Lil Snoozy or Scamp13 Deluxe? - Fiberglass RV


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Old 11-12-2011, 10:27 AM   #1
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Name: Bill
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Lil Snoozy or Scamp13 Deluxe?

As the time approaches to purchase our trailer, anxiety builds while I determine which trailer is best for us. My goal is to order in time to take delivery the first week in May. I was set on a Scamp 13 Deluxe with front dinette. I now find myself leaning toward a Lil Snoozy. I think the Lil Snoozy offers some benefits like superior construction resulting in less long term maintenance and a more comfortable sleeping area. Down side is it costs more, which I am willing to pay if I end up with a trailer that will provide many years of happy trailering.
My initial concern is the all electric feature. This effects me as my summer camping is in the forest with no electricity. This will not effect my winter camping as I will be lined up in a Florida trailer park with other people trying to escape winter. With the lil snoozy I will need to add a propane stove for summer camping. For refrigeration I will rely on my coolers as I have in past years with my pop-up. Those two problems solved.
So for my questions from lil snoozy owners.
1. Is the cost differential worth it?
2. Will there be adequate ventalation for sleeping in the bed area minus electric fan and air conditioning in the summer. (My summer camping spot is under trees and very well shaded.)
3. I had concern about the small table in the Lil Snoozy, but after talking to the manufacturer (by the way, seems like a great guy and someone I would not hesitate to do business with) was assured that a larger table could be made. Do current owners think there is room for a larger table?
4. Is there room for a floor to ceiling closet on the entertainment side just before the bed area? Or if not there, any other area with-in the trailer?
5. How much does the lil snoozy end up really weighing? I'm finding that the Scamps end up weighing about 30% more than advertised. I need to know dry weight and not packed weight so I can can compare apples with apples. I think the aerodynamics of the Lil Snoozy will compensate for some extra weight when highway traveling, but I will still need to lift it over steep grades on occasion. I now have a Jeep Cherokee with a 6 cylinder, 2 wheel drive, and manual shift. This is the largest gas slurper I ever hope to own. I get about 21 mpg towing our pop-up. An 18 mpg tug is not in my future.
Any other information I can gather will be greatly appreciated and thank you to those that have already addressed some of my concerns.
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Old 11-12-2011, 10:40 AM   #2
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Bill
I thought the Snoozy was a 17' trailer?
If so you won't be comparing Apples to Apples anyway?

To me the 13' Scamp is TINY inside especially the Deluxe with the wood closing it in even more.
If you get the front dinette Scamp then are you also looking to a Snoozy with no Bathroom? If so then the Bathroom space seems like a huge floor to ceiling closet to me.

Also Snoozy will stick more windows pretty much anywhere you like and the bigger ones they install are much bigger than any in a 13' Scamp and the entire window can open for ventilation where the Scamp windows only open 1/2 way.

I just have a tough time comparing these as it seems the Snoozy will just be a much bigger and roomier rig.
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Old 11-12-2011, 11:06 AM   #3
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Having had a 13' Burro and a 16' Uhaul, I would go for the larger one. You can get the Lil Snoozy ready for propane; they just aren't licensed to install it, if I recall correctly.

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Old 11-12-2011, 12:03 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by Ed Harris View Post
Bill
I thought the Snoozy was a 17' trailer?
If so you won't be comparing Apples to Apples anyway?

To me the 13' Scamp is TINY inside especially the Deluxe with the wood closing it in even more.
If you get the front dinette Scamp then are you also looking to a Snoozy with no Bathroom? If so then the Bathroom space seems like a huge floor to ceiling closet to me.

Also Snoozy will stick more windows pretty much anywhere you like and the bigger ones they install are much bigger than any in a 13' Scamp and the entire window can open for ventilation where the Scamp windows only open 1/2 way.

I just have a tough time comparing these as it seems the Snoozy will just be a much bigger and roomier rig.
Thanks I realize the size difference but I really want to determine weight for weight. Actually the Lil snoozy is more comparable to the Scamp 16.
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Old 11-12-2011, 12:22 PM   #5
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Apples and Oranges

I am not opposed to the lil Snoozy nor suggesting you buy a Scamp, though I own one.

Comparing a Scamp 13 to a Lil Snoozy 17 is literally comparing apples to oranges. The Snoozy is internally 40% larger than the Scamp, the Scamp 13 is about 10 feet long inside and the Snoozy about 14 feet.

Personally I would not own an all electric trailer if I planned to be off grid. I notice that some all electric owners add propane, those that do not add propane and camp off the grid typically carry a generator.

All trailers weigh significantly more than their un-optioned, unloaded sale weight. Our Scamp 16 fully loaded for the next 11 months of travel weighs about 650 pounds more than an un-optioned, unloaded Scamp 16. (I believe the un-optioned, unloaded Scamp 16 is about 1750 lbs.)

As to aerodynamics, I doubt there is little diffference between the Scamp or Snoozy. They are virtually the same height and the Snoozy is a little wider.

I certainly expect the Snoozy to weigh more than a Scamp 13 and probably as much or more than a Scamp 16.

As to quality of the rigs, we have a 20 year old Scamp 16 and our son has a 16 year old Casita 16. Both of the rigs could not have looked much better when brand new. As far as I can determine the initial quality of the major fiberglass rigs are high, and more important their staying power is outstanding.

As to table size, we have a 24x30" table and it's easily adequate for two.

As to gas mileage, once you decided on any of the fiberglass trailers, it's more a function of your tow vehicle and the speed you travel and typically not weight with in the bounds of these small rigs. For example, we get 23 mpg at usually 57 mph.
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Old 11-12-2011, 12:43 PM   #6
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Li'l Snoozy was the "new kid in town" and the fascination with it seems to be at the expense of the old darling which was Scamp. I see every "pimple" is magnified and every difference perceived as a flaw!
Well... Li'l Snoozy is about to suffer the same fate, only much sooner than expected. There's now a hot new classmate coming onto the scene named "Parkliner" .... The "flaws" of the "Li'L Snoozy" are bound to come to light!

This is great song and says it all so well... please listen and and overlook the intro. The lyrics are on the screen and they hardly need any editing to apply...
Yahoo! Video Detail for New Kid in Town, Eagles (Lyrics)
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Old 11-12-2011, 12:51 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by floyd View Post
Li'l Snoozy was the "new kid in town" and the fascination with it seems to be at the expense of the old darling which was Scamp. I see every "pimple" is magnified and every difference perceived as a flaw!
Well Li'l Snoozy is about to suffer the same fate, only much sooner than expected. There's now a hot new classmate coming onto the scene named "Parkliner" .... The flaws of the "Li'L Snoozy" are bound to come to light!

This is great song and says it all so well... please listen and and overlook the intro. The lyrics are on the screen and they hardly need any editing to apply...
Yahoo! Video Detail for New Kid in Town, Eagles (Lyrics)
Floyd

How So?

They are tough to compare and the Snoozy has no track record at all.

Plus if it were me I could not live with the name on the side of mine.

Ed
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Old 11-12-2011, 01:12 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by Ed Harris View Post
Floyd

How So?

They are tough to compare and the Snoozy has no track record at all.

Plus if it were me I could not live with the name on the side of mine.

Ed
That's the whole point,,The new kid never has a track record, and no two kids are alike , but there's great power in novelty!
Do you think "Cecilia" by Paul Simon might apply? Probably WAY too subtle, and it is more off-point anyway!
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Old 11-12-2011, 04:13 PM   #9
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Bill, if the (scant few) Snoozy owners don't notice this thread and reply to it, you may want to PM them for answers. You could also ask Nicholas for references (names and contact info of Snoozy owners not on this forum) and contact them directly with your questions; I'm sure that any people Nicholas can refer you to will have given their permission and won't mind a call.

With another optional window added on the other side of the bed, I can't imagine how nighttime ventilation could be inadequate.

As far as table size, there is no substitute for being inside one. I hope you can visit the factory. You could set some cardboard or something on the table, sticking out in the direction you wish to enlarge the table, and see what it's like to maneuver around it. Do the same for the area where you would like a closet... set something on the floor that sticks out like a closet would, and see if it sticks out too far to suit you. If you visit the factory, maybe they will let you take a Snoozy for a test tow. And then you could tow it to a scale and weigh it for yourself.

The Snoozy's price is more comparable to that of a 16' Scamp Deluxe, as is the size. If you know why you were favoring the 13 over the 16, that might help you answer the "is it worth the extra cost" question.
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Old 11-12-2011, 06:24 PM   #10
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Having an all electric EggCamper, there is nothing you can not use if you have a generator except for propane heat in the winter. With enough solar and 2 batteries you could operate a 12volt blanket for heat and 12v refer for food and that should meet all your needs.
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Old 11-12-2011, 06:45 PM   #11
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Hi Bill: We visited the plant a couple of weeks ago. We were very impressed with the Lil Snoozy. The average weight depending on what you put in it is 2000 lbs. We have also looked at the Scamp 16 and 13 trailers. You will be adding 200 to 300 lbs. to the weight by going to the deluxe model, and they would not tell us what the dry weight would be. To me it is a matter of what your tow vehicle can handle and what amenities you want. We just came from a camper with no bathroom, which is no fun on a cold rainy night. If you get a chance, go to SC and check out the Lil Snoozy, its you that will have to decide what you really want. And, the only way you can do that is check all that you are interested in.
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Old 11-12-2011, 07:40 PM   #12
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Hi Bill:

You didn't mention what TV is going to be used with this trailer. And how many people will be using the trailer?

To me, you do actually need something that your TV can handle safely. That is in fact the bottom line.

Once you establish the maximum trailer weight, you need to look at your camping needs. If you will be dry camping (which I do), you probably want propane. According to an earlier post, you can add propane to the Little Snoozy, but at a cost. What is the cost? How does Little Snoozy plus propane compare with the Scamp 13 and 16?

You'll also want a generator of some sort. Where can this be placed on either a Little Snoozy or Scamp.

Also, where will you be dry camping? I spend spring time in the Rockies. It snows and rains in the spring, and I require a heater.

The other thing you need to consider is your comfort requirements. Do you want to break down and remake your bed each day? With a Scamp 13, that's what you'll have to do if you want to use your dinette. What do you want with respect to a galley? What about a marine shower?

What about your storage needs? How much gear are you going to take along? How much clothing will you need - will you be away for a weekend or several weeks? How much fresh water will you need for your camping trips? Will you be able to frequently get to a fresh water source.

I take dogs and training equipment with me, so there is absolutely no room in my TV for any trailer equipment. That means my towing equipment, wheel locks, leveling blocks need to be kept in the trailer. Will you be able to stow towing and camping equipment in your TV? If not, you need to look at what your trailer will handle.

Finally, you'll probably need to look into your gas budget. The bigger and heavier the trailer the more gas you will be consuming. One thing about the Scamp Delux, the extra weight is due to wood cabinets. If you get a Scamp, minus the wood, you talking much less weight.

If weight is a big consideration, perhaps you should consider an Egg Camper. Egg Camper owners on this forum absolutely love these trailers. They are a very well built camper, designed for light weight towing. They are all electric, but you can order with propane (an additional $800?). They cost about the same as a Scamp or Casita.

Then there is the used trailer market. When I bought my trailer, prices were fairly high for used fiberglass trailers. However, I noticed that they are much lower this year. It is very possible to find an older model trailer that will suit your needs, get some valuable experience while you have fun with it for 2-3 years, and then get into something that you know will completely satisfy your camping style.

Personally, I'd go with a 16' or 17' camper with a separate dinette and sleeping area, and a marine bath. I'd want to know that I can safely mount an inverter generator on the tongue or back of the trailer. I'd also like to know that the AC unit (if I get one) can start with a 2000W inverter generator. I happen to like propane for the fridge, H20 heater, and cabin heater. I like a decent sized fridge and freezer.

On the other hand, check out posts of Joy A. She has a 13' Scamp which is brilliantly set up. You can see how she has customized it over the years.

Hope this helps.

Good luck!
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Old 11-12-2011, 08:34 PM   #13
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"One thing about the Scamp Delux, the extra weight is due to wood cabinets. If you get a Scamp, minus the wood, you talking much less weight."


That is simply not true, but it has reached "urban legend" status so I guess it is futile to dispute it
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Old 11-12-2011, 09:12 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by Ed Harris View Post
Floyd

How So?

They are tough to compare and the Snoozy has no track record at all.

Plus if it were me I could not live with the name on the side of mine.

Ed
Ed, I had to chuckle at this . I hate to admit this too, but I ordered my Scamp debadged for the same reason. I even chucked the tire cover . It's hard to imagine the painstaking process leading up to the naming of some of these trailers, but I have to believe that Kentucky Bourbon played a role

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