Has anyone changed a floorplan completely?

[melissab]

I am just wondering if this could or has been done. Take a gutted 13ft egg, put in a front kitchen which would free up room for a larger bed in back... say maybe 12" wider or so. I'm guessing the closet serves as a roof support? If so, could one build floor to ceiling cabinets to provide this same support on one side and a closet on the other? Is there a reason there are no current production eggs with a front kitchen? I'd think one could even build in a larger fridge into the support cabinet. Does the egg's roof need support? This floorplan would only sleep 2 but would allow for a larger bed and more cabinets on the port and starboard side and possible a larger fridge. Any problems with this analogy?

Thanks,
Melissa

[Donna D.]

I suppose anything is possible. Lorene has a 13 foot Scamp with a front "L" shaped kitchen, right from the factory. It's one of the highly modified deluxe models. You'd also get a 54 inch bed which is six inches wider than the standard. But, most of the kitchen is still on the side. Wonder if that might have to do with tongue weight?

Picture of Lorene's trailer

I'll be curious if anyone else comes up with something...

[Robert Johans]

I am just wondering if this could or has been done. Take a gutted 13ft egg, put in a front kitchen which would free up room for a larger bed in back... say maybe 12" wider or so. I'm guessing the closet serves as a roof support? If so, could one build floor to ceiling cabinets to provide this same support on one side and a closet on the other? Is there a reason there are no current production eggs with a front kitchen? I'd think one could even build in a larger fridge into the support cabinet. Does the egg's roof need support? This floorplan would only sleep 2 but would allow for a larger bed and more cabinets on the port and starboard side and possible a larger fridge. Any problems with this analogy?

Thanks,
Melissa

How about this?

[melissab]

WOW, Donna, that is georgeous! It doesnt look like there is any additional support provided from the kitchen side. Now I'm wondering if support is necessary for the roof and if so maybe only the one closet provides it.

Thanks for the pix, LOVE the woodwork! I'm jealous, lol!

Melissa

[Raya]

I thought about changing to a front kitchen. I have seen a few 13-ers with them (Lorene's being one). The old Shasta Compacts often had this plan, if you want to take a look at some of them.

One thing to think about is that if you have a propane refrigerator, it would not be as convenient to have the vents on the front of the trailer (I think you would have to make covers for them to avoid major water ingress while trailering). Also, if you already have the vents on the side, you would probably want to fill them in (doable, but of course more work).

Another possible inefficiency is that you end up with a bit of a "dead" corner on the driver's side of the kitchen. You can use it for things, of course, but it's not quite as slick. Also keep in mind that you will still have the "hump" on the former kitchen side floor, because the sunken floor does not go all the way to the side walls.

You're right that you need to keep some support in the middle (and/or somehow keep the walls from spreading). The closet can be made 6" narrower without too much trouble, and you could move the cupboard side support forward 6". You'd just lose the sofa/bunk, as you say.

What I like about it is the big open window-over-the-counter feeling, the convenience of having it right next to the door (which seems silly since it's not exactly a mile to the other side, but somehow does make a difference), and the wider bed (if one is sleeping two people in it).

You would have to watch your tongue weight, as Donna mentions. Currently, the main weight in kitchen and closet are over the axle. With a front kitchen a lot of that would become tongue weight.

Raya

[Frederick L. Simson]

Surfside had a front kitchen in 15', and the new Escape 15' plan B has a front kitchen.

The only 13' front kitchen was Playpac. But I think the bed was smaller.

[Raya]

Actually, some of the Scamp 13 Deluxes have a front kitchen. Although to be fair it is some across the front and some on the side. But it definitely has a "front kitchen" feeling to it. The dinette/bed is then 6" wider, and the closet is slightly narrower (but there is an additional closet to the right of the door as you walk in).

This one is Lorene's:














And another one:

[Robert Johans]

What's going on with the front window in these examples? Has the big standard window been replaced with a little one or is it partially blocked by the vertical cabinet?

[Raya]

The Scamp-factory ones I've seen have a small window in front. Here are the windows on the two different trailers I posted above:

[Frederick L. Simson]

some of the Scamp 13 Deluxes have a front kitchen. Although to be fair it is some across the front and some on the side. But it definitely has a "front kitchen" feeling to it.

While they added cabinetry and countertop to extend into an "L" around the front; the locations of the sink, stove, and refrigerator are in the same side location. It's an enlarged kitchen, but not relocated to the front.

[Frederick L. Simson]

One thing to think about is that if you have a propane refrigerator, it would not be as convenient to have the vents on the front of the trailer (I think you would have to make covers for them to avoid major water ingress while trailering).

Every front kitchen design that I have seen with a propane refrigerator places the refrigerator so it vents to the side. The Surfside places the refrigerator high at the front corner facing sideways, so that the door opens above the countertop. 13' Shasta (stickie) did the same thing. While the Eriba Puck has the whole kitchen across the front, it has an icebox, not a propane fridge. The 15' Escape puts the sink and stove across the front, but places the refrigerator at the side between the entry door and the dinette/bed...

[Raya]

Every front kitchen design that I have seen with a propane refrigerator places the refrigerator so it vents to the side.

Yes, that's true in the ones I've seen as well. I mentioned the potential disadvantage of the front-mounted propane refrigerator because the OP was asking about "changing a floorplan completely," and moving the kitchen to the front. I reasoned that she might be thinking about moving a 'fridge as well, and the venting was something I thought about when I was considering a front kitchen.

[Raya]

While they added cabinetry and countertop to extend into an "L" around the front; the locations of the sink, stove, and refrigerator are in the same side location. It's an enlarged kitchen, but not relocated to the front.

Yes, I agree, it's not a complete front kitchen. However, I guess I included those two because, while the whole kitchen is not in the front; the front has pretty much been given over to kitchen (albeit with a closet on one side).

It looks like it's a way to get a bigger bed, a bigger kitchen, and an extra closet by giving up the ability to sleep four, and while also allowing the manufacturer to move as little as possible in the way of plumbing and venting.

I figured that the OP would find it interesting to see, even though she was talking about a "complete" change of floorplan, which I agree would be more drastic than the ones Scamp makes.

[Robert Johans]

My solution keeps the cooktop and refrigerator located on the street side, but moves the sink to the front and adds a lot of counter space. I've also maintained the big front window. IMHO, keeping these little trailers as light-filled as possible really improves the inside experience.

[melissab]

Awesome design, Robert! And I LOVE the kitchen cabinet space! That looks totally doable. I never thought about only having to move part of the kitchen to get the bigger bed eliminating the venting issue for the fridge etc. Gee, wonder if Scamp would build such a critter... it wouldnt be much different than Lorenes (which I LOVE) although they would have to shift the plumbing and propane lines for the stove. Can't wait to see pix of the 15' Esacpe, it even has a full bath! Amazing what 2 extra feet will get ya, lol.

Melissa

How about this?

[Kevin K]

[melissab]

Awesome! Just by shifting the sink and stove to the front it allows for a larger bed. I'm saving these floorplans for future reference. Thanks e'body! Especially for taking time out of your busy Holiday Schedule to draw up such nice visuals.

Merry Christmas!

Melissa in FL dreaming of my "one day" egg

[Roger C H]

TAB has some interesting floor plans:

http://www.tab-rv.com/story/index.php

TAB's are heavier, however.

(Actually, the A is the "[at]" symbol which computers interpret as an email address.)

[Raya]

I never thought about only having to move part of the kitchen to get the bigger bed eliminating the venting issue for the fridge etc. Gee, wonder if Scamp would build such a critter... it wouldnt be much different than Lorenes (which I LOVE) although they would have to shift the plumbing and propane lines for the stove.
Melissa

Melissa,
Scamp did build Lorene's trailer. It's what they call a Deluxe, and with that you get the wood cabinetry and can tweak the floorplans. I believe that particular tweak is a "standard" one, as I have see it on other Scamp Deluxe 13-ers.

Raya

[Andrew Gibbens]

Here's an original plus a couple of wider-bed layouts done some time ago when this was last discussed. The two alternative layout do have forward-facing refrigerator vents which I hadn't realised was a potential problem when doing these.





Also attached is your holiday play kit - a blank Scamp layout that you can fill in yourself. Just print out the last page of the PDF attachment onto Letter paper and it should be 1:16 scale - there's a 3" grid to help you design your new layout.


scamp_layouts.pdf

This drawing is approximate so check any important dimensions on your trailer. If anyone wants to measure the size and position of things like floor steps and wheel boxes, I'd be happy to add them to the drawing.

Andrew