LiL Snoozy - Fiberglass RV


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Old 07-31-2019, 05:49 PM   #1
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LiL Snoozy

Just heard a possible rumor on the Facebook page - Lil Snoozy Owners that Wesco boat Trailers has been talking to Alan about the resurrection of the Snoozy. To be continued........
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Old 07-31-2019, 06:20 PM   #2
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There are a few people wanting their deposit back first.
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Old 07-31-2019, 10:41 PM   #3
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There are a few people wanting their deposit back first.

That wouldn't be a first, the new ownership would have zero responsibility to the previous ownership's wrongdoings. If that were the case who in their right mind would start a business up that's already $1,000,000+ in the hole?


What happened really sucks but I don't know how the business was structured. If Richard was simply the name "Lil Snoozy" and Alan retained the molds, building, patents and so on but was renting those assets to Richard unless there is some proof of additional money flowing back into Alan's accounts Richard is the owner of that wrong doing.



I do think that those out money should be given some fair options to restore some faith in the name if the intention is to keep it Lil Snoozy but since it's really such an awful name to begin with I'm not sure Wesco would keep it when Wesco works just fine.



Either way, again, it would be nice if they did what they could to set things right but since it's different people and a different business offering the same product there is no obligation to.
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Old 07-31-2019, 11:01 PM   #4
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I've got a name.
'Boatie McBoatface'
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Old 08-01-2019, 05:58 AM   #5
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Just heard a possible rumor on the Facebook page - Lil Snoozy Owners that Wesco boat Trailers has been talking to Alan about the resurrection of the Snoozy. To be continued........
It must be true if you heard it on Facebook.

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Old 08-01-2019, 06:11 AM   #6
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It must be true if you heard it on Facebook.

trainman

It was Wesco that posted it so it maybe be an rarity like hens teeth, a Facebook truth.
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Old 08-01-2019, 07:53 AM   #7
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It would take more than a name change to restore my confidence in this business. Since some of the same people are apparently still involved, they have an uphill fight. When you burn the soup, you don’t just stir the pot. You skim off the good part into a new pot and start fresh.

The best bet would be to start by selling completed trailers, one model, no orders, to rebuild trust. If Wesco wants to build a couple dozen units on spec, have at it! I’d love to see the molds get used by someone. It was a good design.

Wesco, as the supplier of the trailer chassis on which the Snoozy was built, could be just the right company to step in, provided (1) they’re big enough to fully capitalize the initial production run, and (2) they are “clean” in terms of any collusion in the collapse of Lil Snoozy.
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Old 08-01-2019, 10:29 AM   #8
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Somehow, any new company that tries to pick up the pieces, is going to have to be cleared by the bankruptcy court as not being liable for the debt.

There will have to be new people involved that were not part of the old company.

A new name and a few improvements will separate the old from the new.

Then, trailers will have to be produced, at least at first, with no deposits. They will need to show up on a lot somewhere ready to go, like new cars.

As unfortunate as the losses are to so many, there must be a break in liability such that people won't think they can show up at the door and talk to Richard or Alan and get their money back. It's not gonna happen. There is no money.

Probably new mold that is similar, but not the same, and a new name.

I just don't know how new and different it can be, and still be considered the same thing. Or how much bad taste they can absorb while starting a new business. Or who has deep enough pockets and wants to risk it on this business. There will always be comparisons and the bad story will follow them along.

It's interesting how businesses can fail even if they have a lot of production and a lot of money sloshing around. Hymer is a good example. But they seemed corrupt. Snoozy was unable to meet production. It's a classic problem of cash flow. The fewer you make, the more you have to make on each one to stay afloat.

Oliver is the one who is doing it right. They had a lot of expertise going in, a large manufacturing area, lots of money, no corrupt intentions, strict quality control, and they understand customer relations. They found a market niche that works.

Scamp and Casita are other good examples. They're just stamping them out like donuts, and have been for years.

I just hope Jayco isn't the last man standing, after the next recession. Thor seems determined to wreck everything they touch and the market is flooded with trailers.

Here is the Jayco production line, for anyone who hasn't seen it:

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Old 08-01-2019, 03:06 PM   #9
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John - What is it that you're trying to show in the Jayco video? How fast a sticky is thrown together? Our last camper was a sticky and the workmanship was awful. Unfortunately, it was all hidden and it took us the 3 years we owned it to find out the problems!
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Old 08-01-2019, 03:23 PM   #10
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Jan,

Just showing how different the production can be on various trailers. Some go out of business because they can't produce, some from being dishonest. Some get taken over and the quality plummets. Some just keep going and doing well, like Scamp and Casita, but ar every specialized in their appeal. If the market is saturated in the next recession, who will survive? Jayco maybe? They are cheap and easy to buy, available everywhere with no waiting. But the quality is terrible and the resale, even worse.

Everyone that is considering the purchase of a Jayco, should watch this video. Then look somewhere else for a trailer. But it is still fascinating to see in action. The only advantage I can see is how cheap and easy they are to buy. A way to get the family out camping with no waiting.
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Old 08-01-2019, 04:59 PM   #11
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Just to be clear, Lil Snoozy did NOT file Ch 7 Bankruptcy. Apparently this deal with Wesco was in the works and those of us who have lost our deposits and have moved on may still be out of our money. We're just waiting to hear more from Wesco.
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Old 08-01-2019, 10:43 PM   #12
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Somehow, any new company that tries to pick up the pieces, is going to have to be cleared by the bankruptcy court as not being liable for the debt.

There will have to be new people involved that were not part of the old company.

A new name and a few improvements will separate the old from the new.

Then, trailers will have to be produced, at least at first, with no deposits. They will need to show up on a lot somewhere ready to go, like new cars.

As unfortunate as the losses are to so many, there must be a break in liability such that people won't think they can show up at the door and talk to Richard or Alan and get their money back. It's not gonna happen. There is no money.

Probably new mold that is similar, but not the same, and a new name.

I just don't know how new and different it can be, and still be considered the same thing. Or how much bad taste they can absorb while starting a new business. Or who has deep enough pockets and wants to risk it on this business. There will always be comparisons and the bad story will follow them along.

It's interesting how businesses can fail even if they have a lot of production and a lot of money sloshing around. Hymer is a good example. But they seemed corrupt. Snoozy was unable to meet production. It's a classic problem of cash flow. The fewer you make, the more you have to make on each one to stay afloat.

Oliver is the one who is doing it right. They had a lot of expertise going in, a large manufacturing area, lots of money, no corrupt intentions, strict quality control, and they understand customer relations. They found a market niche that works.

Scamp and Casita are other good examples. They're just stamping them out like donuts, and have been for years.

I just hope Jayco isn't the last man standing, after the next recession. Thor seems determined to wreck everything they touch and the market is flooded with trailers.

I guess I'm just not with you on this. Big companies swallow up smaller companies all of the time, there's talks of Samsung buying up Blackberry currently to think of a major one. Pier 1 is struggling, Rite-Aid as well and their infrastructure gets used for other businesses that are better designed to deal with things.



If Wesco took on the Snoozy project I highly doubt it would be worth it for them to walk away from their company established in 1954 over a few hundred thousand in deposits, if that was the goal they could do that now.



My guess is they have more to lose and there's security in that alone. Nobody knows the structure of things between Alan and Richard. I could be wrong about this but I thought it was a pet project for Alan and his kids weren't interested so he made have used poor judgement in turning control over to Richard but I think this is all speculation.



I would love to see a post from Alan about this for some clarification in how things managed to get this out of control.



Also, I'm pointing no fingers but a 50% non-refundable deposit as a rule should be a HUGE red flag!! That screams all sorts of troubles and issues to me and isn't something I would have gone for as I'm sure it scared off many potential buyers.



There needs to be more focus on prosecution of Richard and transparentcy in what actually happened.
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Old 08-01-2019, 11:50 PM   #13
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Adam,

I know absolutely nothing about any agreement between Snoozy and anyone else. I wonder how it will all get settled legally?

But why in the world would a company take over Snoozy and also take over their debt? I see nothing there except a nice design. But no inventory, no tooling, no cash flow, and now, a bad reputation with angry depositors.

And if someone does that, the people who put down deposits will be all over it and want their money now. So, there would have to be a lot of money available to get out of debt. Steps taken to prove it won't happen again, such as high production with no deposits and trailers on lots to sell. The establishment of relationships with suppliers, a place to build the shells, lots of employees, and all of the general infrastructure to put it all together. All while looking at the limited potential upside and how much market share, profit per unit, total of units they might sell, etc. We're talking millions here, with a limited potential number of sales. And at the very least, starting from scratch to introduce their new trailers and dispel all of the potential negativity.

There doesn't seem to be anything there now at all, that could be used to get a jumpstart on a new business or to even start building more shells. Nothing except a nice design.

That is why I say that if someone wants to build Snoozys, they need to start fresh, with something close to a Snoozy, and have no direct ties to the earlier company. Even that is very hard. Look at Nest. Look at Hymer.

I do not mean to put down the people who lost their money in any way. I wonder how much of the discussion is based on the false hope that they may get their deposits back, if only Snoozy can start up again, instead of the reality that there is no money. I can't imagine an investor seeing Snoozy, in any form that picks up where the left off, as a good investment.

Snoozy had a real chance to be very successful early on. But without investors and a good business model, it could not happen. When they devolved into taking huge deposits while delivery dates went further and further out, and there was friction with suppliers, or getting shells, they were doomed. It's too bad so many buyers could not see that. I am not an insider, but it seems that basically one guy took it over and tried to run it. He may have been well intentioned, but that is a recipe for disaster. Especially if he has never done that sort of thing before and has limited resources.
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Old 08-02-2019, 12:07 AM   #14
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What does Lil Snoozy have that is of any value? Certainly not the name, and apparently no assets.
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