Nest Caravans Building a new FG trailer, step by step - Page 40 - Fiberglass RV


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Old 07-16-2015, 01:54 PM   #547
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Super nice at the 1.12 mark
https://youtu.be/BpdbCtDCTkI

and fiberglass dub at 11.39
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Old 07-16-2015, 05:57 PM   #548
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Trailer: 13' Scamp
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Design for Manufacture

Robert,

I think you ended up wasting a lot of money on the monocoque design. I think it is a good feature and makes a much better trailer, but from an actual use point of view nobody cares. Look at all the 1970's scamps that have been beat to crap over the years without falling apart. You are going to have to go over your design and reduce cost and labor at every part of the production process. There are things people will notice, and things most people will not. $35k price point is really high. Your mind set is still renovation to beyond perfect, rather than build to good enough to look great. I also really don't like the layout.

1. I would use real wood cabinets rather than the white things you have. That would instantly give it better look at minimal incremental cost. the white looks cheap. All the airstream models use light colored wood. This would be your best choice. Use bamboo and make "green"

2. The white refrigerator looks cheap to. Makes more sense than stainless steel, but I would always sell with stainless appliances. It looks more modern and classy.


3. Eating inside the camper is a huge thing for me me at least. You need a vent fan over the stove and an easy way to convert part of the bed into a two person dinette... actually I see your idea with the counter top. Interesting. It was NOT clear from the website photos, had to dig into brochure.

4. I think the back door idea was good, but ultimately limiting because it looks long and narrow inside, which means you are going to spend your time squeezing past each other. The side door gives you a passing zone. Have you actually tried camping in it it bad weather in particular? The 16 foot Scamp with front bathroom has this problem, though the side dinette helps

My ideal layout is a full time queen bed with storage underneath, side bathroom, small front dinette, kitchen across from the bathroom. I have a flip up cutting board to expand counter space. My 13' Scamp is configured like this (minus the bathroom and a decent sized bed). I am currently considering converting a 16' to this configuration. Its the bed size that really gets to me.

5. You need a lip at the edge of the counter by the bed on the sink side. I am forever dripping water onto my bed in my Scamp. (pet peeve, not a major selling suggestion. Actually you need a place to dry dishes period. Maybe a flip up drying rack over the bed.

6. None of your pictures show curtains, another sign you have not used this thing.

7. Full height closet not that useful. One of the most popular modification on the Scamp is to put in something besides the closet.

8. Color scheme of camper is kind of ugly if you ask me. I would have gone darker bottom, lighter top, rather than reverse.
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Old 07-16-2015, 06:29 PM   #549
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Hmmmm... and now, after some 548 posts, one can say "So much for the minority report...." LOL


I don't think that Nest is aiming at the same market as Scamp, let sales results tell the tale now that it is either ready for or already in production.


BTW: I think that the rear door floor plan is the best use of space in a small trailer. (I have had two RV's with that floor plan) And I, for one, enjoy rubbing up against my camping mate every chance I can get.....LOL
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Old 07-16-2015, 07:05 PM   #550
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Kevin,

You may or may not be in the minority however every manufacturer wants to know what people like and don't like. It's always difficult to get to the potential customers real view.
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Old 07-16-2015, 07:08 PM   #551
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I'm not in the market, but, I ran the pictures past my wife who commented on the huge sink, but no place to put dirty and then clean dishes. She was startled at the price, saying, "you could buy a 21' Escape for that much money".
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Old 07-17-2015, 12:25 AM   #552
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Name: Darral
Trailer: Scamp Standard 13' 2010
Tennessee
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I personally believe the price alone for the size will kill that camper. As someone has said, "Sales will tell".

To me, when I viewed the clip, I was actually disappointed. I personally saw the interior as "plain jane". I just dont see the value. I'd MUCH rather had a conventional alum. frame and put my money somewhere else! I never have nor ever will like a rear door. Looks like a pickup truck camper on wheels.

On the positive side, I LOVE the modern look of the exterior!! It rocks!
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Old 07-17-2015, 12:51 AM   #553
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I'm curious. How many women were on the design team?
Sounds sexist, but after 45 years of marriage, we had a conversation this evening where I said I would have to show her how to release the ratchet strap on the garbage can ( I'm going fishing ) and she said, "and I'll show you how to load the dishwasher".
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Old 07-17-2015, 09:19 AM   #554
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I think the Nest is beautiful. The design is clean, modern and attractive. It takes the small fiberglass camper to a new level. Think of a small camper in terms of a small car. If I want a two-seater sporty car, I have several options. Pontiac Fiero. Honda del Sol. Toyota MR2. Mazda Miata. BMW Z3. Mercedes SLK. All of these will fit the bill. All of them bring something unique to the marketplace. Some are unquestionably better than others at something -- looks, handling, reliability, gas mileage, ... But, I don't think any of us would think they are in the same class as a Ferrari, a Maserati, a Lamborghini, a Bugatti, and so on, even though they may be, in some ways, "better" cars. The market for these cars is small, but there are always those who are willing to pay for the top end of the market. The Nest is the current top end of this market.

Sure, the Nest costs as much as 3 Scamp 16s. But, how many of us are driving vehicles that cost as much as 3 Nissan Versas? Wouldn't the Versa get us from point A to point B? How many of us are ok with our choice, anyway?

Unfortunately, the design of the Nest doesn't meet my needs, in the same way a Lambo Diablo doesn't meet my needs. I would simply never spend the floor space for a queen bed when a double is ample for us. A walk-around double is my non-negotiable. That puts me in the minority, but that is my priority. And, I would probably settle for the Versa, because that's how I was raised.
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Old 07-17-2015, 05:18 PM   #555
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Wow! I made it to the end! That's quite a thread.

I'll throw in my $0.02, as I suspect I'm the only person here with actual Monocoque RV experience.

What, you didn't know that there were monocoque RVs before the Nest? You've never heard of an Ultra Van then. Designed by an engineer who worked at Douglas aircraft in the 1950s, they're an all-aluminum, low-slung eight foot wide 22 (or sometimes larger) foot class A. The last one was built in the early 1970s.

Like the Nest, they were all pre-ordered, and optioned from a standard list. It's really a very comfortable layout. The coach's greatest weakness is that it stretched the suspension and powertrain technology of the day. It's greatest strength definitely is the monocoque aluminum structure, which means an all-up Ultra Van usually weighs less than 6000 lbs (yes, that's really all up, from weigh-ins at rallies), rides better (fully independent suspension), and sits much lower to the ground than a body-on-frame design would.

Ultra sold about 200 coaches over about 10 years. They essentially never have structural problems unless allowed to corrode for decades in salt air (a problem a Nest wouldn't have).

I'm not in the market for a Nest, now, but I might well be in the future. And yes, I would pay extra for a monocoque design. Just getting the body down over the wheels is a win in itself.

Likewise, your use of infusion forming technology appeals. Light and strong are good - a big reason why I bought a Casita instead of a conventional stick-built trailer.

It's probably worth mentioning that a Prevost is technically monocoque as well, having no frame other than its riveted aluminum construction. It is built more like a ship hull though, with strength derived from smaller compartments attached to each other.
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Old 07-17-2015, 05:30 PM   #556
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Thanks RB, that was very interesting........
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Old 07-17-2015, 05:41 PM   #557
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"What, you didn't know that there were monocoque RVs before the Nest?"

ohh, we knew
OMG Another Opportunity for a Back to the Future FGRV
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Old 07-17-2015, 05:55 PM   #558
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The Ultra was an interesting design for it's time but IMHO: Using the Corvair driveline was one of several nails in it's coffin. Great for engineer types, but not much for Joe camper.


I have seen at least there Ultras within about 75 miles of my house, all three of them either under restoration or decaying in place.
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Old 07-18-2015, 02:14 PM   #559
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We're on the edge of derail, but I'll agree with you, Bob. I really like the Ultra Van my parents have. But it's a lot of work (mostly by my Dad the aeronautical engineer) and a lot of love to keep one in good working order. As I said, the greatest weakness is definitely driveline and suspension. Mom and Dad are agreed that basically nobody who isn't retired can use and maintain one.

Ultras were built after Corvairs disappeared. They used a 307 c.i. Chevy V8 with a rather complicated driveline. The V8 adds weight, takes up a lot more room and requires a radiator. I've thought about what else might fit in the driveline space and not make a disaster of the bedroom, and the best I can come up with is a Subaru engine. If I picked up a V8 one I'd probably put an aluminum block V6 in.

And now very much on-topic to the Nest - what would you say is the hardest single component of an Ultra Van to replace when worn out or damaged? Not the driveline - they built nearly two million Corvairs. Not the RV stuff, which is off the shelf technology for its day. Even things like door latches and headlight housings are pretty easy to deal with. The basic structure is also easy, as it's riveted sheet aluminum like Airstreams and airplanes.

The hardest loss to deal with is the windshield, which is a 1956-58 Chevrolet Step Van item cut in the middle to widen it. They're not exactly common, and only some of them can be cut without propagating cracks.

I'd definitely look into some sort of stone guard for the Nest...
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Old 04-07-2016, 09:46 PM   #560
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As you may have already heard, Nest Caravans was acquired by Airstream. Perhaps they will address some of the issues brought up here on this thread.

Nevertheless, the impossible challenge for any small TT manufacturer is to be all things to all people. Our original intent was to keep the trailer as light as possible (2400lbs!), yet still provide the features that our research had indicated were most important to our customers: full-time, queen size bed; wet bath; comfortable standing room but most of all, quality. All this in a package that, from a design perspective, was completely game-changing.

You'll get no apologies or lame rationalizations from me. Room for improvement? Of course! But the product speaks for itself. Just ask those that have seen it in person and have already commented on it here and on other related threads.
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