Ideas Wanted - New Propane Install - Page 4 - Fiberglass RV


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Old 03-05-2011, 05:36 AM   #43
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Russell,
I haven't even made the purchase yet. I think this question is better for Bill K. My EggCamper is still snowed in, so all of my plans are on hold right now.

The weather guessers were predicting temperatures in the 40s and rain for this morning, but when I looked outside, we've got a dusting of snow and it's still in the mid 20s. Yuck!

Ron

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Originally Posted by Russell A View Post
Ron !

Did you get that furnace installed yet? Mine has been great and npw that our temps are in the 40's I am not using the furnace much. I always have the gen running to keep the laptop running and the electric mattress pad keeps me warm at the same time. Furnace is used only for the nights now.
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Old 05-03-2011, 03:16 PM   #44
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Originally Posted by Bill Robison View Post
Joe, Ron, Matt, Tim and Russell -

Again, nice discussion! To bring everyone up-to-date in my situation...

I considered the eBay purchase mentioned above, but since I am so cheap (read frugal) I decided to go directly to the 'home' websites of some of the vendors offering the 8012 on eBay. I found Panther RV in WA to have a better price on their site than eBay. I ordered the 8012 including the black grill (match the fridge) and the C vent kit since I need the extra length (and by itself sells for $75) for $349 + $40 = $389 S&H. Furnace is scheduled to arrive Jan 4th. I did not order the thermostat or the LP/CO alarm from Panther, since they're S&H is outrageous - I can get them both on eBay.

Appreciate the BTU stats - I figure if the furnace is fired about 15 min out of 60 for 10 hours per day - 20# tank should last about 10-12 days? Less in much colder clim, but even if I only get a week of good heat from 20#I would be very pleased! Menards sells a 'tall' 11# tank for $45 - if everything works as planned I may get one for 'back-up' and outside cook stove to eliminate the 1# tank altogether? If I go that direction - I will have 30# LP, 105AH battery, 15 watt solar and 2000i Honda generator as back-up and/or battery charger - - that gives us a possible two to three weeks off grid potential ;-)

Regarding the 8012 choice - my first consideration was to keep 12v draw low as possible (1.8 amp is great), 2nd consideration was BTU output - I sought out opinion from Orlen who put a 19,000 BTU Suburban in his EggCamper kit and has put it to the test at LOW temps for extended periods of time. He told me next time he would go smaller for two reasons - use less LP and would cook you out ( he already owned the 19K Sub). He figures the 12K should be about right, as do I since the factory electric heater is 1,000 watt which is equal to about 3,000 BTU. The electric heater provided about 80% of what we needed at 12 F and the 12K provides 3 times the heat (9,160 BTU vs 3,000) of the electric heater. I'm trying to decide if I want to leave the electric heater installed along with the 8012 - I think I do.

I'm considering doing something like the attached mock-up for the install - cut out a complete section of fiberglass from galley top to floor - reinforce from the inside with wood strips - custom make a couple small drawers from the top (self-supporting and 22" deep) - not sure about the bottom section, but the new furnace will be in the middle. I will look around the egg to see if I can re-locate the elec heater to other than front of galley - that would make a nice storage spot. I don't really want the 'look' of the GFI and switch (for 1K heater) on the front of the galley - I can easily move them to a more functional and less obtrusive location. How about some feedback...
Hi Bill,
The new furnace arrived today. Now to get things measured and lined up. I'm probably going to use your template for the installation. I have no conscience when it comes to stealing ideas. The only difficulty that I can see is carefully lining up the exhaust vent so that it lines up with the hole that I put in the side of the camper when I installed the 120v exterior outlet. The outlet will have to move a bit.
How is your install going?
Ron
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Old 05-03-2011, 06:04 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by Ron F View Post
Hi Bill,
The new furnace arrived today. Now to get things measured and lined up. I'm probably going to use your template for the installation. I have no conscience when it comes to stealing ideas. The only difficulty that I can see is carefully lining up the exhaust vent so that it lines up with the hole that I put in the side of the camper when I installed the 120v exterior outlet. The outlet will have to move a bit.
How is your install going?
Ron
Hi Ron -

I am making progress day by day. I decided to delay the furnace install until after I completed some other necessary work. The last couple weeks I have installed two additional LED taillights above the originals - WOW are they ever great - I think I will yank the two original lights and put in LEDs now that I can see how visible they are. I packed the wheel bearings - new dbl seals, cleaned & lubricated the brakes and dressed the armature surface of both drums and magnet surfaces. Installed interior LED lights on all five fixtures. Tore the ceiling apart and ran several new sets of wires so I could connect the new digital thermostat (done) - run 12v to two new 12v plugs above either side of the galley on the underside of the upper cabinets (done) - and run 12v to the furnace and new LP alarm (done). Installed CO detector where the smoke alarm was - moved smoke alarm to left side, above large closet - digital Honeywell thermostat - and LP alarm below furnace. I have removed the fridge, rerouted the 120v that previously went to the electric heater switch so it can later be used as an exterior outlet opposite (behind) the fridge.

The electric heater opening has been enlarged and the furnace is setting in place with all wires ready to be connected. Yet to do: furnace support, cut vent opening for furnace and install same, install LP line & reg - run leak tests. Should be done in a day or two - the forecast is for SUN rather than rain for the next 2-3 days.

I have taken some photos along the way, but they are yet to be uploaded. I decided to put the furnace in the same location as the electric heater and have abandoned my earlier plan, so you are welcome to put it to use if it works for you. I have explored what I might do in the future - I like the concept of a long, deep drawer under the fridge - now that I can see the ease of doing so - it can be large enough to be multi-functional (w/compartments) and always easily accessible. I still have to deal with the fiberglass opening that remained where the heater switch was cut out (below the furnace...?

Keep me posted on your progress - thanks for the note!

We still plan to head for Utah and Wyoming by the weeks end so the I know the new 8012 furnace will get plenty of use - especially at higher elevations!

Bill
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Old 05-03-2011, 08:55 PM   #46
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Just had the 8012 installed

We just had a new 8012 installed in our Bigfoot last month. We also purchased from PantherRV. Just a heads up--be prepared for it to emit a noxious odor for four hours or more of initial operation. The tech at Atwood said this is normal as oils inside burn off. I'm not sure I understand what oils, but we had to vacate the trailer and let the furnace run for several hours. It's fine now.
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Old 05-03-2011, 09:01 PM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim D. View Post
We just had a new 8012 installed in our Bigfoot last month. We also purchased from PantherRV. Just a heads up--be prepared for it to emit a noxious odor for four hours or more of initial operation. The tech at Atwood said this is normal as oils inside burn off. I'm not sure I understand what oils, but we had to vacate the trailer and let the furnace run for several hours. It's fine now.
Thanks Tim -

I figured it would smell - so I did about a 4-5 hr 'burn-in' on driveway last week - - before installing ;-)

Is it pretty quiet? It sure sounded quiet while running outside.

Bill
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Old 05-03-2011, 09:37 PM   #48
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When I installed mine my trailer was open and I smelled nothing. Just happy to have had it running. Had none if I had not gotten it running that day. Sat at the edge of the bed and wondered how to hook up the last wire. Didn't understand the wire schematics and just took the chance and hooked up that wire and on came the furnace.

Happy with it ever since. I must let you know that I think your expectations of fuel of 10 days on one 20lb tank is high. I have gone through all winter in temps as low as 0 has taken all that fuel in three days. Non insulated trailer.That is my experience. I have always had one hooked up and immediately had the other filled up. This years task is to insulate the whole trailer.

Russ
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Old 05-07-2011, 04:13 PM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Robison View Post
Hi Ron -

I am making progress day by day. I decided to delay the furnace install until after I completed some other necessary work. The last couple weeks I have installed two additional LED taillights above the originals - WOW are they ever great - I think I will yank the two original lights and put in LEDs now that I can see how visible they are. I packed the wheel bearings - new dbl seals, cleaned & lubricated the brakes and dressed the armature surface of both drums and magnet surfaces. Installed interior LED lights on all five fixtures. Tore the ceiling apart and ran several new sets of wires so I could connect the new digital thermostat (done) - run 12v to two new 12v plugs above either side of the galley on the underside of the upper cabinets (done) - and run 12v to the furnace and new LP alarm (done). Installed CO detector where the smoke alarm was - moved smoke alarm to left side, above large closet - digital Honeywell thermostat - and LP alarm below furnace. I have removed the fridge, rerouted the 120v that previously went to the electric heater switch so it can later be used as an exterior outlet opposite (behind) the fridge.

The electric heater opening has been enlarged and the furnace is setting in place with all wires ready to be connected. Yet to do: furnace support, cut vent opening for furnace and install same, install LP line & reg - run leak tests. Should be done in a day or two - the forecast is for SUN rather than rain for the next 2-3 days.

I have taken some photos along the way, but they are yet to be uploaded. I decided to put the furnace in the same location as the electric heater and have abandoned my earlier plan, so you are welcome to put it to use if it works for you. I have explored what I might do in the future - I like the concept of a long, deep drawer under the fridge - now that I can see the ease of doing so - it can be large enough to be multi-functional (w/compartments) and always easily accessible. I still have to deal with the fiberglass opening that remained where the heater switch was cut out (below the furnace...?

Keep me posted on your progress - thanks for the note!

We still plan to head for Utah and Wyoming by the weeks end so the I know the new 8012 furnace will get plenty of use - especially at higher elevations!

Bill
Bill, I've been wrestling with where to locate the new furnace and right now I'm leaning toward installing it where I have the two drawers installed and leaving the electric furnace where it is. I would still like to use the electric when we have hookups and save the cost of propane for when we really need it. But, I also hate to loose the drawer space, so I'm thinking of lowering the refrigerator about 5 or 6 inches and putting a wide drawer above it. That way I don't have to move the GFI or the electric heater and I will make the wide drawer a little nicer than the two that I made earlier.

BTW, is the Honeywell thermostat an off the shelf home version? I ordered the Atwood one, but it's a bit cheesy. A digital would be very classy.

I replaced all of the running lights, including the clearance lights with LEDs. They are very visible and the current draw is very small. My new tow vehicle (2011 Toyota Sienna) has LED tail lights, and all the wiring to the tail/directionals is around 18 awg wire. When I spliced in the brake controller, instead of using a scotch connector, I stripped and soldered and used heat-shrink. The scotch connector would have just severed the original wiring.

Ron
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Old 05-08-2011, 08:53 AM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron F View Post
Bill, I've been wrestling with where to locate the new furnace and right now I'm leaning toward installing it where I have the two drawers installed and leaving the electric furnace where it is. I would still like to use the electric when we have hookups and save the cost of propane for when we really need it. But, I also hate to loose the drawer space, so I'm thinking of lowering the refrigerator about 5 or 6 inches and putting a wide drawer above it.

BTW, is the Honeywell thermostat an off the shelf home version? I ordered the Atwood one, but it's a bit cheesy. A digital would be very classy.

Ron
Hi Ron -

Lots of choices - I guess it's nice that the EggCamper allows us the flexibility, but need to take our time making decisions, since we can only cut a certain number of holes in the fiberglass galley ;-) I too am still giving mine location a final 'eye-ball' - if I lower it to the point where the bottom of the 8012 will just clear the bumper then the outside vent will be low enough to just about miss the side decal strips. It looks like my current location will put the vent nearly mid-decal.

Hhmmm - interesting concept to lower the the fridge to allow room for a top draw, rather than a bottom draw. Yes, you may be well served to keep the electric heater along with the 8012 ...I wonder if I should as well?? It does allow the best of two worlds in addition to instant back-up heat - sans cube heater.

The Honeywell thermostat is Model# RTH221B - I got it from Amazon for $20 - free shipping. Here is the link - Amazon.com: Honeywell RTH221B Basic Programmable Thermostat: Home Improvement
The 8012 specs say it is OK to use a 12-24v w/ 1 amp. I had it all connected when I did by test burn in the garage for a few (which I highly recommend) and it seemed to work just fine. I have my new thermostat mounted above the large closet beside the water heater switch. Only drawback with this particular model is - not backlit, but it is easy to read, programable and easy to change (up or down) even in the dark with the large arrows.

What LED clearance lights did you use - source?

Keep me posted.

Bill
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Old 05-08-2011, 10:47 AM   #51
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Ron and Bill,
In your decision making as to where to put the heater, do not forget that the propane alarm needs to be mounted low, I mounted mine below the refer. Propane is a heavy gas and drops to the low points.
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Old 05-08-2011, 10:52 AM   #52
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Bill,
I'm curious why the thermostat up high by the exit vs low and closer to the bed? Superbrightleds has the replacement lights and rubber grommets for the egg- I replaced all of mine and will add 2 more ambers on the front lower. You will need a lot of liquid soap but they do look nice when finished. Do it in the sun and when the temperature is above 50- it is a lot easier than working in a unheated garage in the 40's in the winter!
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Old 05-08-2011, 12:56 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cpaharley2008 View Post
Ron and Bill,
In your decision making as to where to put the heater, do not forget that the propane alarm needs to be mounted low, I mounted mine below the refer. Propane is a heavy gas and drops to the low points.
Oh ya!

I have mine mounted at the same elevation off the floor as yours - only below the furnace (behind where your Wave is located).
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Old 05-08-2011, 01:12 PM   #54
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Bill,
I'm curious why the thermostat up high by the exit vs low and closer to the bed? Superbrightleds has the replacement lights and rubber grommets for the egg- I replaced all of mine and will add 2 more ambers on the front lower. You will need a lot of liquid soap but they do look nice when finished. Do it in the sun and when the temperature is above 50- it is a lot easier than working in a unheated garage in the 40's in the winter!
Well it's like this - easy access, easy visibility at that height, it is an inside wall (separated from an exterior wall as recommended), fits in with all my other 'controls', easy place to run wire, we aren't constantly opening and closing the door (furnace will be on mainly for evenings and sleep time). As far as not having it near the bed - the whole heater space for the cabin is only 90 sq ft (+/-) I suspect set inside temp won't vary more than 2-3 F even with drafts and super cold outdoor temps. We prefer a cool sleep environment - so will most likely set the thermostat about 62 F - crawl in bed and sleep like angels ;-) Once we have a bit of experience in using the new furnace we will quickly decide on what temp settings we like to stay comfy - besides it is programable so we won't need to 'play' with it during the night and it becomes necessary - it's only two steps away ;-)

I have to check out the Superbright marker lights - thx
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Old 05-08-2011, 01:18 PM   #55
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Hi Ron -

What LED clearance lights did you use - source?

Bill
Bill, I got them at etrailer (Clearance Lights LED Light Round Trailer Lights | etrailer.com) If I remember, the side lights were 2" and the clearance lights were minis.
I like the looks of your thermostat, but I haven't decided exactly where to mount it. I'm thinking that I can mount it on the wall between the street-side closet and shower opening, at just about shoulder height. I think I should have room for the lp sensor near the floor, below the electric heater. But since I won't need the furnace until our trip to FL in October, I'm going to measure 5 or 6 times before I make any more cuts in the fiberglass.

I think I'll tackle solar before that and run all the wiring that I'll need for the furnace at the same time.

Ron
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Old 05-08-2011, 01:21 PM   #56
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Originally Posted by cpaharley2008 View Post
Ron and Bill,
In your decision making as to where to put the heater, do not forget that the propane alarm needs to be mounted low, I mounted mine below the refer. Propane is a heavy gas and drops to the low points.
Jim - I looking through your fridge rough opening behind your Wave...

Tell us a little about what you did back in there - maybe a PVC support leg held in place via all-thread rod? Is the to support an under-gallery shelf like I put in?

And what is the single black wire - coax?

Please tell us your story about that dark and scary place - supply all of us with lots of photos...

Bill
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