Lil'Snoozy owners : please contact me

[Thomas G.]

Originally Posted by MCDenny

Mine had a few similar problems that I fixed myself. A quality SYSTEM would minimize the assembly errors you experienced but I doubt any of the little FGRV companies think this way or feel they could afford the technical cost to set one up.

I'm curious, do the owners of new Scamps, Escapes, Egg Campers, Parkliners, Casitas, etc experience these kind of

Having spent a career in the automotive manufacturing, I see eggs like the Parkliner as basically prototype builds. As you ramp up production you standardize the assembly processes and hopefully have the same person doing the same job over days and years, so they get really good at it. Also, as your sample size grows you have a better handle on problem areas.

No one like problems with a new purchase, but I think that it is understandable for this kind of unique vehicle. You can't camp in a Camry.

[Cathy P.]

Ruth G: Oh, gosh, you had to be SO disappointed. This sounds like something we would have built in our backyard which is why we decided not too. We all expect a little tweeting but............ So sorry your purchase turned out like that.

This all sounds like the growing trend to just push it out the door and let warranty take care of the issues. I worked at a 5 star manufacturer and quality control was one thing that they really concentrated on. The whole unit was inspected, then usually the owner checked it over when everyone had left for the day and then a complete walk-through was done with the customers, inch by inch.

Personally, if quality control isn't there, I'm not there with my checkbook.

When I purchase something new, I expect to be able to enjoy it without having to have the work completed that should have been done at the factory or having things patched and repaired that are new because it really wears on you and takes away from the joy of having the product.

[deryk]

Originally Posted by MCDenny

Mine had a few similar problems that I fixed myself. A quality SYSTEM would minimize the assembly errors you experienced but I doubt any of the little FGRV companies think this way or feel they could afford the technical cost to set one up.

I'm curious, do the owners of new Scamps, Escapes, Egg Campers, Parkliners, Casitas, or stick built trailers from the big companies, or high dollar Airstreams even, see these same kind of "human" assembly errors?

Denny
www.wanderingourway.wordpress.com

Way back in 1988 my mother bought a brandy new oldsmobile delta 88, was some special super deluxe model with everything in it. My parents took it for a ride to the delaware water gap on a sunday afternoon to enjoy their nicest car they ever bought. My mother pushed the button for the electric window to go down and fell off the track... she was pretty pissed and upset. Unfortunatly human error does happen.

Now Harry said I have ParkLiner unit #4, well I was looking at the title the other day and I think Im #3. I know that Chandler didn't label the 12 volt fusebox, so I will be in the spring turning everything on and pulling a fuse, running around looking to see what went off and labeling it. The paint is peeling off of the hinges ( Im thinking of ordering an extra pair as a backup just in case down the road lol) So Im sure Im gonna find little things here and there. Now Im pretty handy so I can probably handle rebedding windows and such... but even though I might have unit # 3 or 4, even unit # 5061 still could have human oop's. That is the plus sometimes about buying something that is a few years old that hopefully the former owner already fixed the little things...well hopefully lol


deryk

[honda03842]

When you buy an FRV you are buying a trailer from a truly small company. They have small staffs and simply don't build that many units. Quality issues, particularly for startd up are not unusual.

One of the advantages of buying used is that many of the issues have been addressed by the first owner.

[Ken C]

Well, used you can pick up for 10 grand but new are approaching 17 to 20 grand. I think it is common to expect more for your money approaching the 20 grand mark for something. Everyone is different which makes life fun.

[Ruth G]

I was really disappointed with the lil snoozy. I think they rushed to start selling them and it wasn't ready at all. The plumbing issues were ridiculous, even a year later, I am not sure the black tank ever drained like it should have. I would try to empty it at campgrounds, and I couldn't get it to empty. Alan told me to just drive with it open and let it drain as we went. Nice, but that's not even legal.

I was warned not to buy a start up trailer, but seriously didn't think there would be such major issues. I am not handy, it really made me angry when I was out by myself and the door fell off the bathroom. The factory oopsed and didn't put all the screws in. It was way too heavy for me to even lift the door.

I wish them the best, but am relieved to have it someone else's problem. For that kind of money, I shouldn't be annoyed over and over. It's a great little trailer, has a nice shape, tows well, but wasn't worth the headache and aggravation, and trips several times to s Carolina.

[Francesca Knowles]

It seems to me that warranty coverage could stand some improvement among most of the new fiberglass units. I think that in most cases, Casita being an exception, one has to return to the factory for such work, whereas with conventionally built trailers one can have such work performed just about anywhere.

Or am I wrong about that? I'm basing this conclusion only on the little that's published on the various websites, and of course postings in forums.

Here's what Casita says at its FAQ page:

If I have a problem, where can I get warranty work done?
Since a Casita could go practically anywhere we recommend that you contact our Service Department at 1-800-442-9986. You will most likely be directed to an RV dealership in your area.

Francesca

[deryk]

Wow, I guess Im glad he didn't get back to me...When I took my trip down south to look at my ParkLiner, and Scamp 13 deluxe, Alan offered to sell me his original prototype that had a propane furnace installed just not plumbed for 15k but never sent me the photo's, kinda glad he didn't. But remember its always possible with a new one that somehow slid through quality control.

I have friends that bought a brand new 70k Baja express boat...when the marina lowered it in the water they saw "bubbles" coming from the drain plug that they just put teflon tape on it and properly torqued it to manuf spec's. They pulled the boat back out and discovered someone made an "oops" at the factory and accidentally used an oversized hole bit and instead of fixing it properly just smeared alot of calk on it and screwed it in anyway. Ended up haveing to have the area re-glassed and then installed properly... the manuf paid for it but amazing that people just didn't care that it was going to be a problem. Could have held for a few hours and then sunk overnight when no one was around.

Yay for greed and lazyness!

deryk

[Mike Magee]

Originally Posted by MCDenny

Mine had a few similar problems that I fixed myself. A quality SYSTEM would minimize the assembly errors you experienced but I doubt any of the little FGRV companies think this way or feel they could afford the technical cost to set one up.

I'm curious, do the owners of new Scamps, Escapes, Egg Campers, Parkliners, Casitas, or stick built trailers from the big companies, or high dollar Airstreams even, see these same kind of "human" assembly errors?

Denny
Wandering Our Way | Travels with an engineer, a poet and a tiny trailer

Oh sure, other brands suffer from the same errors. Someone here picked up a new Scamp at the factory (a year or so ago) only to find out, when they camped for the night on the way home, that the water pipes were never installed. My stickie trailer had a loose gas fitting that set the alarm off during my first campout... a potentially very dangerous problem.

These trailers all were supposedly inspected by the factory (or in my case, the dealer). How well done is an inspection that misses stuff like absent plumbing or loose gas fittings (supposedly checked under pressure by the dealer, HA!)? So I have to say that issues with a new Snoozy are not unusual.

However, when it is a small manufacturer (be it Scamp, Snoozy, or whoever), I think we should be able to expect the number of human error type problems to be far lower than average, because the small company has less people assembling, more accountability, hopefully more pride and care, more attention to detail possible, and more riding on the quality than some high-volume, slap-together-in-2-hours product off a speed-oriented assembly line (have you ever seen the video of a Jayco being built?).

In the case of early Snoozy trailers, perhaps some inexperience is involved? The Smoaks make a great shell with their boat building background, but boats generally don't have windows or waste tanks. So there's a learning curve. Since they have been in production for a while now, though, I would expect all the kinks to be worked out and any new units rolling out of the building should be rigorously inspected and everything should be top-notch IMHSRO (in my haughty self-righteous opinion ).

[carlkeigley]

Well,
I have to say this thread has been most informing...............
I am really appreciative of everyone's input. I got the idea of copying and pasting all the pertinent posts. When I get to the factory to check out ordering one, I will have lots of information to plop down on their desk......LOL
I even had the thought to offer a premium for "extra" quality control. lol.

There are some fine quality minded folks out there, but they still aren't quite on par with my granddad. I doubt anyone would walk ten miles to repay a fifty cent debt these days. Of course, we don't "have to" nowadays. Walk that is. People laughed at me when I would re-roof a house after a storm. I did it the way my granddad showed me. Last one I did, I did one side and couldn't finish the job so hired some pros to finish the other side. Soon, another storm came. The pros side lost shingles, and mine looked as if there had never been and wind.

My thanks to Ruth G for laying it on the line. Truth is always appreciated.
I know the Snoozy team also appreciated the info for needed improvements.

We sold our house and had to move in a hurry. Impatient buyers. We bought land,
ordered a new manufactured house [trailer house to me], told them to rush, and it was obvious. Took them six weeks, but I think a normal build for a trailer house is less than that and it shows. Even on the more expensive models.

Bottom line: Life stinks...........LOL.

All this helps me on my wish list which will include things you can't see now.

[Thomas G.]

I think that if I was buying new, I'd do a thorough shakedown in a nearby campground, then swing back and get all the little stuff fixed. FGRVs aren't like a car where there is a dealer in every major town.

[carlkeigley]

Some of the Snoozy buyers have done that.
The Smoaks even bring some a beer for breakfast.......LOL

A lot of wisdom in camping before heading out very far very soon.

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by MCDenny

I'm curious, do the owners of new Scamps, Escapes, Egg Campers, Parkliners, Casitas, or stick built trailers from the big companies, or high dollar Airstreams even, see these same kind of "human" assembly errors?

Yes, routinely. We have a 2010 model year class A motorhome from a major manufacturer which has been in business for many years, and we have a dozen issues like those listed for early Lil Snoozys.

We have only had three RVs, but I have looked at hundreds and I've never seen an RV which appeared to be designed or constructed at a level of diligence or consistency comparable to that of mass-production automobiles. I am not surprised by this, since even a major RV manufacturer works in volumes which would be small by general automotive standards.

[Raz]

Our eggs are made much like the model T or earlier. I still think most of the design is gut feel and experience. No Cad/ cam here yet. I wonder how long it will take? Raz

[honda03842]

We went to the Scamp factory to get new cushions and a new coupler. They handled all thecwork well andvwevwere out of there in a couple of hours.

The factory is small. They had surprisingly few workers. Maybe 20 employees of all types including sales and office. There is a fair amount of hand and custom work that goes into each rig.

In no way is this an automated production line.

I suspect this is virtually the same at all of these small frv companies.

[Ken C]

American Boler and CAD drawing are here

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by Ken C

American Boler and CAD drawing are here

The company (American Boler) is sort of here, and has the drawings, but the Zephyr (the trailer) is not here yet - not even a physical prototype. If it gets built, it will be interesting to see if Computer Aided Design is actually used, or just Computer Aided Drawing; Computer Aided Manufacturing would be another step beyond typical current practice.

[David B.]

We just got back from an egg gathering in Quartzsite Arizona, and was able to tour BAMA's "Wake Up Lil Snoozy". I was impressed with most of all I saw, but some things I would like to change to suit our personal needs. Over all I think we have found our next trailer, even though it's 1900 miles away.

[rabbit]

I believe ParkLiner, according to online promotional video, has a CNC router for milling parts in sheet goods. A basic cookie cutter mill, no matter how outdated is a 100K$+ investment. I doubt if these 30 units/year startups can really afford these machines or that they have the volume to make one pay for itself. Back in the day of "32mm" computer numeric mills, the standard joke that CNC allowed you to duplicate your mistakes faster was a sad fact. Lots of enterprising young men went belly up on their first pallet of melamine board and they didn't need to work a seven day week to do it.

jack

[Ken C]

Parkliner's cabinet maker neighbor has the CNC not them.