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04-18-2006, 12:32 PM
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#1
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Member
Trailer: Former U-Haul and Casita owner (now Class C Motorhome)
Posts: 30
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hi all, its me again, my 84 uhaul needs a spare rim and tire, they are 14 inch tires 5 lugs, are they hard too find or pretty standard at most camper or rv business? this is my first travel trailer so i'm clueless. thanks
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04-18-2006, 01:25 PM
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#2
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Member
Trailer: 87 U-Haul CT13
Posts: 43
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Tom,
I haven't investigated for myself, but from what I understand, UHaul uses their own lug pattern, so you may have a hard time finding one. I suppose it's possible you could ask your local UHaul place, but I imagine they would likely be reluctant to sell a tire & rim.
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04-18-2006, 02:31 PM
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#3
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Senior Member
Trailer: Boler (B1700RGH) 1979
Posts: 5,002
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It seems from discussion in forums like this that by far the most common bolt pattern for trailer wheels (for any kind of trailer, but particularly for small travel trailers) is 5-on-4.5".
The size (such as 4.5") in a bolt pattern is the diameter of a circle drawn through the centres of the studs or bolts.
Tom, you could measure the U-Haul to see if it is this common pattern. Before you get a chance, another U-Haul owner will probably supply the correct answer...
There are other factors which affect the fit of a wheel: - width
- diameter (that's the 14")
- offset (how far outboard of the wheel centre is the hub mounting face)
- centre hole size (the wheel must clear or fit the protruding hub)
- hub-centric versus bolt-centric (is the wheel centred by the hole fitting the hub, or does the hole clear and the bolts centre the wheel?)
Most trailer wheels are nearly zero or small positive offset (mine on the Boler are +0.5") and are bolt-centric, with the hub requiring a relatively large centre hole for clearance. Wheels sold as generic "trailer wheels" seem to fit these specs.
I find it hard to imagine that U-Haul would use a unique bolt pattern, because that would increase their costs. They might use a less common - but still regular production - pattern. Dexter, for instance, currently offers hubs for their 2200-3500 lb axles with 5 bolts (lugs) on diameters of 4.5", 4.75", 5.0", and 5.5".
__________________
1979 Boler B1700RGH, pulled by 2004 Toyota Sienna LE 2WD
Information is good. Lack of information is not so good, but misinformation is much worse. Check facts, and apply common sense liberally.
STATUS: No longer active in forum.
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04-18-2006, 07:09 PM
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#4
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Senior Member
Trailer: 1975 13 ft Trillium
Posts: 2,535
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Our Trillium uses standard Ford/Mazda rims IF thats any help loooking for a replacement
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04-18-2006, 11:47 PM
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#5
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Senior Member
Trailer: Scamp
Posts: 3,072
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My understanding is that the UHaul tire and rim are indeed unique to prevent folks from renting the trailer and swapping out the worn tires from their automobile.
I believe I have read that one UHaul owner replaced his hubs with standard RV hubs so that he could find running gear on the road.
Pete
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04-19-2006, 05:37 PM
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#6
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Senior Member
Trailer: 1975 13 ft Trillium
Posts: 2,535
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Good one Pete, I was also going to add that sometimes its a good thing to have your hubs redrilled (by a competant shop or person) to more readily accept more easily accessable replacements whilst on the highways n byways.
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04-20-2006, 06:37 PM
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#7
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Senior Member
Trailer: Boler (B1700RGH) 1979
Posts: 5,002
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I dropped by a local U-Haul dealer, and had a look at their trailers. Between two or three sizes of open cargo trailers and several sizes of enclosed cargo trailers there were at least five different bolt patterns. Of the 5-bolt 14" setups, there were two or three combinations of bolt pattern and offset. One of them looked to be 5-on-4.5", with a conventional offset, but another had a significant positive offset (like a typical front-wheel-drive car) and a bolt circle diameter which might have been 4.75", but might have been between 4.5 and 4.75". Maybe that's the oddball one used for the trailers? The ones I saw had "U-HAUL" stamped right into them, and the tires (ST205/75D14 by Goodyear) had "Property of U-Haul" moulded into the sidewall.
I was measuring with a copy of this template, printed on clear plastic stock:
With only the domed ends of the wheel nuts to go by, it was hard to be accurate, and I had forgotton to cut out the centre hole so trailers with protruding hubs were even worse.
While I was looking (after the place had closed, leaving their trailers accessible in an open parking lot) an employee came by to ask what I was doing. I told him I was looking a cargo trailers for some stuff I have to move (which is true) and that some people I knew of had U-Haul travel trailers and were wondering about the wheels.
He had heard of the travel trailers (which he described as little white fiberglass trailers, "for a Corvette"), and knew that the wheels were an uncommon pattern. He said they were not unique to U-Haul, and thought they were some metric size.
Well, I don't believe this guy is any kind of expert, but perhaps - given the automotive style offset - that one type is something like 5-on-120mm, to fit some sort of car? I don't even know if that's the same wheel the travel trailers use, but it's an interesting possibility.
A random wheel supplier I checked shows wheels with many bolt patterns, including 5-bolt patterns in the following bolt circle sizes in this general range:
112 (4.409" or 4-13/32")
114 (4.488", maybe just 4.5" rounded to the nearest mm)
114.3mm (4.5")
120 (4.724", listed separately from 120.65mm)
120.65mm (4.75")
127mm (5")
The ones which list a 5x120 mm bolt pattern come in various offsets from 3 to 42 mm, and since at least one brand showed 120 mm and 120.65 as distinct sizes, I Googled for "5x120 wheel", and learned that this is (among other things) a BMW size, in 20 mm or higher offset (e.g. Discounted Wheel Warehouse; BMW - Vehicle Bolt Pattern Reference)
I also ran across a GM pattern listed as 5x115 at Discounted Wheel Warehouse; could be a typo (likely for 5x114.3 a.k.a. 5x4.5"), or it could be another oddball size.
So in the end, I don't have the answer, but maybe some possibilities to check out. If U-Haul really used a unique bolt pattern, or even just one for which wheels exist but trailer hubs usually do not, then I guess that's a testament to the extent to which trailers can be customized! They certainly don't put unique bolt patterns on their trucks.
__________________
1979 Boler B1700RGH, pulled by 2004 Toyota Sienna LE 2WD
Information is good. Lack of information is not so good, but misinformation is much worse. Check facts, and apply common sense liberally.
STATUS: No longer active in forum.
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04-20-2006, 11:43 PM
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#8
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Member
Trailer: Former U-Haul and Casita owner (now Class C Motorhome)
Posts: 30
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thanks for all the information. the rims that are on my uhaul camper are not the original ones. i've found a place here in tampa that carries all sizes. so next week one of the tires and I will be taking a field trip to purchase a spare.
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04-27-2006, 10:43 PM
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#9
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Member
Trailer: Former U-Haul and Casita owner (now Class C Motorhome)
Posts: 30
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Quote:
thanks for all the information. the rims that are on my uhaul camper are not the original ones. i've found a place here in tampa that carries all sizes. so next week one of the tires and I will be taking a field trip to purchase a spare.
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well the rim and i went off to rednecks here in tampa, and they don't carry a rim that matches my lugs. the rims on my uhaul are weld's. replacement rims on their website are around $300.00 per rim. Kinda pricey in my book for this old uhaul. maybe i should just bite the bullet or check out the salvage yards.
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04-28-2006, 12:14 AM
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#10
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Senior Member
Trailer: No Trailer Yet
Posts: 237
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be cheaper in the long run to replace the axle and get 3 new rims...
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04-28-2006, 07:10 PM
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#11
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Senior Member
Trailer: Casita 16 ft 1984 and U-Haul CT13 1985
Posts: 456
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We just encountered this same problem. Our '85 U-Haul 13 ft CT was lacking a spare tire so we've been all over town trying to find a 5 bolt 13" rim that matches our lug pattern. The actual lug pattern for our U-Haul is 5 X 4 3/4. Working with our local U-Haul manager we discovered that U-Haul itself is fazing out this unusual size/pattern in favor of a more common one, so although the U-Haul people we talked to tried to help us, they couldn't order the rim. We ended up purchasing a larger 14 inch rim with the 5 X 4 3/4 pattern at a local tire store. With a relatively small tire on it, the radius of our wheel will be increased by 1/2", which our wheel well can accommodate. The cost will run about $60. The difference in wheel sizes should be OK for a short tow in an emergency. Not ideal, but should do in a pinch (and much cheaper than replacement of the entire wheel assemblies).
In the event that we have any major problems in the future with our primary 13 in trailer tires, we plan to replace them with 14 in rims / tires, again with the 5 X 4 3/4 pattern.
Best wishes,
Jeanne and Steve
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04-28-2006, 09:20 PM
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#12
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Member
Trailer: Former U-Haul and Casita owner (now Class C Motorhome)
Posts: 30
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can you tell me who made those rims and what size tire you put on them. that would be a great help. i've just about pulled all my haie out over this
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04-29-2006, 06:37 AM
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#13
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Senior Member
Trailer: 2002 16 ft Scamp
Posts: 614
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Tom, General Motors vehicles from the 60's and 70's (back in my hot rodding days) used 5 lug on 4.75 bolt patterns with various offsets. Most any junk yard or, if you want to get fancy, auto parts store should be able to fix you up with a wheel having those specs. Hopefully, Jeanne & Steve will get back with you on the tire size.
Al
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04-29-2006, 07:55 AM
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#14
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Senior Member
Trailer: 1991 16 ft Casita Freedom Deluxe
Posts: 250
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Yes, GM models such as Malibu and El Camino use the 5x4.75 (or 5x120.65mm, same thing) pattern. More current offerings would include S-10 pickups. The 2wd and 4wd pickup bolt patterns are identical but the offset is different, so be aware of that.
I'm not aware of any 5-bolt, 13" wheels off the top of my head.
It would be easy to figure out the optimum size of 14" tire to match the OD of your curent 13" tire using the tire size calculator here:
http://www.miata.net/garage/tirecalc.html
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04-29-2006, 08:30 AM
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#15
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Senior Member
Trailer: Casita 16 ft 1984 and U-Haul CT13 1985
Posts: 456
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Tom,
We have the rim and tire on order, and haven't actually tested them on our trailer yet, sorry that we forgot to mention that important fact. Also, the price is actually $70, a little higher than we remembered. The rim is ordered from Les Schwab Tires - here's the details: - product code 03508008
- product description: 8046034 14X6 5-4.75 Allied Type 80 white spoke rwd
I had a sinking feeling in the middle of the night that the tire on order isn't a trailer-type tire. We just assumed that the tire expert would know that's what we needed... we'll check on that. But here's the current tire details: - product code 03101524
- product description 175/70R-14 84H Merit SE-H all seasons blackwall
We'll post an update as things develop.
Jeanne
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04-29-2006, 05:59 PM
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#16
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Senior Member
Trailer: Boler (B1700RGH) 1979
Posts: 5,002
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So, perhaps I wasn't out to lunch - the U-Haul travel trailer size appears to be the 4.75" bolt circle diameter possiblity which I mentioned earlier. Since the 120 mm diameter is only 2/3 of one millimetre smaller, perhaps it really is the "metric" 5-on-120mm size, but 5-on-4.75" still fits okay?
The U-Haul wheels possibly of this pattern which I saw had a large offset (more typical of front-wheel-drive or recent rear-drive than traditional rear-wheel-drive) so I would be careful to check the offset if I were equipping a U-Haul.
Load index 84 (as shown in Jeanne's specs) is good for a capacity of 500 kg (1102 lb) per tire in passenger service, which is 450 kg (992 lb) each after 10% de-rating for trailer service. Since a load index is supplied, and no ST is on the beginning of the designation, I believe that this is a passenger-type tire, but for a 13' trailer the capacity seems more than adequate - especially with the relatively high-speed "H" rating.
I believe that the passenger-type tire is a deliberate and appropriate choice, since to meet the desired diameter with a 14" wheel size requires a lower aspect ratio (70%, in this case) than is available in ST tires.
Jeanne's wheel is six inches wide, which seemed unusually wide to me for a 175 mm tire. For each tire, there are specifications for the minimum and maximum wheel width, as well as the wheel width which is used when measuring the tire. The Les Schwab web page for the Merit SE-H bizarrely gives no size information, but the Goodyear Integrity in that size allows widths of 5.0 to 7.5 inches, and 6.0 inches is the measuring rim width, so my first impression was obviously wrong; the ordered wheel looks like just the right width.
I am somewhat concerned about the accuracy of the Goodyear data, because that page lists the Integrity P175/70R14 84T with a load capacity of 1433 lb at 35 PSI, which would be a load index of 93, not 84. Perhaps it is 93 at low speeds, and 84 at "T" range speeds? Anyway, I think a load index of 84 should be fine. Too bad my twice-as-heavy B1700 is not so easy to fit.
__________________
1979 Boler B1700RGH, pulled by 2004 Toyota Sienna LE 2WD
Information is good. Lack of information is not so good, but misinformation is much worse. Check facts, and apply common sense liberally.
STATUS: No longer active in forum.
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04-29-2006, 06:06 PM
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#17
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Senior Member
Trailer: Boler (B1700RGH) 1979
Posts: 5,002
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The tire portion of the above discussion is similar to the discussion in Auto/Truck tires on 13 ft. Scamp?, Bias or radial?. In that one, Garret chose P195/70R14 tires, which are 20 mm wider and thus about 14 mm (half inch) larger in diameter; I don't think it's an important difference.
__________________
1979 Boler B1700RGH, pulled by 2004 Toyota Sienna LE 2WD
Information is good. Lack of information is not so good, but misinformation is much worse. Check facts, and apply common sense liberally.
STATUS: No longer active in forum.
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05-06-2006, 06:24 PM
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#19
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Senior Member
Trailer: Casita 16 ft 1984 and U-Haul CT13 1985
Posts: 456
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Quote:
Tom,
We have the rim and tire on order, and haven't actually tested them on our trailer yet... We'll post an update as things develop.
Jeanne
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I'm sorry to report that our rim/tire combo didn't work out after all. The rim didn't have a large enough offset, leaving the outer edge of the tire in-line with the outer edge of the fiberglass wheel well, with not enough clearance to keep it from rubbing during travel. I apologize for getting your hopes up Tom, I should have waited to see if our rim/tire combo would really work before posting an answer.
So, we too are still in search of a spare...
Jeanne
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05-06-2006, 07:26 PM
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#20
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Member
Trailer: Former U-Haul and Casita owner (now Class C Motorhome)
Posts: 30
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jeanne, thank you so much, now a question, did the rim fit your Uhaul? the tires on my Uhaul are 7.00-14lt. i'm not sure of the brand right now, put i'll post that up here. And thanks again to everyone
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