why ask why?

[Jon in AZ]

Some models, like my Scamp, are precluded from having opening windows on the front (and in some cases the back as well) because of the curvature of the shell.

As to others... there was a discussion a while back about the fixed rear window on an Escape. The reported official answer was there were some issues with dust and water infiltration. Of course, that's always an issue with any opening window, and a very minor one if it's properly installed and maintained.

My conclusion is that the real reason is cost. The prevalence of AC today makes banks of operable windows less important, and so less worth the additional cost.

There is also this. Forty years ago when the original Trilliums were being made, if an owner found a little bit of water around the window after driving in a hard rain, the reaction was likely, "That's normal, no big deal, and after all this is camping." Today... "Hey, the window is defective, we need to make a warranty claim."

So, if you are one of those blessed with an older Trillium that has full jalousies all around... be thankful, and take good care of it!

[Gilles]

I owned a 1980 Trillium Jubilee 7 years, I loved all the windows were all around jealousy.

You could go for a hike by leaving the windows open, safe water infiltration.

And when the windows were closed and we took the road with heavy rains, there was no water intrusion.

I replaced the Trillium by Bigfoot for more spaces.

When we bought the Bigfoot, I was told that I would replace the scenes windows by jealousy, but the previous owner had replaced the four side windows.

I still have forward and backward, if they become defective, I will replace perhaps by jealousy windows...

I know some companies that manufacture custom windows for trailers, manufacture jealousy.

[Raz]

Originally Posted by Jon in AZ

As to others... there was a discussion a while back about the fixed rear window on an Escape. The reported official answer was there were some issues with dust and water infiltration. Of course, that's always an issue with any opening window, and a very minor one if it's properly installed and maintained.

My conclusion is that the real reason is cost. The prevalence of AC today makes banks of operable windows less important, and so less worth the additional cost.

We ordered an Escape under the mistaken impression we could get jalousie windows. Despite offering to pay any additional costs, they refused, so we cancelled and bought our Trillium. My guess is Escape was concerned about complaints more than cost. Had we continued with the sale we would have had a fixed window in the front and back, a slider on one side and a egress window on the other. That just would not work for us. If you camp at pubic campgrounds in the northeast as well as most federal campgrounds there is no electricity, so AC is useless.

So, if you are one of those blessed with an older Trillium that has full jalousies all around... be thankful, and take good care of it!

The newer US made Trilliums all have Hehr jalousies. I was told these are the same series Scamp uses except they are bigger. Raz

[Carol H]

Biggar's also have opening front windows.

[Jon in AZ]

@Raz... I am in complete agreement with you that AC is not an adequate substitute for lots of natural ventilation in the kinds of places I like to camp.

But my observation is that few newer trailers do offer all-around ventilation like your Sidekick Trillium, so I have to ask why not. And I really do think cost- including both the windows themselves as well as leak-related warranty costs- is the driving factor. And it sells AC... and generators...

I note that Sidekick Trilliums cost more than similar-sized and equipped alternatives and have struggled to stay in production. I'd hazard a guess that the original Trillium also carried a price premium over the Bolers and Scamps of the day. I know the windows aren't the only reason they cost more to build, but it's certainly a factor. I'd balk at paying $20K for a 13' trailer without a bath.

Fantastic Fans have become the poor man's alternative...

[Raz]

Originally Posted by Jon in AZ

@Raz... I am in complete agreement with you that AC is not an adequate substitute for lots of natural ventilation in the kinds of places I like to camp.

But my observation is that few newer trailers do offer all-around ventilation like your Sidekick Trillium, so I have to ask why not. And I really do think cost- including both the windows themselves as well as leak-related warranty costs- is the driving factor. And it sells AC... and generators...

I note that Sidekick Trilliums cost more than similar-sized and equipped alternatives and have struggled to stay in production. I'd hazard a guess that the original Trillium also carried a price premium over the Bolers and Scamps of the day. I know the windows aren't the only reason they cost more to build, but it's certainly a factor. I'd balk at paying $20K for a 13' trailer without a bath.

Fantastic Fans have become the poor man's alternative...

They got pricey when they went to dealers. Mine is not a sidekick but a 2010 Trillum made in California. At the time they were about $12k to start factory direct. We paid about $14k delivered which was a little more than the Scamp we priced out and quite a bit less than the Escape 15'. At the time Scamp gave buyers a choice of sliders or jalousie at no adfitional charge. I suspect given the option many would be willing to pay more for jalousies. As you said earlier, I am very happy to have them. Raz

[floyd]

Originally Posted by Jon in AZ

Some models, like my Scamp, are precluded from having opening windows on the front (and in some cases the back as well) because of the curvature of the shell.

A few decades ago, Scamp changed the molds to accommodate a flat sliding rear window in all models.
Recently they eliminated the flat area on the front of the 19 and thus eliminated the option for a front window.

[Jon in AZ]

Originally Posted by floyd

A few decades ago, Scamp changed the molds to accommodate a flat sliding rear window in all models.

…a move we're all grateful for. A bit odd that they still supply a slider back there, having recently switched to radius jalousies on the sides... any insights on that, Floyd?

Casita, on the other hand, didn't, so their old-design models (13' and 16') still have a fixed plexiglass rear window. Probably not much reason to make the investment, since they sell mostly the newer 17'ers that accommodate an sliding back window.

Originally Posted by floyd

Recently they eliminated the flat area on the front of the 19 and thus eliminated the option for a front window.

I didn't realize they ever offered an opening window in the front. It doesn't really seem necessary in a fifth wheel. That space is for sleeping, so less light and better insulation is good. Cross ventilation is still provided by the side windows.

[Peter B]

We too have never been happy about the lack of ventilation at the front of our 2010 Trillium Outback so I had Escape Trailers install a small awning window at the front street side corner. We also have an opening window in the door so now we can get some cross ventilation. I removed the front bunks/goucho and converted the area to a two place dinette. I also converted the rear dinette to a permanent bed with a slide out tray underneath with two large clear plastic tubs for extras, mainly clothes.

[floyd]

Originally Posted by Jon in AZ

…a move we're all grateful for. A bit odd that they still supply a slider back there, having recently switched to radius jalousies on the sides... any insights on that, Floyd?

.

I don't see it as odd since I prefer slider windows. If I were to order a new one it would have sliders,if possible, even if I had to provide them myself or order the trailer without windows and install my own.
I am concerned that the decision was made by the supplier though.
Really a moot point for me, shy of wreck, since I already have my trailer.

Sliders provide simplicity and a cleaner look with a less obstructed view, especially on the back where it also provides a means of egress, obviating the roof escape hatch.

[Jon in AZ]

I didn't mean sliders were odd, only that the mismatched window styles seemed a little unusual. But I take it the reason was so the back window can serve as an emergency egress in builds which omit the roof hatch. Which makes some sense...

I actually agree with you about the sliders. In addition to the things you mentioned, I'm concerned the newer crank mechanisms may not be as durable as the old. My little crank out kitchen window already has a chipped plastic roller that causes it to jump its track occasionally.

[Raz]

........... But I take it the reason was so the back window can serve as an emergency egress in builds which omit the roof hatch.

.....I'm concerned the newer crank mechanisms may not be as durable as the old. My little crank out kitchen window already has a chipped plastic roller that causes it to jump its track occasionally.

Picture : Combination Egress/jalousie

Link: if the operator fails


Operators

[Carl V]

Originally Posted by Jon in AZ

So, if you are one of those blessed with an older Trillium that has full jalousies all around... be thankful, and take good care of it!

Our Trillium has 7 windows, 3 of them double size, and they all open. Now that's ventilation!
One of the main reasons we bought a 5500.

[floyd]

Too many windows can make for a lot of condensation on a cool night and a lot of cold air cascading off the windows.
There always seems to be a compromise.

[Carl V]

Possibly. We'll see how it goes. Our Trillium was just bought last summer, is undergoing some remodeling, so we haven't used it yet.

We're used to deal with condensation in our popup. Not that we had a lot, but we always acted to minimize it. Can't imagine the trailer being any worst. If it's the case, we'll just sleep with the windows open I guess!
As for cold, I've camped in a tent in the middle of winter at -20, no heat, and I was just fine (got to have the right equipment though) !!

[David Tilston]

A Maxxair powered vent would help with condensation.

[RogerDat]

My scamp has the prop up windows all the way around including the door. Can't imagine those with kids the little prop arms are just begging to be run into and broken if one is not careful.


I do like the 360 degree no power consumption air conditioning, and that in moderate rain they can be left open.


Many camper brands and models have experienced feature creep. Items that used to be only on higher end models have made it down to the more basic. Anyone else recall the first time they saw factory air on a pop-up canvas sided camper? Even showers & toilets are common now on "base" models, as are microwave or at least a location for it and the TV. Expando slide out units used to be worthy of comment walking around a campground, now pretty much all the larger campers have at least one.


Not a good thing or a bad thing since those features are desired by some and complexity to be avoided by others. If buying new I would hope I can get what the heck I want for windows. Would seem a shame to run a stereo with "sounds of nature" tape since I can't open the windows and just hear it.

[Carl V]

Originally Posted by David Tilston

A Maxxair powered vent would help with condensation.

I guess so, but how much of an issue is it?
My roof van has a old and inefficient noisy little fan that I intend to replace anyway. I was looking at large computer fans, they can quietly move a lot more air and probably draw less power than my tiny fan. Probably not as powerful as a Maxxair, but much cheaper.

Back to the jalousie windows, one thing I don't like about them is when you walk along the camper and they are open you have to be careful not to bang your head on the edge or corner of a pane. I suspect camping with stitches on the forehead might not be quite as fun.

[RogerDat]

Carl raises a good and important point Do Not to put cooler with beer and/or wine in it right under a window that sticks out. If you wake up with a head ache you want it to be from having too much fun not from smacking your head going for only your second cold one.

[BarbieB]

Love my jalousie windows in my 1977 Trillium! Have rarely used my Magic Fan as we get great cross ventilation - and with my original screen room attached, I can leave the front door wide open all the time. They knew how to make 'em in the old days!