Help right a wrong!!! - Fiberglass RV


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Old 03-28-2003, 11:16 AM   #1
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Help right a wrong!!!

I'm trying to help right a wrong.

At the very least, I'm hoping the vast internet RV family will help express my outrage.

On March 26th, David Koertge, a registered user on www.fiberglassrv.com quickly responded to the following ad listed on auto-rv.com:

1982 16' SCAMP TT, $1,999.
located at PATS CAMPER
www.patcamper.com
DAYTON, OH
1-800-842-4074

As you may or may not know, used tiny molded fiberglass rigs are hard to find, so David was excited about his "find."

"I called and made a deposit with credit card." David said. "I was going to pick up saturday morning but the dealer called and said too bad he sold it to someone the next day."

I called the dealership to verify David's story, and talked with his Pat's Camper salesman, Eric, about the soured deal.

The salesman verified that David had, in fact, put a $500 credit card deposit on the trailer ... but that someone had come in the later who was willing to pay "in-full" for the rig.

"We refunded his deposit to his credit card the next day," said Eric, the Pat's Camper salesman.

Eric explained that the dealership's policy was that a deposit was not enough to "hold" an RV if someone else was ready and willing to pay in full.

I told Eric that I thought that since "money had changed hands," that David would have a legally binding contract, from a legal standpoint.

"We had nothing in writing," the salesman said.

I sincerely believe that we should let the fine folks at Pat's Camper know exactly what we think about their shoddy business practice ... by either email or calling their 1-800 number.

Here is the email form:

http://www.patcamper.com/feedback.htm

Here is the dealership's 800 number: 1-800-842-4074 and its toll number: 937-236-4074

Here is a link to the Dayton, Oh Better Business Bureau:

http://www.dayton.bbb.org/
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Old 03-28-2003, 11:51 AM   #2
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"We had nothing in writing," the salesman said.

Anyone know the fine print rules of being a visa merchant? My bet is that the rv dealership had a legal binding obligation when they took the deposit, they certainly had certainly a moral one.

Is the term "rv dealership and moral obligation" an oxymoron? :o

I wonder what Visa would have to say about this......
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Old 03-28-2003, 12:19 PM   #3
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Bidness Law 301

It's my understanding an oral contract is legally binding (at least in Texas).

Problem is enforcement, since it's difficult to prove (your word against mine).

If you add to the mix a deposit via credit card, though, I would think you'd have all the evidence necessary to prove there was indeed a contract.

I think legally you could require specific performance (that they sell you the trailer), or that you could sue them for damages suffered from their breach of contract.

What Pat's Camper of Dayton, Ohio is apparently counting upon is that it's too much trouble to take 'em to court.

And I'm sure they're right. Might be worth asking a lawyer about, though; or at least worth telling all your friends!

:dance
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Old 03-28-2003, 12:22 PM   #4
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This is terrible. I'm really sorry, David, that this happened to you. I registered a complaint with the Dayton BBB just a minute ago. I also wrote a scathing email to the dealership. Thank you, Charles, for bringing this to our attention. David, PLEASE, contact a lawyer today and see what your rights are in this matter. Maybe you can get your trailer FREE after this! ;)

Nancy
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Old 03-28-2003, 12:28 PM   #5
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>>Better Business Bureau

Thanks Nancy! I also checked. Pat's Camper is not a BBB member. Gee, I'm not surprised.

I also will see to it that David finds a little bitty camper.

Talk about getting your hopes and dreams up ... and then having some shoddy business dash them into the ground!
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Old 03-28-2003, 12:35 PM   #6
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Lousy

I mailed the lousy trader.
I think he will be impressed ;) ;) ;)
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Old 03-28-2003, 01:00 PM   #7
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Ya!

there goes any future chance of selling rv's in Holland! ;)

(thanks Lex!)
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Old 03-28-2003, 02:13 PM   #8
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Shady operators...

Here's the text of my love note to Pat's Camper Sales...

"The wonderful thing about the internet is that the shoddy business practices of unethical operators always come to the fore sooner or later. In the matter of your breach of contract with Mr David Koertge you may have gotten your $1999, but the bad press you're going to reap from that will be worth far, far more to your pocket book than a mere two grand. Luckily for us (too bad for you), RVers are a "connected community" and it will be our pleasure to see to it that we do our best to spread the word about Pat's Camper Sales. (We also spread the word about good outfits that deserve our business. Too bad you're not one of them.)"
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Old 03-28-2003, 05:16 PM   #9
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Thanks for emailing the dealer Robert. I'm hoping lots of folks email them ... or complain to the BBB ... or better yet, cut and paste my original post with details on other RV websites that y'all frequent so we can really let this place know we don't take kindly to them selling a trailer out from underneath one of our own!
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Old 03-28-2003, 07:04 PM   #10
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goes a bit further

Actually this is illegal in OH to the best of my knowledge. So a couple of more things can be done. One file an actual criminal complaint, next file a formal complaint with the state attorney generals office, next hire a lawyer and sue them in front of a jury they will lose big time.

I know an rv dealer in OH and they say once a deposit is taken you have to sell the unit.

Just answering that suit will cost them more than the two grand. Hehe.
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Old 03-29-2003, 03:44 PM   #11
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:wave Hello Charles-
Just wanted to drop you a line to say that I agree with you that David was robbed. I came across the thread in the OPEN ROADS forum. I have sent an e-mail to the dealership explaining my disgust. If the dealers can't police themselves then it is up to the buyers to do it for them. I also will be sending e-mails to the manufactures that make the new lines they carry. The manufacturers don't like to hear things like this even when it doesn't concern one of their products. They still represent that dealer! All the extra pressures help. Their regional managers (manufacturers) will certainly let them (dealers) know if enough people log complaints about their tactics. Great job and good luck David!!!
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Old 03-29-2003, 05:30 PM   #12
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I also sent a short sweet note to the dealer in question here. I did mention I had been in his fair city twice in the last three months and seriously questioned if I felt I could risk doing any business of any type with his company. (Not quite those words)
I was wondering if you were buying a unit thru that company that had to be ordered from the factory. After you gave the deposit and waited the 2 to 6 months for the unit would you have the fear that as you were driving over to pick up the unit he would sell it to some one "with the full price on hand". Then I guess he could put you back on the waiting list and reorder a unit from the manufacturer again.
That would be a nice way for his customers to help him "floorplan" his dealership, at no cost to him.
I would strongly sugest David hire an attorney, one with a lot of teeth.
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Old 03-29-2003, 05:56 PM   #13
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Visa

Rick may have something! David should contact the issuer of his Visa Card. Perhaps if Pat loses the right to be a Visa dealer, it will make an impression on him and his wallet.
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Old 03-29-2003, 07:07 PM   #14
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I too am sour

I am very big on principle and one takes advantage of someone like this it really gets my dander up!

I have not yet e-mailed them because I just heard about this, but you know that I will. SAVE THE VISA RECIPT!!! And contact a lawyer! True you may not be able to get this trailer from the other people but a couple grand in the pocket would be nice to help you find a new one.

Not only the $1999 but the pain and suffering this ordeal has caused! Hey things like this are stressful and people who treat people like this need to be taught a lesson.

Can you just guess how many e-mails this company is going to get??? Man they are bumming... Say good-bye to that salesmans job!:weep

What is the main kind of RV does this company sell? I will also e-mail them. I agree all the pressure on this company the better for David!

Well Keep us all posted and thanks for informing us Charles!
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