Moved from a 16 scamp to a 21 Bigfoot - Fiberglass RV


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Old 09-23-2019, 11:16 PM   #1
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Name: Aaron
Trailer: 2000 Bigfoot 21RB, & 92 Vanagon Westy
Idaho
Posts: 159
Moved from a 16 scamp to a 21 Bigfoot

Took a while to find one but we moved to a 2000 millennium edition 25b21RB. It is in amazing condition.







Our Scamp was our first trailer and we had it for 2 years. Learned a lot and reevaluated what we wanted and what we could do. Our area has really long shoulder seasons, where it gets really cold but does not snow. So we wanted to extend our camping season, and while we were at it have a permanent bed. Ours has the winter package, along with an upgraded furnace.

So far we love it, although it is such an upgrade from our Scamp that it kind of feels like glamping now instead of camping, who takes ice cream camping. Ok I do because I could. Fridge is twice the size, and actually works, holding tanks large enough to easily last a long weekend, massive windows, i can stand up to shower. More storage than we know what to do with, we moved all our stuff over from the Scamp and the Bigfoot was only half full.

We got it out for a nice shake down run, took a trip into the Sawtooths, nights down to 33 degrees.



The Bigfoot handled it so much better than our Scamp ever did. No more sticking reflectix in the windows, way less worry about condensation (we barely had any), and there was no need to have any of the windows open (well that trip anyway).

We are going to miss our Scamp, had a lot of fun trips in it, and we might very well miss the cozy feeling we got huddled in side on rainy days, but then again there is always ice cream.
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Old 09-24-2019, 05:30 AM   #2
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Name: bill
Trailer: 2013 Escape 19; 1977 Trillium 1300
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Very well thought reasoning, this is how you make really good decisions!

Nice!
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Old 09-24-2019, 10:34 AM   #3
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Name: Wayne & Barbara
Trailer: Parkliner
Iowa
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Are you pulling the BIGfoot with the VW Vanagon? Seems it would be grossly overloaded?
We had Vanagons, the last was a '91. Pulled a 13 ft Scamp. But when we traded for a 2000 16ft DLX, went to a Honda Odessey.
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Old 09-24-2019, 12:42 PM   #4
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Name: lee
Trailer: trailswest campsterl, 1996 Scamp 16 foot
Idaho
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Wayne Must be another vehicle in the mix. We live in Twin Falls Idaho and I can assure you a Vanagon would have a hard time getting itself into the Sawtooths. Lee and Norma
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Old 09-24-2019, 02:11 PM   #5
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Name: Aaron
Trailer: 2000 Bigfoot 21RB, & 92 Vanagon Westy
Idaho
Posts: 159
I pulled my Scamp and now my Bigfoot with a 2500 (3/4 ton) Suburban with a 7.4L engine, 3klb payload capacity and 10klb towing.

Although my Westy has made it into the Sawtooths many times.

I forgot some photos, we acquired the Bigfoot before the Scamp sold so I got some comparison shots.



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Old 09-24-2019, 02:51 PM   #6
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Name: Wayne & Barbara
Trailer: Parkliner
Iowa
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee Senn View Post
Wayne Must be another vehicle in the mix. We live in Twin Falls Idaho and I can assure you a Vanagon would have a hard time getting itself into the Sawtooths. Lee and Norma
From our experience, the Vanagons had plenty of power to go just about anywhere. Just not pulling a heavy trailer.
One they went to a water cooled engine, and improved the steering geometry they were a much better performer than the previous VW vans.
You just had to learn how to shift on the hills.
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Old 09-29-2019, 09:54 PM   #7
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Name: Aaron
Trailer: 2000 Bigfoot 21RB, & 92 Vanagon Westy
Idaho
Posts: 159
Another trip in the Bigfoot, this time in some light snow.

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Old 09-30-2019, 01:43 AM   #8
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Name: Julie
Trailer: 1985 Scamp 13 and 1985 Scamp 16 and 2005 Bigfoot 25B25RQ
Nebraska
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From Scamp to Bigfoot too!

Congratulations! We went from tents, to a pop-up trailer, to a Scamp 13 to a Scamp 16 to a Bigfoot 25RQ! We love our Bigfoot!
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Old 09-30-2019, 08:16 AM   #9
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Trailer: 91 Bigfoot 17
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Hey it's just like mine. Except newer and nicer...and 4 feet longer...

Looks really nice. I was dreaming about a fall trip to the same area, but couldn't make it happen this year.

Enjoy the Bigfoot. Yours has better insulation than mine, but even mine does great in cold weather.
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Old 09-30-2019, 08:40 AM   #10
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Name: Floyd
Trailer: 2004 13 ft Scamp Custom Deluxe
IllAnnoy
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Nice Bigfoot!
Going from an apple to an orange is a very subjective move.
No trailer handles better than a Scamp when properly towed.
At 6ft, I stand comfortably in the shower in my prefire Scamp13D.


While I would not consider an even trade, Your Bigfoot is a great trailer and while its not for everyone, I'm sure it will meet your needs well.


With all its faults, I'll still give you $500 for the Scamp and come and get it.
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Old 09-30-2019, 10:06 PM   #11
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Name: Aaron
Trailer: 2000 Bigfoot 21RB, & 92 Vanagon Westy
Idaho
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Quote:
Originally Posted by floyd View Post
Nice Bigfoot!
Going from an apple to an orange is a very subjective move.
No trailer handles better than a Scamp when properly towed.
At 6ft, I stand comfortably in the shower in my prefire Scamp13D.


While I would not consider an even trade, Your Bigfoot is a great trailer and while its not for everyone, I'm sure it will meet your needs well.


With all its faults, I'll still give you $500 for the Scamp and come and get it.
Defensive much?

Saying apple vs. orange is a over simplification, as there are many objective reasons to pick a single trailer over an other for any given person. Picking a trailer entails both subjective and objective reasons, with any given trailer having pro's and cons. It is up to the owners to determine if those are pro's or cons, and how much they mean to them.

"no trailer handles better than a Scamp when properly towed." Speaking of subjective, I am sure there are a lot of other people out there with out scamps that would disagree with you, personally the new Bigfoot handles great. And as my personal experience is that our Scamp frame broke, well I can't say it tows well.

Well you might be able to stand up in your 13' scamp bath that has nothing to do with the fact that I could not stand up (being 6' myself) in my 16' layout 4's bath.

What does it matter if you would consider an even trade? Your choice of trailer is yours, as your needs and wants are different then the next person.

You might think of them as faults, but those were design decisions done by the manufacture of Scamps. What I listed are in fact objective facts of the two trailers. The Bigfoots fridge is twice the size, with a much larger freezer, on top of that it is a roof vent. Roof vented fridges work better than side. The headroom in the 16' layout 4 bath is far less than 6', while the bigfoot is 6' at the toilet and higher in the shower. The fresh water tank in the bigfoot is 30 gallons, while the scamp is 12 gallons. Scamps have little insulation and single pane windows, making them not great for winter camping. Yes this makes the Bigfoots both bigger and heavier, but does not change the objective comparison.

None of this makes the Scamp a bad trailer, there are compromises for being smaller as well as larger. We loved our scamp and think it is a great trailer, it was just that our needs were outside of its design.

How people feel about those compromises, and features are why there are so many different trailers being sold. And why Scamp is still going strong, why Casita is still gong strong and Escape, Bigfoot and many other brands that fill similar functions (not everyone purchases a Bigfoot or Oliver for winter camping).

Next time you get defensive about your trailer just remember that other peoples decisions on what is good for them does not reflect on your choice.
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Old 10-01-2019, 10:30 AM   #12
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Name: Floyd
Trailer: 2004 13 ft Scamp Custom Deluxe
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Are you Defensive much?...
Apples and oranges, is an appropriate metaphor.

On second look I see your 16Scamp was a side bath, that would explain why you couldn't stand up straight even with 2-1/2 inches more headroom than my 13Scamp overall.

As I said The BigFoot is a nice trailer, not that my opinion of your choice matters any more than your opinion of mine.

Of course your BigFoot would tow better than anything with a broken frame!

On that, though, I missed your point...
I see that your original post was referring to "handling" the camping conditions, and not its "handling" while being towed... my bad.

That is certainly true as the Bigfoot is among the best for cold camping, and most others, like Scamp are strictly 3 seasons only.




Thanks for sharing the joy of your new purchase!

Also thanks for sharing your opinions as well.
Although, having done so, it seems odd to me that you would not expect to hear the opinions of others.

As you say...

"Next time you get defensive about your trailer just remember that other peoples decisions on what is good for them does not reflect on your choice."
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Old 10-04-2019, 03:21 PM   #13
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Name: Aaron
Trailer: 2000 Bigfoot 21RB, & 92 Vanagon Westy
Idaho
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Originally Posted by floyd View Post
Are you Defensive much?...
Going for the "i am rubber you are glue" approach I see.

Problem is I was not defending my purchase, I just reiterated points I had already made in the original post. By pointing out the numerical differences I had hopped you could see the difference between objective and subjective. It seems I failed in that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by floyd View Post
Apples and oranges, is an appropriate metaphor.
It really is not. Both are travel trailers, both sever the same needs. Anything I did with the Scamp I can do with the Bigfoot (save perhaps fitting in some spots) and visa versa (although I would have to winterize the water system in winter). Speaking of, lots of people in this forum still winterize their Bigfoot's for winter use despite having a 4 season trailer. You can still go camping to the same locations, and do the same activities.

When someone is shopping for trailers they look at what they want in a trailer (subjective based on that specific person), but they look at trailers objectively as well as subjectively (interior color). How does one trailer compare to another for my wants, bigger fridge? larger tanks? Small easy to tow? Light? Low profile to tow easier? Smaller to fit into smaller tent sites? These all have real numerical vales associated with them, that you can compare to each other. Everyone compares trailers and picks the one that they think will best serve their needs, based on many factors.

Travel trailers have far more in common then they have differences, and as such you own it to yourself to compare and contrast as many trailers as you can. Because at the end of the day, they are still travel trailers and are used for the same function.

I find it odd you don't think so.

Quote:
Originally Posted by floyd View Post
On second look I see your 16Scamp was a side bath, that would explain why you couldn't stand up straight even with 2-1/2 inches more headroom than my 13Scamp overall.

As I said The BigFoot is a nice trailer, not that my opinion of your choice matters any more than your opinion of mine.



Of course your BigFoot would tow better than anything with a broken frame!

On that, though, I missed your point...
I see that your original post was referring to "handling" the camping conditions, and not its "handling" while being towed... my bad.

That is certainly true as the Bigfoot is among the best for cold camping, and most others, like Scamp are strictly 3 seasons only.
But you are wrong, Scamps are not strictly 3 season, they are just designed for 3 season. I have taken my scamp camping in winter, it just has a harder time doing so. Furnace runs more, reflectex on the windows, winterize the water system. There is a fun post of a guy that wintered in his Casita and the efforts he had to take to keep it working, it takes more effort but you can make it work.




Quote:
Originally Posted by floyd View Post
Thanks for sharing the joy of your new purchase!

Also thanks for sharing your opinions as well.
Although, having done so, it seems odd to me that you would not expect to hear the opinions of others.
Are you putting words into my mouth? I fully expect opinions from others. But just because you give an opinion does not mean people can't give an opinion back.

Quote:
Originally Posted by floyd View Post
As you say...

"Next time you get defensive about your trailer just remember that other peoples decisions on what is good for them does not reflect on your choice."
And it is still true. You should think about it.
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Old 10-05-2019, 06:30 AM   #14
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Name: bill
Trailer: 2013 Escape 19; 1977 Trillium 1300
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I don't think four season has much to do with winterizing. If you leave the trailer unheated, outside storage in cold weather, you will freeze stuff.

We lost power in our "four season" home once in the middle of winter. Froze the hot water line between the first and second floor, froze and burst two hot water radiators (heat) before I wised up and drained my boiler heat system.

Here in the mountains, every year it seems like some person (Floridian) that owns a summer vacation home overlooks winterizing and they always do a lot of damage. Why Florida? 2/3 of the second homes in our county are owned by Floridians. Very popular summer location.
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Old 10-05-2019, 09:53 AM   #15
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Name: Aaron
Trailer: 2000 Bigfoot 21RB, & 92 Vanagon Westy
Idaho
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Originally Posted by thrifty bill View Post
I don't think four season has much to do with winterizing. If you leave the trailer unheated, outside storage in cold weather, you will freeze stuff.

We lost power in our "four season" home once in the middle of winter. Froze the hot water line between the first and second floor, froze and burst two hot water radiators (heat) before I wised up and drained my boiler heat system.

Here in the mountains, every year it seems like some person that owns a summer vacation home overlooks winterizing and they always do a lot of damage.
Sorry I should have been more clear. I have seen posts on this forum from people that own Bigfoots that dont use the water system when camping in winter, instead they leave it winterized.

You are absolutely right that when not in use you should winterize your trailer (house) in winter no matter if it is 4 seasons or not.
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Old 10-05-2019, 10:59 AM   #16
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Name: ginette & ron
Trailer: 2008 25RB 21 Bigfoot
Ontario
Posts: 81
Congratulations on your new Bigfoot. Sounds like you will spend alot of enjoyable time with it. I know we have been very happy with ours.
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Old 10-05-2019, 08:44 PM   #17
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Name: Benny
Trailer: Casita
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This idea is looking good to me as an option. We live in our 17ft Casita year round in the Pacific northwest. The insulation factor is what is tipping the scales. I can relate to the reflectix and condensation on the windows daily. More room might be nice too.
Thanks for sharing your experience.
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Old 10-06-2019, 08:06 AM   #18
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Trailer: 91 Bigfoot 17
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I have to imaging that "size matters" here too. Insulation matters, of course. But one or two people in a camper significantly larger than a 17' Casita has to make a difference with condensation. Have you been in a Bigfoot? If not, you might be shocked at how much more spacious they are. I have a 17' Bigfoot and a friend of mine has a 16' Scamp. It's amazing how different they are.

Mine has more insulation than most fiberglass trailers, but still gets condensation. Not sure how it compares to a Scamp or Casita. When lows get to the 20s and highs in the 30s or 40s, I have clogged salt shakers, slightly wet walls, and my window frames drip a little at night. I'm sure that isn't all just from not having the double-pane windows, but some probably is.
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Old 10-06-2019, 09:40 AM   #19
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Name: Benny
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We need to look inside a 17ft Bigfoot for sure.
Thanks sharing for your experience.
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Old 10-07-2019, 11:23 AM   #20
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Trailer: 16 Scamp, 17 Casita, 21Bigfoot now
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Congrats
We went for 16 scamp to 17 Casita to 21 bigfoot also. Big difference towing but was perfect for 2.
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