Adding an Outlet to Cabinets - HOW?

[GordM]

I've done the usual search of the forums, and haven't had luck finding this. I have a 1972 Boler, 13' and I want to add an electrical (110) outlet to the cabinet. There is one right in front, but I wanted to add one to either the end at the dinette, or the end at the bench, whichever is easier to get to. Anyway, long story short, how do you cut into the plastic cabinets without wrecking it? What tool have most of you used? Thanks!

EDIT: Sorry for putting it in the wrong subforum. I though it might should be in here, but I wasn't sure.

[Rick G]

Hi Gord,

I have put electrical outlets in the main kitchen cabinet, the big cupboard, and the rear dinette bench on the cupboard side. For the outlets which were far away from the electrical service inlet, I used a standard outdoor extension cord for wiring. This was because the stranded wire used in outdoor extension cords should handle the flexing and vibration better than solid core house wiring and the cord is already waterproofed.

To cut into the fibreglass body parts, I first drill a 1/4 inch or so hole along one of the outlines of my electrical box. Then I use a standard electric jig saw with a wood blade to cut out the shape I want. It is, however, important that the blade guard of the jig saw not touch the fibreglass that you are cutting. This is because the jig saw will leave scratch marks on the fibreglass if it is painted or even if not painted, which are impossible to get rid of. The jig saw will leave these marks even if the blade guard is covered in tape, as I do to avoid scratch marks in wood or metal.

So, what I do is manually hold the jig saw in the air while cutting, so that only the blade itself comes in contact with the fibreglass, This is actually quite easy and has worked perfectly. It uses up the blade fairly fast, but blades are cheap.

I also recently installed large access doors on the outside of the trailer, using the same technique to cut the holes. That post can be found here: http://www.fiberglassrv.com/board/in...howtopic=40060

Of course, fibreglass fills the air so you would want a breathing filter and protective glasses, and I also use ear protection although it is not really necessary for the particular saw that I use.

Hope that helps,
Rick G

[GordM]

Oh that's great Rick, thanks for the info! I considered a jig saw, but having never tried it, I had visions of plastic cracking and breaking off etc. I also thought of a dremel.

But I do have another question for you though. When you mentioned that you used extension cords for outlets on the other side of the electrical service, did you just drill a hole in the bottom of the Boler and ran the cord underneath? And did you use silicon to seal the hole? I'm curious about this too, because I might in the future need to do that as well. Thanks!

[Carol Ann in TO]

Just as an aside Gord... your cabinets are not plastic. They too are fiberglass.

[Matt in SV]

To cut into the fibreglass body parts, I first drill a 1/4 inch or so hole along one of the outlines of my electrical box. Then I use a standard electric jig saw with a wood blade to cut out the shape I want. It is, however, important that the blade guard of the jig saw not touch the fibreglass that you are cutting. This is because the jig saw will leave scratch marks on the fibreglass if it is painted or even if not painted, which are impossible to get rid of. The jig saw will leave these marks even if the blade guard is covered in tape, as I do to avoid scratch marks in wood or metal.

How about putting tape on everything? The blade guard and also mask off the surface to be cut?

I think it might be possible to attach some protective surface to the blade guard, maybe a Delrin or Teflon runner, with counter-sunk screws?

Have you ever tried one of the Dremel Multi-Max Oscillating tools? It looks a little like a small angle grinder, but it has a semi-circular cutting blade, and can also take different sanding tips. It looks like it might be a good tool for small fiberglass and gel-coat repairs. I saw one at Home Depot (they're about $100) and was going to try it out on a panel I need to install. I may try the jigsaw first, though.

Regards,

Matt

[Raya]

One nice thing about the Fein Multimaster/knock offs (oscillating blades) is that they create very little dust, and what they do make tends to mostly fall down (vs. flying everywhere).

Otherwise, I tend to tape a stick to a vacuum hose and hold the end of the hose right next to the tool.

Raya

[K Slade]

How about putting tape on everything? The blade guard and also mask off the surface to be cut?

I think it might be possible to attach some protective surface to the blade guard, maybe a Delrin or Teflon runner, with counter-sunk screws?

Have you ever tried one of the Dremel Multi-Max Oscillating tools? It looks a little like a small angle grinder, but it has a semi-circular cutting blade, and can also take different sanding tips. It looks like it might be a good tool for small fiberglass and gel-coat repairs. I saw one at Home Depot (they're about $100) and was going to try it out on a panel I need to install. I may try the jigsaw first, though.

Regards,

Matt

I use nothing more than a regular Dremel rotary tool with a disc cutter follow the line that you put on so you have something to follow. Works well but does get a little smelly and the dust is a problem no matter what method you use.
Ken

[Per Walthinsen]

I often wrap some electrical tape around the end of a hacksaw blade. Goes very fast after you drill a hole or two to stick it through. On some jobs you may not be able to get a jigsaw maneuvered to the right place, but the hacksaw blade almost always gets to it. Less dust with it too.

[Scott H]

How about putting tape on everything? The blade guard and also mask off the surface to be cut?

I think it might be possible to attach some protective surface to the blade guard, maybe a Delrin or Teflon runner, with counter-sunk screws?

Have you ever tried one of the Dremel Multi-Max Oscillating tools? It looks a little like a small angle grinder, but it has a semi-circular cutting blade, and can also take different sanding tips. It looks like it might be a good tool for small fiberglass and gel-coat repairs. I saw one at Home Depot (they're about $100) and was going to try it out on a panel I need to install. I may try the jigsaw first, though.

Regards,

Matt

I've recently cut some holes in the interior cabinets of my Trillium. The Dremel with the reinforced cut off disc was the ticket; not fast but very precise, but eats up the wheels pretty fast. As always; respirator, eyewhere, ect.

[GordM]

I have a dremel and a jigsaw, so I guess I'm not sure. It sounds like either option works well for everyone. My only issue with a jig saw is that sometimes it gets away from you. I think I'd have to be very diligent to make sure I didn't go off course. The dremel sometimes feels like its going to vibrate your arm off and can take a while. I think I'll try the jig saw.

What has everyone done to get power into other sides of the camper? Have you run the cable beneath etc?

[Raya]

On some jobs you may not be able to get a jigsaw maneuvered to the right place, but the hacksaw blade almost always gets to it. Less dust with it too.

Good point! The lack of dust is a major plus to using hand tools. I find a hand drill to be very useful for the same reason. I just dampen a paper towel and place it below the drill and the small amount of shavings fall onto it and "stick" there. Much better than dust flying around (not to mention the noise).

[GordM]

Yes, I have one of those little hand held hack saws. That's a great idea, and you don't have nearly the chance of it getting away from you. Great point.

[Perry J]

A dremel tool with a cutting wheel works very well in areas where there is little room for a jig saw.
I prefer the dremel for small cut outs such as an electrical outlet.
John

[Pam Garlow]

Thats one of the cool things about Uhauls (double walls) is that you always have a built-in wiring chase throughout the trailer. The base cabinets all connect together so any wiring can run inside them, from one side of the trailer to the other.
For those without that contiuous connection, I have also heard of some people running the wire through base cabs, and then crossing the open spaces using those plastic enclosures made for cord management in homes ('wire mold'). They're run low on the wall near the corner of the floor and are not really very noticeable.

[Casita Greg]

I have both a Fein oscillating tool and a Roto-Zip. I find both work quite well for cutting fiberglass materials. I have made several mods which have required cutting into the fiberglass, and both made excellent cuts. The problem with using a standard jig saw is that they tend to fracture and spawl the top coat of the fiberglass when used to cut it (chipping the finish).

[GordM]

I have ONE more question that is related to this topic. Can you use a wood or wood/metal hole saw on the outside fiberglass of a boler?

[Rick G]

I have ONE more question that is related to this topic. Can you use a wood or wood/metal hole saw on the outside fiberglass of a boler?

Hi Gord,

Not having done it, I don't see why not. As you can tell from the posts, the fibreglass can be cut by many different types of blades. I have used hole saws (the kind that go into a drill like a regular drill bit) on many surfaces and never had a problem. They are similar to other kinds of saws, just round.

To answer your earlier question (I only get to review the forums once or twice a week), I always run the electrical wires inside the trailer, not outside, from the area under the kitchen where your electrical service is, around the back of the trailer attached to the inside of the rear dinette seats, and over to the area on the entry side where I need it, again under the rear dinette seats. On my trailer, to go from the one dinette seat to the other across the back I ran the wire under the insulation at the very back of the trailer (the trailer stop/turn light wiring is already there), and then covered the edge with a vinyl self-adhesive baseboard moulding for floors that I got from Home Depot for about $3. It also went very well with the new lino floor that we installed a couple of weeks ago, so it covers the wire and looks nice too.

As for the electrical service, when we bought our trailer it had essentially none, just a wire going into the trailer and a bunch of Marrette twist-on connectors to various other wires. So, I replaced the wire with a good quality power bar that has a power conditioner and a circuit breaker built in, attached to the inside of the little cupboard between the fridge and furnace. This served the purpose of distributing the electricity with more control and flexibility, and should be safer. Not as elaborate as a house circuit box, but works very well. As a bonus, I no longer had the long wire sticking out of the trailer that had to be connected to shore power and then rolled up again. Instead I use a standard outdoor extension cord, with a trailer connector adapter for the 15 amp service when required. Works great, easy to do.

Regards,
Rick G

[GordM]

Thanks Rick for the info! In regards to the hole saw, I did some research, and I've found fiberglass boat owners doing it, without issue. Some pre-drill with a smaller bit than the one on the hole saw. Then start to cut with the hole saw, lining up the bit in it. And they say to drill the hole saw backwards for a bit to help prevent chipping of the gelcoat. And then, go ahead steady and away you go.

My electrical service is an octagon box (that is the incoming power) and from there a wire goes to the outlet electrical box, and from there it goes up an aluminum pipe into the fluorescent light over the counter. That's all for my 110v. So its nice and tidy at least. The wire is solid aluminum. So I might change it someday. I suppose I should use 14 gauge stranded wire?

Oh, and I forgot to mention. I made my own GFCI protection extension cord. I took a water proof electrical box and installed a GFCI outlet, and attached it to an extension cord. So now my hole Boler is protected to ground shocks. I could have just put on in the outlet, but I didn't see the point since the outlet is good. My 1 year old son sleeps in a playpen and I wanted to make sure he was safe if he stuck his little fingers in there.

[Raya]

Hi Gord,

Yes, boaters often use hole saws to cut holes into their boats. When doing it in an area of nice gelcoat, I would tape over the whole area with blue tape (or the like) to protect the surface. Plus, you can make marks on it with abandon. Just peel it off reasonably soon, as otherwise it will turn to concrete (or close to it!).

Raya