Need Help Finding SUV to Pull My Casita

[DaveK]

There are a lot of experienced technical folks weighing in here, with a lot of good info.

My contribution isn't so much technical as based on experience pulling my L'il Bigfoot with a 2002 Villager: It towed the trailer just fine fine. Hills, stopping, no sway, even coastal winds, no problems. Granted, the 13.5 Bigfoot is a little lighter than the 16' Casita, but.....

I did find that I needed more support in the back end than came stock with the van. I bottomed out more than once, fortunately without damage. I was planning to install airbags, but I bought a Tacoma instead. If you don't go with a bigger vehicle, I'd strongly recommend beefing up your suspension one way or another.

Call me cynical, but I suspect the car salesmen were far more worried about making a sale than about customer safety.

Good luck!

[Brian B-P]

I think Dave's observation is quite common: even while staying within all of the applicable limits for load, the rear springing may be softer than ideal for this type of use. This may be particularly true of relatively light-duty vehicles such as passenger vans and wagons (including SUVs), but it also applies to everything up to full-size pickup truck, and air bags or springs are a common solution for many types of vehicle. I think the key is to remember that they are to improve ride attitude and handling/control, and do not increase axle capacity.

I'm pleased with the effect of the air bags that I added in the rear springs of my Sienna.


Hey, Dave... the air bags would have been cheaper!

[DaveK]

Hey, Dave... the air bags would have been cheaper!

But not as much fun!

[Karalyn]

wow, all the information, and it sounds like I am not as bad off as I thought. I have been looking to replace my mini van and honestly I am not finding any SUV out there with the amount of room my mini van has. I can take out the middle seats on the mini van, move the 3rd seat to the front and fold it up, and have tons of storage room then in back of the front seats to the rear of the mini van. As I look at SUV I have not found one yet that I can remove the rear seats in. I want to pile stuff on the floor of my TV and not on the seats.
I might just be stuck with a newer mini van to get the storage I thought I would get in a SUV.
I want the safest TV out there for towing, and I just am not finding one with room in the TV.

Thanks much for all the answers. I will keep this information as I go on my search.
Who do you think would be the most truthful in my search, a car dealer, an RV dealer or a trailer hitch place?
THANKS AGAIN FOR ALL THE HELP!
Karalyn

[CD Smith]

As I look at SUV I have not found one yet that I can remove the rear seats in.

All General Motors SUVs have removable third row seats and fold down second row seats. This results in a storage capacity equal to or greater than the majority of mini vans.

Check out the Chevrolet Tahoe, GMC Denali, and the Cadilac Escalade. Some even get better towing milage than mini-vans.

I am sure the other major manufacturers have the same configurations.

[Roger H]

Who do you think would be the most truthful in my search, a car dealer, an RV dealer or a trailer hitch place?

Karalyn

Karalyn,

Where there's money involved, you need to do your own research and make your own decisions. A purveyor of goods will sell you either whatever you think you want, or if the decision is left to them, sell you the one that makes them the most profit while appearing to meet your needs.

That said, there are reputable dealers of all three, and they can be very helpful in finding the right combinations for you. You need to do your homework so you understand if what they're saying makes sense in the context of what you know. It is always very useful to have a disinterested third party on your side; whether that's a friend who tows or an independent mechanic who can help assess what the capabilities of a vehicle are.

And, you're not so bad off with your minivan. Frankly the body configuration isn't as big a deal as the frame and drivetrain for towing. If what's competent happens to be wrapped in a minivan, buy it. If it's wrapped in an SUV, and you like it, then it's ok. The big difference is typically that the minvans do tend to have more seating, easier rear seat access, lower loading sills, and more passenger amenities. SUVs tend to have features like 4WD and higher ground clearance for off-road. Your traveling habits and daily needs should influence what style you want, and then buy one with the tow capacity rating you want.

Roger

[Joe Z]

Who do you think would be the most truthful in my search, a car dealer, an RV dealer or a trailer hitch place?

Karalyn

Karalyn.... If you had to pick one from the above i would go to a reputable trailer hitch place (like U-HAUL etc.) They will have the specs you need for the weight in their catalogs on your vehicle .....be sure to ask for gross trailer weight and trailer tongue weight for your vehicle with a class III hitch installed.... and go to about two or three of them to see if you get the same answer from each... And i would give serious consideration for air bags or a WDH if the weight specs come back close to trailer weight.
I have a 16'casita with bath and although i haven't weighed the tongue i feel it in the high two hundreds somewhere ....maybe 275lbs and gross about 2100 to 2500lbs(i travel light)
Joe

[Brian B-P]

The massive SUVs which CD listed would certainly work for the Casita. If a more modestly sized vehicle is the target, the rear seats are more likely to just fold, and I've found that vehicles called SUVs - especially those with folded seats - have nowhere near the interior room of typical "minivans", due to the SUVs higher floor (with the same roof height) and generally shorter wheelbase (and thus less interior length).

In the GM line, the new Lambda-platform "crossover" models (e.g. GMC Acadia, Saturn Outlook, Buick Enclave) look desirable to me. I've looked at the specs and poked around them in the showroom, and compared to the minivans which they are replacing, they appear

• to have not lost too much interior room, and
• to have gained hauling capacity with some stronger components in the rear,
• without being excessively heavy.

I still don't know of any reason not to use a Villager, if the weights and axle loads all check out. I second Roger's assessment. In addition, "SUV", "minivan", and now "crossover" are all just marketing labels for station wagons; the label chosen says more about style and marketing plans than actual vehicle characteristics.

As for information sources... unlike Joe, I would not use U-Haul. I have downloaded and read the user guides for their rental trailers and tow dollies: they are inconsistent and occasionally blatantly wrong. As a hitch shop, their motivation is to sell hardware, whether the resulting rig is safe or not. As a franchise, the staff at an individual dealer may or may not have any experience or competence; the ones I've talked to have neither in the towing area. It's not that U-Haul is especially bad... they're just not special.

[Frederick L. Simson]

"SUV", "minivan", and now "crossover" are all just marketing labels for station wagons

I recently read that next year, Chrysler will be the only US domestic manufacturer of a "Minivan".
Just like the "station Wagons" they replaced, Minivans are no longer "hip" or profitable...

[DaveK]

I think Roger H and Joe Z hit the bullseye in their above comments. You'll need to do a bit of research and make a few phone calls. Phone calls are free.

Apropos of my comments about rear end weight earlier, I don't think all hitch receivers are born equal. I had mine installed at U-Haul, got a fair price and good service. But I think the hitch is heavier than most, made of large diameter tube steel compared to some others I've seen. DrawTite comes to mind. That's just a visual comparison, mind you. But when you're hanging 150-250lb off your back end, even a 10lb savings is worth investigating, I say. And I've got a bent nose wheel to prove it. (Note: Bigfoots are a little nose heavy compared to Casitas unless you modify your Casita's tongue, as many people do. Even a Li'l Bigfoot)

More than once I thought I should have looked around a bit more, but as a neophyte I went with a known quantity. I don't regret that part of the decision a bit. But Brian makes a good point. U-Haul isn't special -- but they are corporate and that gives a complaint a little extra weight, because if you don't get satisfaction you can go over the head of the guy behind the counter. All in all, it really depends on the person doing the work. Look around until you find somebody that you feel comfortable with and whose words match your research. In a very real sense, this is a decision that has the potential to make or break your trailering experience for a long time, so feel good about it and make sure you get what you ask for.

The other thing I've heard ugly stories about is the installation of the brake controller and the cable back to the 7-pin connector. I've talked to a couple of people whose cables were installed visibly by so-called legitimate dealers. Visibly as in: running the inside length of the van. on top of the carpeting. You shouldn't be able to see it, and if the dealer suggests he can't hide it, find another one because he's not telling the truth. This all may seem incredibly obvious, but sometimes (call me a cynic if you like) people take advantage of newbies. Fortunately for you, there is Fiberglass RV!


Good luck!

[Pete Dumbleton]

Just for the record, Ford does handle their own trailer hitches (that may depend on the dealer and what they can do locally) because I have seen one on the floor of the local Ford Store when I was looking around for one for my Ranger. The Ford one did not appear to me to be any different than the after-market receiver I ultimately purchased.

I would recommend getting a Weight Distributing Hitch (WDH) rather than getting air springs (I've had both). All the air springs essentially do is lift the rear end higher above the rear axle, making the body level again but not transferring any weight of significance to the front end. They do improve handling by dampening rear end sway to some extent.

OTOH, the WDH does transfer weight from the rear end to the front end and to the trailer axle.

[Karalyn]

OK, sounds like if having a mini van I need WDH for safety. I will have to think about that for next summer if keeping mini van. I then need to check out some Gen motors SUV to see what theirs look like without that third seat, and the middle seat folded. (my mini van middle seats are stored in garage and 3rd seat folded like a pancake squished smack against the front seats..)
I think I will be searching on line getting ideas for months. There is a LOT to learn.

Those of you that have 16 ft campers with front bath, can you tell me WHY you chose the TV that you now use to pull the camper? In other words, what was your deciding point in the car/truck or mini van you chose to pull with?

[Steve L.]

When I first bought my 16' Casita I had a Ford Explorer with the V6 engine. I shortly thereafter went to an east coast rally in Tennesee. Rolling hills. I felt the Explorer was underpowered. I shortly thereafter went to the longer wheelbase 4 door model and the V8 engine. I felt the whole assembly was more stable (longer wheel base, a little heavier) and I felt the engine was better suited to the task.

There was less drop in mileage towing with the V-8, but the baseline was lower. I like my "stuff" so I travel well equipped and really liked the Explorer. Moving my sailing gear back and forth from the sail boat in the spring and fall required one fewer trip which was another plus to the 4 door Explorer over the 2 door.

I now tow with a F150 with a V8 engine but that's because I also sometimes bring my ATV in the bed of the truck with me camping so my current tow doesn't apply to your situation.

In the interests of fair disclosure I will mention I work for the blue oval (tire and wheel engineer for trucks).

[Roger H]

I towed my 16' and 17' trailers with a 4WD Toyota pickup; either the original Compact Trucks, a T100, or now, a Tundra all with either the 3.0L V6 or more favorably in the last couple of trucks the 3.4L V6. The 3.0L V6 was not a stellar performer, by the way. I used a pickup because I haul tools and yard and construction "stuff" when I towed the small trailers.

Roger

[Brian B-P]

my mini van middle seats are stored in garage and 3rd seat folded like a pancake squished smack against the front seats..

Modern minivans (meaning not the obsolete GM design) don't really do that anymore. The third row seat folds into a well in the floor, and sometimes even the second row does as well, so a big space is cleared in the back (and maybe the middle) without hauling seats out or leaving them behind. Maybe looking at new minivans is an option to an SUV?

In my Sienna the third row folds into a well, and the second row seats fold (just the seatback), tumble forward, or remove. We normally remove the second row and fold the third row, leaving lots of room but allowing one side of the third row to be popped up (with some rearranging of cargo!) if required to give someone a ride at some point along the trip.