All Electric Egg Camper

[Mike Montville]

It's one of those "makes the news" items. People get killed several times a day in automobile accidents, but we still drive. Something makes the news about a person getting hurt, then we better not ever do or use what ever hurt that person, still we drive our automobiles. A tree falls onto a house and destroys the house, local news. A gas leak causes a house to blow up, national news. Still we drive our automobiles.

More fires are caused by electrical problems than natural gas/propane and space heaters cause the greater number of house fires.

Propane is safer for cooking than many other heat sources. In fact the BSA (Boy Scouts) have banned white gas(Coleman Fuel) and alcohol stoves and use propane or butane stoves.

If you're uncomfortable using propane, that's fine. But be aware that some of the alternatives are more likely to cause problems than propane is.

During a natural or non-natural disaster I'll have enough propane to cook with for a couple weeks or more.

Am I detecting some anger ?
I'm not saying don't use it. I'm saying, I choose not too. At least with an electrical fire you have time to get out and get too safty, Propane, not so much.

I'm not trying to change what you do, or telling you what to do. I simply offered up some information on what I did with my boler and why.

Mike

[Donna D.]

Everyone stay calm. And there's no need to reiterate your position.

[Byron Kinnaman]

Am I detecting some anger ?
I'm not saying don't use it. I'm saying, I choose not too. At least with an electrical fire you have time to get out and get too safty, Propane, not so much.

I'm not trying to change what you do, or telling you what to do. I simply offered up some information on what I did with my boler and why.

Mike

NO NO!... No anger here.
Just pointing out that sometimes things aren't always as they appear at first blush. Also, that our news media will make things look a lot worse than reality and as a result we tend to make decisions based on that limited information. I had heard about the two houses where a gas leak caused them to blow up, national news. More houses were destroyed by wind than gas leaks. I'm just trying to point out that there's more than one way to look at things that might put us in danger.

For me, it's a matter of putting things into perspective. There are millions of RVs on the road, most have propane systems. If it was big problem it would be banned. Therefore, I have no problems with propane. I do have a propane detector, a smoke detector and a CO detector in my trailer.

If a person has a fear of such things, then by all means go with the fear. You'd never be able to enjoy a camping trip if you spent all your time worrying about the propane system. That's what it's really all about is enjoying the great outdoors. That's not meant to criticize you or anybody else, for that matter. So, enjoy your trailer!

[Gina D.]

Mike has mentioned he lost a personal friend due to propane and that in itself, even if it was the only issue ever in history with it, would make me leery too.

I was hospitalized from an electric blanket malfunction once. I am fully aware that this was a fluke and very rare, however, to this day, I do not use one, and won't unless I am freezing to death and it's the only thing available. I do actually own one, it was a gift from someone who didn't know, but it has only been used once and not by me.

We need to get back to the practicalities of Cathy's original question. Which is, would you go all electric, and if not, why not?

It's a good question, but lets keep it to what works best for you and why. I am sure she can learn from our collective experiences and make her own decision.

[Mike Montville]

NO NO!... No anger here.
Just pointing out that sometimes things aren't always as they appear at first blush. Also, that our news media will make things look a lot worse than reality and as a result we tend to make decisions based on that limited information. I had heard about the two houses where a gas leak caused them to blow up, national news. More houses were destroyed by wind than gas leaks. I'm just trying to point out that there's more than one way to look at things that might put us in danger.

For me, it's a matter of putting things into perspective. There are millions of RVs on the road, most have propane systems. If it was big problem it would be banned. Therefore, I have no problems with propane. I do have a propane detector, a smoke detector and a CO detector in my trailer.

If a person has a fear of such things, then by all means go with the fear. You'd never be able to enjoy a camping trip if you spent all your time worrying about the propane system. That's what it's really all about is enjoying the great outdoors. That's not meant to criticize you or anybody else, for that matter. So, enjoy your trailer!

Few,
I'm glad, I was starting to think I had offended you in some way or another and that was defintely not my intent. Happy camping.

[Booker B.]

Back to the original topic - the all electric egg camper. There was a very nice Trillium trailer nearby that we turned down because it was all electric. In the last 3 years we have camped extensively and not once have we been at a campground that was serviced. In British Columbia we have both unserviced Provincial Parks and unserviced Forestry Campgrounds and by far they are the nicest camping areas here.

That said, we likely won't be using the propane features extensively unless it gets cold enough to turn on the furnace - we will still be cooking outside on our coleman propane stove and using our good old propane lantern - in fact I have spoke to others who don't even use the fridge as they are pretty small and have to pack coolers anyways.

For us, the move to a trailer from our tents was due to my wife and I's 40 year old aches from lying on the ground and the lack of desire to do a daily setup and tear down of the tents when go campsite jumping on longer trips.

[Donna D.]

And I on the other hand am always hooked up... or at least have been so far. I find for myself, I can be alone in a crowd. So, it's not them... it's me. I was going to pull all the propane out of my trailer, but figured since it's there... I'd just leave it. For that 1 in a million chance of needing it in a time of crisis. When it's cold, I use a cube heater rather than the propane. I mean, I've paid the campground for the services, might as well use it. I don't have a problem of using propane, at least not a fear. I've got Natural Gas appliances in my home... not much difference.

I feel fortunate to live in a beautiful state with beautiful parks. I know others aren't so fortunate.

[Bonnie]

I am going all electric (120v and 12v) with the Play Pac. It came down to what type of camping I'm planning. While I will be attending festivals that don't have hookups, most will. I don't anticipate a lot of dry type camping, but will be able to do what I need with the portable grill and 1lb propane canisters. I don't intend to cook inside the trailer. If I do, it will using be a hotplate or a crock pot.

I guess my thought is, define what your style is then choose the camper fittings that fit.

I am investing in Solar to make the 'all electric' feasible. It's been a blast planning and plotting this adventure. I am, however, making sure I leave the option of adding propane later, if I so choose.

Heating, if it became a survival issue, could be done with vented windows and candles. During the '06 ice storm (10+ days of weather in the low teens and no power) I managed to keep my bathroom pipes from freezing with vented use of tealights candles. I used muffin tins in the shower or bathtub and kept the candles going 24/7. Both bathrooms stayed quite warm, almost hot. I didn't lose any plumbing and that was the objective.

I am coming from a primitive camping background and find myself hesitant about adding lots of extra 'stuff' to the PP. Not that I don't wonder what it will eventually look like. And I've certainly learned a thing or two watching and reading the exchanges on this board.

One of the absolute best pieces of advice I've seen is start camping and only add what you really want/need.

[Greg A]

All electric would be a good choice if you will spend a high proportion of time camping with facilities.
I think it is much more important to put in a good 12v system with LED/Cold Cathode lighting and solid battery, then it is propane. Then maybe add a solar unit to allow more capability. We were out for seven days last week and used the LED lights at night even though we had facilities. On day five I hooked up the charger and the battery was still at 14.6, so it looks like I could go about 14 days off the grid with my lighting system.
One simply has to add a good cooler, a Coleman stove, portable heater and you're a boondocker with the lil 1 lb propane bottles you can pick up anywhere.
Without a good 12V lighting/electrical system, even in a park with facilities, storms take out their utilities and you would be in a not desirable situation.

[Gina D.]

Greg brings up a good point. When I traveled to Oregon one really wet Christmas, storms had taken out power all along the northern California coast.

That, unfortunately, was my route. I was in my 13 footer and I was turned away from one park that lost power. I was kindly sent to another that was still up, but the power went down periodically. I set up like I was without power and managed fine during outages because I have back ups for boondocking. (Including lanterns and a one burner bbq/stove.)

I ran the fridge on propane and heat as well. The battery stayed up to run the heater and I do cook inside, so all was as it would normally be.

Personally, I would not be without propane as I use all the stuff it was put in for and am far too dependent on a reliable heating source. I go camping in FS campgrounds etc, AND I use the trailer as a motel room for travel, temp housing as well. When I have the hook ups, it's nice to use the 110 options, but I don't want to be restricted.

[Palmer M]

When I started this full-timing adventure, I was on shore power almost every night,
and a 2 or 3 day trip off shore power had no apparent effects on the 12V system.
Then I started working 3-4 days at a time off shore power, and quickly killed a couple
of batteries!

The propane is pretty efficient and predictable -
Winter - 1 20lb tank lasts about a week
Summer - 1 20 lb tank lasts about 3 weeks.
Incredibly, the cost of propane hasn't skyrocketed like other fuels. In late '04, I was paying
$11-15 per tank; today I am paying $13 per tank locally.

The things that run off propane - 1 tank of hot water every day, kettle of water for coffee,
refrigerator, and the furnace - use a lot of BTUs, something that the battery power could
only provide for a few hours, really. Generating heat via electricity is, generally speaking,
very inefficient. Heat from electricity is basically a big short circuit through a big wire!

I added a modest 15 watt solar panel and have plenty of power for the lights, water pump,
furnace fan, even hours of 12V television/movies in the evening. Every day by late lunch,
even on the shortest day of winter, the battery is back at full charge. I haven't seen the
charge go below about 50-60% since adding the solar panel, which is good for battery
longevity.

I wouldn't dream of powering things like hot water, cooking, heat, or refrigeration electrically
using solar power/DC battery(s). Not even if I had 50-80 watts solar, because, electrically
speaking, these utilities use KILOwatts of energy! You would need to deploy about an acre
of solar panels to power these utilities.

I think that any all-electric rig would realistically need to be plugged into shore power at least
every couple of days, and you would want to make sure to be disconnected from your tow vehicle
while using any electricity.

Mike, you don't specify the particular accident that caused your friend's death, but if you are
able to post the details, I and probably others would appreciate it as a safety lesson.

I agree with Bonnie: camp out first, then add what you need.
With a little solar boost, and the energy density of propane, my rig works great all the time
with basically no thought or maintenance required.

P

[Cathy P.]

In our case right now we have a lot of tent camping equipment: Buddy Propane Heater, Sierra Cook Stove (burns pinecones or whatever you have), Coleman AC/DC Cooler, Lanterns, etc., one of those Breeze Fantastic Fans that runs on DC and some heavy duty sleeping bags, an inverter and I can't remember what else. So, we have all that hardly used We just bought one of those cool crank-type weather radios. So, I guess we would just need to find places for this stuff. (For emergencies - well, if you sit down and make a list for your needs I think you will be blown away as even in a house the list and figuring out how to get and maintain all the elements is mind boggling.) Cathy

[Suz]

I appologize if this has already been address, but if not I'd like to point something out. The 12v fridge in the Egg Camper is NOT the same as our two or three way RV refrigerators. These are a compressor refrigerator designed to run on 12V in boats, trucks, rvs, etc. They are much more efficient both in cooling and power usage. One could easily camp "off the grid" with a small solar panel or for a couple of days without one.

I would love to be able to camp off the grid, but with the Texas heat, going without air conditioning isn't comfortable for me.

[Suz]

Even so, I think I would prefer propane for cooking and the water heater.

One of the nice things about the Egg Camper is that you can actually get a 12V refrigerator AND a propane stove if you so desire.

As we always say, decide what you want, then find the camper that suits your needs. If you want all electric, then I think the EC is absolutely a wonderful choice.

[Palmer M]

Suz
I meant to mention that. I've been shopping for a 12V compressor refrigerator to replace the 3-way.
The consumption figures on the ones I've seen look like even my panel could handle it easily.
The T@Da trailer has a fridge like that. I think it's a NorCold.
P

[Howard]

The way I camp or travel is not for everyone but it works for me. No propane, no wired electric, no refrigerator, etc. Depending on what I am traveling in my fuel is either mogas, avgas, kerosene or diesel. Lights are liquid fuel lanterns or candles. All food is dry or canned or now foil pouch. if I have access to or am traveling with some one in their rig which has electric or propane I will enjoy it,
but don't need it.

Howard

[Nancy]

Gee Howard, don't you use cow pies?

On our trips cross country I think about how comfortable we have it. Roughing it was walking across the plains, hunting for the food, never having a fridg.

Fred and I are happy with ice for the cooler. I love having my propane stove for coffee and wash water. I am really happy I was not a pioneer.

Nancy

[Pete Dumbleton]

I once camped next to a lady in a small sticky who had no electric in the trailer except the running lights. She did everything with candles, LP range and ice cooler. I've seen other folks who had some nice oil lamps.

Bottom line is YOUR camping style.