Problems with headliner and adhesives - Page 2 - Fiberglass RV


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Old 06-12-2016, 01:06 PM   #15
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Name: john
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Reflectix on walls....

I put Reflectix on my Compact Jr walls using heavy-duty Velcro with adhesive backing.

I simply adhered one side of the Velcro to the corners of pieces of Reflectix and on the corresponding spot on the walls.

With the thickness of the two pieces of Velcro there is a small gap for air between the wall and the Reflectix.

The difference of hot and cold when touching areas covered and not covered with the Reflectix is very noticeable.
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Old 06-12-2016, 01:12 PM   #16
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About commershal only adhesive only. Find out the name and look for it on the Internet. I have found that many can be found and ordered.
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Old 06-12-2016, 01:23 PM   #17
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I hope your going to paint the styrofoam if you go that way.
Styrofoam is very dangerous if it exposed to flame, a poisonous gas.
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Old 06-12-2016, 01:29 PM   #18
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Name: Dean
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Well I've been searching for 3M 90 in and around Vancouver Bc Canada and we don't sell it? Home Depot only has up to 3M 77. Not sure if I can drive over border and bring it back into Canada either?
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Old 06-12-2016, 02:48 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by Mollie View Post
Well I've been searching for 3M 90 in and around Vancouver Bc Canada and we don't sell it? Home Depot only has up to 3M 77. Not sure if I can drive over border and bring it back into Canada either?
Try DAP High Temp Headliner spray adhesive..... found it here in Az. at the local hardware store "Do-IT Best Hardware" The 3M 77 would not hold up to the AZ heat, and the 3M 90 bled through the marine headliner, leaving a yellow/brownish stain.
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Old 06-12-2016, 06:20 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by starbrightsteve View Post
John, I'm not sure if you were using extruded polystyrene(Dow blue board) or expanded polystyrene(white bead board). In either case both materials are hard to find a compatible adhesive.
Steve thanks for the input! I am using the white styrofoam variety as it is more flexible for the curves of the Boler than the blue board. I like the idea of the rboard, first I have heard of it, from what I just read it has a fiberglass mat facer on both sides which could possibly make it compatible with fiberglass resins and epoxies and maybe better suitable for other adhesives as well. What is the name of the foam similar to Great stuff that you said you used?
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Old 06-12-2016, 06:21 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by john madill View Post
I put Reflectix on my Compact Jr walls using heavy-duty Velcro with adhesive backing.

I simply adhered one side of the Velcro to the corners of pieces of Reflectix and on the corresponding spot on the walls.

With the thickness of the two pieces of Velcro there is a small gap for air between the wall and the Reflectix.

The difference of hot and cold when touching areas covered and not covered with the Reflectix is very noticeable.
The velcro would certainly allow the air gap that k corbin was speaking about and eliminate the dulling of the shinny foil but I still don't think reflectix is the best choice for me but I appreciate the reply.
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Old 06-12-2016, 06:22 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by Darwin Maring View Post
About commershal only adhesive only. Find out the name and look for it on the Internet. I have found that many can be found and ordered.
Darwin I will try that, the problem is some of the stuff is cost prohibitive to ship with hazmat fees or can not be shipped at all via UPS
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Old 06-12-2016, 06:25 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by RRJR View Post
I hope your going to paint the styrofoam if you go that way.
Styrofoam is very dangerous if it exposed to flame, a poisonous gas.
Ron if we go the painting route I would pull down all the styrofoam first. We don't have any open flames in our Boler, the only source is our water heater which is on the trailer's tongue. Removing the foam and painting is really a last resort, I would rather find the right glue to keep the headliner up without eating the foam....
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Old 06-12-2016, 06:34 PM   #24
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Anyone used 3M™ Fast Tack Water Based Adhesive 1000NF?
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Old 06-12-2016, 10:10 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by Mollie View Post
Well I've been searching for 3M 90 in and around Vancouver Bc Canada and we don't sell it? Home Depot only has up to 3M 77. Not sure if I can drive over border and bring it back into Canada either?
I got mine from Acklands Grainger.
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Old 06-13-2016, 12:23 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by Johnny M View Post
K Corbin your post is exactly why I choose not use reflectix and yes I have been on their website but I have been told by many to use it. Good to know info about the glue dulling it. K Corbin what do you suggest we do try a different adhesive and stay with the styrofoam? We considered removing it but worry we will have same problem with the headliner directly on the fiberglass as we did on the inside of the door. We are considering pulling it down and just painting the inside but worry the 5000 BTU AC won't be effective. Borrego Dave thanks for your I put too don't remember the exact temperatures as the test were last summer but they seemed significant enough to justify the styrofoam not to mention the styrofoam was significantly more cost effective not including our wasted material. There has got to be something out there like Nasa space stuff lol that would work for these eggs with good R values and stay put.

Super 77 spray adhesive is intended to be re-positionable for up to 2 days. So that is not going to work for an overhead ceiling application where you are applying a material to a surface that is already overhead. Under those conditions you need to use a glue that is not rated as re-positionable for any substantial length of time. For instance Weld Bond brush on VOC based contact cement, you might get one extra try but it will only happen within a few minutes time frame window to make a re-position possible.

Styrofoam is that type of solid ridged stuff they make those white disposable coolers from that drive you crazy with the squeaking. They also use it for float docks and sometimes for packaging. They used to use it for insulation in walls on RVs and houses but there are much better products being sold for that purpose now.

So that leaves the question of exactly what kind of foam board insulation product did you buy? Without actually knowing what foam board product you used it is hard to state what adhesive might work on the surface. If you bought the polyisocyanurate board that has a thin layer of plastic sheeting on the surface then that thin plastic layer could be much of your problem in trying to get an adhesive to stick fabric to your foam board. There is not going to be any adhesive I can think of that will stay well stuck to it so of course your headliner will fall down. That thin film is helping to act as a moisture barrier but if you have the foam stuck to the ceiling already and that is the kind of insulation board you purchased I guess you could peel of that layer and try using a spray foam.

For what it is worth I myself have come to the conclusion that for overhead insulation using a closed cell foam product is going to be about as good as it gets for insulation values in a fiberglass trailer where you are not going to have a professionally sprayed in place foam layer. The Ensolite product that people in this forum talk about that gets used in some makes of trailers is a dense closed cell foam. You can use spray glues on that product. There will be a list of suitable spray glues for it on the sites that sell that type of foam.

The denser closed cell foams will give the best R value but of course the denser it is the more it weighs and it cost more too. Landau padding foam is also a closed cell foam that will insulate, it has lower R value than a dense foam such as Ensolite but it does insulate and it too helps with noise reduction and does not cost as much.

Darn it I have a low ceiling and a tight budget too. I want thin but dense closed cell foam. Fortunately one of the marine businesses in this building just put a bunch of relatively dense orange colored, closed cell foam sheet, leftovers in the dumpster and I spotted it before the trucks came It is new material, the color does not matter since it will be hidden! Maybe they have more leftovers? Maybe they have a job coming up soon that will require it and might save the extra pieces for me? They can see my Campster renovation happening from their big windows upstairs and it is so adorably cute and tiny that perhaps I can get them to consider helping to keep it warm by feeding it their leftovers? If I was still adorably cute and tiny that would be even more of a help in going begging for materials.
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Old 06-13-2016, 09:30 AM   #27
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I'll throw my .02$ in on contact cement. I DO know what ever Scamp uses is VERY VERY strong and hard to rip apart. On the other hand, I did need to get under one of their "marine upholstery" seams. I went back on the seam cover with the 3M 90- NOTHING less! It has held for several years with not a sign of retreating in hot/humid Tennessee weather! The "77" is almost like it's removable! I wouldnt use it for ANY type of headliner.

Another example- I had a new headliner installed in my '99 Nissan truck a few years ago. I didnt have the sunvisors done- not for $50. I bought the material myself and wanted the "challenge" to see how I could cover them. I did as they had an internal "board" in which to place the "headliner" material. In my case, this is "foam" backed. Keep in mind, my sunvisors were originally "sown". Not now...it's strictly 3M 90 and they're holding fine.

Interesting stuff on the "reflectix" I've always questioned Scamp's listed R15! BUT, I do have a question, the glue is only attached to the outside. You STILL have the "bubbles" in which the air (the insulator) is still there. As far as the "reflection" being gone, how in the world can that affect it's insulating ability if it's not used in the sunlight? (Like sunvisors at windshields) Just curious.
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Old 06-13-2016, 10:16 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darral T. View Post
I'll throw my .02$ in on contact cement. I DO know what ever Scamp uses is VERY VERY strong and hard to rip apart. On the other hand, I did need to get under one of their "marine upholstery" seams. I went back on the seam cover with the 3M 90- NOTHING less! It has held for several years with not a sign of retreating in hot/humid Tennessee weather! The "77" is almost like it's removable! I wouldnt use it for ANY type of headliner.

Another example- I had a new headliner installed in my '99 Nissan truck a few years ago. I didnt have the sunvisors done- not for $50. I bought the material myself and wanted the "challenge" to see how I could cover them. I did as they had an internal "board" in which to place the "headliner" material. In my case, this is "foam" backed. Keep in mind, my sunvisors were originally "sown". Not now...it's strictly 3M 90 and they're holding fine.

Interesting stuff on the "reflectix" I've always questioned Scamp's listed R15! BUT, I do have a question, the glue is only attached to the outside. You STILL have the "bubbles" in which the air (the insulator) is still there. As far as the "reflection" being gone, how in the world can that affect it's insulating ability if it's not used in the sunlight? (Like sunvisors at windshields) Just curious.
Just got of the phone with Cellofoam in Conyers GA who makes the Poly Shield 3/4" 4x8 sheet we bought from Lowe's. I explained what I was doing and the problems I encountered and they told me I need to use a water based adhesive, the foil should be faced out towards the shell/fiberglass and that their product would offer better insulation and r-value than the reflectix even without an air space at (R3 as opposed to an R1). They also said that the glue "dulling" the foil would not substantially affect the r value as it is for reflecting radiant heat rather than direct sunlight as that is how it is used in normal residential construction practices. They also said the styrofoam will degrade at temperatures above 180 degrees (F) and long term exposure should not be above 167 degress. So I am putting a thermometer in the Boler today at ceiling level to see what the inside temperature gets to with it closed up as it will be in the 90's here this week and I will report back with my findings. The also said to contact Demand Products in Atlanta for adhesives compatible for their products or Woolley & Co. in Norcross GA for alternatives for insulation.
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