Welcome to Kenna and Crazy Harry's 1971 Astro modifications thread 2009.



Thank you F.B.R.V.

Our family trailer is in the molded fiberglass family tree of the Campster/Hunter/Compact/K-Line- ishy trailers.

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We will be posting modifications here using posts and pics relating to project objectives and discoveries we make along the way.

When we restore or remodel any of our fiberglass projects it rarely runs start to complete finish in a progressive order like we would like to see it done to present it.

We thought we would give it a go this time doing the whole remodel from start to finish first, then with a few good edits all the topics could be presented in a precise order, all from start to completion when posted, alas we are giving up on that idea as insane obsessional thinking.

The nature of the remodel beastie is fickle to the fiberglass molded nutter, Our resin cure times have been changing greatly with 40 degree temp swings here, the humidity has not been helpful either, nor the dust storms as of this posting.

Waiting forever to post anything trying to finish everything per topic within any of our single posting categories in the "never ending remodel" is not working for us at all, we have re-acquired no patience for this strategy.

We have now decided to post per topic by modification any modifications structurally which have gone well to its near structural completion, but not necessarily to the cosmetic finish...the final finish work will be wrapped up on the trailer as a whole near the end of our sojourn into remodel Nirvana.

We have not yet epoxied coated the Astro's hull/shell so we are not really all the way thru to the finish line here to date 10/2009 as of this post.

Presently we are sanding our hearts out, the trailer shell is actually upside down off of the rebuilt frame on milk crates for support, its various body damage/modifications are repaired.

Cargo hatches forward are cut in and reinforced now, the front window is gone completely eliminated, the side windows are reinforced around their boarders to twice the original hull thickness, the shell/hull is on the second go round of sanding (moving to 200 grit) really focusing below the belly band first (remember its upside down like a turtle)...we'll flip it on the newly reworked frame bolting it down after the final epoxy top coating sets, We will be re-installing the oak interior a few weeks after the top is done being flipped back again right side up...

Our opportunity of temperature and humidity window is now seasonally...its ready for the application of the 1^st coat of Primecoat ™ on the bottom half now…that's the trailers reality as of 10/09.

Over the many years living with this egg we have learned from it a few design concept guide line rules we will try to incorporate into our design strategy for the 2009 project, below are the big ones this go round.

Rule One. "thou shalt not penetrate the hull with sharp objects" where the roof is concerned we think we can do this 100% including attaching the pop top box frame with scissors assembly differently. No nails, screws or bolts in the roof.

Exceptions were made to this rule were months latter...

Side windows including the cargo hatches were eventually handled differently regarding this #1 rule...We would have to re-order windows, find hatches using a "sandwich in design" to their installation method or locate "rubber seal/grommet methods" of installing these; We did not even try these ideas because of our limited expenses, also we prefer the side windows we currently have in our desert environment (aluminum loves the sun, however the sun destroys rubber parts mercilessly) anyway vertical surfaces have never been the problem for us over the years like the roof has been.

Rule Two. " Its 2009; Its the age of new epoxies! Think adhesives or bonds first before screws and bolts" [/b]If supersonic aircraft, or commuter planes can be built of composites and bonds so can our camp trailer where the application of that technology is correct, we will look for opportunities for these applications which were not available in 1971, this rule does tie into #1.

Rule Three. "distribute weights over the axle and main frame rails...not to the sides of the trailer off the frame rails or ahead of the wheel wells on the rib extensions off of the frame rails, try to be mindful of placing weights to the 2x2 square steel frame itself, not to the fiberglass pan thru the wood bottom to areas un-reinforced, think about how weight is distributed across the frame".

Rule Four. "Think U.V.A. and U.V.B." our new coatings will be generations better than 1971.

Rule Five. "So we thought we would camp forever when 25? Design smarter for older ages now"

In our 20s thru are 40s we could throw a lot of energy towards our camping strategies tolerating the calisthenics of youthful motion making up for inefficient designs forcing awkward movement or positions, then in younger years we could meet any issue with a surplus of effort and agility...not anymore guys!

We have some experience to bring into this project these years camping with this little trailer, now its time to apply the knowledge being held hostage by molded fiberglass has taught us.

Kenna and I have a few miles to go...We haven't seen it all yet!

Did I mention its going to cost a bunch for us?

Game Plan Outline, (the small list)

1. Eliminate all screw penetrations in the roof particularly.
2. 1st epoxy the refrigerator top exhaust vent system into the trailer roof over its refrigerator compartment from within the shell/hull, then mount a second identical twin vent over the outside of the first vent epoxied into place permanently earlier, this outside identical vent fits snugly "like a glove" one over the other prior epoxied in place.
   
   Locking the "cover or top vent" in place for travel is done by using two screws placed into the sides of both these vents, holding the top one in place for travel, the screw heads face towards the outside for easy access.
   
   (The advantage to this) is as the outer vent top cover deteriorates over time, the one underneath or the "bottom seal vent" remains epoxied in forever, covered by the easily replaceable "outer vent top" the underneath vent remains in pristine shape because its covered, also remember this bottom vent by virtue of being epoxied into the roof provides no opportunity for leaks ever, even in driving rain this system needs no sealants to be maintained or screws penetrating the roof to hold it, the outside vent assembly replacement is a snap with two screws, just like changing hats.
3. We must re-size the access door hatch for the rear of the refrigerator compartment to a size that fits within the new bulkhead locations. This is a smaller size requiring a few tricks to pull off.
4. Because the ducted power range exhaust/light over the stove exits exactly where the curve/arc of the roof/wall area is in the shell/hull, we will mold in a seamless epoxy adaptation (transition) into the hull here, this will make an integrated hull hot air exit with no curve for the flat stove exhaust vent outer cover to deal with, the hull/shell transition being molded into the hull is absolutely water proof.
5. The wood square frame that secures the pop top tent to the roof of the trailer hull/shell with screws presently will not be used, we want no contact with the horizontal plane of the new roof design on either the trailer or its pop top roof surfaces...We will fashion a different system to eliminate all screws involving attachments thru the top of the trailer shell/hull, only side screws may be used thru the vertical 2" lip of the molded oval pop top hatch on the trailer.
6. Add the12v fantastic fan into the fiberglass pop top roof, its trim shall be epoxied it in...then it must have an adaptation for thickness epoxied in, it must be serviceable and removable.
7. Invent a different way of attaching the pop top tent material top and bottom so as to shed water efficiently, we want to sandwich the material between two hard wood flat frames in a even "pinch," it must integrate with project (3), also eliminate the need for the too many staples in the pop top tent materials present design.
8. Remove the front window entirely, its a flawed idea anyway...Its insane to face any trailer window towards the leading edge of every hurricane your ever going to drive thru putting a window right there? "unless its a cockpit window" We create with modern hi speed travel on our roadways wind speeds that match hurricane conditions on the bow/nose of this trailer.
   
   Its just itching for a leak to persist placing a window here,We will get away with this nostalgic idea. We will side step this issue entirely creating a nose/ bow for the trailer which is seamless by eliminating the front window entirely. "anyway we did not like the draft on our heads"...Remember this area is the permanent bunk now.
9. Redo the light duty frame where needed, replace the leaf springs to 1500 lbs capacity. Then rework the leaf spring attachments, rework all suspension supports, elongate the tongue to accommodate a utility box to also too include the two deep cycle batteries, add a trailer jack I need for a bum arm, then add ribbed extensions in key areas as needed under the fiberglass bottom pan, include gussets into corners of the frame box joints.
10. Throw out my modern suburban furnace electronic start furnace installing an older "passive" one which will work above 8,500 feet without re-jetting it or failing that sounding like the "1812 Overture" in higher altitudes when it ignites and I have not re-jetted it from low altitude camping.
11. Install tail lights into the frame bumper, not the trailer, we will not install signal lighting into the fiberglass hull anymore. We will try to eliminate our hull penetrations to necessary ones only. We will not run the R.V. signal lighting harness interior to the hull, rather we will run it along the frame outside the hull.
12. Add lockable insulated cargo space, installing insulated hatches across from each other creating access from one side to the other under the now to be permanent bed, this permanent bed which has an insulated bottom to it eliminates constant worry about lockable stowage space.
13. Install center console with 12v accoutrements over head in the bunk section of the trailer, the console placed dead center over the large permanent bed includes the A/C venting distribution system from the central A/C.
14. Add central A/C...This will be installed without the A/C placed thru any wall or window... it will sit in the cargo bay area...the cargo door will be closeable while it runs...it can operate at full efficiency without getting this sealed insulated compartment hot at all.
15. Add a 45 gallon polypropylene water tank over the axle.
16. Replace the complete interior 12v system, locate the charger/12v converter in the cargo bay next to the inverter 115v supply close to the fuse panels.
17. Install exterior lighting, we install one light on all 4 compass points outside our trailer, the switch is in the fixture itself operated from outside, they are the non bug alluring type.
18. Relocate 6 gal suburban hot water heater to the very rear of the trailer next to the door on the refrigerator side, re-size old cut out smaller to accept the new cargo door on the port bow side where old cut out was, re-plumb gas and water.
19. Replace rear door with a new one, this door has a second aluminum screen door built into it, to save cost we will re-size a salvage yard R.V. door, this will save allot.
20. Repair all hull blemishes, sand all old finish off, replacing old finish with epoxy U.V. stabilized products.
21. Modernize the lighting system to L.E.D. lamps to reduce battery draw.
22. Install rain lips over the two side windows.
23. Completely replace the galley, Kenna wants DuPont™ Corian® Solid Surface counters and a deep well sink with a flexible hand faucet, the sink must have a cutting board that fits smartly in it...(What the wife wants she gets!)
24. Cabinets to be replaced with visible storage using wire drawers.
25. Replace curved bulk head walls with stronger ¾ ply oak ones, re-cut to tighter tolerances supporting the trailer contours better.
26. Reinforce the two remaining side window sockets to double hull thickness.
27. Re-install gas light (we love it) but add fire proof reflective material behind it and above it against the ceiling.
28. Add insulation to the walls, this will be an underlain layer of silver bubble wrap, it will be held in place with an interlocking overlay of snap-in cut to fit F.R.P. (fiber glass reinforced panel) panels which will interlock with assistance from the window oak trims also utilizing the oak center console in the ceiling to pre-tension the f.r.p. Into the curved spaces of the roof to wall areas.

We do want to stay small, we really have enjoyed our tiny fully contained people pod, its been just right to explore in, camp in , or go on a dig in, it works very well to hold up in being just ourselves...although we must allow time for visitors who always come up to us wanting to peek into it.

The full Monty...The Bare Frame Painted.

The frame after welding needed to be sanded down to the bare metal, prime coated, and painted.

To remove the old finish I used my 4 ½ inch grinder, using an abrasive metal wheel, I followed the process up with a metal brush on the same tool. Kenna was moral support because her hands was not strong enough to take the hours of holding onto a grinder that wanted to take off in any direction without much warning. The time required for this process was two days.

After researching Por-15, which is a very good product, we decided it was not the product we were going to use, we decided it was overkill for our climate conditions, also it is not U.V. stabilized. "another U.V. coating which was stabilized would need to be put over it for that protection."

The second issue for us using was Por-15 was it is expensive comparatively, in no rust issue applications too expensive, if we were in a rust belt zone we would definitely use it.

We opted to be more conservative in the paint/coating tech on the frame, the money saved we threw at the epoxy outer coatings on the fiberglass shell latter on, this seemed to be the issue we needed to deal with anyway here, our gel-coat was suffering from sun damage powdering off greatly in the last 5 years.

We did use primer with an enamel black paint both by [i]Rust-Oleum over the metal surfaces changing the frame color from white to black, we did do two coats of each product, the drying time of the primer curing was almost 6 weeks until it was hard enough to use? The black enamel paint was not an issue, it dries well, cured to a hard surface,the primer was a whole other matter.

I did go to Ace Hardware with my concerns about the primer cure times, with the primer in hand and they ran a few tests on the primer themselves, it did not dry any faster or harder for them in their tests than for us, the factory was called by them with no help from them for any of my problems.

I do not recommend Ace brand primer. (made by Rust-Oleum)

Finally we decided to wait letting the Arizona sun bake it to death...I went on to other modifications while solar cooking our painted frame.

If we were to do it again, we would spray paint the primer with an can or airbrushed automobile primer, then use the Rust-Oleum enamel paint by brush over that, it would save 6 weeks of dry time in the sun at 101 degrees.


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When the frame came back from the certified trailer frame welder it had the modifications we wanted, added to the old frame was the length needed to place the utility box on the frame itself where before up in the air. "there was a crude frame holding the bow in the air over the tongue just under the front window." We could move to a larger box as well. Within this box are the batteries used for the trailer, We like them here because when parked the tow can be brought up to the front of the trailer in most cases parking it with the vehicle battery inches from the trailer batteries. This is helpful in the boondocks's, We can charge them if needed jumping these batteries in any needed situation.

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A heavier tongue jack was installed, This was sorely needed for a bad shoulder, its capacity is over sized to get a better gear reduction for me employing less effort to crank, instead of being a "top spinner" the jack is a "side spinner" being far more manageable for myself and Kenna, its placed into a standard configuration into the frame so a 12v one might be added latter as needed.

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The areas where the shackles were attached to the too thin frame originally were reworked, the thickness of the original Astro frame was insufficient to off road camping, a 2x2 square tube of correct length was welded to the original frames square tubing, this was a thicker walled square 2X2 tube as well caped on the ends closed against possible water corrosion being welded closed.

The shackle lengths were adjusted to accommodate the correct clearance of the frame to ground distance factoring the space taken up by the 2X2 tube adaptations. The Leaf springs are 1500 lbs each increasing the capacity by 50% over the original leaf springs.

The original leaf springs installed at the factory were attached in a trailing arm style using the leaf spring itself as the trailing arm, the leading edge of the spring was bolted directly to the 2X2 frame with the rear of the leaf spring hung on an 8" shackle. We did not like this system, the trailer was too low, the springs did not support the trailer well in roadway washboards or speed bumps. The springs were installed in a conventional manner distributing the weight on equal length shackles.

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I can weld, having the equipment to do so, we chose a certified frame welder with the insurance to do this work A.D.O.T. "Arizona Dept. of Transportation" has a few rarely enforced regulations in this area of trailer modifications, since the manufacturer is long gone, the liability for a accident because of a frame failure would be mine, even with my insurance from their point of view, the liability would be a shared nightmare to settle in court with a home done frame modification, did I fail to mention my insurance takes a dim view of covering home modifications? Another layer of liability insurance is also placed into the accident equation and is in this state worth the cost.

Arizona's court system establishes degrees of responsibility...I could be 50% responsible because I built it, the insurance would cop out on paying a claim by that amount due to my home built frame failure or worse...This is a simple explanation being of course more complicated than this always...But you get the picture.

Added to the rear of the frame is a class two receiver, this receiver will be used in the future as a removable step for the rear door.

Gussets were added to the frame in the corners see http://www.synthx.com/articles/trailer-strength.html for more information.

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The Astro frame unlike some of its other boxy cousins has ribbed extensions welded outwards off both sides of the primary side frame rails, these rib extensions placed in eight places support the four corners of the lower fiberglass body, they are located before and after each of the fiberglass wheel wells too, these ribbed extensions off the side frame rails prevent stress cracks in the lower molded fiberglass pan due to over hang stress points incurred here, these stresses are the galley and refrigerator accumulated weights bearing down in areas off the frame and off the wood reinforced floor.[

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Examples of problem areas over side frame rails when ribbed supports are absent over the years and begin to flex breaking the glass strands in this molded body making these areas droop over their respective frame rails, can be seen in a picture of a Campster frame and then its body showing the frame used in the Campster manufacturer of this very similar trailer which has an identical molded fiberglass body bellow the belly band, another pic shows the issues that no frame ribs can cause.

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The Astro manufacturing company apparently learning from these earlier trailers using this molded body design incorporated ribs into its frame design.

I often suspect that as this body moved on thru the various attempts to keep it manufacture whether or not key people involved in its development moved with it improving the product as key personnel to the development of the changes I see when these are compared one to the other.

A post and band propane tank mount was added to the tongue ahead of the battery box, since the battery box is now moved behind the tank rather than mounted on top of it using a home built mount welded to the frame the tank can be taller now being easily removed to fill.

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This is the receiver hitch welded to the rear center column of the frame, its there so we can use the receiver to slide in a step...when traveling its put away.

Harry & Kenna

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Wow, this is going to be a great thread!

I've had some thoughts similar to you - whenever my Boler gets to the point where I have a rivet leak (they're all fine now), I plan to tab the "furniture" in on the inside with epoxy and fiberglass tape - more like a boat hull.

I have a couple of question/comments (well, actually, about 400, but I'll limit it to a few )

The wood square frame that secures the pop top tent to the roof of the trailer hull/shell with screws presently will not be used, we want no contact with the horizontal plane of the new roof design on either the trailer or its pop top roof surfaces...We will fashion a different system

I can't exactly visualize all of this, but I just wanted to mention something that might come in handy, which is pre-made fiberglass "angle iron." For example, one could bond a piece of this to the underside of the roof panel, and then attach fasteners to the "hanging down" part of the angle.

Again, this might not work for what you have, but I'm just mentioning it as a possibility.

Repair all hull blemishes, sand all old finish off, replacing old finish with epoxy U.V. stabilized products.

When you mention "epoxy products," are you talking about for an exterior coating? In my experience, even UV stabilized epoxy is not an ideal outside coating, especially in a place with strong UV. I wonder if you might want to consider something like a two-part, linear polyurethane (examples of brands are AwlGrip, Alexseal, Sterling, etc.). These are products we use for painting fiberglass boat hulls, and they can still look very good - and shiny - after ten or more years. My own boat was painted with Awgrip in 1985 and still looks quite good.

Replace curved bulk head walls with stronger ¾ ply oak ones, re-cut to tighter tolerances supporting the trailer contours better.

Couple of thoughts here, again coming from the fiberglass boat angle.

First of all, you might want to consider something that will be lighter than 3/4" oak, but still strong. Even in a highly stressed boat, that would be a really big, heavy bulkhead. As an alternative, there are some good foam-cored materials that make very light, stiff bulkheads. Also if you are going to attach any other furniture to the bulkhead partway up (say, the kitchen counter) that will help to stiffen it (without bulk).

Also, if you fit the bulkheads really tightly and perfectly to the shell, you risk some print through and a stress riser. In boats we purposely keep the bulkhead 1/4" to 1/2" or so away from the shell (hull) - spacing it out with closed cell foam. Then we fillet the corners (using thickened epoxy you basically make a 45º angle of the corner) and use fiberglass tape to "tab" the bulkhead to the shell. That way, the bulkhead doesn't touch the hull, so no imprint or stress riser, and the tabbing spreads the load out over a wide area.

Okay, I'll stop now

Can't wait to see the progress updates!

Raya

Interesting ideas, Harry. Thanks for sharing them here. Lots of creative thinking going on.

Your input is much appreciated, especially by those who have similar trailers. Keep the pictures coming; they greatly help in visualizing your work.

Raya's boat experience is quite relevant, as these craft share fiberglass hulls, 12v systems, tight spacial considerations, etc. I agree that 3/4" ply is unneccesarily heavy and that there are thinner, lighter, yet effective alternatives.

Great, detailed coverage here; keep it coming, Harry!

Fran
74 Compact II

[quote name='Raya L.' date='Oct 18 2009, 08:21 PM' post='337002']
Wow, this is going to be a great thread! 53.gif

Quoted by Raya
The wood square frame that secures the pop top tent to the roof of the trailer hull/shell with screws presently will not be used, we want no contact with the horizontal plane of the new roof design on either the trailer or its pop top roof surfaces...We will fashion a different system


Raya,
I can't exactly visualize all of this, but I just wanted to mention something that might come in handy, which is pre-made fiberglass "angle iron." For example, one could bond a piece of this to the underside of the roof panel, and then attach fasteners to the "hanging down" part of the angle.

Reply Harry & Kenna
That's a very elegant way to do it...I had not thought of that.

Harry & Kenna
What I fabricated as a "test run" fabricating the pattern pieces out of pine that worked well for us was a solid square with rounded corners that fits on to of the pop top hatch fiberglass lip, "like a wood cap on the fiberglass raised lip of the hatch"

I then in the test model took my router and cut a 1" deep groove 5/16th wide into the center of it so it would fit smartly over the hatch raised lip with the lip of the fiberglass body inside the cut grove of the wood frame. This formed a wooden cap over the fiberglass lip itself draped on both sides of the fiberglass lip was wood.

I could then can attach my hardware to the wood & its fiberglass center...The wood cap or wood ring is locked onto the fiberglass hatch lip with 4 recessed stainless steel bolts going thru the sides of the wood oval oak cap locking the wood cap onto the fiber glass lip. Hence no penetrations to the horizontal plane of the trailer roof.

We liked the warm look of the wood ring ( or mantle) we could envision when the pine is duplicated in honey oak.

PLEASE SEND ME ANY SOURCE YOU HAVE FOR THE FIBERGLASS ANGLE.

Quoted by Raya
Repair all hull blemishes, sand all old finish off, replacing old finish with epoxy U.V. stabilized products.

Raya,
When you mention "epoxy products," are you talking about for an exterior coating? In my experience, even UV stabilized epoxy is not an ideal outside coating, especially in a place with strong UV. I wonder if you might want to consider something like a two-part, linear polyurethane (examples of brands are AwlGrip, Alexseal, Sterling, etc.). These are products we use for painting fiberglass boat hulls, and they can still look very good - and shiny - after ten or more years. My own boat was painted with Awgrip in 1985 and still looks quite good.

Reply Harry
I come obviously from the same cloth as you originally, learning fiber glassing boat repairs on Kodiak Island in the 70s, those are really good product names with ALOT of research behind them, We considered these as well including the newer single part epoxies and all the urethane's looking briefly at the silicone's as top coatings too...

Since I was not going to "officially" shoot another gelcoat BUT was going to sand one 39 years old near off the trailer which was going to powder anyway Raya (and you know powder if you do boats) we decided to stay in the epoxy range of coatings.

We settled for Interlux Perfection as a top coat and went with Interlux Prime Coat as the bottom coatings 2 x 2 coatings. I did use a fairing compound on some of the contours needed but do not want to elaborate here as this will be another posting subject. I wanted a 2 part epoxy really to replace the gel I was going to sand off.

Quoted by Raya
Replace curved bulk head walls with stronger ¾ ply oak ones, re-cut to tighter tolerances supporting the trailer contours better.

Raya
Couple of thoughts here, again coming from the fiberglass boat angle.

First of all, you might want to consider something that will be lighter than 3/4" oak, but still strong. Even in a highly stressed boat, that would be a really big, heavy bulkhead. As an alternative, there are some good foam-cored materials that make very light, stiff bulkheads. Also if you are going to attach any other furniture to the bulkhead partway up (say, the kitchen counter) that will help to stiffen it (without bulk).

Also, if you fit the bulkheads really tightly and perfectly to the shell, you risk some print through and a stress riser. In boats we purposely keep the bulkhead 1/4" to 1/2" or so away from the shell (hull) - spacing it out with closed cell foam. Then we fillet the corners (using thickened epoxy you basically make a 45º angle of the corner) and use fiberglass tape to "tab" the bulkhead to the shell. That way, the bulkhead doesn't touch the hull, so no imprint or stress riser, and the tabbing spreads the load out over a wide area.

Reply Harry & Kenna

Your really very right in all of this Raya, the gaps we had were way more than the ones you suggested for good reasons, The bulk head with the refrigerator was a problem for us in the past, we actually got a draft through it from the refrigerator compartment giving Kenna cold feet...

The bulk head part is done now and it turned out really well, I did address the issue you so well out lined out by keeping to the lessor gap without getting to close and placing a silicone cap on the bulk head mating surface as a crown already cured on it when I snugged the bulk head into the spot.

The reason I strengthened the bulkhead too was the bed is now a permanent one using the bulkhead as the sole vertical support to the floor on that end. When my rear end is sitting on the end or the wife's rear end is there its got well...substantial weight on it...added to the bulk head weight load is the partial weight of the gas/electric refrigerator, this honestly shares its weight with the wheel well it also rests on...It seemed prudent to increase the bulk head weight load integrity a bit.

I will be placing the pop top modifications and the Fantastic fan install into next posting to this thread.


Thanks for the ideas.

Harry & Kenna

Wow (me too) Harry, this is a great thread and will be very useful for me and many others I am sure. You are taking so much time to type this all up, now if we could get you to post many more pictures some where......

Raya,

You are correct again kinda I think, I have had this product sold to me by the wholesale rep as a 2 part urethaneish product?...I think the Rep is on drugs and this time the common wisdom is wrong in favor of its chemistry.

The curious thing I scratch my now bald head over on is in the labeling of Perfection TM. because if you look up the c.a.s. numbers you find its 1st primary ingredient is billed as proprietary polyester resin?

While I know and you know reps of chemical products are wonderful sometimes I think the sales department on this one is not conferring with the lab end of the business.

THANKS for the lead and the fiberglass sources!!!

As you will find out in future posts I have been using common F.R.P. as a backing because I cannot find the green board here... Its worked well as long as I stay in ester based bonds, (like loctite) with a broader chemistry to handle multiple plastic chemistry.

If I go to the straight ester resins only to save cash with Chinese made F.R.P. I get into trouble...the bonding is weak.

While the cas #s in the f.r.p. from China I tried does not state any blend of s.m.c. plastics in the product, I suspect they threw in the kitchen sink when they blended the plastic? Some of the F.R.P. did bond like it has s.m.c scrap pellets in it?

This only happened when I was using the F.R.P. out of China ?

When I switched to the California made stuff out of Stockton the issue goes away totally, have you heard of anything regarding the difference between the two sources regarding their plastic chemistry?

Am I crazy?

Happy Camping Safe Trails.

Harry




Interlux Perfection is a LPU (Linear Polyurethane, such as I was recommending) and not an epoxy. So we're on the same page there It's basically the same as Awlgrip, etc., but is made with rolling and tipping in mind (brushing) vs. spraying. I'm not sure how or if they actually modify it for that, but it is definitely an LPU.

Ok, sorry but all the science speake threw me. is the interlux a good coating to use on the shell of an FGRV? I ha vew a compact Jr that needs to be shal we say, brightend up. My wife want's it white but I am not sure yet. Can you get this product in colors? and where do you get it?

Heath,

There are several members on F.B.R.V. that have used Interlux Perfection, although I do not remember any specific parties I have read their posts...My brain does not remember names well, I could be wrong, I do not remember anyone that used it with Interlux Prime Coat as we did. The Prime coat smooths the imperfections, improves adhesion, fills in micro fractures.

It can be shot (sprayed) with the correct solvent to thin it or rolled and brushed, (with another solvent) its a topside finish that holds up very well to the U.V. light spectrum.

It rolls well with special rollers, brushes well with the right brushes and when it activates and sets to a rock hard plastic shell, We chose this over the other coatings because we wanted to stay in the epoxy family of coatings.

Here is link to answer your questions.

http://www.jamestowndistributors.com/userp...rt+Polyurethane

It is stated as a polyurethane, but its principle ingredient is a epoxy...What this is to me is a little confusing. What I know is it works great, please watch this thread, I will post the coating process and you can judge for yourself.

I am allowed 5 pictures per post so I am going to have to do subjects by chapters.

Others have used some other methods with other products, I have used this one before and feel more comfortable with it so we went with what we knew.

Any questions feel free to P.M. me.

Happy Camping, Safe Trails.

Harry

Addition of Fan-Tastic Vent model X-8000 to pop top of Astro.


On the hull roof of the Astro model 8-T there are strategically placed corrugations on the pop top to strengthen it, these corrugations occur on a larger scale also on the main trailer roof.


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This caused issues with this project regarding placement of the Fan-Tastic fan.

Kenna and I wanted a 12v fan, it seemed logical to place this 12v power exhaust fan in the trailer pop top roof because it was the farthest point from the bed for noise control, also being on the pop top roof, not the main roof, we would make sure leaks if any, were away from the bed, the water would harmlessly be manageable on the open floor space in front of the rear facing trailer door.

We did not want a fan that would blow on us, the bunk occupies the whole front of the trailer as a permanent sleeping space, it has the two sliding windows occurring at near mattress bed level, we liked the idea of just opening the windows and letting the 12v fan gently draw in the cooler air exhausting it out the top. By doing this we would have a nice breeze for naps.

The corrugations in the pop top roof itself were spaced by the factory so that no 14X14 space was available for fan placement, other issues present were with the fan design itself, it also needed the customary 1" hull thickness regarding the main outer vent lid section and the thin inner trim with the inset screw retainers, also a roof seal would need to be part of the plan.

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Increasing the weight on this roof might require heftier helper springs on the scissor mechanism but posed no great obstacle to us. We really did not want to gasket or butyl tape the vent into the roof as a seal only then having to run a bunch of screws trying to keep up with leaks as it aged.

We decided to remove the center corrugation entirely, this would mean fiber glassing two repairs to the pop top roof on both sides of the fan install, inside the roof we would add an additional thickness of F.R.P. (fiber glass reinforced board) as a backing plate to the removed corrugations adding to the strength of fan install in general, this would help the repair process of the fiberglass. "cutouts"

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We decided to epoxy the inner plastic retaining collar into and onto the pop top roof bonding them as one piece, this wound create a secondary seamless seal, on the outside of the pop top roof we created a oak wooden square for the 1" thickness the outer fan section with lid would need, this oak square was also epoxied to the pop top roof bonding it, this creating the primary water seal, the wooden square was made to a slightly larger size making a needed gap so the fan body would slide over the epoxied in place collar, without interfering with the wood square, then rest snugly on top of the oak square where it would be secured.

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See next post for more.

Chapter 2 (pop top Fan-tastic fan.
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When the cut out was made all scrap was saved, this provided the stock pieces of fiberglass that would be needed for a nice repair. Please Note. Safety is always present in our minds, this includes respiratory safety...Our sanding equipment is attached to a vacuum recovery system (shop vac) we bought our third one from Lowes Hardware, the vacuum used a primary large disposable filter bag and then a pleated H.E.P.A. Filter so there are two stages of protection. All sanding tools were attached to the vacuum.


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Please...When working with fiberglass consider no less, we also use ear protection, a face shield and a nose and mouth organic cartridge respirator, these items were not expensive and when working with these materials are absolutely necessary.

Do not consider this kind of work with out safety protections in place.

The material is easy to work with... I would not be afraid of it...But as with all things in life a little knowledge goes along way.

Its good stewardship regarding our lives to always ask the question : "What do I need to protect myself and others?" when working with fiberglass materials.

Lastly we can only post 5 pictures per topic new entry as we add to this thread, since these are the boundaries we must post within, we will do it in chapters within the topic subject as chapters as necessary, some information just needs more than 5 pictures. If when following the posts and it seems to run out of pics on a topic like "Installing Fans" just go to the next chapter of it..

If its not there we are most likely be writing it to post it.

This Fan-Tastic fan was fun!!!!

Harry & Kenna

See next post for more pics... these next posts will show pics with short explanations in rapid secession

Chapter three... step by step Fan_Tastic fan pop top install.

In the pop top roof flipped upside down draw cut out for vent, note the wings in our cut out will be cut latter, this latter cut is to remove whats left of the corrugation entirely after the square for the main hole is drawn out. Removing the last of the corrugation allows us to blend in the final contours of the roof for the fan install in that spot.

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I cut fiberglass with a 4" grinder with a metal blade to cut straight lines, the cuts are smooth this way, remember I am using a face shield and a respirator, in an open area, I have Kenna holding the vacuum nozzle just ahead of the cut sucking the dust up as the blade does its work. In this pic you can see the drawn outline of the next step to remove now the last of what is left of the center corrugation after the square hole is cut out for the vent.

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Then we measure and draw out the backing piece out of F.R.P. (fiberglass reinforced board), We will cut only the square for the vent in this piece because the wing cut outs are to be backed by the F.R.P. board, not left open like the center.

The F.R.P is acting as a back stop for the flat pieces of stock to be inserted latter to fill in the depression left where these wing like cut outs are...when the backing gets bonded in place.

The stock from the square center cut for the vent will become the stock to cut the repair filler pieces from.

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Chapter 4 Fan-Tastic fan install.

Before bonding the F.R.P. backing to the inside of the pop top with the now large hole in it, you must insert the retaining collar into the large hole for it, then bond this square collar to the fiberglass. This is where a good bond product comes in handy, if this were styrene or s.m.c. plastic "sheet molding compound" that was used to mold this part a straight resin would not work so well. A bonding product is made to do this job.

Stop for a moment and read...

Tip...The dimensions of the hole in the fiberglass pop top roof will always be perfect, if when measureing the hole to cut you always use this piece to draw the hole needed in the top to cut out.

Explanation of terms: There is differences in bonds, glues, fillers, and plastic welds in the plastics industry, when WE say "bonds" I mean a substance that bonds "two" dissimilar plastics together through its own chemical properties, acting as mediator..."a bond is a go between"...it lends its linking molecules like a chemical bridge, to other materials, linking them by attaching its molecules to dissimilar plastics in a flexible manner.

Other terms, like "glue" use different mechanics in the way they work.

Going on with the project...

Place the epoxy bond on the collar and 1/2 along the edge of the fiberglass hole, place a board on top and press flat into the hole until set up., flip it around and use another batch of bond around the edges until flush filling any gaps you may have level with the top of the roof surface.

See pic bellow to show a fill operation using bond of a collar gap.
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Next step is to reinforce the area and close up the hole left at the sides when removing the corrugations to make the area flat, an F.R.P. panel with a square hole in it bonded directly to the fiberglass roof will serve this purpose.

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F.R.P. panel before cut outs.

Measure the square cut out for the F.R.P. panel to go over the square flared pre-installed bonded to the fiberglass roof collar, when bonded in place the F.R.P. panel should be flush with the collar not over covering it.

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Pattern to be cut note cut and no cut areas.

We use Loctite as a general bond allot, it has a broad range of applications...not just plastic...After using a vacuum attached belt sander to rough up the glossy textured side of the ready to place F.R.P. pattern.

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Tip... The roughing up of the fiberglass is best explained this way....Take the sander and sant the tops of the orange peel texture flat...just the tops of that texture...get that far and your done.

We clean that sanded side with Acetone.

Then mix Loctite up, we apply the chemical bond to the cleaned fiberglass on the roughed up side and inside the pop top contact area, place F.R.P. panel into roof, bond in place, using a liberal amount of bond, a trowel made of scrap F.R.P. with teeth at 1/8 spacing apart spreads the bond so when pressed together it will not ooze out.

Press evenly and firmly until set.

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F.R.P. reinforcement, backing in place, inside view and bonded.

Tip*** Make sure no excess bond is where flat stock needs to be put as filler, if there is, it will increase the thickness of the filled area requiring more sanding.

To be continued chapter 5.

Chapter 5, How to repair those holes left from the Fan-Tastic fan install?

Now that the fan install collar is bonded into the roof, and the F.R.P. reinforcement/backing panel that slips over the collar "without touching it" is bonded into place turn the roof over to the topside.

When done the next thing appears, will be two depressions "puddles" where the cut outs were for the removed corrugations. To my knowledge Astro manufacturing were the only ones of these trailers that did this, I have not seen it on the other variations to this body design. If you have another brand like a Campster this step is not needed but you might like to see how its done, its a basic hole repair also how I re-size hatches in technique.

Since we have the original pieces of cut corrugation were going to use this as a pattern, using the flat square cut out as stock draw the pattern and cut out the two flat plugs...When cut out they should fit smartly into their parent holes, if not I use the bench sander as a grinder on its side with the vacuum running and sand tiny bits off until the right fit occurs.

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Old removed corrugations used a patterns
for needed flat plugs to fill depressions.

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After trimming, flat plug fits smartly in place.

Once we have the plugs made to fit then sand the contact side flat, "non gel-coat side" smooth, with no texture on it, when done the plug is ready to bond.

Stop a moment and please read below...

The Metal Tape Trick

Tip...We like to build a simple press where clamps cannot be used...Also I need to explain a trick that always works. I always have a roll of Metal Duct Repair Tape around, the Nashua brand tape is a good brand 3" wide. When you peel the paper strip off the metal tape keep it, the paper is useful for repairs...While the metal tape part is useful for holding small projects in place while setting, it molds well holding firmly any shape.

The paper peeled strip of this tape has a waxy side that never sticks to the metal tape very well and is the side that touches the adhesive, the other side of the paper strip is not waxy, if it touches the adhesive it sticks permanently.

We use the waxy side allot, facing it towards the work, while being pressed firmly results in making the epoxy bond over run that oozes out of a pressed piece smooched flat, when it sets in 10 min (for 5 min epoxy) the tape can be pulled back easily with little to no sticking to the work itself. The now bonded piece with its flattened unified surface is now easily sand-able in a day.

The Simple Screw Press "where high force is needed"

We do have many clamps of all kinds, but on a repairs where you are behind a flat fiberglass wall where C clamps will not really work and you are doing a plug, or "fill" or a fiberglass repair needing pressure or extreme pressure on your project this works well.

Take two scrap flat wood pieces "I like ply" then put them on both sides of the work to be done running drywall screws thru the wood, thru the hull into the wood on the other side...This makes a fiberglass sandwich, make sure under the wood there is a non stick surface like the "paper tape idea" outlined above on both sides next to the work...wax paper works too, only not as well...also will butcher paper using the wax side. (yes I know they sell the plastic)
"The small hole left by the screw on a larger repair is easily handled."

Magnetic press "where low force is needed"

The other favorite press is two welders project magnets, and two scrap ply pieces with the no stick paper under it."or the plastic available from supply stores"
Pop a magnet on both sides holding the wood in place using the magnets force as the press.

Now on with it...Using the screw press method.

Place the perfectly shaped plug into the hole with the epoxy in place there too...Next place the wood pieces to both side of the work, placing waxy paper next to the work waxy side facing the liquid bond on both sides of the work.

Run needed screws thru the top wood into the fiberglass work and thru the other side into the other bottom piece of wood drawing the two wood pieces together making a vise.

Using the 5 min epoxy wait 10 minuets. Then disassemble...

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Equal amounts then mixed together inside the depression
to receive the plug piece.

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Note screw holes, note overrun smooched flat?
This is now ready to sand.

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Ready for belt planning and orbital sanding.

Harry, You are the professor!

Chapter 6...Spiffing it up and adding the wood square spacer?

O.K. the roof is now reinforced, the mating adapting collar is now epoxied in, and the corrugations that were cut out leaving gaps where we did not want them are gone...Whats next.

Filling a hole is one thing, making it blend in and look nice on a large surface quite another.

Look closely where we did our repair to the corrugation gaps by using a backing and plug technique, on close inspection you will see that the plug is about 1/16th of an inch higher than the rest of the surface, this is caused my the layer of bond adhering the plug to the backing...This is a problem as it will require allot of bondo or fairing compound to bring the larger surface flush again with these repairs...

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On close inspection you will see that the plug is about 1/16th of an inch higher than the rest of the surface.

So bringing the two smaller sections down to the correct height with the rest of the roof seems to be the way to go...

Its easy. Wait 24 hours.

Bonding products do not sand well sooner.

We plane the uneven surface with our belt sander using 80 grit belts, the suction from the running vacuum attached to the belt sander pulls all the fiberglass dust in, when sanding move evenly and deliberately back and forth at about 50% belt speed so as to not heat up the work...The repair plugs will sand off their excess heights gel-coats first down to the surface of the rest of the roof exposing resin and fiberglass.

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After belt sander removes excess on plug making
the area level with the rest of the surface.
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Note***"Latter, in the finishing process, we resin coat the exposed fibers, sand, fill, prime and top coat this area, when done no trace will remain of this repair."
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Excess "loctite bond" smooched out also goes away with this sanding, what is left after sanding is a uniform flush surface with no gaps.

Next a oak wood square ring is made, this square collar makes up the needed 1" gap so the Fan-Tastic fan rests on it as designed when installed in a double hull trailer.

This oak wood spacer will serve as another way to strengthen the roof because we will bond it to the roof with epoxy, it provides another water barrier with its epoxy seal which we call the primary water barrier because any water entering must bridge this barrier first.

This solid oak square spacer functions as a seat for the fans weight to settle on or nest on. Into this ring, "not into the roof" are stainless steel screws, under the lip of the mating surface of the plastic fan body is butyl sealant or a rubber gasket which poses no problem for rain water because it is a raised deck.

If the primary water seal failed the next barrier in line to water penetration into the trailer would be the inside plastic collar we epoxied in place earlier, its raised edges facing the weather will stop water penetration there, this seal we call the secondary water seal.

We could have a go at the numerous ways to build a wood square, myself I do not like butt joints, what we did was take four 1/4" thick correctly wide and long wood planks and alternating at the corners over laid them so they interconnected there.

We used Gorilla Glue which is a water proof urethane glue, set up the pieces and using wood clamps set it all up under pressure, in 24 hours we sanded all the ooz off.

Then we placed the square into position, we made sure the fan mounted the collar with room on the inside side square for the whole works to settle in tight and precise.

****DO THIS***We then drew an outside square to mark the precise placement of this wood ring...

We then took the fan out, placed loctite bond on the wood ring mating surface of the wood ring clamping it all around in place using the square we drew to place the ring exactly where it was before.
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Wood ring bonding being clamped in place.
"Note appropriate gaps in the interior dimensions
for the collar to function with the fan top."

This last picture shows the wood ring bonded to the roof with the fan placed in it, there is no sag, now the real work begins to make this look good too.

For the curious I want to address the looks of a wood ring...The trick is we will coat the hard wood with an epoxy resin, then prime coat it, then top coat it, the fact its a hard wood will not be known when all is done...Kenna and myself will cover this in the body work chapters and the coatings chapters that will come under "body work" as another topic.

This concludes the section on Fan-Tastic fan modification.
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Modification complete.

Happy Camping Safe Trails.

Harry & Kenna

Vent Modification...Adding a side range hood vent flat cover to a curved hull.

This is chapter 1 the introduction to our side vent modification discussion.

Synopsis...
The project featured is to add a flat side vent cover outside for the power exhaust range hood over the galley stove, the exit for the vent is exactly where we do not want it, it exits right on the arc or curve of the trailer hull, the point transitioning the main roof horizontal plane to the vertical plane of the outside side supporting trailer wall.

This discussion is about eliminating the curved hull issue by molding in a structured platform for the vent cover to rest on while not looking awful doing it.

Our problem...
We have had a power vent fan for years over our stove, the correct outside flat vent cover would stick out at the very top, its straight vent face thrusting straight up as the curved surface of the trailer hull behind it gently departed backwards away from the cover creating a greater and greater gap looking really tacky...It took allot of silicone goop to fill that space...
We did mean tacky.

What you will get by reading this...
Following this modification within this "Astro Middle Age Re-model" topic you will share what we do when faced with the issue regarding the topic of molding another feature to an existing curved hull to create a functional flat plane on it while still being symmetrical in looks...We used this construction technique to create flat platforms on top of curved roofs for R.V. A/C systems, or adding cargo doors, or placing windows onto slightly curved surfaces in our business too.

This to us has been an important skill learned for working with curved fiberglass surfaces.

Below is a teaser pic of what we are discussing...
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This is the sculpted, resin fiber reinforced adaption to
our curved hull that is featured step by step in this Vent Modification
thread.

The issues faced...
Adapting anything to a curved surface can be difficult enough, but on a 39 year old trailer that is currently using a sculpted silicon rubber seal that intermittently leaked every 5 years or so was going to be fun!!! The gel-coat was powdering heavily from years of the desert sun, we were definitely going to the resin layer before we were done. We braced ourselves mentally to modify this Astro the 3rd time...

While it has been our 17+ year companion, the lure and siren call of a fiberglass 5th wheel had our ears this year, then the economy hit...

Our lite Astro trailer, full of squat troll like personality would be our boxy orphan companion camper another decade. Again it will with fancy sleek behemoths next to it on both sides get another life to confuse and confound successful retirees 10 years ahead of us wanting to know "What the ---- is it?"

We wanted to share with the so many boxy cousins now found on F.B.R.V. our Astros story declaring it was going to be new again. The money saved for the down payment of the dream 5th wheel would rebuild with no money owed to any banker this Astro. Not to mention save me from extreme boredom while I got fixed too, I needed a surgery.

In the very beginning of this Astro modification thread we stated our intentions to eliminate screws penetrating the hull which might lead to leaks in the future.

Using a reinforced resin molded block that screws could use too "bite into it" but never penetrate the hull itself seemed the right plan for us regarding this vent issue, the project idea stayed within the strategy of making an attractive molded extension of the hull eliminating any seam in common with the roof behind the future flat vent cover. This would guard against any pathway for water to shed from the roof to inside the vent system or allow screw threads to penetrate the interior hull.

This introduction page is the beginning of this modification topic, chapters will be used as we are allowed 5 pictures per posting...Writing fast as we can you may see this topic stop while the rest of it is composed.

Just follow the chapter numbers until it ends.

Happy Camping, Safe Trails.

Kenna & Harry

Vent Modification...Adding a side range hood exhaust vent flat cover outside to a curved hull continued.

This is chapter 2 the beginning to our side vent modification discussion.

There are items you will need to have on hand, like the metal tape discussed in "Fan-Tastic fan modification," We use Nashua 324A cold weather tape, two flat vent-line covers from the R.V.Store which are plastic, see below.

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Standard vent cover with lockable door
damper and plastic duct built on rear.

Why two covers? One cover is sacrificed becoming the molded platform for the other removable cover.

From N.A.P.A. Auto you need the unwoven fiberglass matte N.A.P.A. #765-1288, Resin N.A.P.A. #765-1285
An extra tube of liquid hardener N.A.P.A. #765-1294.
You may want on hand the resin in jelly form N.A.P.A. #765-1241. (Optional)
Buy the box of disposable Derma-Lite nitrile gloves N.A.P.A. #6609. (a must)
Also a polypropylene flexible flat scrapper N.A.P.A. #15510.
A gallon of Acetone N.A.P.A. #7651577
G.E. 100% silicone... One caulking gun cartridge. (black)
Do not forget lots and lots of shop towels...tough paper shop towels.
Sanding sponges...medium and fine.
Some scrap F.R.P. (or stiff paper board)
Interlux Watertite epoxy filler or similar product Kit #YAV135 See below link.

http://www.jamestowndistributors.com/userp...te+Epoxy+Filler

As far as tools go a 4 or 4 1/2" hand side grinder with metal cut off wheels, a Shop Vac with a paper bag in it AND a H.E.P.A. pleated filter. (Lowes/Homedepot)

(see Fan-Tastic fan remodel post before this post on vacuums and sander equipment)

A variable speed belt sander with vacuum hose attachment.
A non repeating random orbital sander with vacuum attachment.
Sanding disks 40-80 grit 100-200 grit.
Sanding belts 40-60 grit.
Caulking gun.
Screws 1/2-3/4"

On the subject of screws... Their are many kinds more than what the hardware store has. These fiberglass trailers need a design specific fastner... do not mess around with generic fasteners unless you know it is for fiberglass...Screws that are alleged be used on fiberglass to sell them are everywhere...I look for fasteners specifically designed for fiberglass work...The guy who will help you at the local hardware store saying "yes these work" most likely does not know the difference.

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It looks the same sorta...

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Now read the difference...
Why talk about something like screws?
We know we're going into detail in these postings; We can show our neat modifications (we think they're neat) in a few pics then leave, but that style of sharing only shows the project can be done...
It will not help anyone to duplicate or build on our mistakes or success...
If common wisdom learned in the attempts to do a project is not passed on in the extra effort to tell the story then errors made will to some degree repeat themselves again.

As wordy as we are being here, we cannot cover every variation you might have, we had replaced our range hood years ago buying the power hood with the light in it because in a tiny trailer cooking anything on a rainy day with two asthmatic adults cooped up was disastrous...Ergo the hood went in fast.

Briefly stated when installing the hood we drew the rear vent hole position for the exhaust outlet using the back of the appliance itself, when mounted temporarily we used the factory installed rear square hole in the unit pushing against the outer hull as the pattern for drawing a position marker square. Warning *"do not cut this yet "*

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Rear view of typical R.V. 12v power vent

When we again remove the exhaust fan unit, the eventual "cut out" square pattern is drawn using the "position square" as a guide by centering the actual plastic rear of the vent cover, that has the 4" long square molded duct on it we draw the new final dimensions of the"cut out".

This places the final "cut out" position exactly where it needs to be mechanically on the curve of the hull.

2nd warning..The hole size to be cut may not be the one drawn first...Its real size is to be the real size of the duct that sticks out behind the vent...Not the exit hole size of the hood!!!!

The reason for this strategy is to get a tight fit needed between the exhaust vent rear duct throat thru the hull itself...this is crucial.

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Plastic rear duct of the "side vent" fits snugly thru hull wall.

Explanation* This method uses three separate pours of resin , layering fiberglass matte in two of them between the pours, the fiberglass matte is to strengthen the molded structure as it builds up, to the correct thickness... More importantly it limits the deep cracking endemic to this kind of pour with this kind of product.

Pouring resin shapes as resin blocks releases allot of heat very rapidly in the mold, the heat accelerates the cure rate making more heat

Slip the duct tightly into the hole bringing the front cover against the hull tightly.

The rear of the vent cover will poke thru the hull into the galley area.

Draw a line around the outside of the vent now, then sand off the gel-coat within that outside square to the resin layer. ( creamy brown color) Stay as much as possible in the box square drawn.

Now do something everyone will tell you not to do...From the inside silicone the square duct on all 4 sides right where it comes in past the hull. ..Put a thin consistent uninterrupted bead on all 4 sides of the incoming duct. Use the metal tape on the outside to hold it firmly in place 24 hours.

Why do it?
We need that inside seal...When we pour the resin in the first pour it keeps the curing resin from entering the trailer thru the spaces between the hull where the duct penetrates it. By holding back the liquid resin long enough for it to set in the first pour we will fill gaps behind the cover itself up next to the hull (these covers are hollow) filling the tapered arc to flush with the top of the vent face in the first pour to be molded.

This ends chapter 2, the discussion continues in chapter 3.

Happy Camping, Safe Trails.

Kenna & Harry

Vent Modification...Adding a side range hood exhaust vent flat cover outside to a curved hull continued.

This is chapter 3 of our side vent modification discussion. "Building a simple Mold"

Now that the rear of the vent face (the outside part of the vent) is flat against the outside hull with the duct behind it inside the trailer being held in place with a continuous silicone bead on all 4 sides of the inside duct sealing it to the hull its time to do the outside front face of the vent.

We silicone the front face with a thin even bead of silicone where ever it touches the fiberglass hull, "this seal will be removed" we want this to hold back resin when poured. Where the face and hull start to separate because of the arc of the hull a different solution will be employed.

What are we doing next?

"We are sealing holes so resin cannot ooze out of them, do this for all vent face screw holes."

Description of how its done.

The screw holes in the vent face from the factory need to be taped closed using the waxy paper from the metal tape roll (discussed in "Fan-Tastic fan modification" earlier) placing a waxy paper patch over the screw holes first hold these paper patches in place, taking another piece of just metal tape place it tightly over the paper patch taping the waxy paper patches over the screw holes sealing them in place, sealing on all sides of the waxy patch with the metal adhesive tape we make a patch which is removable after the resin cures without sticking...

We are sealing holes so resin cannot ooze out of them, do this for all vent face screw holes.

After sealing the screw holes we must now address the gap at the top of the vent face outside the hull, this gap will be handled by a temporary mini patch or another way to say it is a temporary mini retaining wall, this wall is lined with the waxy paper trick... The waxy side always facing the resin.

A simple hand drawing of the side cut away view of the trailers lines shows the gap needed to be closed.

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Side view drawing showing discussed gap to be closed.

On square bodied trailers it easy to get the degree of curve needed for a close match to the body arc needed to make the small side wall pieces fit very tightly...This is done by drawing the arc needed on the cut scrap F.R.P. to be used in the mold, take the scrap to the back corner of the trailer, using the body where its curve can be outlined draw the curve to be cut out on the scrap.


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Drawing the curve on scrap to be used as a sidewall to the mold.

The next pic shows the future F.R.P. sidewall piece having the curve cut out of it now being lined with the waxy paper towards the poured resin side, We use a razor blade to again cut the arc out of the waxy paper so both F.R.P. wall piece and its covering of waxy paper will snuggle into the hull tightly.

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Shows F.R.P. cutout lined with waxy paper, "waxy side out" being trimmed to cut out arc.

Do this for both sides, tape in place the side pieces to the vent fan face tightly, make a back wall of F.R.P. to go between the two side pieces just made, line this back wall the same way with waxy paper from the roll of metal tape. This is so the mold will release all panels when resin cures.


We attached our mold walls "side+side+back" by tightly taping the whole structure with metal tape, We put long side crews in place on both side sections to suck them in tight, also we silicone to the outside a bead seam on the side wall of the mold to the trailer hull.


We made sure the tape over laps all sealing contact points with the hull, also taping all forming corners...The strategy is to have a sealed mold that will hold resin long enough to harden resin into a desired shape.

IF done correctly, the resin will not enter the trailer because of the silicone bead on the other side of this work done earlier...The side walls must go to a point taller than the height of the roof as must the rear wall extend to that height too.

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Side wall in place; Note screw to holding wall into duct/vent; Note the silicone bead outside as a barrier to hold back resin.

This last pic is to show how this is supposed to work...The pours of resins will be three individual pours...This pic is not to say pour all at once...The next picture is meant as an illustration of the mold only right now.

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Note... The three retaining walls of F.R.P. lined with waxy release paper, re-used from our metal tape roll, this shape only has to be held 15 min...That will be chapter 4.

This ends chapter 3, the discussion continues in chapter 4 of Vent Modification...Adding a side range hood exhaust vent flat cover outside to a curved hull.

Vent Modification...Adding a side Range hood exhaust vent flat cover outside to a curved hull continued.

This is chapter 4 of our side vent modification discussion. "the messy part"

Doing this in five picture chapters at a time has been interesting, we took many more pictures than space does permits. The mold has set up another 12 hours so the bead on the side wall sections has time to set.
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Worth mentioning...This is the time to pour the first batch of resin, the liquid resin technique we will describe in this post here is the one we present because we like it the best, but the optional resin jelly 765-1285 could be used in the step before this one as a pre-loaded packing behind the hollow vent face. Backing up a moment when the vent assembly was slid into place, this jelly being much heavier could have worked well filling up the spaces behind it...So...Without going threw all the pain and trouble of sealing the vent into the hull as a liquid tight hollow plastic body to be filled with liquid resin against the hull, we might have move faster in the project with the jelly...but not better we think.

Personally, the liquid resin technique does adhere more tightly to the sanded bared fiberglass when it sets up...The jelly did not appear to have the same adhesion albeit a close second.
_________________________________________________________________

Click to view attachment

Level of the 1st pour, in real life leave the whole mold together, this was done just to show levels and take the picture for the benefit of F.B.R.V. members.

The pour person puts on disposable Nitrile Gloves, keep box near, if you make a mess peel gloves off and put new ones on in seconds, have a partner to help with this also the partner operates the thermometer.

In the first pour mix (I like a flexible rubber silicon collapsible bowl) 16 0z. by volume of the N.A.P.A. resin 765-1285 with 30 drops of hardener 765-1294 per 4 oz. of resin.

{16 oz resin divided by 4oz equals 3 X 30 drops of hardener equals 90 drops of hardener per 16 oz of resin.}

At 80 degrees F. below 25% humidity wait 3-4 minuets of an average 10 minuet work time before you pour your resin solution, the temperature of the resin should pick up about 5 degrees before you start, try to not go beyond 20 degree rise in temperature or a consistency much past syrup before you pour. (Use a laser thermometer, see below link for an example.)

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=93984

Mix steady and fast without whipping bubbles into the mixture, it will turn from clear to dark, mix until all the mixture is uniformly dark...mix 1-2 minuets.

Pour resin mixture into the pre-built mold praying you did not forget something major...If you leak a little plug it, do not move to fast, be observant inside the trailer and outside the trailer regarding this pour giving attention to its leak zones...Pay attention to the big stuff...Your partner can standby with acetone wipes for resin dribbles or resin run off on the hull...In 15 minuets it will harden...If you're in a cool ambient area, place a can of resin in hot water 105 degrees warming it up to 80 degrees before mixing, when you pour resin in the cold do it under a spot light about 3' away (500 watt halogen) to warm working area in the cool weather, keep light on work area 20 minuets, have a box fan running on low to mix air up in a closed room.

This first pour will come to just under the top of the actual vent rim, another view of the pour with the mold off for your viewing is below, this is to show the amount and progress of the 1st pour only. Do not after this 1st pour of resin remove the mold!!!

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Top view looking across mold towards tongue the mold is open for picture only.

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This is a top view looking down 1st pour.

When this resin sets firm (in about an hour to two hours) and the temperature of the resin is dropping not increasing, the second pour can begin.

We mix resin the same way as before only this time we pour a little differently, we also will add the fiberglass matte now, cutting two squares of matte the same size as the inside square of the mold top surface looking into the top of the mold.

We do not wait in this 2nd pour for any set up of the mixture this time, rather work immediately after mixing.

Pour 1/3 of the contents into the lower mold on top of the 1st pour, lay the pre-cut fiberglass matte into the resin letting it soak up the resin poured into the bottom. A stick is useful in positioning the matte so it lays flat, do not use fingers, its more problem than its worth.

Pour another 2/3 of the resin into the mold onto the soaked matte.
Wait an hour to set up firm...The purpose of the fiberglass matte layers is to minimize cracking, some may occur, that's alright.

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Pic of fiberglass matte laid into space.

"note the difference in the back mold wall heights in the last two pics this is because we decided to bring the pour up to level with the roof in our pour."

When ready repeat the 2nd pour step...this is the 3rd pour.
This 2nd matte is placed into the mold, soaked the same way, with the rest of the resin poured after it. Let this firm up...If this last pour does not bring up the level of the resin to the level plane of the roof then repeat until it does...If another pour (a 4th) is done do it as a catch up pour without the matte.

After this sets up firm and the top of the poured resin is at the roof level you can disassemble the form exposing the resin chunk, this will set up for 24 hours to be sandable, a couple of days to be safe, it may crack slightly on the top, this is normal.

Click to view attachment
Molded feature reveled after mold is disassembled, ready to shape in 2 days.

This ends chapter 4, the discussion continues in chapter 5 of Side Vent Modification...Adding a side range hood exhaust vent flat cover outside to a curved hull.
Kenna & Harry

Harry,

I am a new member and also a new owner of a 1972 Astro; just brought home this past Saturday. When I first looked at it the owner and elderly widowed lady who had in her backyard the last 10 years had a make shift wood top. So I assumed it was a Havasu with damage or compact with damage. The name plates are exactly as yours are and the pop-up top portion is gone. I took the infested wood off in moments after getting it home. It needs a lot of work but the original range, sink and body are in great condition.

I picked it up for $300.00 knowing it needs work. Thanks for all the updates on yours, I will most likely be reducing the length of the dining area; takes to much of the 9 foot length.

Hope I did this right and attached the pictures.

-Debbie

Debra,

We are so excited!!!! Another Astro, what a deal!!!!! 300.00.

My wife Kenna is from San Francisco... Hunters point district and Pasifica!!!

We are so Bloody Happy here

Its been lonely here with so many lovely box trailers and no Astro to keep us company.


Our Astro's if you notice have the external corrugations molded into the hull body that strengthens it...

So far I have not seen any of the other box designs that have it.

We are currently remodeling ours now but we have always used a permanent bed set up.

While we are composing these posts as fast as we can the pics needed to post are many more to go and many many are not able to be posted.

Also we have the original flowered cushions complete no damage which we boxed up decades ago in good shape in the attic, the stove parts we have stored too (so you have extra parts) which are discontinued parts and are available, we have the ice box, we went ammonia refrigerator years ago. Extra water tanks as well. You might want them, and much more.

If I have an email, P.M. one I can send the whole picture album too...Presently I am setting up a photo bucket account with the many pictures I cannot post so members can see them and pick thru them.

I can make a mold of the Astro's pop top if needed, or outline and pattern the scissors assembly if you need it since you have the pop top hole and no top...the pop top lift assembly is slightly different too...I also have a pattern for the pop top canvas I have...We are thinking of ordering a new one, this one is still good...zippered windows with screens.

Feel free to "P.M." me. "personal message system"

Happy Camping, Safe Trails.

Kenna and Harry

I hear bagpipes!!!

Harry,

Thanks so much I would love to know what you have. Right now it need a lot of airing out. Pretty molded on the outside and just to closed in for long. The top is fantastic news. I had a 89 Westfalia and was even thinking of improvising in a similar fashion. Being 5- 6" even just putting a molded skylight on would have worked. Additionally Harry, I was glad it fit in my garage. Storage in the City is quite expensive.

Click to view attachment My email is DebraNebreda[at]aol.com ( first and last name). I just sold my 1975 Montgomery Wards Camping Trailer that I restored and when I went last week to take it of Craigslist the Astro is what I found. Naturally, I ran over and purchased it- just as I was swearing off projects. At any rate, yes when you have time please tell me what you have and attached is a picture of my old rig ( had to share...)

Thank you again,

Debbie

P.S. Tell your wife I live in Daly City, next town from Pacifica.

Vent Modification...Adding a side Range hood exhaust vent flat cover outside to a curved hull continued.

This is chapter 5 of our side vent modification discussion. "Sand, sand and sand"

Click to view attachment
Coners are sanded down a bit, see "cracks" [at] 2 days cured.
Looking at the picture you can see the cracking we were mentioning earlier in the posting, this is normal for this product, there are resins specifically designed to do this kind of work with a more minimal cracking issues but frankly they are not worth it as the repairs are easy to do...

The intuitive thing to do is to pour resin, the same resin the block is made of into the cracks...It will work...Clean with acetone first then soap and water and rinse, make sure its really dry and go ahead and pour resin into cracks...Use the waxy tape trick with the metal tape backing it up and holding the waxy tape wax side towards the work... Tape it in such a way that the poured resin does not leak out. Let it set 24 hrs before sanding at +75 degrees. Repeat step if needed.

What WE do is fill with loctite 5 min epoxy because we like this better, you do not wait around 24 hrs, its the same cleaning steps, but only two hours to cure.

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We use loctite 5 min epoxy as a filler because its quick.

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Clean all silicone off the outside used to origionally seal epoxy from leaking out...
DO NOT SAND IT OFF!!!

_________________________________________________________________

***Point of Interest... Sanding silicone off is not a smart idea, the epoxy or urathanes as coatings used in the final coating process will not adhere to areas that were sanded with silicone present...Sanding silicone works it into the resin and makes it un-manageable with these coating products as coatings over this boo boo...IF THIS HAPPENS, then after sanding paint area with resin...Sand lightly with 200 grit paper after its cured with the non repaeating orbital sander using a vacuum set up...THIS then is the new surface to coat over....
NO EXCEPTIONS.

Click to view attachment
Get the little imperfections of resin cast around edges of vent cleaned up.

Starting with the belt sander and 100 grit belt sand the top of the resin block flush with roof...this sander IS attached to a vacuum recovery system described in "Fan-tastic fan remodel chapter" then switch to the Non repeating orbital sander with vacuum attached using 80 grit disks and round all corners making the unit look nice.

When sanded to round corners of our liking, the last thing we do is sand of the 45 degree vent cover completely off...This is to finally make the platform for the second vent cover which will screw on this pre-cast platform now built as an integral part of the hull...We will show the final appearance of this vent remodel in the "hull finishing work" chapter much later on.

Click to view attachment
Sand of 45 degree rain hood creating a flat surface.

The concludes the Vent Modification...Adding a side Range hood exhaust vent flat cover outside to a curved hull.

Oh yah we done it!!!

Refrigerator Vent Modification...Installing a refrigerator roof vent without screws, permanently leak proof & make it changeable in 2 minuets too. "Oh! and its leak proof."
Chapter one...What we are going to do...
We hate screws in the roof on our fiberglass trailer. While the rounded roofs have an advantage shedding water fast, the square tops do not, hail is a joke accumulating and melting causing condensation inside while outside pooling water forms shallow ponds.

The roof mounted vent for an absorption refrigerator is the best way to go, however conventional installs require many screws, these are a real pain and a source of leaks way to often. If not now then later. This adaption we will discuss and show can be used in square fiberglass trailers including the quirky round dome homes that shed water off their bald noggins enviously.

In our very lengthy preamble to this thread turning into quickly the source of callouses on my two typing pinky's we stated...(1) Eliminate all screw penetrations in the roof particularly. and (2) 1st epoxy the refrigerator top exhaust vent system into the trailer roof over its refrigerator compartment from within the shell/hull, then mount a second identical twin vent over the outside of the first vent epoxied into place permanently earlier, this outside identical vent fits snugly "like a glove" one over the other prior epoxied in place.

This is the post that will show the process to do this.
A teaser pic is below showing the vent in place, no screws, water tight in a fiberglass shell.

Click to view attachment
This view shows the vent in place, note the flange is not on top of the roof!

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This view shows a view looking up, from inside the refrigerator compartment where the refrigerator slides in, note the bottom flange of the vent is here!

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This is a straight up view, looking from the bottom shelf where the refrigerator weight sits looking up at just where all that nasty heat goes...

Now you might cheat saying, that "yes the pics explain everything"...to which we answer "huh no they do not".

Material is everything...Be careful what you ask for!

Not all plastics bond to fiberglass well, or work with the same bonds.

The choice of your plastic vent is very important, some of these guys are polypropylene (stay away) The epoxy resins will not bond at all with these plastics...S.M.C. (sheet molding compound) is relatively new but a favored production
method...or styrene plastics.

On the bottom of plastic made stuff there is a code stamped there by the industry, a triangle with a number or a "iso" number.

Below is a trade paper "one of them" to describe the point for intrepid readers...
http://www.ftc.gov/os/comments/greenpkgworkshop/534743-00034.pdf

The point is to be aware not all plastics will bond well...

Look for vents that are V (vinyl/ polyvinyl chloride) (PVC) or PS (polystyrene) to do this...
Next you ARE GOING TO USE A TWO PART EPOXY BOND.

We always run tests with the bond on the material and see if it peels off...if in doubt test.

Stuff you will need...
2 bottles of locktite two part epoxy bond (Lowes, or Homedepot)

Click to view attachment
Look for this...

You will need Acetone.
A Non-repeating orbital sander with vacuum attachment to a vacuum system described and shown in the "Fan_Tastic fan modification" thread before this one.
50 ish grit sanding disks
100 ish grit sanding disks

Nitrile "Derma Lite" disposable gloves.
Polypropylene flat scrapper
2 identical refrigerator vents of appropriate size and material for glue and fiberglass.

Click to view attachment
My favorite "Barker" refrigerator roof vent. (try eBay first)

(Note see: Vent Modification...Adding a side Range hood exhaust vent flat cover outside to a curved hull ) for stock numbers or sources.
A dremel tool set or the like would be useful..
A side grinder with a 4 1/2" metal cut off wheel.
Organic respirator filter, nose and face protection...no exceptions.
Safety glasses...
Ear protection.
Drill.
Roto-zip saw,(spiral saw) or jig saw with an abrasive blade for plastic.

A good sense of humor, and a willingness to be daring...

This ends Chapter 1...The rest of the discussion will continue in Chapter 2 of
Refrigerator Vent Modification.

Since this writing is in process and this thread is being written as we go keep checking this thread...it will appear.

Happy Camping, Safe Trails.
Harry & Kenna

Refrigerator Vent Modification...Installing a refrigerator roof vent without screws, permanently leak proof & make it changeable in 2 minuets too. "Oh! And its leak proof."

Chapter 2."Cutting the hole." First make a model..."cut out model"... To draw the hole to be finally cut out of the fiberglass hull, use the bottom opening hole of the vent to be inserted thru the roof into the trailer hull hole to be cut out. This cardboard model does not included the measure of the flange itself!!! "the space around the outside bottom of the vent", the logic employed here in this approach takes into account that the vent with the flange must fit from inside the trailer up into the correct size and shape of cut out hole so that the flange can be epoxied in place permanently from underneath the roof cut out for it.

Making a flat cardboard model as the hole stencil pattern also helps to position the vent inside the refrigerator compartment space helping position the cut out locations prior to the actual cut out in the fiberglass.

Take the cardboard representation of the exact size hole needed for the vent cone itself excluding the base flange size, drawing on flat cardboard stock cut out the model hole, test the hole by placing the cardboard model over the vent cone, it should fit snugly all around with none of the flange underneath to be seen, the flange around the base of the vent should firmly rest against the cardboard on top of it all the way around on the other side when flipped over...

The actual cut out pattern[/b] to be used in outlining the "cut out" hole to into the fiberglass roof is the one created using this cardboard model.

Our Astro refrigerator top vent needed a certain discrete distance from the pop top roof mechanical scissor and assist spring operations because the roof must clear the vent assembly not affecting these components as the pop top roof goes up and down. The vent needs this clearance not only for the vent cone but also its rain cap, it must be considered in pop top normal operations too so placement is important and needs thought...This was a crucial measurements, attention should be paid to this...

Making sure the base flange of the vent cone to be installed into the roof properly fits by full contact against the bottom of the trailer top roof surface so the RIGHT epoxy adhesion results is why all the modeling is done FIRST.

Click to view attachment

Vent cone, showing the flange to be epoxied underneath the inside hull.


By modeling first we really protect ourselves from two large mistakes, which are two large a "cut out" and bad positioning of the "cut out" in the hull roof interfering with the pop top operations..

What tool to use to do the "cut out"?

When making the cuts in the roof on the lines left by positioning and tracing the card board model we use the side grinder with the 4 ½' metal wheels to cut our straight lines first, then switch to a jig saw with abrasive blades rated for plastic avoiding a toothed blade jig saw blade to cut the rounded ends at the ends of the hole. We have also used a roto-zip or scroll saw too, they both work equally well.

Think Safety Please

We are always wearing full face & eye protection at all times, an organic respirator covering both nose and mouth behind a rubber mask that seals the face anytime we cut fiberglass, the filter mask uses inexpensive filter cartridges to filter air for breathing...Do not use a cheaper paper filter mask because these are not enough, ear plugs with eye protection are recommended too.

Making the "cut out"

Make the cut out from the top of the roof down, "the gel-coat side" use a partner with a vacuum running to suck up dust while cutting, We use a vacuum like the one shown earlier in the "Fan-Tastic Fan Modification" thread it's a worthy precaution. Kenna follows near my cut sucking the fiberglass dust away without hitting the tool in my hands while I cut going slow...There is no fast speed...The slower the better.

The roof "cut out" now made its time to test slipping up the vent up inside the cut hole adjusting the size of the hole into a tight uniform fit around the vent by shaving or sanding as appropriate.

Click to view attachment

View of the "cut out" looking from the bottom of refrigerator up.

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View from the top roof of hull after the cut.

Why the a tight fit again?

After the cut out is made being tested regarding a snug fit, a good light clean up of the "cut out hole" edges is done "we use a coarse sanding sponge" then a wire brush on a drill is useful to clear any old interior paint back away from the contact edges that will be epoxied to the vent flange, the interior hull resin should be open to contact with no paint residue with the vent flange for the bonding epoxy, use the drill wire brush to clean and clear back the contact hull resin surface of the hull clean with Acetone before its bonded...Do Not Use Acetone on Vent

The goal is to be able to place epoxy around the top of the flanged base of the vent cone, then pressing the vent cone up from inside the trailer into the roof hole tightly until the flanged base with the epoxy bond on it presses tightly against the inside bottom of the roof/ hull leaving only the cone of the vent protruding above the roof line.

Click to view attachment

Tools to clean any interior coating around the hole, clean to resin so flange bonds plastic to plastic.


***Warning***Do Not clean the vent with Acetone!!! just the hull resin.


The reason why?


"Do not use Acetone to clean the vent"…No one can really know today what plastic is used in the vent plastic or the blend formulations making up these parts today or their resistance to solvents. These parts are made in counties mostly that do not regulate well their plastic industries to save costs in manufacture.
If you must use any solvent on any plastic part TEST IT FIRST . Use an area that will be unseen and test the material and solvent you are using.

Favorite tricks or stuff?

In our minds the 5 min loctite epoxy (Homedepot or Lowes) is the only way to go.

We use a piece of scrap ply and a scrap 2X4 cut to the right length to put together to press up against the bottom of the installed vent, pushing against the floor holding up the ply against the bottom of the placed vent, hold this in place for 20 minuets with 5 minuet epoxy to set properly.

When the epoxy bond is set up there will be a slight fill needed topside between the hull roof and the vent cone/body to fill any gaps left there, filling up of any minor space with a back-fill of epoxy bond or a good epoxy fairing compound like Interlux "water tite".

Click to view attachment

Vent pushed thru "cut out" hole and bonded underneath using flange.



Note of interest...You need to know this...

A very important reason to epoxy seal ANY cut out into the trailer hull is the phenomenon of wicking moisture...A cut out in a fiberglass hull for even the most usual reasons like water fill ports or cargo doors can expose a material weakness intrinsic to any the fiberglass hull.

Any hole cut into the trailer hull produces a ragged edge of fiberglass and resin mix around the cut providing an excellent point to wick any liquid around its circumference. Its the most overlooked area in trailer modifications, the fix is a simple one, take epoxy bond or epoxy resin and hardener sealing it completely or soak resin or epoxy into the fibers at the edges of any"cut out" by daubing it in at the edges of the cut...Any cut. We usually sand it very lightly when the resin or epoxy bond is set up, just to keep the"cut out" smooth but sealed well still.

"For the purpose of this post, this above step is why we instruct to fill any gap in the paragraph before this one."

When the coatings are applied after this step to the refrigerator vent and its seal our trailer roof refrigerator vent actually looks as if it were molded in.

If you are not using a total exterior coating replacement in favor of just a touch up around the vent modification the application of any top coat will make the vent look better.


***Tip***When choosing an exterior coat or touch up use a U.V. stabilized coating as bonds or resins are not U.V. stabilized and will deteriorate if exposed to intense sun to long rather quickly.

Remember we wanted two identical vents?

Taking the second identical vent now simply place it over the epoxied into place twin vent cone bonded into the hull...

We put a self adhesive foam protective strip under the bottom flange of this second identical vent cone, the foam prevents vibration scratches to the coating finish on the hull roof from the unprotected flange vibrating against it...This second vent cone functions as a slip cover being held on by two screws on the side.

This makes change outs easy, the rain cap or top is held into place by two more screws, since this modification requires two complete vents this leaves us with one extra cap.

This concludes the topic thread on Refrigerator roof vent modification (And its leak proof!!!)

Happy Camping, Safe Trails.



Harry & Kenna

Hey Harry,

Great thread...

Sounds like your recovery is going well too. Glad to hear it. All the best.

RJ

Robert,

Thanks for the well wishes mate, a few on F.B.R.V. have been sending positive comments, they are welcome by me, I am growing my hair back other than being bored stiff its been a cake walk up until now, but the bills are rolling in like bird shot in duck season...Glad you like the thread, I will try to keep it going until the unseen forces on F.B.R.V. tell me other wise...or the wifey pulls on the leash.

Cheers
Harry

This Post within the Astro modification thread will deal with the elimination of the front window, reinforcing side window modifications and adding cargo doors.

The front window in any fiberglass trailer is a challenge, over the years Kenna and I have not really used it. With its butyl seal as a source of leaks periodically when speeding down a rain soaked highway facing hurricane winds it was a source of irritation for us.

When we first got the F.B.R.V. trailer we tried to utilize the trailer as designed, but not much to our liking. The cushions that made up the bed when it was set up to sleep were awful to lay on after the age of 40. In the first decade of our ownership in our 30s the idea of separate convertible dining and sleeping areas appealed to us, but after that the idea left our minds in favor of a permanent cozy bed with a nice thick lovely mattress and a dog.

The large comfy bed with no cushions to move apart letting our middle age derrieres slip down between the gaps onto the cold hard boards beneath was right up our alley. The kids gone now the larger trailer sold, the Astro was our good friend again having been stored but not forgotten, but Astro was showing its age now.

The glass front window made for colder heads at older ages too, also wet heads in cold weather so we determined to removed it, then we strengthened the wall thickness around the two remaining side windows, because stress fractures were showing up in the corners of the window "cut outs".

The bed rebuilt several times as a permanent bed by 2009 would be rebuilt again only this time we were putting in cargo doors underneath the bed for stowage we desperately needed, insulating the bottom of the bed with 1" foam sandwiched between two strong ply wood pieces provides a foundation for the bed in one ply wood layer, the other plywood layer provides for the roof of the cargo compartment.

We used insulated cargo doors purchased at Arizona R.V. Salvage that when opened would allow us to reach all the way thru to the other side of our created space. The plywood roof ensured that the compartment once locked was insulated and secure.

These cargo door "cut outs" like the window "cut outs" would be reinforced like the windows were, also an obstacle to over come would be relocating the water heater from the port side front to a rear facing location, the cargo door "cut outs" on this side were smaller that the "cut out" in the fiberglass hull the water heater used needing to be re-sized now for the new smaller sized cargo doors.

All holes would be closed up, water fill holes, drains, the works.

This thread is just how we did it, some teaser pics shows the inside front area after the end of the project discussed in this thread. If you want to do this modification then read on as we add to it as time permits.

The inside tricks we use will be shared, we wanted to use everyday materials getting body shop results, the outside of the front window modification will be handled in the chapter named (Body Repairs) "Eliminating the scars of trailer life" We will in this thread focus on the inside stuff. Its our hope that we can take the mystery out of making major modifications in F.B.R.Vs, its easier than you think?

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Picture of the end product of inside of window modifications.

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Picture of window with reinforced sides x4.

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Window showing the reinforced sides plus the cargo door "cut outs" below for the future cargo compartment.