Thom and Cari's Parkliner

[Kristen in MO]

Thom, thank you so much. Yes, you answered everything and more. I think I would get along wonderfully with your wife - I love her very practical ideas! I appreciate all the info you share and I will let you know what we end up doing. And of course, I may be back with more questions.

Sincerely,
Kristen

[Kristen in MO]

Hello again! I didn't think I'd have another question so soon, but... regarding the icebox. Since I've never been inside a Parkliner, I have no idea if this would work or not. I read somewhere else that someone removed a fridge or icebox and replaced it with a cooler and were very happy with it. Would that be something to consider in a PL if one was sure they didn't want the refrigerator? Don't even get the icebox and ask for the space to be finished as an open shelf? Then place a normal top opening quality cooler. Or even install an extension shelf so you can pull that out and access the top of the cooler? Just wondering what you think? Thanks!

[accrete]

Hi Kristen, thx for the thx & kudos on my wife : ) she's a keeper.

On ice box... well... knowing what i know at this point...? I would ask Chandler if there were finish options for that area rather than having the ice box put in there. I'm not sure i posted the dimensions but i think the rough area is 20"Deep X 18"Wide X 20"High. So with that in mind you might be able to go with a high quality YETI cooler that would easily keep ice & sub 40 degree temp for 7 to 8 days depending on the ambient temp. Our 70qt would do that in 70 degree temps. It would be small...35 Quart size would be about it, but doable. OR if you wanted to go Certified Bear Resistant...the Engel Deep Blue 25 QT would fit in that space and be just a bit higher quality build and duration with the added security to know you would be in-regulation in national parks to leave your cooler out (many are now requiring bear certified if left outside).

I realize the prices for ice boxes of this quality are not for the faint of heart...BUT our YETI which we just sold for ~40% retail was on every trip we took from 2007 through last month's trip and the new owner just reported that there is still ice remaining in the cooler on day 9 and they are very pleased with it. SO one should realize these high quality coolers such as Engel, Pelican, and Yeti are used by commercial fishermen and guides because they work!

I might at some point remove the ice box again (my post on getting the hepVo to work at draining faster) and do some simple finish work with shelves and front opening netting for travel.

Cheers,
Thom

[Kristen in MO]

Thanks for commenting. Definitely a question I will ask when I finally order. Have a great rest of the weekend!

[accrete]

Below is a re-post of what i believe is an important bit of information for current and future PL owners:

Originally Posted by Thomas G.

I agree that something is not right...You could double check all of these with a multimeter - battery voltage, current input to the battery, etc.

Well i've done just that at this point.
Today after the trailer had been unplugged for over 24 hours i checked the two batteries' voltage. They were both showing 12.9 volts (hand held VOM on posts) and the Xantrex was showing 13.0 volts (on common + bus-bar). I checked voltage on PD4045 and it was a measured 13.2 volts two days ago before i unplugged from the 30 amp service. During the 3 months of active use i have never seen a voltage higher than 13.6 volts & 1.3 amps being delivered from the PD4045 to the batteries.

After going over (once again) all manuals (Optima batteries & PD4045) and discussing what i had seen/measured with both optima and progressive dynamics i have come to the conclusion (with their assistance) that the PD4045 is not set up to properly (fully) charge Optima Blue Top batteries. These batteries are looking for a minimum of 13.8 volts during normal charge with a max 10amps, and then dropping to 13.2v and 1amp during "float". The PD4045 is incapable of sending out more than 13.6 volts during normal charge, and sends out 13.2v during float, but at a very low rate ~0.1 amp. This rate is to low to properly maintain Optima Blue Top batteries for maximum life/health according to Optima techs and the Optima BT specs.

SOooooo, i have an Optima 1200 digital charger on order that i will hook up to the common bus which is connected to individual 60amp fuses and then to each D34M battery.

Once hooked up i will report back.

thom

[Kristen in MO]

Hi, Thom. I'm not following. Is the PD4045 the factory converter? And it's not charging the now factory batteries enough? Is the optima charger necessary in addition to the PD4045 or instead of? And when I do finally get a PL, will this be something that someone with no electrical knowledge, but who can follow instructions/directions, be able to install? Thanks for your patience with all my questions.

[accrete]

Hi Kristen,

The PD4045 is a high quality converter that is in many RV's these days...and it came stock with our PL#35.

Here is my issue...I AM A MacGyver.. & enjoy knowing how things work. So in the case of our electrical system(s) i hook up redundant metering units (one hard wired in the bus-bar, one XANTREX LinkLite, one temporary handheld VOM). I now have just shy of 1000 hours of metering data from my setup and have not seen any voltage over 13.6 or more than 1.3 amps coming from the PD4045 even after being off-grid for 9 days use and running the bank down a (redundantly) measured ~30%. Once i even took my kindle reader out to the trailer when plugging in the unit and physically watched the meters for over an hour and still saw only the above info. One would think that was plenty of time to kick in a "Boost" mode? I will continue to test and maybe there is a PD solution...but in the mean time i will use the Optima charger as my battery maintainer.

Had i not been myself, and not wanted to know how things worked... i would have simply plugged the 30amp cable in and believed the batteries were being brought back up to 100% after each of our off grid adventures. I can imagine i am one of few peeps that go to this length of monitoring systems. And that is OK either way...it is just who i am...and who they are.

All i can say is what i've seen in my unit. And actually, i don't really care at this point since we only use the 12volt side of things anyway. . . so now i'll just be plugging in a ~25ft 14guage 15amp extension cord for the optima charger to do it's thing. This setup is very similar to what i used for several years in my Amateur Radio "Shack" and i know that AGM batteries are looking for particular specs out of a battery charger. I am happy with my decision to spend the $ on the optima charger for the two optima batteries in our rig, to me it is just part of good maintenance. I wish it could have been as simple (for battery health) to just plug in the PD4045...but 1000 hours of data later...i'm not seeing that is the case. (And our PD unit is apparently working according to specs per the PD tech folks.)

Dear Reader(s) Remember...all the above is on my particular Parkliner #35 built in April 2013 (that i still pinch myself as i spend time in...we luv it!)... your millage may vary!

Thom

[Kristen in MO]

Lol... Ok. It sounded like a major issue for all present and future PL owners when I read it the other day. But now not so much. All your detail is WAY out of my league, so sorry for all the questions. I do like reading all your posts about #35, I just have a long way to go before I understand it all.

[frank_a]

While we still like the layout of the ParkLiner, it is a bit disconcerting to me why the company is so disengaged from their existing and future customer base. Actually it worries me about their future prospects! For instance, on their Facebook page this morning, it looks like their last post was July 8 (today is the 27th). I'm not much of a fan of Facebook, but at least I check it every day. They have a slew of questions and comments there that have not been answered (a good one - what's the best time to call? no reply...). Why even have a Facebook page?

It worries me because I'm afraid if I buy one of these great little trailers, the company will simply disappear due to lack of customer engagement. It's just weird.

Don't mind me. Thinking of laying 20 some grand down for one of these trailers gets me thinking, always dangerous!

Frank

[Kristen in MO]

Yeah, I agree. But I'd also like the price to not go up any more before we buy, and that's what could happen if they staff more. And as small as their shop is, it's probably a lot of man hours to field questions from people who may not end up buying. And I'm guessing there's a lot of that in this market. So I'm just going to be patient and expect a wait when I finally place the order. And pester people here with my questions (thank you, everyone). And if they do fold before I get my trailer, I'm out $2000, I think. Not that I have that to throw away, but not enough for me to not risk placing the order either.

[cpaharley2008]

Originally Posted by Kristen in MO

Yeah, I agree. But I'd also like the price to not go up any more before we buy, and that's what could happen if they staff more. And as small as their shop is, it's probably a lot of man hours to field questions from people who may not end up buying. And I'm guessing there's a lot of that in this market. So I'm just going to be patient and expect a wait when I finally place the order. And pester people here with my questions (thank you, everyone). And if they do fold before I get my trailer, I'm out $2000, I think. Not that I have that to throw away, but not enough for me to not risk placing the order either.

I'm positive there are regulations in place where deposits must be returned in the event of non-completion, I'd not worry about that. It can only get better

[Kristen in MO]

Awesome! Then I'm not worried at all! Thanks.

[accrete]

Greetings Kristen, Frank, Jim & EggFamily

Sorry my wording and such might have caused some concern Kristen. As i stated my bottom line is i'm still pinching myself as i spend time in the little egg even with my perception/need to tweak what i see there.

Frank i too wish they would be more present and active, both here and FB!

Jim...that's my take on the $ issue also. And above that i do believe that Chandler's personal integrity would not allow such to take place.

Cheers...it's off to the salt mine for me.
Thom

[frank_a]

It will be a month or so till I have the 2 grand anyways, but I will have it and more. Just because some law says people can't be dishonest doesn't mean they will be honest. I don't know these folks at ParkLiner at all. Certainly the local Fox News video and NCPTV video look good, but heck, even if they were responsive to me and other folks, who knows what to think?

It really was reading all the ParkLiner posts here on fiberglassrv that's got me wondering, just so y'all know.

Frank

[cpaharley2008]

Frank,
If you are really concerned then contact the NC Attorney General's Office and their BBB and ask about your deposit.

[frank_a]

That does no good really Jim. What am I supposed to ask? "Does everybody have to follow the law?"

I've been financing commercial businesses for 30 years. I've seen companies pack up and leave in the middle of the night. (Well, I didn't actually see them - I would have stopped them!) Law does not stop folks from doing illegal things. Because of my background in finance, I tend to be a bit more cynical than most. I can't change who I am.

Enjoy your day,

Frank

[honda03842]

The PD Convertor has a Charge Wizard built in and it should, at least once a day, go to 14.1 volts for 15 minutes. When we had Incandescent bulbs it was clearly obvious when this happened and not good for bulb life but great for the battery. Our Trojan 105s lasted 14 years and going strong when we sold the RV.

Not knowing anything about Optima or the variety yu have, what voltage do you need to top them? When I read the Optima site it suggests 13.2 to 13.8 volts as adequate for a normal charge..

Thanks for the info

[accrete]

Originally Posted by honda03842

The PD Convertor has a Charge Wizard built in and...

Not knowing anything about Optima or the variety yu have, what voltage do you need to top them? When I read the Optima site it suggests 13.2 to 13.8 volts as adequate for a normal charge..

Thanks for the info

Greetings,

I took this from my Optima spec sheet and it lines up with what their tech folks have told me:

Optima Battery Model: D34M Recommended Charging Information:

Alternator: 13.65 to 15.0 volts

Battery Charger (Constant Voltage): 13.8 to 15.0 volts; 10 amps maximum; 6-12 hours approximate

Float Charge: 13.2 to 13.8 volts; 1 amp maximum; (indefinite time at lower voltages)

Rapid Recharge: Maximum voltage 15.6 volts. No current limit as long as battery
(Constant voltage charger) temperature remains below 125°F (51.7°C). Charge until
current drops below 1 amp.

Cyclic or Series String Applications: 14.7 volts. No current limit as long as battery temperature
remains below 125°F (51.7°C). When current falls below 1 amp,
finish with 2 amp constant current for 1 hour.

All limits must be strictly adhered to.

---end spec sheet quote.

The figure/area that i will point out (as the tech folk did) is the "Constant Charge" is what is also called "Normal Charging" by some manufacturers (such as Prog.Dyn for the PD series of converters). The optima BT D34M is looking for a minimum of 13.8v (PD4045 folks verified the unit only gives out a Max of 13.6 during "Normal Charging") to bring the battery up to 100% after it has gone through any time of "Boost Mode" of a given converter (PD4045 has a boost mode of ~14.4v). Then the D34M is looking for a "Float Charge" of 13.2v (which the PD does).

As i type the bank has been purpously brought down to almost 12.5v overnight... still at 12.57v as i type so i'll wait a bit longer until i test as Raz suggested.

On a related AGM battery charging note. I've mentioned my HAM Shack utilizing the same battery technology. And i had issues with my first charger not able to bring the battery up to 100% charge and going into maintenance mode prematurely. What i'm seeing with our PL#35 stock system is a similar situation. So i'm looking back at my HAM Shack fix and hoping a similar fix may be applicable here.

It's all good either way. I'm thankful to have rigs we can escape with and i do enjoy doodling!

Thom

[accrete]

I have just completed a two hour test of the PD4045 in my Parkliner #35 as suggested by Raz (thx again!). It was a fun quiet time with my kindle paperwhite and a good read out in the PL on an overcast mid-60's Oregon coast day : )

I took notes each 15 minutes on what the readout on the Xantrex LinkLite, Bus-Bar-Meter (the PD4045 is connected directly to the Bus-Bar also), and handheld VOM off each battery. My findings in summary were the PD4045 sent out ~13.5volts at an average of ~6amp over the two hours with a beginning battery voltage of 12.45 volts before hooking up the PD4045 to our 30amp service. The max voltage was 13.52 volts and max amperage for first 15 minutes was 8.2 amps. Here is a listing of each 15 minute reading:

Time..........Bus-Bar..........Xantrex..........VOM..........AMPS
0000..........13.4................13.5............ .13.45..........8.2
0015..........13.4................13.5............ .13.46..........7.6
0030..........13.4................13.5............ .13.46..........6.9
0045..........13.4................13.5............ .13.47..........6.3
0060..........13.5................13.5............ .13.48..........5.9
0075..........13.5................13.5............ .13.49..........5.2
0090..........13.5................13.5............ .13.50..........4.6
0105..........13.5................13.5............ .13.51..........4.1
0120..........13.5................13.5............ .13.52..........3.7

I ended the test at this point as it was twice the allotted time that Raz suggested that the PD4045 should go into "Boost Mode" and show 14.4 volts. Obviously this never occurred. Though, in discussing the unit with PD techs over the phone last week and running some suggested tests with them in the loop the unit was said to be working according to specs. So as i've stated, i really don't know what is up at this point, nor actually do i care since as stated i will be using the 12volt DC side of the system and not the 120vAC side so having the PD converter hooked up is a non issue since we use the rig off grid and what i'm after (and always have been) is simply to keep the battery bank healthy. If that means a high quality stand alone charger (such as the Optima arriving next week) so be it. Nothing lost, yet good knowledge gained in the experiment.

I will post the results of the test with the Optima charger once installed. I will draw the bank down to the same starting level and take readings at 15 minute intervals for two hours to compare and then also post as to when bank is (i hope!) topped off which has not happened yet with the PD4045.

Happy Trails! Our next adventure is in another three weeks so this is all good timing and rig will be ready to go with a full battery bank! Yippie.

Thom

[glennco]

From what I'm reading on the PD site, it only goes into boost mode once every 21 hrs. Why did you think you could observe this during your 2 hr test?