An update from Lil Snoozy Land - Page 3 - Fiberglass RV


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Old 03-22-2013, 07:13 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by Bill in Pittsburgh View Post
As I have said in other threads, Lil Snoozy being an all electric camper manufacturer need not be a deterrent to a persons interest in their product. They offer a really nifty "Propane Ready" option that allows a propane company located a few miles from their plant to do a retrofit in a minimal amount of time and at a very reasonable cost. Lil Snoozy is not insured for propane installation but is always eager to please their customers. After taking delivery, you simply drive down the road a few miles and the propane company can install your propane and appliances in less than two hours!

Can't beat that, Bill.
The nicest thing I love about the Snoozy, besides the owners (I've met both father and son), is the HUGE windows! IT made the Snoozy so bright inside. BTW....I'm 6' 5", and I had no problem with room inside the Snoozy. They sure have come a long way with their decals....etc.
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Old 03-22-2013, 08:48 PM   #30
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The interior width is 6.5 feet.

Surge brakes would be undesirable for a cargo carrier because the weight changes constantly. I've written to Nicholas for a price quote and specified that normal electric brakes would be desired for the cargo hauler I'm after. It would seem simple enough to delete the surge unit and add a 7 pin plug, so a controller in the tow vehicle could apply the brakes instead of an inertia device.
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Old 03-22-2013, 08:55 PM   #31
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Good idea...

Frankly, I think that surge brakes are a bad idea in any kind of towing except perhaps for rental outfits that have to deal with folks that don't have controllers...but I'm very conservative in that department!

Francesca
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Old 03-23-2013, 11:57 AM   #32
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Yes, being able to apply trailer brakes without tug brakes is a great safety tool should sway ever start.

I'm still waiting for someone to say what kind of axle is under the Snoozy.... maybe an owner? In the back of my mind I think they are torsion axles, but I am no longer sure.
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Old 03-23-2013, 12:14 PM   #33
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Mike, Snoozy does use rubber torsion axles, but have Disc brakes activated by surge control unit. If electric braking is desired, I think magnetic/drum brakes would have to be used. Does anyone know if electric disc brake are available for trailers?
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Old 03-23-2013, 12:30 PM   #34
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Disc brakes are hydraulically actuated but there are methods of "converting" them to electric/manual actvation via an onboard brake controller. Here's one such method.

For trailers as small as ours I think there's little gain in using disc brakes, but there are those who disagree.

I wonder if the Snoozy's available with standard electric brakes? Correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought they got their frame/axle assemblies from a boat trailer supplier and that they all come with surge-type drum brakes due to some preference for drum over disc in marine applications.

Francesca
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Old 03-23-2013, 12:35 PM   #35
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Francesca, their web site pictures shows disc. Disc brakes work much better than drum brakes when wet. I don't know about preferences when it comes to salt water though, as materials used for disc might not like the salt.
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Old 03-23-2013, 12:38 PM   #36
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So they do come with disc- thanks, David!

Francesca
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Old 03-23-2013, 01:43 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by Francesca Knowles View Post
So they do come with disc- thanks, David!

Francesca
Yes, they do have disc brakes, and yes they sit on a boat trailer.
I asked Alan if they had the floating versions yet. He said it would float if the door under the bed was sealed and the back door was sealed. lol.
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Old 03-23-2013, 08:26 PM   #38
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Thanks for the axle and brake info. I had forgotten completely about the disc brakes, but now I recall having heard it before.

It can float, eh? We'll have to see about a transom and an outboard motor!
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Old 03-23-2013, 08:43 PM   #39
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Yes, being able to apply trailer brakes without tug brakes is a great safety tool should sway ever start.
I understand the logic, but I have never had any reason to want to manually apply our Boler's brakes. We don't use any kind of weight distribution or anti-sway device, and there is nothing special about the trailer.

Between the Boler, a club's travel trailer, various borrowed flat decks, a couple of car transporters, our utility trailer, and a U-Haul rental, the only time I have had a sway issue was with the old travel trailer being used to carry equipment to an event which had been unloaded and re-loaded without being unhitched, so I didn't notice that someone had piled everything at the back - it had negative tongue weight and I had a tense few seconds on the highway!

A drag 'chute might be a handy backup for high-speed brake failures, but I don't carry one...
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Old 03-23-2013, 08:55 PM   #40
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Does anyone know if electric disc brake are available for trailers?
As Francesca explained, light trailer disk brakes (meaning the calipers) are hydraulic, and an electric-over-hydraulic actuator (such as a Dexter DX) allows them to be run from an electric controller. Heavy trucks and their trailers have air-actuated calipers when they use disk brakes.

There is a direct electrically operated brake caliper design which works very well and is intended for motor vehicles, but would be great for trailers. Unfortunately, it has not made it to production; trailers would not be a sufficient market (especially since the system would be very expensive by trailer standards), and the motor vehicle industry is not ready for "brake by wire" yet:
Siemens VDO Electronic Wedge Brake
There are no electric calipers for road vehicles (either motor vehicles or trailers) in production.
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Old 03-23-2013, 09:12 PM   #41
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Originally Posted by Mike Magee View Post
Surge brakes would be undesirable for a cargo carrier because the weight changes constantly.
That is exactly why I think that surge brakes are good for cargo trailers.

If you use conventional electric brakes, and set the controller to produce the right amount of braking for a given trailer load, it will be wrong for every other load. If you set it for the empty trailer, then double the trailer weight with cargo, the controller will put out the same power for the same rate of deceleration, even though the trailer needs twice as much braking - it will be inadequate. If you set it for the loaded trailer, then halve the trailer weight by leaving out the argo, the controller will put out twice as much power as needed, which will be jerky and may lock up trailer tires.

With surge brakes, the braking force applied is not directly related to deceleration; it is directly related to the force of the trailer pushing against the tug. The proportion of coupler force to braking force is a constant, determined by the sizes of components of the braking system. If the system is properly balanced for the empty trailer, and you double the weight of the trailer and decelerate at the same rate, the system will find a balance in which the force on the coupler/actuator will be twice as high so the hydraulic pressure is twice as high and the trailer braking will be twice as strong. The pushing on the coupler against the tug's ball is small compared to the braking force of the surge-activated system, just as the force you apply to your motor vehicle's brake pedal is small compared to the amount of braking force which results - even without power-assisted brakes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Magee View Post
It would seem simple enough to delete the surge unit and add a 7 pin plug, so a controller in the tow vehicle could apply the brakes instead of an inertia device.
The changes would be
  • substitute plain coupler for surge actuator coupler
  • substitute electric brake assemblies for hydraulic calipers and brackets
  • substitute hub/drums for hub/disks or separate hubs and disks
  • substitute brake wiring and breakaway switch for hydraulic plumbing
I hope the Snoozy comes with a 7-pin - at least in camping versions - to include a power line for charging the trailer's battery from the tug while driving. It's possible that it has only a 4-pin, and in that case there would be a few dollars of connector and cable upgrade.

While these would be custom changes, the actual cost of components would be less in each case, so the change should reduce the price, or at least not increase it (even if an upgrade to 7-pin is required). One caution - if the trailer is not to have a battery, then a breakaway battery would be required as well. Electric is cheaper on the trailer in part because the controller is not included, and in part because the electric approach avoids most of the mechanical components and hydraulic seals.
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Old 03-23-2013, 11:42 PM   #42
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I have towed a utility trailer with surge brakes in the past. With a 3000 lb machine loaded, it was fine. Unloaded, the tires locked up every time the brakes were actuated. I never want such a system again, I have no way to stop the skidding and wear on the tires! With electric brakes, it's a simple matter to reach over and adjust the dial a couple of clicks to lessen the force when the trailer load is lightened. I do it all the time.

I think the easy way would be if Nicholas ordered in a different axle with electric drum brakes. Wiring in a small breakaway battery and a 7 pin plug should be pretty simple.
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