Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 06-02-2011, 12:52 AM   #1
Senior Member
 
Adrian W's Avatar
 
Name: Adrian
Trailer: Lance 1985~'Casita de Campo' ~23' 4"~Dinette Slide Previously: Scamp 16 ft Side Dinette, Front Bath
New Mexico
Posts: 1,124
Thumbs up Terracotta Radiant Heater, Instead of a catalytic heater

I read about someone selling a contraption made from unglazed red clay flower pots. About 3 or 4 clay pots each a little smaller mounted together on a bolt, one inside the next. Kind of like a bell. { Terracotta Pot Candle Heater - Hacked Gadgets - DIY Tech Blog } I figured if one of these contraptions was placed over the burner on the stove, the clay pots would collect, store & radiate the heat from the burner and warm up the interior of an Egg pretty fast.

I make one and used it last summer when it got cold after thunder storms with hail came to visit while we were camping at about 9,000'. It worked really well and kept radiating heat after the burner was turned off. It was a dryer heat than the catalytic heater, which does put moisture into the trailer. We were pleased with it. I believe I used 4 pots and less nuts & washers than the original terracotta pot candle heater had.

Remember to keep from waking up dead from carbon monoxide affixation, you have to leave something opened a little (a top vent or window or both) so some fresh air can come in. Once the burner is off, close the venting to keep the heat in longer.

It did warm up our Scamp quickly and then radiated heat for some time after the burner was off. Very happy & it was a nice dry heat.

http://heatstick.com/_Process.htm

Edit Warning:
On another Forum, Someone wrote: "Many years ago I tried this aboard my sailboat. After the pot got good and hot it suddenly cracked and redhot pieces fell on deck and cushions. Mad scramble with water, and much hissing, before I got the pieces cool enough to pick up."

The thought about the pots cracking has entered my mind.......something to consider. I have only used it twice so far. Not sure if using only a very low flame would keep it from cracking or not??? The inventor does warn people about making one of his gadgets, the cracking and pieces flying maybe why.

From the description, it seems to have not only cracked, but explode somewhat as well. It is a good heads up. This might not be such a good idea after all.

Someone else said burning of propane in any way would make the same amount of moisture. As for this burning of propane making the same amount of moisture, I had wonder about moisture from a flame vs moisture from catalytic burning of fuel. I figured with the catalytic burning, it was making more moisture. Wouldn't know for sure.

All Things to Consider before doing this.
__________________

__________________
Adrian W is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2011, 07:55 AM   #2
Senior Member
 
Trailer: 1996 Casita Freedom Deluxe 17 ft
Colorado
Posts: 312
Adrian, I think your idea of using the flower pot gadget on the stove is a great idea. However, the website seems to be a bit of a scam. The heat from one candle is still not much, no matter how much of a heatsink you put over it. It's sad if people are spending $30 for these things and thinking they're going to heat anything.
__________________

__________________
Terry G is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2011, 12:06 PM   #3
Senior Member
 
Adrian W's Avatar
 
Name: Adrian
Trailer: Lance 1985~'Casita de Campo' ~23' 4"~Dinette Slide Previously: Scamp 16 ft Side Dinette, Front Bath
New Mexico
Posts: 1,124
On another Forum, Someone wrote: "Many years ago I tried this aboard my sailboat. After the pot got good and hot it suddenly cracked and redhot pieces fell on deck and cushions. Mad scramble with water, and much hissing, before I got the pieces cool enough to pick up."

The thought about the pots cracking has entered my mind.......something to consider. I have only used it twice so far. Not sure if using only a very low flame would keep it from cracking or not??? The inventor does warn people about making one of his gadgets, the cracking and pieces flying maybe why.

From the description, it seems to have not only cracked, but explode somewhat as well. It is a good heads up. This might not be such a good idea after all. Maybe Just TOO CHANCY TO BE USED.

Someone else said burning of propane in any way would make the same amount of moisture. As for this burning of propane making the same amount of moisture, I had wonder about moisture from a flame vs moisture from catalytic burning of fuel. I figured with the catalytic burning, it was making more moisture. Wouldn't know for sure.

All Things to Consider before doing this.
__________________
Adrian W is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2011, 03:18 PM   #4
Senior Member
 
Trailer: 1996 Casita Freedom Deluxe 17 ft
Colorado
Posts: 312
Adrian, I'm thinking the clay pots are very porous and probably going to absorb a lot of water in an environment like on a sailboat. When they're heated, this turns to steam, which can't escape fast enough, and blam! A one candlepower heater is probably at lot safer--just useless.
__________________
Terry G is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2011, 04:31 PM   #5
Senior Member
 
Francesca Knowles's Avatar
 
Name: Francesca Knowles
Trailer: '78 Trillium 4500
Jefferson County, Washington State, U.S.A.
Posts: 4,541
Registry
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adrian W View Post
I read about someone selling a contraption made from unglazed red clay flower pots. About 3 or 4 clay pots each a little smaller mounted together on a bolt, one inside the next.

It did warm up our Scamp quickly and then radiated heat for some time after the burner was off. Very happy & it was a nice dry heat.

Process
That's a real interesting idea...
We heat our house with a soapstone woodstove, and really enjoy the benefit of the 6-8 hrs of stored heat the slabs radiate after the fire goes out
I might have to experiment with my endless supply of old clay pots!
Thanks for passing along the idea, Adrian

I did have to laugh when I looked at the site that's selling the finished product- This bit about the "finish" on the metal stand is a hoot:
" We use either a very mild acid solution to generate a natural rust coating on the steel and then we allow the stands to sit out in our coastal environment until they rust up".

Around here we call that "forgetting it out in the rain".
Trust American Ingenuity to figure out how to make rust a selling point!


Francesca
__________________
Francesca Knowles is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2011, 05:46 PM   #6
Senior Member
 
Mike Magee's Avatar
 
Name: Michael
Trailer: Li'l Hauley
Oklahoma
Posts: 3,047
I have a better idea for heat generation. Use an exercise bike in the aisle, you'll sure be toasty! Sorry, couldn't resist...
__________________
Mike G.
Oklahoma
If you're over the hill, why not enjoy the view?
Mike Magee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2011, 06:06 PM   #7
Senior Member
 
Perry J's Avatar
 
Name: John
Trailer: 13' Scamp and Toyota Sunrader
California
Posts: 824
Send a message via AIM to Perry J Send a message via Yahoo to Perry J
I don't mean to be rude! My suggestion as to the clay pot heater is DON"T.
An open flame in a confined area is flirting with undetectable carbon monoxide poisoning or death.
When I was a sheriffs deputy I was also an assistance coroner and investigated 3 deaths by carbon Monoxide poisoning in small trailers.
__________________
Perry J is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2011, 08:34 PM   #8
Senior Member
 
Francesca Knowles's Avatar
 
Name: Francesca Knowles
Trailer: '78 Trillium 4500
Jefferson County, Washington State, U.S.A.
Posts: 4,541
Registry
But- Surely none of those CO poisonings were caused by the use of a single candle...
Aren't such incidents usually associated with charcoal briquets, generator fumes, or the old gasoline/kerosene heaters?
It seems unlikely that a single candle will produce enough CO to be cause for concern, especially given the air-leakiness of most of these trailers.

Francesca
__________________
Francesca Knowles is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2011, 08:43 PM   #9
Senior Member
 
Perry J's Avatar
 
Name: John
Trailer: 13' Scamp and Toyota Sunrader
California
Posts: 824
Send a message via AIM to Perry J Send a message via Yahoo to Perry J
Quote:
Originally Posted by Francesca Knowles View Post
But- Surely none of those CO poisonings were caused by the use of a single candle...
Aren't such incidents usually associated with charcoal briquets, generator fumes, or the old gasoline/kerosene heaters?
It seems unlikely that a single candle will produce enough CO to be cause for concern, especially given the air-leakiness of most of these trailers.

Francesca
I propane stove burner on low in an old leaky 19' trailer.
__________________
Perry J is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2011, 09:01 PM   #10
Senior Member
 
Francesca Knowles's Avatar
 
Name: Francesca Knowles
Trailer: '78 Trillium 4500
Jefferson County, Washington State, U.S.A.
Posts: 4,541
Registry

Since propane combustion produces mostly carbon dioxide and water, the only way that'd kill anyone in my trailer would be by drowning...
And anyway, we're talking about a single candle here.
I'm not giving up our romantic candlelit dinners in the trailer.
If there's a way to harvest a little (extra! ) heat from them, I aim to give it a try!

Francesca
__________________
Francesca Knowles is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-2011, 12:33 AM   #11
Moderator
 
Frederick L. Simson's Avatar
 
Name: Frederick
Trailer: Fiber Stream
California
Posts: 7,833
Registry
Send a message via AIM to Frederick L. Simson
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adrian W View Post
I read about someone selling a contraption made from unglazed red clay flower pots. About 3 or 4 clay pots each a little smaller mounted together on a bolt, one inside the next. Kind of like a bell. { Terracotta Pot Candle Heater - Hacked Gadgets - DIY Tech Blog } I figured if one of these contraptions was placed over the burner on the stove, the clay pots would collect, store & radiate the heat from the burner and warm up the interior of an Egg pretty fast.

This had been discussed here in the past.
"Compact Jr" trailers - any good? Page 2, beginning with Post #20
Black Cat Heater - Dissapointing Results Page 1, beginning with Post #7

I know there are more posts on the subject, I just did a limited search...

Some people are OK with taking the risk, and some are not.
__________________
Frederick - The Scaleman
1978 Fiber Stream 16 named "Eggstasy" & 1971 Compact Jr. named "Boomerang"
Frederick L. Simson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-2011, 01:17 AM   #12
Senior Member
 
Adrian W's Avatar
 
Name: Adrian
Trailer: Lance 1985~'Casita de Campo' ~23' 4"~Dinette Slide Previously: Scamp 16 ft Side Dinette, Front Bath
New Mexico
Posts: 1,124
My Scamp doesn't seem to be very leaky at all, dust does not seem to get into it and we get some good dust storms here at times; I know it keeps sound out, very well when all closed up.

A candle, I wouldn't thing would be too lethal, but on a cold night, I believe I would have a window or vent cracked open a little. Just to be sure. On a warm night, I would think you would have the windows open or the A/C going.

We use a catalytic heater to heat up our Scamp (not to sleep with one going), if we do not have electric hookup and/or can not run the generator. I was using the clay pot heater idea to do the same thing, but with a low flame on the stove top. When cooking, we leave a window open a little as well as the top vent. To keep from doing ourselves in. We do the same with the catalytic heater and with the clay pot heater as well. In years past, we have used a Coleman Lantern (non-propane) to heat up a TT after the heater stopped working. We used the open window/open vent method then as well.

In my OP, I did warn: "Remember to keep from waking up dead from carbon monoxide asphyxiation, you have to leave something opened a little (a top vent or window or both) so some fresh air can come in. Once the burner is off, close the venting to keep the heat in longer." I see I misspelled asphyxiation in the OP.

I grew up in South Texas with natural gas space heaters as the source of heating the house. Unvented heaters, I'm not sure if the house was just not too air tight or if my parents left a window cracked or not. When in collage, one year, I lived in an old army barracks with unvented heaters in the rooms. A very small room. I believe I would open the window a little when it was going. I am sure it wasn't a very air tight building. We must realize asphyxiation can happen if we let something use up all the air in a space, even people. We have to take care not to allow anything to do so. Not sure if I lucked out or if someone was thinking. But we survived no seat belts (lucked out), no child seats (lucked out), and I am sure many other things (lucked out) as well. Many others did not.

A long time resident of Las Cruces, a young businessman, after just having a new home built, moved in and was asphyxiated, killed one night. The builders had left a piece of dry wall blocking the vent on the central furnace. Death by apoplexy. Or was it from carbon monoxide asphyxiation. Carbon dioxide is lethal in an inclosed space.

My terms may not be medical correct, but to keep alive, I know we have to keep oxygen in the room. Keep it vented, have some fresh air/oxygen coming into the trailer.

"Asphyxia or asphyxiation (from Greek σ [a] - "without" and σφύξις [sphyxis], "heartbeat") is a condition of severely deficient supply of oxygen to the body that arises from being unable to breathe normally. An example of asphyxia is choking. Asphyxia causes generalized hypoxia, which primarily affects the tissues and organs. The body creates the need to breathe from the excess carbon dioxide in the lungs; the body has no way to detect the absence of oxygen. Many gases, though non-toxic, are classified as simple asphyxiants in their pure form or in high concentrations for this very reason."

For several reasons, the Clay Pot Heater is Just TOO CHANCY TO BE USED. With a candle not so chancy at all, but should always err on the side of caution. Always vent when burning up oxygen, especially with propane.

We have never slept with a catalytic heater on, but if it was so cold we felt like we had to do so, I'd want to have the window and top vent opened a little more. Or get a catalytic heater which has a carbon monoxide sensor to turn off if levels get too high. Or is it a carbon dioxide sensor?
http://wiki.answers.com/Q/How_much_c...take_is_lethal
http://www.nutramed.com/environment/monoxide.htm

Common Sense can do a person good. Asphyxia can not. Open a window. We can not live without oxygen.

Perry J, Thanks for the warning. People need to be aware of the dangers so they can keep from being a victim. However, not to be rude, but what does this mean, "I propane stove burner on low in an old leaky 19' trailer"? Curious minds want to know.
__________________
Adrian W is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-2011, 02:08 PM   #13
Senior Member
 
Mike Magee's Avatar
 
Name: Michael
Trailer: Li'l Hauley
Oklahoma
Posts: 3,047
I think Perry J meant that it only took one stove burner on low to kill someone, despite the fact that it was in a leaky, somewhat larger trailer.

A burner may be working fine at first, but as oxygen is consumed and gets low in the trailer, combustion becomes less and less complete and carbon monoxide production increases. Even if CO levels do not reach lethal levels, CO2 rises and Oxygen is depleted, which means poor air for breathing and possible health risk.

Up till now I simply believed that a stove burner would always produce a fair amount of CO while burning, period. After reading at the website www.propane101.com about this, I now think that if the burner is working properly (nice blue flame) and oxygen supply is continually replenished (partially opened windows), the burner probably will not produce harmful effects. The risk then would mainly be an open flame with no one to supervise it during the night, rather than CO production or O2 depletion.

I certainly can see the value of smoke and CO detectors in any RV, regardless!
__________________
Mike G.
Oklahoma
If you're over the hill, why not enjoy the view?
Mike Magee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-2011, 02:14 PM   #14
Senior Member
 
Francesca Knowles's Avatar
 
Name: Francesca Knowles
Trailer: '78 Trillium 4500
Jefferson County, Washington State, U.S.A.
Posts: 4,541
Registry
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Magee View Post

I certainly can see the value of smoke and CO detectors in any RV, regardless!
I wholeheartedlyly agree!
And would add: a fire extinguisher, for both the trailer and the tow vehicle.
Since one's first concern is to get OUT of the trailer if there's a fire, I also recommend that its extinguisher be on the outside of the trailer...

Francesca
__________________

__________________
Francesca Knowles is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Leaving a propane radiant heater on all night Greg Yother Care and Feeding of Molded Fiberglass Trailers 39 03-12-2009 09:42 AM
Radiant Heater Time K General Chat 1 01-11-2009 08:55 PM
Candle powered radiant heater Bonnie General Chat 14 12-17-2008 09:56 PM
Catalytic Heater william russell Classified Archives 1 07-30-2008 09:32 AM
Leaving a propane radiant heater on all night Greg Yother General Chat 0 12-31-1969 07:00 PM


» Upcoming Events
No events scheduled in
the next 465 days.

Our Communities

Our communities encompass many different hobbies and interests, but each one is built on friendly, intelligent membership.

» More about our Communities

Automotive Communities

Our Automotive communities encompass many different makes and models. From U.S. domestics to European Saloons.

» More about our Automotive Communities

RV & Travel Trailer Communities

Our RV & Travel Trailer sites encompasses virtually all types of Recreational Vehicles, from brand-specific to general RV communities.

» More about our RV Communities

Marine Communities

Our Marine websites focus on Cruising and Sailing Vessels, including forums and the largest cruising Wiki project on the web today.

» More about our Marine Communities


Copyright 2002-2012 Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 06:37 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

Fiberglass RV News Delivered to your Email!

Stay up-to-date with Fiberglass RV info to your inbox!

unsusbcribe at anytime with one click

Close [X]