New Scamp "hard cushion" remedies

[rdickens]

Apparently, many/most owners of newer Scamps are finding the cushions too firm/hard to get a comfortable nights sleep.

Owners of those newer Scamps and/or newer Scamp cushions are apparently having to use foam mattress toppers or air cushion camping mattresses under their bedding in order to be comfortable. In another thread located in the modifications/alterations section, I posed the question of what remedies people were using to address the hard cushion issue:
http://www.fiberglassrv.com/forums/f56/more-comfortable-scamp-cushions-67016.html

We have a friend from our pop-up camping days who is in the upholstery business and who made new cushions for my son's older pop-up camper.
My son said that his cushions are comfortable for sleeping. I asked our friend where she got the foam for my son's new cushions and she referred me to a local KC business. I called them and took my Scamp cushions in for them to take a look at.

Here is what the owner of that business said:

The foam in the new cushions for my son's pop-up was apparently better quality foam than Scamp used in my trailer. The owner demonstrated the difference in some of the various types of foam that he stocked versus the foam from my cushions. Although still reasonably firm, the better quality foam (N36?) deflected more easily and rebounded more quickly than the foam in my Scamp cushions.

Although the owner said that he had created a 3-layer dual-density foam sandwich (lower density/higher density/lower density) for the reversible chair cushions in his "man cave", he suggested that I probably didn't need to go to that kind of multi-layer dual-density solution for our Scamp cushions. He said that just using a higher quality foam (like my son's cushions) would probably be satisfactory. Total cash-discount cost for foam for the 6 cushions that comprise the bed = $140 if I stuffed the foam back into the cushion covers ..... $150 if he put the new foam back into the cushions (he said the zippers were smaller than he would normally have expected for cushions of that size). You might compare those costs to the cost of purchasing/using/storing a separate foam mattress topper or air camping mattress.

The store owner also told me that the reason that my cushion seams keep frustrating us by slipping around on the cushions is that the slippery plastic covering the foam had not been removed after inserting the foam into the cushion covers. (Especially with smaller zippers, that slippery plastic foam covering is apparently necessary in order to allow the foam to easily slide into the cushion cover material. After putting the foam into the covers and insuring that it goes all the way in (clear to the bottom), they would reach in on the sides and grab the thin plastic and rip as much of it as possible off of the foam and take it out of the cushion cover.)

Other possible non-replacement remedies:

If we didn't want to replace our cushion foam, the store owner suggested that we either

1) "Run over the cushions with a truck/car"
or
2) "Put on clean socks, throw the cushions on a clean living room floor, and stomp all over them."

When I looked incredulous, he said "I mean it. Put the cushions between two full sheets of plywood and run over them with a truck."
(The stomping version may be a little bit like the old "I Love Lucy" episode, that some may remember, where she is stomping grapes in a wine vat. )

I guess that the idea is to break down at least some of those rigid foam cells. Just lying on the bed may not do the trick. You apparently need to put enough pressure on the entire cushion (or at least in many spots) to compress it significantly. (While I was in the store, the store owner punched a corner of my foam cushion repeatedly and it did seem to soften up a bit.)

In an earlier thread, Donna D suggested "As an all molded towable owner... no matter the size of the TT, there are two things that are paramont (IMHO) a comfortable place to sleep (is the bed big enough) and a comfortable chair to sit outside! EVERYTHING else is gravy. YMMV."
http://www.fiberglassrv.com/forums/f55/help-new-to-be-13-scamp-owners-need-help-with-bed-58124-4.html

I agree!
Both the size and the softness/firmness of the bed might be important for a comfortable night's sleep.

So that's the story. Take it for whatever it might be worth. As always, YMMV.

Good luck with whatever you decide!

Ray

[Carol H]

Originally Posted by rdickens

The store owner also told me that the reason that my cushion seams keep frustrating us by slipping around on the cushions is that the slippery plastic covering the foam had not been removed after inserting the foam into the cushion covers. (Especially with smaller zippers, that slippery plastic foam covering is apparently necessary in order to allow the foam to easily slide into the cushion cover material. After putting the foam into the covers and insuring that it goes all the way in (clear to the bottom), they would reach in on the sides and grab the thin plastic and rip as much of it as possible off of the foam and take it out of the cushion cover.)

Ray before pulling the plastic that Scamp uses to get the cushions into the tight fitting covers (you will also need to use it if you ever wash your cushion covers) you may want to consider the long term protection factor it provides the foam. Have seen some pretty dirty smelly foam the result of no plastic protecting it from spills etc. on the other hand I have seen some foam that has been in a trailer for over 15 years and heavily used that looked and smelled new as it still had the thin plastic (about the same as a dry cleaners bag) on it.

Scamp does make the covers pretty tight fitting so I didn't notice a lot of slippage with the originals (Since replaced) but for one - perhaps it the cover sewn a little bigger or the foam cut a little smaller. I removed the cover and used my sewing machine to take in one of the seams just a little bit to snug it up.

I BTW have found the addition of a memory foam topper to be the easiest/fastest/cheapest way to improve the comfort level.

[Timber Wolf]

Originally Posted by Carol H

I BTW have found the addition of a memory foam topper to be the easiest/fastest/cheapest way to improve the comfort level.

^^^This^^^ I have 26, going on 27 year old Scamp foam and it is too hard for me. I use 3" regular foam on top and it is just OK. Funny I did not think about driving over my foam when I had it for washing the covers.

[rdickens]

I was told that trash bags or dry cleaning bags could be used to aid insertion/reinsertion.
I've noticed that my sofa at home has larger zippers on the cushions and some sort of a white, less slippery cover on the foam.
In the trailer, we do use use a mattress pad, under our summer weight bedding, to keep the cushions (and foam) protected and cleaner.
All of the bedding is rolled up into a "cowboy saddle roll" and stuffed into a king size pillow case (bag/cover) every morning as we convert to daytime "table mode".
In a 13ft trailer, I am a little concerned about the additional space required to roll up and store a separate mattress topper on a daily basis.




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[Carol H]

Originally Posted by rdickens

In a 13ft trailer, I am a little concerned about the additional space required to roll up and store a separate mattress topper on a daily basis.

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I hear you..... even in a 16' the storage of such is an issue. Which is why after my first year of using the trailer I decided to just make the bed as comfortable as I could and leave it made up. Have a nice light weight table for 4 to use outside if camping at spots with no tables that fits nicely under the awning for eating and playing cards etc. if its cool out a small propane fire pit helps. If doing a quick stop on the road ... just sitting on the couch with plate in lap or on the bed with the plate on the kitchen counter works just fine!

Personally found the back dinette area with the table up to be very uncomfortable place for reading or watching moves etc on poor weather days anyways. More comfortable with it down and lot of pillows etc to relax up against.

[TomK]

Lots of good info here Ray. We don't tear our bed down daily, so a foam mattress topper works well for us. Basically our camper is a support system for our bed. We're hardly in it, except to sleep at night. If we did switch daily, foam replacement would be the way to go, making tear down and storage easier.

In case anyone hasn't seen the plastic bag method for stuffing the cushion back in the cover, here it is:

Upholstery Cushion Covers - Shrinking And Inserting Foam - YouTube

Tom

[floyd]

Originally Posted by rdickens

I was told that trash bags or dry cleaning bags could be used to aid insertion/reinsertion.
I've noticed that my sofa at home has larger zippers on the cushions and some sort of a white, less slippery cover on the foam.
In the trailer, we do use use a mattress pad, under our summer weight bedding, to keep the cushions (and foam) protected and cleaner.
All of the bedding is rolled up into a "cowboy saddle roll" and stuffed into a king size pillow case (bag/cover) every morning as we convert to daytime "table mode".
In a 13ft trailer, I am a little concerned about the additional space required to roll up and store a separate mattress topper on a daily basis.




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convert to a wraparound couch, lounging comfort is increased and storage space is much greater!

[Mike Magee]

Foam does indeed soften up with use. Starting with cheap, soft foam means having it soon become too unsupportive. Too bad we can't buy just the kind we like and have it stay that way for the life of the trailer.

On my last trailer, I went too far with the stiffness when buying new foam. I went from sinking down so far I had trouble turning over, to feeling like I was on a board. After spending all the money on the new foam, I ended up adding memory foam on top for sleeping. Sheesh. I should have tried lying on some middle-of-the-road foams while I was at the foam supplier.

[rdickens]

When I told him that our cushions were too firm/hard, the store owner did seem surprised and commented that he was more accustomed to people wanting a little more firmness/support.
The multi-layer dual-density foam sandwich solution would be a bit like a firm supportive home mattress with a more comfortable pillow top.
I'm not sure whether I will soon replace our foam with the higher quality stuff or just try to tenderize our current cushions a bit with the stomping them on the living room floor technique.
Sadly, I didn't get a price on the multi-layer dual density approach. ... just for comparison.


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[Carol H]

Originally Posted by rdickens

I'm not sure whether I will soon replace our foam with the higher quality stuff or just try to tenderize our current cushions a bit with the stomping them on the living room floor technique.

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LOL I suspect it will take a fair bit of stomping! My trailer is now 22 years old and in the 6 years I have had it the bed has been used at least 400 days probable more and its still stiff!

[Jon in AZ]

We upgraded from tent camping (with an air mattress) to our Scamp. I have lower back issues, so I am really enjoying the firm support of the Scamp cushions (and being off the floor). A nice puffy sleeping bag adds a layer of softness. Any more comfortable and I might never want to go home! 😴 Guess it's all relative.

[rdickens]

I think that it might make a huge difference whether you sleep on your side or on your back/stomach. Also, your body weight/height and the ambient temperature may also influence how much the foam deflects and/or conforms to your body contours.

My wife and I both sleep on our sides. I'm 5'10" and 195 lbs and my wife is considerably shorter and lighter. With a very firm mattress, we both feel uncomfortable pressure points on our hips and our shoulders.

I think that a higher quality foam might work a little better for a wider range of body types and weights. (Maybe an expert could weigh in on that?)

To learn more than you ever really wanted to know about the various types of foam and the various performance metrics (type, density, IFD/ILD, etc.) of each, you could check some of the following URLs:

Density and Softness
http://www.bedinabox.com/memory-foam-mattress-density-and-softness.html

Comparing Latex & Visco
http://www.sleepez.com/comparelatex-visco.htm

FOAM CUSHION MATERIAL
http://www.carrscorner.com/foam.php

Latex Firmness(ILD)
http://www.latexmattress.org/latex-faq/latex-firmness-ild.php


Ray

[CampyTime]

My back got sore on the dinette cushions too so I cut an egg crate foam thingie to fit and my mom sewed a sheet to fit the contours. Helps a great deal. She sewed in pockets to have egg crate sit in these to hold sheet on. All I do is roll it out and sleep! I use a sleeping bag though.

Haven't done this for the lower bunk yet but will have to as when the kids come, I'll be on the bunk


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[Byron Kinnaman]

I don't find the factory cushions any too firm, in some way I would them a bit more firm. But then I was in the Army for short period of time and learned to sleep on a pile of rocks with a steel helmet for pillow.

[TomK]

Originally Posted by Byron Kinnaman

I don't find the factory cushions any too firm, in some way I would them a bit more firm. But then I was in the Army for short period of time and learned to sleep on a pile of rocks with a steel helmet for pillow.

Happy Veteran's Day Byron and any Vet reading this. Thanks for your service.

Tom

[Donna D.]

Originally Posted by TomK

Happy Veteran's Day Byron and any Vet reading this. Thanks for your service.

Tom

Absolutely, positively

[Carl Pa]

That steel helmet was not only your pillow, but also your shower. Carl