but it is all about being under powered.

If you roll a bowling ball along the road it takes very little effort. (Young children can do it.) How hard would it be to roll the same bowling ball up a long incline? (I would be down shifting too.)

With my 460 V8 one ton Ford I could go up hill and pass anything towing my 5th wheel. I always had to decide if it was worth an extra $5.00 or not. I basically got 8 to 9 MPG flat, up hill, or on the level. Now with a smaller tow, sometimes I have to down shift, but I get much better mileage.

Good luck.

Jeff,

A dumb question for you - but I'm guessing that by now you're open to all suggestions. Is there anything under the trailer that could be blocking off the airflow passing under it? Clearly it must be in its right place when stationary, or you would have already noticed it, but maybe it gets pulled down by the airflow under the trailer and then blocks if off.

The ideas I'm having are:
- is there a grey water tank that's being pulled down?
- has part of the floor delaminated and that is being pulled down?

Presumably getting someone to follow you well back would enable them to see if there's anything moving around underneath.

And, no, I'm not volunteering to hang upside-down off a vehicle in the next lane to look for you....

Andrew

That Scamp didn't use to be used as a tractor-sled used in towing contests did it?

This sounds like an underpowered tow vehicle problem (despite the specs - perhaps a tuneup is needed?) and it would certainly be interesting to find someone towing a 17' Casita and have them test out your Scamp.

At speeds of 35-50 it would seem with a 3,375# towing capacity vehicle that it could easily maintain and increase speeds uphill. To eliminate the two vehicle from the equation, I guess you could rent or borrow an F250 or similar and do some tests yourself.

Certainly an interesting puzzle.

We towed a 13 foot Casita Patriot Deluxe all over the country with a 1998 Toyota Tacoma truck with 5 speed standard trandmission with a 3.55 rear axle ratio. Bilstein shocks and airlifts on the back. I know exactly what you are talking about. It was a miserable experience. Second and third gear up the hills on the interstates with 18 wheelers passing us running twenty or thirty miles per hour faster than we were able to go.. One of the happiest days of my life was when we were hit by a drunk with no insurance. We had to replace the truck, so we purchased a replacement that was capable of towing the trailer not just pulling it.

Nick

Hi Andrew...

Yes, I've thought of that. When I had my friend tow the trailer with his F-250 I closely followed looking for anything and everything acting as a wind-dam. Nothing of the sort was found. I've been under the trailer checking it thoroughly, as I have flood damage to the floor from Katrina that I have to eventually fix...but its not causing any resistance.

Hi Patrick...

All of my vehicles are maintained in absolute pristine shape regarding the mechanicals and maintenance. Remember, the engine in the Caravan is new as the engine blew in Arizona...and the new engine doesn't pull ANY different from the original. The new transmission and suspension components didn't help either. Like I said, the Trans-Am is well suited for any heavy duty towing as the rear end and rear suspension and clutch have been seriously beefed up. But, like I stated, its still towing WRONG. I used to tow a 24ft trailer with my Dad's old Dodge, bone stock from the factory, with limited power, no maintenance, no extra towing package items added...and it towed much easier than this, without failure, without a transmission cooler, and it rang up 90000 miles doing it.

Also, to those offering advice to tow the trailer with a truck...that's been attempted, with an F-250, and I had the same results. Overly difficult to tow. Also remember a giant tow truck slowed down towing this trailer...see my previous posts.

This just makes NO sense.

I have a 16' Fiber Stream that when fully loaded (My Weight Story HERE) I now guesstimate to weigh 2700 pounds, after adding an air conditioner.

I tow it with a 2003 Honda Odyssey LX, to which I added: Transmission Cooler, Power Sreering Cooler, (Honda parts; not generic), class III receiver, Prodigy Brake Controller, and I use a Weight Distributing Hitch with 350 pound spring arms. Honda says I can tow 3500 pounds equipped this way IF there are NO MORE THAN 2 PERSONS (of 150 pounds each) riding in the 7 passenger van. My towing capacity drops to 3000 pounds if there are 6 persons (of 150 pounds each) riding in the van. If a 7th person (of 150 pounds) rides in the van, the towing capacity drops to 350 pounds! Ten percent of the capacity with only two persons! The reason for such a significant drop between the 6th and 7th persons (other than the 1050 pounds of weight) is Location, Location, Location. The 7th person sits in the center of the 3rd row seat, Aft of the Rear Axle. Think leverage and friction.

Some random thoughts...
How high (or low) does your Scamp sit relative to the pavement?
How much clearance is there between the tire tread and the wheel well?
Where is your trailer's Center of Gravity?

I concur with Andrew:


I know I haven't found you answer. But I hope I've pointed your thinking in a new direction...

Hi Fred...

I have no one else in my vehicles but me and two dogs. As my previous posts show, I easily had 1000+ pounds of extra cargo with me when I evactuated for Katrina. I assumed, on the trip, that this was the culprit. But, when I was able to dump all that garbage and run an empty van and a normally loaded trailer, my towing difficulty did not change one bit. It felt EXACTLY the same. No change whatsoever.

As far as the height of the trailer...hmmm, I don't know. It looks like every other late model Scamp; it may be 1/2" higher due to the 1st change of tires/rims. I easily have 6-8 inches of clearance from the top of the tires to the top of the wheelwells.

I have no idea where my center of gravity is. How do you tell? And, what does all this have to do with anything? I mean, the height off the ground, tire clearance between wheelwells, etc...

Thanks,
Jeff

How about them brakes? What kind of controller? Does it have a pendulum? Have you tried disconnecting them and doing the hill test?

Is your axle well secured? Any abnormal wear on the tires? I would replace the auto tires with trailer ones.

Hi Patrick...

The controller is a Prodigy, but I didn't even have it hooked up the first half of my trip. The wheels spin freely when you jack up the trailer with no hint of lag whatsoever. The brakes aren't sticking; it was one of my first thoughts to check. Also, when I push my panic lever on the Prodigy all the way to "max", you can feel the trailer grab a little, but the wheels don't lock up, and its definitely NOT the kind of effect you expect...you expect the trailer to instantly grab the car and tug on it hardly...but it doesn't. Even slamming the trailer brakes on doesn't seem to make much of a difference in the strain of towing this trailer. Mind you, I haven't adjusted the trailer brakes because I don't WANT to add any resistance by tightening up the shoes any. That's not my concern at this point.

As far as the passenger car/trailer tires, I originally had TowMaster trailer tires on it. It wasn't any easier to tow then. I agree the AquaTreds are giving me some rolling resistance (I hope to god they are) since I'm in the process of changing the wheels/tires.

I do have cupping on the edges of the AquaTreds after about 5000 miles. I'm not sure why; could there be a problem with my axle? The wheels spin freely and true, and they have been balanced and the wheel bearings packed. My experience is that cupping is caused by too much air pressure combined with inadequate shocks and a light load causing the tires to bounce along the road. But, with as much weight as I have in this trailer, I seriously doubt I have this scenario. If you sat another trailer on the roof you couldn't get a better contact with the road.

Does any of this info shed any new light????

Irregular tire wear is a sign of an overloaded axle. How many pounds is your scamp axle rated for? The tires would turn freely if the weren't under load. I would expect some heat after running tho'.

You might check your wheel alignment.

Hi Maggie...

I have no clue what my axle is rated at. How would I find out? I assumed Scamp designed the trailer with an axle that was strong enough for its own weight....

My rims are always cool to the touch...

How do you check alignment on a single axle trailer? Who can do this type of work? I've asked about it before at shops, and always got the "what the hell are you talking about" look in response...

Thanks again,
Jeff

Jeff, does this look like your problem? http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8...476521&q=towing

Hi Patrick...

No, that doesn't look like my problem. I'm not an idiot, and I haven't overloaded my tow vehicles. My tiny trailer is dwarfed by the vehicles that tow them...until I get to a hill or the slightest bit of wind, and then they seem HUGE.

Call Scamp with the VIN number. They can tell you what axel was installed when the trailer was built. My 2006 standard has a 2200 lb axel. If that's what's on your trailer you're overloading the axel.

Another point. I noticed that talked about towing at 65 and 70mph. Most state laws have a maximum tow speed of 55mph. I tow between 55mph and 60mph. Never never go to 70mph or above.

I'm lucky to be able to reach 65 or 70. Its not a problem for most other people towing things to reach this speed or more, with MUCH less powerful/equipped tow vehicles, with MUCH bigger trailers. Its embarassing.

Also, please lets not turn this into a discussion on safety/towing under 50mph, etc...while I respect those views, I am looking at realistic situations. I need to be able to get up the tiniest of hills and the smallest whoosh of wind without going into 2nd gear foot to the floor 9 miles a gallon 4500rpm at 30mph.

My Boler B1700RGH will not lock the tires, under any reasonable brake current. It does brake well under normal conditions, but at some point it just can't brake any harder, and the brakes cannot overcome the available tire traction to lock the wheels. This is expected, according to the brake controller (Cequent/Tekonsha Prodigy) manual, in some combinations of trailer weight and brake size.

I believe the problem in my trailer is that one pair of 10"x2.25" brake drums just are not enough for almost 3000 lb of vehicle. Jeff's brakes are likely (and here I acknowledge I'm guessing) the 7"x1.25" drums as shown for the 1000 - 2200 lbs capacity axles (the #9 series of Torflex) from Dexter. That's about the size I see in the rear end (the easy-to-brake end) of the small Toyota and Hondas I have owned, and their curb weight is only about a ton total. Too little brake, so not enough ability for severe braking, and no wheel lock in testing.

If the axle is another brand, there are links (including the Dexter one) in FiberglassRV's Helpful-Links section, but I think the situation will be similar.

As for the drag, I think that some recent posts have hit the relevant point: the axle may be overloaded, the rubber which serves as both springs and bushings to control alignment may then be overly distorted, so the trailing arms are no longer parallel under the rolling drag at speed, and thus the wheels are no longer properly aligned. The description sounds like an air drag or hill climbing problem, but perhaps those situations are just the last straw. Wheel misalignment would cause lots of drag, and cupping tire wear.

I would very quickly leave any shop which claimed to perform wheel alignment work, and did not understand how to check a trailer. The design is fundamentally the same as the rear suspension of many vehicles, including my Toyota Sienna - it's trailing arms. Regardless of the design, they just need to clamp on their hardware and measure toe and camber.

Please keep in mine that I have not experienced the potential axle problem, and am only trying to help interpret what has been said, in the context of my understanding of how rubber torsion axles are constructed.

I hear you. My Honda never had any "difficulty" pulling my Fiber Stream up a hill going 75 miles per hour. While doing that my engine speed would be at 3500 rpm (but not red-lined) and my fuel consumption was 10-1/2 to 11 mpg, (In a vehicle that is capable of 27 mpg when not towing). (Yes, Byron, I have seen the light and repented.)

I get the feeling that something is causing friction somewhere in your suspension system. You state that when the trailer is jacked up, the tire spins freely. But under that circumstance, you have also taken the pressure off of the torsion axle, as well as the wheel bearings. You haven't isolated those two separate functions. If only there were a way to test with the pressure off of the bearings, but on the torsion axle.

Tire Cupping @ 5000 miles indicates a problem.
Many axles have a tag on them describing the weight they were designed to carry, check that and your trailer tags where the serial # or VIN is as the max weight is listed there as well.

As for the safety discussion. I'm gonna say one thing to consider. Many suggest you pull 75% of your vehicle max. You are pretty close to that with what you've said so far, but can't tell because you mentioned adding propane tanks. 2480lbs/3375lbs X 100% = 73.5%
Now does your Tow Vehicle manual say anything about max frontal area for a towed trailer? mine does.

And here is a page on Tire FAQ's that says:
"Research indicates that the average vehicle is driven about 15,000 miles per year. A vehicle with a toe alignment just .34 degrees (.7 inches) out of specifications has dragged it's tires sideways for 85 miles by the end of the year. This will result in premature tire wear out, tire cupping and also decreased fuel economy."

One last question, are you driving in OD on the hills?

I'm sure this is an obvious question and you've thought of it. Just to be sure, have you looked at the wheel well with the tire off for rub marks, primarily where the tire would rub when the suspension bottomed out?

Hi Roy...

Thanks for the advice. I've checked my frontal area, and I'm way under the maximum square footage indicated by my manuals. As far as the weight of my van, it weighed at 4400lbs fully loaded. As such, I'm still way under my GCWR.

As far as the cupping, it is very slight; no "wear" as far as decrease in treadlife per measuring treadwear, but the outer edges are simply slightly cupped. No one has answered this, but with such a simple axle set-up, how would you ALIGN this axle set-up, and who would be equipped or knowledgable to do it???

I have a 3speed Torqueflight transmission in the Caravan, all the other tow vehicles are manuals. I could NEVER tow in overdrive; the rig would just slow down. Hills are tackled in 2nd gear, the big climbs in 1st at 10-15mph.

I have always thought of the idea of friction under load at speed...but what would I have to do to check for this, and what could be the culprit??? Like I said, I have NO hint of even "warmth" on the rims after a long pull.

Also, I have no rubs or anything of the sort on the wheelwells or tires. I have plenty of clearance, and my suspension never really bottoms out.

Thanks for all the suggestions...

How about the hubs, are they warm? (Someone I know has an infrared thermometer from Radio Shack that he uses to check hub temperatures and other vehicle parts after travel a few hundred miles.)

Well, I've never really felt the actual hub. I have "Smoothie" rims on the trailer now, and have felt the rim, and the area around the lug bolts...but didn't grab the bearing cover or anything. When I had my blowout in Arizona, it was after a 5 hour straight run...and the wheel and hub were cool to the touch when I finally got the trailer off the ground...and this was after a massive sidewall blow-out.

Jeff

What is the actual horsepower and torque of your engine? And the year?

And have you ever had someone drive behind you and see if the trailer is tracking straight with the van?

My trailer has always tracked straight down the road, and I have followed it myself. The trailer does "lean" a little to the left; ie, the left (driver's) side is a little lower to the ground than the right when you look at the trailer from behind. But, I think this is normal for these trailers, as nothing is really "straight" on them. I can't really see how that could affect anything, and there is nothing really on each side thats in the same position to measure distance from ground to trailer for comparison. Maybe the rear bumper, but I never really measured it for the difference. How could I correct this, by the way? I doubt if its possible easily...

Also, I already listed the power/torque of my different cars. That's not the issue. The Trans Am and F-250 are more than powerful enough especially torque-wise to tow 2500 pounds. If other people's Honda minivans can tow MORE weight than I have with a fully loaded van...well, then power isn't the issue here. I've tested that with so many different cars and variables and always had the same result.

It may, or may not be the issue, since the issue remains unresolved. There's been a lot of postings and I don't see offhand the specs on the Caravan. I do see "modified ram-air equipped open exhaust V6 Caravan". But if you don't think it's relevant, then it isn't.

Sorry Patrick...thought I listed the specs of the Caravan. Its a 1992 Caravan C/V 3.0 V6 3spd Torqueflight Cargo/Conversion van. The van's engine as I stated, was COMPLETELY rebuilt with new valves, lifters, rod bearings, etc-the whole shebang. ("She bangs, she bangs...gotta love William Hung LOL). I never have any engine problems. The van has, among everything else, new, swapped, or reconditioned:

1) Fuel Pump & Fuel Filter
2) Fuel Pressure Regulator
3) 02 sensor
4) Distributor Cap and Rotor (distributor is original)
5) Magnecor Spark Plug Wires
6) Autolite Dual Platinum Plugs
7) No EGR valve on this van
8) New PCV valve
9) No Catalyitic Converter, new Flowmaster, dual exhaust 2.5"
10) K&N Air Filter with cold air induction/functional hoodscoop
11) 52mm throttle body with changed out TPS and idle motor (3 times in all)...throttle body, pintle, orifices, etc thoroughly cleaned
12) Coolant Temperature Sensor
13) MAP Sensor
14) EVAP system disconnected from the intake (purges to outside air, vacuum line on plenum capped)
15) Coil
16) Thermostat
17) Timing increased to approximately 15/16 degrees, always run 93 octane name brand fuel
18) All new relays for everything, Every single electrical connection cleaned/lubed with dialectric grease, all grounds reinforced, new master ground 4 gauge wire installed
19) Fuel tank flushed, lines flushed
20) New radiator, new hoses, new water pump
21) New oil pump
22) New alternator
23) New battery
24) New complete intake manifold
25) New HVAC check valve/reservoir
26) New transmission & torque converter
27) Unrelated new items: struts/springs (Quick Struts), air shocks, completely new brakes front and rear, new A/C system (everything but the evaporator), radiator and A/C fans, headlights, turn signals, cowl grille, license plate lights, paint, pinstripes, rear wing, roof rack, running boards, rims, tires, hood latch cable, emblems, wiper motors front and rear, front wheel bearings, steering rack, all new belts, A/C pulley, new motor mounts...basically EVERYTHING has been replaced...

I'm estimating my horsepower to be in the 190-200 range, same with my torque. Not a LOT, but like I said, compared with much higher horsepower/torque V8 RWD vehicles it makes no difference in towing this amount of weight.

You still have not said what the tags say about trailer weight and / or axle capacity.
For example my 13'er has a 1200 Lb axle.

I'm still trying to figure out how you get a 13' to weigh in at nearly 2500 Lbs when the original specs are 1000 Lbs. You are weighing in at more than the 19' 5th wheel. Something is screwy.

Axle alignment is built in when they are made if you are running a torsion flex. Plus when it is welded or bolted on. Any alignment shop should be able to give you readings off the trailer, you should be able to give Scamp a call and get the original specs. A good body shop with frame straightening equipment should be able to check your frame for you.

Does the trailer have a break away switch?

Hi Jeff. I my years as a "Billy BigRigger" I found that a hard pulling trailer has 3 main causes.
Overload (to the tire capacities )
Poorly distributed loads
and under-inflated tires.
You mentioned that you blew the side wall out of a tire, I always associate that with underinflation
Just my humble observation
Martin

Overloading the axle to even twice it's rating shouldn't cause drag, just a lack of suspension. A sidewall blowout, barring a tire defect, is usually caused by overloading and/or underinflation. The sidewall flex heats the tire until it fails.

Your post about the brakes and the prodigy not having a great deal of effect causes me to wonder a couple of things. First, you may in fact have a 1200 lb axle under your 2400 lb Scamp. That would have 7" brakes which wouldn't be all that effective on a 2400 lb trailer. Secondly, you mention that the wheels roll freely when the trailer is jacked up (and presumably not connected electrically to your tow vehicle) but the trailer is difficult to tow with ANY tow vehicle. Although you report that you're not recognizing any heating issues with the wheels I wonder if you don't have a wiring issue that is causing the brakes to come on as soon as you plug the trailer wiring into the tow vehicles. While it may not be a full-on braking condition, might they be getting enough to cause drag on the brakes? I would think that the Prodigy would indicate some fault, but I'm not an automotive electrician.

Just another thought...

Roger

Roger

Our 13 foot Casita with 7 inch brake drums and a prodigy controller was capable of smoking the tires. It weighed in the 2200 lb range.

Jeff

Hook your trailer up. Find a straight level road with little traffic. While running about 60 mph shift into neutral. Just coast and see what happens. Then try the same with just the tow vehicle for a reference.

Nick

If the brakes are adjusted to certain specs, and you overflex the axle, couldn't they drag under load wether they're hooked up or not?

Nick's suggestion is excellent!

Maggie, there's nothing I can think of in the way of loading or overstressing an axle that would affect whether or not the brake shoes are in contact with the brake drum surface. You'd either have to signficantly warp a drum or experience a total wheel bearing failure that allows vertical movement of the hub on the spindle for that to happen (and at road speed, that condition wouldn't last long). Generally even when a drum gets out of round, the only thing that happens is that the brakes will "pulse" and/or you'll feel a "stuttering" from the trailer when you apply the brakes. The only thing that can cause them to drag all of the time is either misadjustment (which would show up as drag on the drums all of the time) or if there's electrical current reaching the magnets causing the brakes to be "on" all of the time when the trailer is attached to the tow vehicle.

What's puzzling here is that if the brakes are "on" all of the time to one degree or another, it should show up with the wheel getting substantially hotter than ambient air temps and/or the magnets should eventually "burn out" and the trailer brakes fail altogether. Neither seems to be the case in Jeff's situation.

Roger

Your 2400+ weight is more than the axle is rated at!!!

Jeff, I can only conclude at this point that your tow vehicle has inadequate HP and torque, despite your experience with the other tow vehicles. The trailers are so simple that barring a drag issue from brakes or heated axles, the inability to pull the load up a hill can only be the torque power and gearing of the Caravan. And your tow truck driver may have been kidding you about the hard time pulling it.

It's an Occam's Razor thing http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam's_razor

And I think this is the proof: "The Neon did just as good as any of the others. " A 2004 Neon, for example, has a towing capacity of 1,500# with 135# of torque and a the 1998 model 1,000# (per Edmunds).

And I looked again at the Dodge Caravan Cargo for 2006, both engine sizes, and the towing limit is 1,800#. I don't recall if you posted your year.

Wow thank you everyone so much for continuing to help me troubleshoot this...

Roy...I haven't been able to verify my axle rating yet. Kent at Scamp doesn't have that info at the moment...but he says that my trailer is the ONLY complaint he's EVER gotten regarding difficulty pulling...which I don't honestly believe. Regarding the weight of my trailer, it is a Scamp Custom Deluxe in Oak, with full front bath, microwave, stove, furnace, hot water heater, gray/black water tanks, full wraparound roof cabinets, TV built into the cabinet by the door, car minidisc recorder stereo w/cd changer and 4 6X9's, dual propane tanks, roof air, refridgerator, some small oak 4"X5" nick-nack holders on the front wall...I assumed my weight would be similar to any other comparably equipped Scamp Deluxe, maybe a little more. When I had it weighed at 2480 lbs, remember I had the trailer loaded with all the personal belongings I could fit on half the bed and under it due to evacuating from Hurricane Katrina. So, I'm sure that added a lot...but that was a realistic reading. BTW...I don't have a breakaway switch.

Martin...I've always paid attention religiously to my tire pressures and weight distribution. The trailer tracks amazingly well, and my tires are absolutely all (tow vehicle and trailer) kept at their maximum cold ratings (44psi at present) when towing. I believe my sidewall failure was due to non-use of the trailer parked in the hot swamps of southern Louisiana (even though I kept 303 on the tires) for about 3 years. The weight rating of the tires is much higher than the weight of my trailer. Also, the tire that blew was the passenger's side, which is the lightest of the two sides of my trailer.

Roger...I only recenlty on my evacution trip even hooked up the brakes on the Caravan. I didn't have the Prodigy even in the van, and had no wiring to the trailer connector, for the majority of my trip. I've checked the wiring at the brakes with the trailer both not hooked to the tow vehicle as well as hooked to the tow vehicle with the Prodigy on and disconnected at a stop for voltage...nothing. I don't have any extraneous voltage going to my brakes. I think the fact that my brakes are slightly ineffective is due to the fact that they have never really been used since new...just once, for about 1500 miles when I bought the trailer towing with the Neon. I've never serviced or used them besides that until the latter end of my evacuation from Katrina. I remember they made more of a difference when the trailer was new; ie, they "worked" more. The only reason I don't adjust the brakes themselves on the trailer is that I don't want to cause the chance of ANY more drag, and as I understand it...aren't these brakes adjusted the same as old fashioned car drum brakes, where you set them for a tiny bit of drag when you spin them??? Needless to say, I don't need anything else pulling me back. BTW, I have to set my Prodigy at all the highest settings for it to even seem like its doing anything as far as helping me slow down. And, I have proper voltage at the wiring just before the brakes themselves.

Patrick...the tow truck driver wasn't kidding. We went very slow for about 50 miles up hills in Utah. Other people that have towed this trailer weren't kidding. A 315 hp V8 RWD 3.73 rear axle ratio 6 spd 3500lb Trans Am with a correctly modified rear suspension should be able to to tow 2400 lbs like its not there. And, it SURELY should tow easier than a car with less than half its power. More power makes NO difference in this situation; its been tried. F-250's pull 30 ft 12 ft high fifth wheels up mountains (albeit slowly) easier than this trailer. I already posted my van's specs and its GCWR as well as its towing limits straight from my factory manuals.

I'm leaning toward the axle scenario....but some say that shouldn't make any difference in drag, and my trailer has plenty of bounce and doesn't bottom out....so I'm back at square one. How does an overloaded axle (assuming I may have one) contribute to drag if you're not losing shock ability and your trailer is at the normal height???

Thanks all again!

I don't know how an overloaded axle would contribue to drag, I've never had this problem. I have had axles that were borderline for their purpose and failed, but both times they just blew out the wheel bearings. Underpowered, poor weight distribution, tremendously bad airflow, or friction. Oops, I almost forgot...or anchor. I am out of ideas. Good luck!