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Old 07-18-2015, 11:06 AM   #15
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Name: Fred & Linda
Trailer: Little Joe
Texas
Posts: 19
ChiTrailer :
Your inquiry has gotten lots of good suggestions.

Before you make your decision, please take a look at the Little Joe by Weiscraft. We have one and love it and it tows like a dream. Dry weight is 1200 pounds. We tow ours with a short wheelbase Jeep Wrangler and have another friend with a Little Joe and they tow it with a Toyota Corolla just fine.

One of the reasons we chose it over the Casita and others is that it is narrower making it so much more comfortable towing with smaller vehicles plus the inside height is greater than the others making it more comfortable for me standing up (I'm 6'1" and it think the inside height is 6'2").

In the Little Joe, the bed is lengthwise and 6-1/2 feet long and slightly wider than a queen size, great for me. Take a look some pictures on their website: Little Joe Lightweight Trailer - Compact Camper Trailer for 2 by Weiscraft Trailers Little Joe Lightweight Trailer - Compact Camper Trailer for 2 by Weiscraft Trailers

We are in the Dallas/Ft.Worth area and camp in hot weather here with the AC and at least once a year take it to Silverton Colorado where the nights get cold and with one small electric heater it is also very comfortable.

We have every convenience the big rigs have except the bathroom and it works out great for us (we have a portapotty for emergencies but have never used it - always set up close to the campground restroom).

Just my opinion and suggestion among the many others you are getting. Good luck with whatever you choose!

. . . . . Fred
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Old 07-18-2015, 11:08 AM   #16
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Name: Michael
Trailer: Looking
Illinois
Posts: 14
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Originally Posted by Bob Miller View Post
For Mike, with a "Do Not Tow" manufacturers towing limit, the cost of connecting his Series-1 Bimmer to a Scamp should be $00.00 USD. Or, with conversion, $00.00 CDN$


The several attorneys I have discussed this issue with don't really give a rat's patootie about trailer brakes. Towing over manufacturer limit is the issue and that leaves the owner open to all kinds of liability issues in the event of even the slightest accident, regardless of fault assignment. The issue can be that the vehicle/trailer should not have even been on the road when the accident occurred.
I think this might be the only argument that matters...as I write this tears pour all over my phone.
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Old 07-18-2015, 11:16 AM   #17
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Name: Michael
Trailer: Looking
Illinois
Posts: 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fred-Linda View Post
ChiTrailer :
Your inquiry has gotten lots of good suggestions.

Before you make your decision, please take a look at the Little Joe by Weiscraft. We have one and love it and it tows like a dream. Dry weight is 1200 pounds. We tow ours with a short wheelbase Jeep Wrangler and have another friend with a Little Joe and they tow it with a Toyota Corolla just fine.

One of the reasons we chose it over the Casita and others is that it is narrower making it so much more comfortable towing with smaller vehicles plus the inside height is greater than the others making it more comfortable for me standing up (I'm 6'1" and it think the inside height is 6'2").

In the Little Joe, the bed is lengthwise and 6-1/2 feet long and slightly wider than a queen size, great for me. Take a look some pictures on their website: Little Joe Lightweight Trailer - Compact Camper Trailer for 2 by Weiscraft Trailers Little Joe Lightweight Trailer - Compact Camper Trailer for 2 by Weiscraft Trailers

We are in the Dallas/Ft.Worth area and camp in hot weather here with the AC and at least once a year take it to Silverton Colorado where the nights get cold and with one small electric heater it is also very comfortable.

We have every convenience the big rigs have except the bathroom and it works out great for us (we have a portapotty for emergencies but have never used it - always set up close to the campground restroom).

Just my opinion and suggestion among the many others you are getting. Good luck with whatever you choose!

. . . . . Fred
Thanks. looks like a perfect floor plan for two. We feel the same about the bathroom/shower. The scamp has bunks so if we wanted to bring a couple kids. Food for thought.
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Old 07-18-2015, 12:01 PM   #18
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Name: Floyd
Trailer: 2004 13 ft Scamp Custom Deluxe
IllAnnoy
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I haven't a clue or a care as I believe all of those vehicles were built before manufacturers had printed towing limits and the issue of safe towing automatically became the full liability of the owner.

.
Actually the first couple were completely scratch built, using OEM or better components long after manufacturer's tow ratings,which have been around for more than half a century.
Safe towing remains the responsibility of the person doing the towing, After all, the manufacturers likely have even more lawyers than you have.
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Old 07-18-2015, 12:20 PM   #19
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Trailer: 1973 Hunter Compact II
California
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(clip) "After all, the manufacturers likely have even more lawyers than you have."


Yep, and that's exactly why one should pay close attention to those manufacturers specifications and limits, one will not be able to argue that they are superfluous against their band of brothers.


And, we are talking about production vehicles with stated and published specifications, not hot rods and one-off custom builds.
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Old 07-18-2015, 12:41 PM   #20
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Name: Floyd
Trailer: 2004 13 ft Scamp Custom Deluxe
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(clip) "After all, the manufacturers likely have even more lawyers than you have."


Yep, and that's exactly why one should pay close attention to those manufacturers specifications and limits, one will not be able to argue that they are superfluous against their band of brothers.


And, we are talking about production vehicles with stated and published specifications, not hot rods and one-off custom builds.
Actually I think we are talking about making rational decisions and taking personal responsibility. I.E. Whether legal or not, I have no intention of towing at 80MPH even with four lawyers in the car.

In the interest of amity and to avoid further obfuscation and futility, I will concede what I perceive to be your point, that some folks are just not capable of good judgement and must therefore by default, defer to those who would make all our choices for us. Now... I wonder what my nutritionist is having for lunch.
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Old 07-18-2015, 01:57 PM   #21
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Name: Michael
Trailer: Li'l Hauley
Oklahoma
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Originally Posted by Chitrailer View Post
I think this might be the only argument that matters...as I write this tears pour all over my phone.
Lawsuits and prosecutions for towing a recreational trailer weighing more than the mfr's rating are as rare as hen's teeth, so IMO the "lawyer says..." should be left out of this.

If you decide to tow something under 1000 lbs, here are some possibilities. This first one is no longer built, but sometimes you can find a used one:
2004 Columbia Northwest ALITE 400 - Tent Trailer | RVWeb.com
Then there are the pop-up tent trailers which are built to be towed even by motorcycles (gasp!) with zero tow rating (double gasp!!).
Roll-A-Home Motorcycle and Small Car Campers
Lite Tent Camper, LLC - Lees-ure Lite Motorcycle Pop Up Camping Trailers
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Old 07-18-2015, 02:11 PM   #22
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Name: Wayne
Trailer: Nest fan, Airstream Sold
Ontario
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Is it just me or is this forum more about the fine art of towing or the "Lawyers club of America". Ghesssssh!
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Old 07-18-2015, 02:42 PM   #23
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Name: Norm and Ginny
Trailer: Scamp 16
Florida
Posts: 7,300
Michael,

I've never owned a BMW and know very little about BMWs except your BMW is a lot more powerful than our Honda CRV and has a longer wheel base.

We towed for 7 years, made numerous loops of the USA, were on the road for 7 months a year, never had a single problem with our manual transmission, 2.4 L vehicle, drove across numerous mount ranges, pulled up gravel 18% grades, and never called our lawyer.

You made need a special hitch as Wayne suggests (MC1) but so what everyone needs a hitch. I don't believe the body structure of a BMW is any different than one built in Europe, there may be some component differences but not structure, the volumes are not high enough and in many cases the American engines are larger, the case with the Honda.. I can tell you our CRV is rated for 1500 pounds in the USA and over 3000 pounds in Europe. We choose the European rating.

Don't believe the statement about European Towing speed limits. In France the motorway towing limit for 3.5 tons (my Honda and Scamp 16 meet that req.) is 81 mph, in Belgium 74, in Portugal 62 and Germany 62. Heck trailer ST tires are only rated for 65.
We keep our speeds below 65, and after all the towing speed limit in 13 states is 55 mph.

There's some measure of LCA on this site.

Consider well, make sure you get trailer brakes and if your BMW is a convertible think twice they generally are not as stiff.
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Old 07-18-2015, 03:39 PM   #24
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Trailer: 1973 Hunter Compact II
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(Clip) "Don't believe the statement about European Towing speed limits. In France the motorway towing limit for 3.5 tons (my Honda and Scamp 16 meet that req.) is 81 mph, in Belgium 74, in Portugal 62 and Germany 62."

This is my source for towing speed in European countries. If someone has a better/different one please post it as it disagrees with Norms comments.


Speed limits | Overseas Holidays | The Caravan Club


I have driven extensively in Europe and can concur that caravans are always pulled much slower than the general flow of traffic.
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Old 07-18-2015, 04:03 PM   #25
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Name: Norm and Ginny
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Originally Posted by Bob Miller View Post
(Clip) "Don't believe the statement about European Towing speed limits. In France the motorway towing limit for 3.5 tons (my Honda and Scamp 16 meet that req.) is 81 mph, in Belgium 74, in Portugal 62 and Germany 62."

This is my source for towing speed in European countries. If someone has a better/different one please post it as it disagrees with Norms comments.


Speed limits | Overseas Holidays | The Caravan Club

I have driven extensively in Europe and can concur that caravans are always pulled much slower than the general flow of traffic.
Bob,
I used the very same source (humor) but read it like a lawyer. Here's quotes from your source.

"France Speed limits when towing:
If the gross train mass of your of car/caravan is under 3.5t then the speed limits are the same as a solo car. That is 81 Mph."

Germany:
"**There is an option to drive at 100km/h (62) if your car and caravan passes a TUV test in Germany. The test costs approximately 70 and takes two hours to complete."

If you look at Belgium you'll see the 74 mph is correct and see Portugal is also correct.

I try to give accurate information. I believe I'm the one who originally posted this link when there were similar statements about European speed limits.
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Old 07-18-2015, 04:17 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by honda03842 View Post
Germany:
"**There is an option to drive at 100km/h (62) if your car and caravan passes a TUV test in Germany. The test costs approximately 70 and takes two hours to complete."
and it appears they have the performance based TV's to cruise at those speeds.
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Old 07-18-2015, 04:21 PM   #27
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I also try to give accurate information as well.


I stated that "Most" European countries have a speed limit of about 80 kph. On the list 10 of 18 have that limit and a couple at 90, which is still only 55 mph.


Also, for France, they give an exact example for a CRV that puts that vehicle in the Over 3500 kg gross train mass classification resulting in the lower speed even if it doesn't meet that total weight.


Gross Train Mass is actual weight of the tow vehicle + maximum rated towing weight, even if the caravan does not reach that weight. It sounds unfair, but that's their law...
In short, if you have a higher towing weight rating you will usually get slowed down, at least in France.
Example
Honda CR-V 2.2 i-CTDI SE
Gross vehicle weight -2160kg
Towing limit - 2000kg
Gross train mass - 4160kg


That said, everyone knows that we each have out own agenda on this topic.
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Old 07-18-2015, 04:33 PM   #28
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Name: Michael
Trailer: Looking
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and it appears they have the performance based TV's to cruise at those speeds.
A 135i laughs at that Porche Cayman
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