rivets - Fiberglass RV
Journey with Confidence RV GPS App RV Trip Planner RV LIFE Campground Reviews RV Maintenance Take a Speed Test Free 7 Day Trial ×


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 11-20-2008, 06:50 PM   #1
Senior Member
 
ronsmith100's Avatar
 
Trailer: Casita
Posts: 451
I think, as an old retired engineering prof, that the most annoying thing about my egg (Casita) is the riveting. It is so crude and ugly. I suppose it is economically necessary in that that screws that didn't pop could very well stress to cracking (fracturing) limits thus rendering the hole a diameter or two larger than designed. Nevertheless they are... as I said....ech.
Nothing against rivets. Without them Boeing would be doing something else but still they are ugly.
I think I saw that the Escape or some other egg, having dual walls that had metal frame sections within the walls where the "furniture" could be attached rigidly with common screws, were better suited to solid riveltess construction.

Comments?
ronsmith100 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-21-2008, 12:02 AM   #2
Senior Member
 
Roy in TO's Avatar
 
Trailer: 1972 Boler American and 1979 Trillium 4500
Posts: 5,137
I think you hit the rivet on the head with the word ... economical.

I was given some aircraft grade rivets by a friend, I could barely get them to work with the hand unit. They simply took too much force to use. Went out and bought some regular "pop rivets" to finish the work. I've even tried some of the SS bolts with washers and the nylon lock nuts. Much more expensive, and install best with 2 people.

From an engineering perspective, I'm surprised they don't use FG raceways for conduits and strength.
Roy in TO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-21-2008, 08:45 AM   #3
Administrator
 
Mary F's Avatar
 
Name: Mary
Trailer: 2015 Escape 21; formerly Casita 1999 17 ft Liberty Deluxe
Posts: 10,941
Registry
We've had lots of discussions on the pros and cons of rivets. Do a search on the "care and feeding" forum; you'll probably find lots of opinions on the subject.


__________________
Mary F Fiberglass Rules!
________________________________
FGRV Forum Custom Search
Info on Adding Photos to a Post
RV Life Network FAQ
Mary F is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-21-2008, 09:16 AM   #4
Senior Member
 
Daniel V.'s Avatar
 
Trailer: 1974 Trillium 13 ft
Posts: 495
I think it should be fairly easy to cover ugly rivets with plastic screw caps for inside use, or perhaps a dab of resin.
__________________
Driving on parkways and parking in driveways.
Daniel V. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-22-2008, 06:51 PM   #5
Member
 
Rand's Avatar
 
Trailer: 17 ft Casita Liberty Deluxe
Posts: 58
Hi Ron,

Lucky for me I don't mind rivets and how they look. Considering where I have towed our little Casita (coming off the Hopi Mesas on our recent trip in a 75 mile an hour head wind from the hurricane in Mexico as an example) I am amazed I haven't popped more of them!:-) Got to get our baby washed and cleaned up for the cover and a winter nap soon...but strangely enough too cold here in SC lately!

Rand:-)
Rand is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-24-2008, 08:52 PM   #6
Senior Member
 
ronsmith100's Avatar
 
Trailer: Casita
Posts: 451
Quote:
Hi Ron,

Lucky for me I don't mind rivets and how they look. Considering where I have towed our little Casita (coming off the Hopi Mesas on our recent trip in a 75 mile an hour head wind from the hurricane in Mexico as an example) I am amazed I haven't popped more of them!:-) Got to get our baby washed and cleaned up for the cover and a winter nap soon...but strangely enough too cold here in SC lately!

Rand:-)
Oh I was being coy. Of course they work but they are ugly... like a bunch of little white zits poking out of the skin. Just ugly. Which fiberglass RV has no rivet pimples? any?

I have many times pulled my egg over 60 miles (one way) of the toughest rock roads in the United States (to toroweep grand canyon) and have popped only one rivet. But I am kinda like a wincing mechanic. I drive very slow and careful and just cringe when the bump feels too hard. It is stressful.

ronsmith100 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-24-2008, 10:33 PM   #7
Senior Member
 
Raya's Avatar
 
Trailer: 1974 Boler 13 ft (Neonex/Winnipeg)
Posts: 3,008
Quote:
Which fiberglass RV has no rivet pimples? any?
The 1970s Trilliums basically have no rivets (I think they have a half dozen holding the rain gutter on over the door, and maybe a few others, but none to speak of.) I don't think the Compact Jrs have very many either. In addition, I don't think the Burro/U-hauls have any (?)

Raya
Raya is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-24-2008, 10:40 PM   #8
Senior Member
 
Trailer: 2008 Oliver Legacy Elite
Posts: 904
Registry
Quote:
Nothing against rivets. Without them Boeing would be doing something else but still they are ugly.
I think I saw that the Escape or some other egg, having dual walls that had metal frame sections within the walls where the "furniture" could be attached rigidly with common screws, were better suited to solid riveltess construction.

Comments?
Olivers have a double hull, high gloss marine grade gel coat in and out. No rivets. The furniture and cabinets are molded into the inner hull. The reinforcements between the hulls, where necessary, as well as the frame, are aluminum. Perhaps this is the brand you're thinking of. I believe (though I've never seen one in person...) that the Escape is single hull, evidenced by the vinyl liners, side-mount A/C, and non-fiberglass cabinets in the website. Is that correct?
SherryNPaul is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2008, 09:43 AM   #9
Senior Member
 
Raya's Avatar
 
Trailer: 1974 Boler 13 ft (Neonex/Winnipeg)
Posts: 3,008
I have a rivet question, while we're on the subject. (I've searched the archives but not found this.)

Usually, in houses, boats, etc. it's considered somewhat second-rate if you re-paint the outside, and, instead of removing hardware, simply paint over it. I'm thinking of door hinges, doorstops, and other fasteners.

On something like a Scamp or a Boler, let's say you were getting ready for a nice paint job, so you were removing the aluminum windows, and then either removing or masking off other hardware (belly band, black window gaskets, door hinges). Okay, but what about the rivets? Would the proper way be to remove (yikes) them all? Would one mask them off? Paint right over them? Same question would apply to the truss heads if one had replaced their rivets with screws.

I know they make those plastic rivet covers, but I'm not fond of the way they protrude so those wouldn't be in my equation.

(I'm not planning any large painting projects, but this question popped into my head the other day after reading this thread and so I'm curious. )

Raya
Raya is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2008, 05:59 PM   #10
Senior Member
 
Pete Dumbleton's Avatar
 
Trailer: Scamp
Posts: 3,072
Send a message via Yahoo to Pete Dumbleton
If one removes all the rivets from one interior fixture, one might have trouble getting it all back together so the holes match.

There are two answers to your dilema:

1. Strip everything out, use epoxy and glass tape to install elevator bolts to the inside walls for fasters, then fill the former rivet holes from the outside. Or just use glass and epoxy to fiberglass the inside of it all to the inner walls.

2. Get one of the doublewalled trailers like Burro, etc.
Pete Dumbleton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2008, 06:30 PM   #11
Senior Member
 
Rick kl's Avatar
 
Trailer: 2000 24 ft Shasta Ultra Flite
Posts: 251
Pop rivets have many uses although I don't like where they are used on my trailer when I put up new blinds and removed the old curtain rods I drilled out the rivets and replaced them with SS screws and SS finishing washers.
Attached Thumbnails
ricks_picks_061.JPG   ricks_picks_063.JPG  

ricks_picks_065.JPG  
Rick kl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2008, 07:07 PM   #12
Senior Member
 
Raya's Avatar
 
Trailer: 1974 Boler 13 ft (Neonex/Winnipeg)
Posts: 3,008
Hi Pete,

I understand about using fiberglass tabbing instead of rivets, as I use that method on boats. I think it would be superior, but was probably not done at the factory becuase it would be more labor intensive (i.e. more expensive), and the rivets do work.

I was asking about if one was going to keep on using rivets or screws/nuts, then what does one do with/about the rivets when painting the outside of the trailer (as compared to removing or masking off other metal hardware).

I'm still curious.
Raya is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-28-2008, 07:38 AM   #13
Member
 
Jen'nBarb's Avatar
 
Trailer: 17 ft Escape
Posts: 67
Quote:
Olivers have a double hull, high gloss marine grade gel coat in and out. No rivets. The furniture and cabinets are molded into the inner hull. The reinforcements between the hulls, where necessary, as well as the frame, are aluminum. Perhaps this is the brand you're thinking of. I believe (though I've never seen one in person...) that the Escape is single hull, evidenced by the vinyl liners, side-mount A/C, and non-fiberglass cabinets in the website. Is that correct?

We have an Escape and no there aren't any rivets. The mold is such that the cabinets can be attached internally. We have taken ours over some rough roads and long journeys and we haven't had anything pop or come loose. We love ours!!
Jen'nBarb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-11-2011, 11:46 PM   #14
Senior Member
 
Name: kevin
Trailer: 13' Scamp
Colorado
Posts: 172
SS hardware

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick kl View Post
Pop rivets have many uses although I don't like where they are used on my trailer when I put up new blinds and removed the old curtain rods I drilled out the rivets and replaced them with SS screws and SS finishing washers.

Stupid questions:

1. How does one go about "drilling" out a rivet without ending up drilling holes in the camper. I assume you try and pull out the rod sticking out of the middle of it from the outside and then drill into the void...

2. If you are putting in screws on the outside, what is holding up the curtain rods. and if you are using screws are you just screwing directly into the fiberglass?

3. Very new at this, still a little nervous about putting holes in "dream camper."
KevinScamps is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2011, 08:34 AM   #15
Senior Member
 
jack maloney's Avatar
 
Trailer: 1986 U-Haul CT13 ft
Posts: 494
U-Hauls and Burros are rivet-free. The double-hull construction features molded cabinets and furnishings on the inside, without any through-fasteners needed.
jack maloney is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2011, 09:13 AM   #16
Senior Member
 
floyd's Avatar
 
Trailer: 2004 13 ft Scamp Custom Deluxe
Posts: 8,519
Registry
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roy in TO View Post
I think you hit the rivet on the head with the word ... economical.

I was given some aircraft grade rivets by a friend, I could barely get them to work with the hand unit. They simply took too much force to use. Went out and bought some regular "pop rivets" to finish the work. I've even tried some of the SS bolts with washers and the nylon lock nuts. Much more expensive, and install best with 2 people.

From an engineering perspective, I'm surprised they don't use FG raceways for conduits and strength.
If you wish to rivet fiberglass you should use aluminum rivets,fiberglass can be crushed using stainless steel or carbon steel rivets. The riveted cabinets install best with two people as well.
The word "economical" should be replaced with the word "versatile". It allows for custom work like my 13 deluxe which can't be had from any other source. My trailer is nearing 8 years old... check back with me in 25 years to see the best value possible in excellent condition! (IF I'm Still around)... otherwise you will have to check with the guy who pays a premium price to my estate for a trailer which he can treasure for many more years!
floyd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2011, 09:42 AM   #17
Senior Member
 
floyd's Avatar
 
Trailer: 2004 13 ft Scamp Custom Deluxe
Posts: 8,519
Registry
I have a deluxe Scamp with7-1/2 years and 50,000 plus miles on it, and not one defective or loose fastener through the hull.
Of course esthetics are subjective, but your characterization is a bit silly and extreme. As far as function is concerned, I have owned all sorts of fiberglass trailers and the riveted trailers have held up as well or better than any others. If you are popping lots of rivets when towing then you would be damaging any other trailer through the same type of abuse.
I have owned several Scamps over 30years old in every condition imaginable and I can tell you the rivets are not an issue when it comes to refitting an antique fiberglass trailer.
floyd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2011, 09:43 AM   #18
Senior Member
 
Name: David
Trailer: 16 foot Scamp
Arizona
Posts: 323
I think Scamps use of rivets is rather ingenius to be honest. So far I have had one broken rivet and my trailer has seen a lot of flexing and bouncing. It could have even been a pre-existing defect that caused it. They set them into acorn nuts on the inside which I think was pretty clever. As Floyd mentioned, it gives them a lot of freedom to accommodate our custom wishes. One major reason I bought a Scamp was because of that ability and willingness. Rivets have some unique qualities as well. They are not simply inferior to bolts. For one thing, they maintain tension extremely well, and the tension they exert is very uniform from one to the other. To get that kind of precision from a bolt would require a torque setting driver on each one. If the rivets were replaced with bolts they all have to be loctited or fitted with locking nuts. Rivets fill the holes they occupy, but bolts do not. That means that bolts have to create all their bonding and locating strength through clamping force. If the clamping force is insufficient, the panels will shift and the holes will enlarge even more. If the clamping force is too great the glass can crack. Something to consider when bonding materials like fiberglass. I could go on and boar everyone to tears, but you get the idea .

I do agree the shell would look better perfectly smooth, but rare is the advantage that comes without compromise.

David
DavidSo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2011, 09:58 AM   #19
Senior Member
 
jack maloney's Avatar
 
Trailer: 1986 U-Haul CT13 ft
Posts: 494
Quote:
Originally Posted by floyd View Post
I can tell you the rivets are not an issue
Surprising, considering the frequency with which rivet issues are raised in this forum! Rivet breaks, leaks, and replacements have often been discussed over the years I've been in this forum.
jack maloney is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2011, 10:14 AM   #20
Senior Member
 
Name: kootenai girl
Trailer: 1976 Trillium 1300
British Columbia
Posts: 1,411
I had a quick question re: rivets. On my 2010 Scamp on the outside it looks like the factory puts silicone or something similar under the caps. It is already coming off on several rivets. Is this something you have to redo every year and if so what is the best stuff to use for it.
I must confess I much prefer the clean look of the Trillium with no 'pimples' on the outside.
Thanks.
kootenaigirl is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Rivets - Used on a Trillium? Paul Richter Problem Solving | Owners Helping Owners 1 05-02-2010 09:22 PM
replacing rivets Rick Harmer Problem Solving | Owners Helping Owners 1 01-20-2010 07:57 PM
Scamp and the pop rivets Bruce M. Care and Feeding of Molded Fiberglass Trailers 25 05-20-2008 05:57 PM
Removing pop rivets... How?? Legacy Posts Problem Solving | Owners Helping Owners 4 04-29-2003 07:13 AM
replacing rivets ScottK Modifications, Alterations and Updates 0 01-01-1970 12:00 AM

» Upcoming Events
No events scheduled in
the next 465 days.
» Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 05:16 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.