Should I Fix the GTO to tow a Scamp?

[honda03842]

Roger,

I've been fortunate to have two early death events in my life, both of which I wish I could have prevented, but both triggered dramatic changes in my life.

Both events let me know life was short and to enjoy every moment.

My Dad died the day before my first son was born; I was 24. After that I made a list of goals and things I wanted to do by 45 and accomplished all but one. I was accessively driven to achieve.

At 59 my college roommate died, I was at the height of my career. I immediately stopped working and for some reason locked on to RVs, something we had never done. Within 9 months we were ready and have been on the road for most of the last 13 years. I don't think any of this would have happened if John hadn't died.

In my career everytime I started to work on a problem with a fresh approach I heard how it wouldn't work. Sometimes it didn't but even those that didn't often led to even better solutions. Don't let anyone stop you from your dreams besides yourself.

My first mentor told me the purpose of life was to have fun and if you're not having fun (in a rut) do something else. Later in life an older friend told me that as you age you should do more of what "you" like. Go for it.

Wishing you success in dream realization

[RV NUT CASE]

Originally Posted by Bob Miller

Suitability and Safety of Tow Vehicles are popular topics hereabouts and one can always be certain to get some critical comments.

I really doubt if there are many hereabouts qualified to comment on the suitability and safety of towing with an almost 50 y.o. vehicle, especially one admitted to have been neglected for some time. I'd almost bet you would get better answers about towing anything on a GTO oriented site, as I am sure someone would be there who has done just that.

If it's about specific trailers, we are a wealth of knowledge, but 50 y.o. tow vehicles, especially those less often seen, are a different story.

BTW: Towing a 17' FGRV would be a lot easier than towing that Nomad you mentioned for several reasons including weight, frontal area, and shape.

I did not say a thing about towing the Nomad with the GTO. The GTO is an F body its a mid size car. The Nomad would be too heavy wouldnt even think of it. I am a certified Auto Technician I know this car inside and out. This car would be brought back to 150% before I would even think about a trip like this. The reason I got on this website was to get your guys advice about these Scamps. I know the limits of my car. But I don't know about Scamps. If a mini van can pull one of these I would hope a car pulling close to 400 hp would pull one? Again I need your expertise on the Scamps. I just don't know?

[RV NUT CASE]

Originally Posted by honda03842

Roger,

I've been fortunate to have two early death events in my life, both of which I wish I could have prevented, but both triggered dramatic changes in my life.

Both events let me know life was short and to enjoy every moment.

My Dad died the day before my first son was born; I was 24. After that I made a list of goals and things I wanted to do by 45 and accomplished all but one. I was accessively driven to achieve.

At 59 my college roommate died, I was at the height of my career. I immediately stopped working and for some reason locked on to RVs, something we had never done. Within 9 months we were ready and have been on the road for most of the last 13 years. I don't think any of this would have happened if John hadn't died.

In my career everytime I started to work on a problem with a fresh approach I heard how it wouldn't work. Sometimes it didn't but even those that didn't often led to even better solutions. Don't let anyone stop you from your dreams besides yourself.

My first mentor told me the purpose of life was to have fun and if you're not having fun (in a rut) do something else. Later in life an older friend told me that as you age you should do more of what "you" like. Go for it.

Wishing you success in dream realization

THANK YOU I NEEDED YOUR ADVICE AND YOUR WISDOM! That one came from the heart . You just made my whole morning

[honda03842]

Roger. I just read this on one of Lisa's post and was appropriate.

"Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than by the ones you did. So throw off the bowlines, Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover."

I'm familar with towing a Scamp 16 and would be glad to answer any questions about our Scamp and experiences.

I tow with a unibody, manual transmission, 180 hp, 162 ft-lbs torque 2004 Honda CRV. We have towed all over North America without any issues.

The Scamp 13 and the Scamp 16 both have the same frontal area and in that sense, an important one, they are similar to tow. The Scamp 16 and 13 (our son has one) both tow beautifully.

Our Scamp is now 22 years old and our son's 36 years old. If maintained, repaired, upgraded it seems, like your GTO, Scamps can last a lifetime or longer.

[RV NUT CASE]

Originally Posted by Frederick L. Simson

Opinions are one thing, a few facts help you make up your own mind. This is why I weighed people's trailers at rallys to build up a database of what these things actually weigh loaded for use:
http://www.fiberglassrv.com/forums/f...rld-43010.html

According to the link, the lightest 13' Scamp weighed 1,620 pounds, and the heaviest 13' Scamp weighed 1,950 pounds.

The lightest 16' Scamp weighed 2,520 pounds, and the heaviest 16' Scamp weighed 2,800 pounds.

Does anything listed on that spreadsheet fall within your comfort range?

This is what I need to find out? This is where I need you guys. I do know I will have a custom receiver made to bolt onto the frame. Because of the value of the car I dont want anything welding. I would also reto fit a tandum master cylinder and also put in a brake controler I don;t think anybody is going to notice two holes drilled underneth the dash wherre the controler went . Doesnt matter its my damn car anway LOL!
I am in just the thinking stages here guys. I don't even own one of these trailers and the Goat is a long ways from back on the street.

[honda03842]

Roger,

We have a bolted on frame. I check the bolts every now and then, like during a 1000 mile dirt road ride. It has worked just fine.

[luvrOlife]

Roger,

Do you have any idea how cool it will feel to be driving your GOAT with the wind in your hair along the Oregon Coast and dropping your new Scamp so you can run into the Ocean and feel that blast of Cold Pacific Water on your feet as the Sun shines on that smiling face of yours?!!!

Which is exactly why you should do what you dream...

You don't know it yet, and you won't, until you put in place all the pieces to make your dream come true. You've got the GTO, you need a Scamp and you've got a lot of heart. Of course, you can do this!

I say GO FOR IT....This Life is what you make it...if this is what your heart is telling you, listen to it before it kills you from dying a slow, miserably unhappy death. It's good to be nuts...it means you still have dreams. You just need to put your left brain to use on the details and let your right brain do the leading.

Sending good juju your way so that you'll listen to your heart and let it sing!

[Frederick L. Simson]

Originally Posted by RV NUT CASE

The reason I got on this website was to get your guys advice about these Scamps. I know the limits of my car. But I don't know about Scamps. If a mini van can pull one of these I would hope a car pulling close to 400 hp would pull one? Again I need your expertise on the Scamps. I just don't know?

There have been raging debates on this website about towing a trailer (any trailer) with a car (any car) and what can be accomplished safely and economically, and what activity will put you (and anyone on the road near you) upside down scattered across the roadway with the Ambulance Chasing Lawyers straining at their leashes.

To me “Towing Safety” is not about a (black/white) (yes/no) answer to, “Is it safe?”
Life does not work like that. There are multiple variables to the equation:

• Is the Tow Vehicle in optimal condition?
• What is the cut-off line between what the tow vehicle can and cannot tow and how is that determined? How safe is “Safe”? Are there any specific guidelines that state the safety parameters for your specific Tow Vehicle and Trailer combination? (Is there a “Towing Capacity” statement in the Tow Vehicle’s Owner’s Manual?)
• How experienced (or inexperienced) is the driver in performing the towing?
• Can the Tow Vehicle’s engine pull the trailer load weight without causing undue damage to itself? (Most people initially think of just this one thing.)
• Can the Tow Vehicle’s braking system bring the combined rig to a stop in a straight line within a short distance? (This is more important than the previous question!)
• Can the Tow Vehicle’s structure (frame, bolts, welds) survive the stress of the added weight load in both starting and stopping the whole rig without breaking itself apart?

To most experienced trailer towers, one needs to start by looking for two numbers:

1. The towing capacity limit usually found in the specific Tow Vehicle candidate’s Owner’s Manual.
2. A Certified Weight ticket for the fully loaded specific Trailer candidate.

If the weight value for #2 is less than the weight value for #1, then most members here will welcome you open armed. If the weight value for #2 is greater than #1, then SOME members here will doggedly try to teach you the error of your ways. OTHER members will be of the opinion that you’re an Adult, and you should be capable of doing this. Then your thread will devolve into an argument between these two factions, and I as a Moderator will have to step in and shut the discussion down.

[Thomas G.]

Originally Posted by RV NUT CASE

...........
Ben Franklin said it best. If you say if you can or can't you're right!

I agree with the sentiment, but this quote is generally attributed to Henry Ford.

[Mike Magee]

Don't think for even a second that you can tow a 17' Scamp with your old GTO... because they never made 17' Scamps, only 13s and 16s! But other than that, yes definitely go for it! The GTO probably has a heavier frame than a lot of today's pickups. If you get it into reliable running condition and feel confident that it will take you there and back, then by all means rig that baby up to tow, hook up, and GO GO GO in your GTO.

Now if it were a vintage slant-6 Dodge Dart with 3 on the tree, I might have second thoughts...

[Mike Magee]

I just looked up the value of your GTO. WOW. If it were mine, I'd sell it, then buy a brand new vehicle and a trailer with the money. But that's just me....

[RV NUT CASE]

Originally Posted by honda03842

Roger. I just read this on one of Lisa's post and was appropriate.

"Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than by the ones you did. So throw off the bowlines, Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover."

I'm familar with towing a Scamp 16 and would be glad to answer any questions about our Scamp and experiences.

I tow with a unibody, manual transmission, 180 hp, 162 ft-lbs torque 2004 Honda CRV. We have towed all over North America without any issues.

The Scamp 13 and the Scamp 16 both have the same frontal area and in that sense, an important one, they are similar to tow. The Scamp 16 and 13 (our son has one) both tow beautifully.

Our Scamp is now 22 years old and our son's 36 years old. If maintained, repaired, upgraded it seems, like your GTO, Scamps can last a lifetime or longer.

You both have really made my day!!!!!!!!!!!!! It has been so long since sombody like you have given me such a positive repore. I just can't thank you enough! I guess I am speachless. I thought people like you didnt exist. I will take you up on your offer of advice. If I am going to get one its going to be a 16 footer. I want a frig not a ice box. I have a Motor Cycle that is in beautiful shape. I can't find anybody that wants to ride and it just sits in the shop and collects dust. I think I am going to put it up to trade for a scamp. If I can find sombody to trade this will really put me in gear I will be really motivated! I know how to do RV repair so if it needs some work that is not a problem as long as its not structure problems.

Thank you so much you guys you have really inspired me!

[MC1]

Wow, that vintage of Goat is "Prime" Especially with the tri 389.

This guy has been connecting car and trailers together for 40 years. May want to check out his site for some tips. Can-Am RV Centre | Your Towing Experts

Luv those vintage cars towing trailers.....

PS.... sure the GTO will tow a glass trailer but it is the details of the connection and set up which will contribute to the success of the project.

[RV NUT CASE]

Originally Posted by Mike Magee

I just looked up the value of your GTO. WOW. If it were mine, I'd sell it, then buy a brand new vehicle and a trailer with the money. But that's just me....

Sure sell it and buy a truck with Chinese parts and some parts Made in Mexico and probably put together in Mexico or................

Drive down the road in an American Made Muscle car with American made componets and Built with American Pride! Pull up to the light and smell that excess raw fuel coming out of a 400 Pontiac big block with a lumpy lump Isky cam. The smell of unburnt fuel comming out smells so good! I know what your thinking you been sniffing way to much unburnt fuel! LOL

I have a very nice 3/4 Ton truck that my Uncle bought new that I have put thousands of dollars into. I also have a Nomad Trailer built back in the 80s I would rather have that truck and trailer than the crap they put together today. The iside of the Nomad is all solid wood. And it tow so beautfully! I got flow masters on the truck and you can hear that old truck blasting up the canyons and I roll the window down and just listen to them loud exhaust system. Music to my ears guys music to my ears.

So no I am not getting rid of the Goat I would kick my self in the butt for the rest of my life.

[RV NUT CASE]

Originally Posted by Mike Magee

Don't think for even a second that you can tow a 17' Scamp with your old GTO... because they never made 17' Scamps, only 13s and 16s! But other than that, yes definitely go for it! The GTO probably has a heavier frame than a lot of today's pickups. If you get it into reliable running condition and feel confident that it will take you there and back, then by all means rig that baby up to tow, hook up, and GO GO GO in your GTO.

Now if it were a vintage slant-6 Dodge Dart with 3 on the tree, I might have second thoughts...

Ok you got me shows how much I know about these trailers! That is what I have you guys for to teach me!

I will take the dart is it a 70? I could throw in camp gear and a tent though and go. Good selection for a car. Can you throw in some air shocks the rear end will scrape because I pack way to much crap!

Thanks again you guys you have seriously cheered me up!

[RV NUT CASE]

Originally Posted by MC1

Wow, that vintage of Goat is "Prime" Especially with the tri 389.

This guy has been connecting car and trailers together for 40 years. May want to check out his site for some tips. Can-Am RV Centre | Your Towing Experts

Luv those vintage cars towing trailers.....

PS.... sure the GTO will tow a glass trailer but it is the details of the connection and set up which will contribute to the success of the project.

Hey thanks for the pics of the old cars towing travel trailers. About 8 years ago some ole boy up in Bend Oregon at the camp grounds there brought in a 69 caddy convert with a big a## 30 foot travel trailer. The guy had been all over the states with it. It was way cool but he was really conseeded about it. But the car and the trailer was cool. I stayed up there for about a week. Nice camp ground. I have to check out this website thanks again! You guys are starting to put a flame up my butt a much needed flame LOL

[RV NUT CASE]

Originally Posted by luvrOlife

Roger,

Do you have any idea how cool it will feel to be driving your GOAT with the wind in your hair along the Oregon Coast and dropping your new Scamp so you can run into the Ocean and feel that blast of Cold Pacific Water on your feet as the Sun shines on that smiling face of yours?!!!

Which is exactly why you should do what you dream...

You don't know it yet, and you won't, until you put in place all the pieces to make your dream come true. You've got the GTO, you need a Scamp and you've got a lot of heart. Of course, you can do this!

I say GO FOR IT....This Life is what you make it...if this is what your heart is telling you, listen to it before it kills you from dying a slow, miserably unhappy death. It's good to be nuts...it means you still have dreams. You just need to put your left brain to use on the details and let your right brain do the leading.

Sending good juju your way so that you'll listen to your heart and let it sing!

Thank you so much for your words of encouragement it means alot to me! Your reply really made my day! It's nice to see there is some people still out there that will support a dream sombody has. I am now motivated to find a 16 footer I truly think a 13 is going to be to small. I don't need a shower don't need a tolit but would like maybe a heater and a two way fridge. Water tank hot water heater and a sink I am good to go. I don't need much I am a pretty simple person! Thanks again you truly made my day also!

[Marinab]

Roger, I also rode a bike but gave it up for our little eggs. Do what you dream and don't let anyone change your mind. I have met the best people through my trailer and now have friends to go camping with as well as going to rallies. Welcome to the world of fiberglass!

[Adrian W]

Photos from the Gallery:

Fiberglass RV - Gilda's Album: Happy Camping (and Glamping)! 2011 Scamp 13' Standard - Picture

Fiberglass RV - Ken in Philly's Album: 16' Scamp - Picture

Fiberglass RV - samcamaro's Album: Steve & Toni's 13 foot Scamp - Picture

NOT Scamps:
Nice car
Fiberglass RV - Sheila Murchie's Album: Hippie Haven - Picture
Seems used to tow this
Fiberglass RV - Sheila Murchie's Album: Hippie Haven - Picture

Hoping for something like this:
Fiberglass RV - FRED SMAILES's Album: If we had more time we'd stop!! - Picture

Fiberglass RV - FRED SMAILES's Album: If we had more time we'd stop!! - Picture

Fiberglass RV - FRED SMAILES's Album: If we had more time we'd stop!! - Picture

You can check other Trailer makes in the Gallery section & see if you can find a nice vintage car towing a trailer.

Post Edit:
By the way, 13' Scamps made after 2005 have the same inside height as the 16' Scamp.

13' Scamps have a lower to the ground stance than the 16' Scamp.

Much like what some of the cars used to tow larger travel trailer back in the day, Stinger Hitch Helper

Article on Hitch Helper

Not too many of the Lite House TTs are about, but a nice small trailer.


However, new trailers are being made from the old molds:
Little Joe or Ponderosa very lightweight travel trailers. Made in Colorado.

I towed our 16' Scamp with a Ford Ranger for the first 3 years without any problems at all. Around New Mexico, into Colorado, all the way to North Dakota a few times. Never any trouble towing the Scamp into the mountains, nor coming down from them. Equipped with a small V-6 automatic.


Went to a heavier Ford F150 in 2009. Gets a little better mpg even.

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by RV NUT CASE

... I don't know about Scamps. If a mini van can pull one of these I would hope a car pulling close to 400 hp would pull one?

I'm not concerned about the GTO towing, but I do have a caution about comparing to minivans..
My Toyota Sienna "minivan" has longer wheelbase, wider track, and greater curb weight than a GTO... and 230 honest net horsepower (not 1970's "gross" values). Common minivans of the last ten years are all about this size, with increasing power levels. Anyone thinking that a minivan is not very capable should wonder instead if their car is as capable as a minivan!

To put this in perspective, minivans like mine have no problems with substantially heavier and larger trailers than a Scamp 16.

If an engine is modified to substantially higher power output it is not necessarily better for towing, which requires reliable sustained power for climbing grades. I don't know of anyone who uses - or needs - the full output of their stock modern vehicle's engine for more than a few seconds of acceleration. I think the emphasis in powertrain enhancement should be in driveability and cooling (coolant and perhaps engine oil).