fuse panel

[Rick and Shannen]

We plugged our trillium up to power to see which lights ran off of 110 and which ran off the battery ( previous owner couln't remember ). Was told all lights worked inside and out. I assume there's a fuse panel of some sort and maybe the reason for no inside lights is a blown fuse. Where is the panel located ( if there is one , previous owner didn't know this either ) . Any help will be greatly appreciated!

[Roger H]

Rick... it might help to know what is and isn't working for starters. Do you have 12v lights but no 110? Or is nothing working? Does your Trill have a battery somewhere, or is the 12v just wired to run off your car or the inverter?

Roger

[Rick and Shannen]

Please bear with me as all this is new to me. Do all trills come with an inverter and if so, where are they located? As for what works, nothing. I'm pretty sure the battery needs replacing, haven't tried charging it yet. But when plugged the trailer into power from my shop nothing came on.

[Roger H]

Hi Rick... first, let me say that I wrote "inverter" when I meant "converter". So as not to confuse the issue, an inverter changes 12v DC to 110v AC and trailers don't usually come equipped with one. I just "mis-spoke". Now, to the problem...

First you need to determine how your 12v works. You may or may not have a power converter. Hopefully someone with a Trill 1300 can speak up here. If you don't, then the 110v AC probably just runs the fridge and an outlet or two (unless you have 110v lighting fixtures as well). Most trailers today have lights that are all 12v, and the outlets and fridge run off 110. They have a converter that changes 110v AC to 12v DC and supplies power to the lights when plugged in, and generally supply some kind of current to the battery to charge it. Later converters are "intelligent" and know when the battery is charged and stop charging it. Older ones just supply the same amount of current forever, potentially overcharging the battery.

The last configuration could be that you don't have a battery, and the 12v lights run off your car's battery through the pigtail that connects to the car, and if you don't have a 12v converter, you may not have 12v lights when the trailer isn't hooked up to the tow vehicle. That also was a fairly common configuration once upon a time as it was really easy and cheap to wire up.

Fuses in your 12v system are located in various locations depending on the trailer. Newer ones with late model converters have a fuse box in the converter, either glass or blade fuses. My Scamp, in addition, has two other 30 amp fuses; one at the battery, and one inside the trailer but just 24" from the one outside. My Scamp was really confusing because it was tough to find the inside one that had blown because the power converter had gone bad. The new converter would run the circuit on 12v, but the battery wouldn't charge, nor would it power the 12v as it should. It does now!

So... you should be thoroughly confused by now... and as I said, hopefully someone who HAS a Trill 1300 and has some idea how they're actually wired can jump in here and help!

Roger

[Bill and Jacquie G.]

Hi Rick... first, let me say that I wrote "inverter" when I meant "converter". So as not to confuse the issue, an inverter changes 12v DC to 110v AC and trailers don't usually come equipped with one. I just "mis-spoke". Now, to the problem...

First you need to determine how your 12v works. You may or may not have a power converter. Hopefully someone with a Trill 1300 can speak up here. If you don't, then the 110v AC probably just runs the fridge and an outlet or two (unless you have 110v lighting fixtures as well). Most trailers today have lights that are all 12v, and the outlets and fridge run off 110. They have a converter that changes 110v AC to 12v DC and supplies power to the lights when plugged in, and generally supply some kind of current to the battery to charge it. Later converters are "intelligent" and know when the battery is charged and stop charging it. Older ones just supply the same amount of current forever, potentially overcharging the battery.

The last configuration could be that you don't have a battery, and the 12v lights run off your car's battery through the pigtail that connects to the car, and if you don't have a 12v converter, you may not have 12v lights when the trailer isn't hooked up to the tow vehicle. That also was a fairly common configuration once upon a time as it was really easy and cheap to wire up.

Fuses in your 12v system are located in various locations depending on the trailer. Newer ones with late model converters have a fuse box in the converter, either glass or blade fuses. My Scamp, in addition, has two other 30 amp fuses; one at the battery, and one inside the trailer but just 24" from the one outside. My Scamp was really confusing because it was tough to find the inside one that had blown because the power converter had gone bad. The new converter would run the circuit on 12v, but the battery wouldn't charge, nor would it power the 12v as it should. It does now!

So... you should be thoroughly confused by now... and as I said, hopefully someone who HAS a Trill 1300 and has some idea how they're actually wired can jump in here and help!

Roger

Rick and Shannen: Welcome and congratulations on the new addition to your family!!!
You're amongst friends.
We are Bill and Jacquie in Eugene, OR. and our little beauty is Tilly, a 1978 13' Trillium.

Four years ago we discovered Tilly behind the proverbial barn, waiting in the weeds for us to adopt her. She had been used as a hunter's cabin in the mountains for five or six years. As her various appliances failed, they were rudely ripped out of her, leaving nothing but gaping holes and critters. The rest of the story at a later date.

There is no such thing as a dumb question! The talents and the expertise of the members of this forum will continuously amaze you. And they will be asking you one "dumb question" after another and you will be asking yourself "Why didn't I think of that?"

LET THERE BE LIGHT!!!

Note: our 30 year old trailers have probably experienced some "creative wiring" in their lifetime. It's best we start at square one.

Note #2: Our trailer did not have a central fuse block. There was a small inline fuse between the battery and the interior lighting system.

ALWAYS start by being sure that you have good ground connections. The factory wiring had the 12 volt ground bolted to the street side of the tongue about 24 inches behind the coupler. Behind the street side wheel well, you should find a green ground wire (6 or 8 guage) bolted to the frame and routed up through the floor near the wheel well.
Remove bolts and scrape frame metal clean. Replace with new bolts, lock washers, nuts, and star washers under the heads of the bolts.

Factory wiring color codes:
White = ground
Green = clearance/running /tail lights
Black = hot lead for interior lighting

Trillium Owners Manual can be found in the new Document Center that was just posted by Donna D. Complete wiring colors will be found there.

Borrow your wife's multi-meter
and start checking the continuity of the wires you find. Thank you, Shannen.

Please feel free to send us a PM any time. We are happy for you.

Bill and Jacquie

PS We have a small tool box packed and loaded in our MINI Cooper. We can be there in a little over two hours.

[Ed Harris]

Another Congrats on the new Trill!
Welcome to the group also.

I would guess there are no two units exactly alike after all this time but I can tell you about my 73-1300.

There was no obvious clue about there ever being 12volt power thru mine when I got it.
As was mentioned above,power can be supplied thru the connection with the car but it would have to be wired for this starting at the car for it to be "Hot"

On my 1300 there is a connection box right where the cable comes into the trailer under the front bench and there is a single fuse holder there for the wiring going to the factory inside lighting which were common 12 volt D.C fixtures. These fixtures have actually not changed much in all the time that trailers have been around and are very inexpensive to replace.

On a seperate feed at the curb side of the trailer was a 120 volt A.C. cable that connects standard house current to the inside of the trailer.
On mine there was no AC to DC converter,the only AC devices were a few standard house sockets.

My guess would be that by determining which wire supplies power to the 12 volt lights they would light up and if you connect the ac cord you will have power at the outlets.

Please be careful though and sure that you have good connections and that the devices are in decent shape after 30 years before applying power or you may "Let the smoke out" of something or worse

If you are nervous or unsure try to find some help.

Good Luck
Ed

[Joe MacDonald]

on my 1300 I had a small 110v breaker box located under the drawer in the left hand side of the counter. (under the sink)
This operated the light above the sink and the 110v plug ins.

under the bunk on the LH side of the trailer(looking forward) the trailer wiring cable came in
In the wires I found a black and a white which when connected to a battery gave power to the 12 volt lighting.

my trailer never had a converter, I used an old battery charger to give me 12 volts when I could plug in, (with no battery hooked up)and charge the battery at a later time.
this was an old charger, the new ones won't turn on if they don't sense a battery in the circuit.

On these trailers, the white wire is usually negative(ground) and the black is positive for the 12 volt systems.

[Brian B-P]

With all the possible changes, I can see how it could be confusing to determine what light runs on what power. If you're not up for probing sockets with a voltmeter (and I wouldn't advise anyone to do that if they are not already comfortable doing so), then the writing on the bulbs helps (if it is still readable): although this doesn't apply to fluorescents, regular bulbs are usually marked with their voltage (and maybe power consumption in watts).

You can also identify many bulbs by style: the metal part which inserts into the socket is the "base", and almost all 120V AC bulbs have screw bases, like the ones in your house. Other bases - such as bayonet or push-in styles - are normally for 12V power. The screw base can be misleading: my Boler B1700 has a stove hood with a light, and the light bulb has a screw base and looks just like the appliance bulb in home refrigerators, but the one in the Boler is 12V. Wouldn't that be interesting to screw into a 120V AC socket!

Fluorescent fixtures should have electrical specifications on them (moulded into the plastic housing or printed on a sticker), including the input voltage.

The nice thing about examining the lights themselves is that if you have a power source problem (broken wiring, blown fuse, faulty breaker...) you can still look at the lights and get an idea of where the power should be coming from.

[Rick and Shannen]

Although my husband asked the initial questions, I thought I would put my .02 in.

We have three 110 lights - two in the trailer and one on the exterior of the trailer. These take normal light bulbs which is the only reason we know they are 110. We also have one 110 outlet on the outside and one on the inside. We plugged our trailer into our shop outlets and nothing is working. We haven't checked the 12V yet because we are pretty sure the battery either needs to be recharged or is dead.

Rick found a manual online and is going to check under the sink to see if there is a fuse panel of some kind. (Please let there be one!) We will let you know what we find as I am sure we will need more help!

Thank you for all the help. We have owned trailers for the last 3 years but have always just used plugged them in and they worked. Hopefully, it is an easy fix.

*Shannen*

[Rick and Shannen]

PS We have a small tool box packed and loaded in our MINI Cooper. We can be there in a little over two hours.

Bill and Jacquie - I forgot to add a big thanks for the warm welcome and your offer to help. We have our fingers crossed that this is something we can figure out without having to call the RV repairman.

[Roger H]

We have three 110 lights - two in the trailer and one on the exterior of the trailer. These take normal light bulbs which is the only reason we know they are 110.
*Shannen*

Shannen... now THAT's interesting... I don't think I've ever seen an exterior light be 110v... even on the old, old trailers. Can you post some photos of the fixtures for us?

Roger

[Byron Kinnaman]

Don't be fulled by the base. There are 12 volt bulbs with the same base as the 120 volt varity.

Here's one

[Rick and Shannen]

Shannen... now THAT's interesting... I don't think I've ever seen an exterior light be 110v... even on the old, old trailers. Can you post some photos of the fixtures for us?

I will try to take some photos when I get home tonight but it may be too dark by the time I get home.

The exterior light is removable. It is a light fixture that you plug into an outlet on the outside of the trailer once you set up camp. It looks like a little front porch light.

There was no fuse panel under the sink like we had hoped.

We are at a loss. Rick is trying to charge the battery that came with it and if it won't take a charge, we will buy a new one asap so we can test this trailer out!

The light fixture over the sink is the exact same fixture seen here: Ian R.'s Trillium

[Brian B-P]

...These take normal light bulbs which is the only reason we know they are 110.

As I mentioned and Byron reinforced, the medium screw base bulb could be either voltage, so the fact that "normal" bulbs fit doesn't mean they are necessarily 110V (or 120V, or something like that). The 12V versions are used in my Boler stove hood, some trouble lights, and apparently marine applications. Many of the other styles are only 12V, but printed specifications are always a better indication.

[Brian B-P]

...The exterior light is removable. It is a light fixture that you plug into an outlet on the outside of the trailer once you set up camp...

That sounds like a really interesting setup. The plug/receptacle design would be interesting to see (when you get a chance to take pictures) and might offer a clue about the operating voltage as well. Is it a common design that you could describe (e.g. normal household outlet, automotive lighter socket, etc)?

[Rick and Shannen]

We checked the light bulbs but were unable to determine if they were 110 or 12v as most of the writing on the bulb has been rubbed off. The battery is complely dead and won't take a charge so will have to replace it and see if any or all lights work on 12v. Pics of the outside light are coming, just waiting for the camera battery to finish charging.

[Roger H]

That's a good plan. From what you've written so far, I'd be willing to bet that all of those lights are really 12v lights and run off the battery!

Roger

[Rick and Shannen]

We are back to square one. We contacted the former owner and they say that the two interior lights and the one exterior light are 110 and worked. Rick is going to get a voltmeter (I think that's what it is called) and we will see where we stand then.

We took some photos of the exterior light (which I think is pretty darn cool) and the outlet boxes in the closet.

We appreciate everyone's help!

*Shannen*

[Roger H]

They sure do look like 110! That's amazing... I doubt very much that any of that is factory. Normally, there would be a breaker box somewhere near where the pigtail enters the trailer... but since that was probably installed by some previous owner... who knows?

This is going to be a toughie... I think the multi-meter is your best hope.

Roger

[Ed Harris]

After seeing the pictures it is very clear that this wiring is not the original factory wiring at all.

If someone added this 120volt ac wiring I would hope they also provided some sort of disconnect/protection for it also.
It should not be too hard to see where this enters the trailer and try to follow it from there carefully measuring voltage until you figure it out.

The 12volt dc wiring certainly originated from the battery location and you should be able to connect any working 12 volt dc source there and do the same tracing on this side of the wiring.
Again I would hope there is some sort of disconnect/protection for the 12volt system even if it is merely a single fuse inline.

Do not be afraid to seek professional help,it is not worth risking your safety and it should be fairly simple to figure out for someone familiar with these systems.

Ed