Scamp 13 Furnnce Question - Page 2 - Fiberglass RV


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Old 04-15-2015, 10:47 AM   #15
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This is a thread that has that image. Suburban GT6-3A furnace help, please.

I live in the US and we can always find some cranky Swell Old Boy that worked on something old for 25 years who is more than willing to fix it if for no other reason he doesn't like the "newfangled" ones. :-)

In truth safety is mostly down to the operator, their mindset and willingness to take responsibility. Cars have turn indicator signals but that does not prevent folks from changing lanes or turning without taking responsibility to warn other drivers with those signals. Smoke a CO detectors require batteries be maintained etc. or they don't enhance safety but rather give a false sense of safety that might lead one to run a poorly maintained furnace while they sleep. Say one that has not had propane connections checked in a decade.

Can't fix operator error with technology..... except with duct tape. Taping the foolish to a chair generally keeps them from causing problems for at least a little while. A piece over the mouth keeps them from being annoying.
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Old 04-15-2015, 12:13 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by David Tilston View Post

Carole, I find it difficult to believe that a licenced furnace service person would get in atrouble for repairing an appliance that was CSA approved in it's day. That is like saying that a mechanic would loose their license for working on a Model T because it doesn't meet current crash standards.

Please leave the CO argument alone. This style of furnace is no more likely to develop a leak, or cause CO poisoning then any current design. The reason they no longer meet CSA standards is all about surface temperature.
David I am not at all interested in arguing with you as to the reasons why it was declared unsafe to use although my understand of one of the big issues surrounding it use clearly differ from yours.

I was simple attempting to point out to someone new to these trailers such as the OP that there are known safety issues with what they are considering using and have indicated they want to do so safely - which according to the people who made the product and and those responsible for public safety and governing such things and who know the actual reasons why, that its not possible, without some major modifications to the products design.

In regards to licensed service personal - most have their own governing bodies that issue them licences and they do receive directives from them as to best practices and what they can and can not repair. Those governing bodies do also have the power to take away a license. Some also receive directives from the companies of the shops they work for or the companies who's products they sell or parts they use for repairs. Think you will find its the same with the furnace in your home. There will come a time when a licensed repair person will not touch certain model/aged home furnaces just as an electrician may come to your home and refuse to put a new line into a box they feel needs to be totally upgraded before they will do it.

As I said at the end of the day its up to each of us as to who's opinion we want to take in regards to the safe use of any item - the opinion of those on an internet users forum or those who actually make the product &/or the governing safety body.

Choose at the end of the day is the end users.
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Old 04-15-2015, 12:34 PM   #17
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In regards to licensed service personal - most have their own governing bodies that issue them licences and they do receive directives from them as to best practices and what they can and can not repair. Some also receive directives from the companies of the shops they work for or the companies who's products they sell or parts they use for repairs. Think you will find its the same with the furnace in your home. There will come a time when a licensed repair person will not touch certain model/aged home furnaces just as an electrician may come to your home and refuse to put a new line into a box they feel needs to be totally upgraded before they will do it.
Please provide references of directives prohibiting working on CSA approved appliances. I would consider it a safety issue if the owner was forced to do all their own work. Why would any regulatory body do that?

I am very familiar with the electrical code, there is NOTHING, that I am aware of, baring an electrician from working on antiquated equipment. I can only assume that the same applies to gas fitters. Typcially laws, which is what the code is, can't be made retroactive.

I think it is worth noting that the folks at Trillium / Outback, did a complete rebuild on my gravity furnace. They also manufacture trailers, with propane. So, I would think it unlikely that they would so casually risk their license to do that.

It also occurs to me that since the parts for these furnaces are still available, someone is working on them.
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Old 04-15-2015, 01:12 PM   #18
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As it turns out, just this a.m., there is a furnace tech due where I am staying to repair a burned out junction block on our electric furnace. As this is an LP/Electric only area, with thousands of RV visitors every year, I will ask his opinion on the question as well.
Bob, when talking to him, please ask him if HE has ever been issued a directive from any governing body, etc., during his career, telling him that he can't work on a furnace?

Just wondering?

Bill
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Old 04-15-2015, 03:04 PM   #19
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The dreaded liability issue!

I think the OP has received fair warning that his furnace is not state-of-the-art design.

If I'm not mistaken OP has indicated he will be consulting with or hiring professional to assist with his decision making and any repairs.

So the battle between pro and anti using a gravity furnace folks need to get married to each other and fight like civilized people someplace other than in this thread.

If you can help the OP in his quest for parts, assembly / removal advice or specific things one should be looking for with this type of furnace go ahead and share. If you are just trying to make a point that has already been made. Eh just let it go.
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Old 04-15-2015, 03:41 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by David Tilston View Post
I am very familiar with the electrical code, there is NOTHING, that I am aware of, baring an electrician from working on antiquated equipment. I can only assume that the same applies to gas fitters. Typcially laws, which is what the code is, can't be made retroactive.
As I see the moderator has spoken I have nothing further to say on the topic of the OP furnace or liabilty but will answer David's question above. Assuming thats ok.

I am very familiar with the building codes in our area and all I will say in these parts if the home owner asks an electrician to add a new receptacle that requires a new line back to the panel, they require a permit. The permit requires them to do the installation using the current code - if the homes panel they are connecting into does not meet current codes then they can't attach any new lines to it without upgrading the panel.. simple as that. They can as you say repair an old system but they can not add anything new or do what one might consider a major overhaul on the panel unless it is to bring it up to code. Same goes for replacing an old gas furnace - that requires a permit and all the piping and vents that are to be attached to the new furnace must meet current code.
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Old 04-15-2015, 03:53 PM   #21
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I believe we were discussing repairs to old furnaces, not new construction.
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Old 04-15-2015, 03:58 PM   #22
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Actually they are dead simple, even if they are old. There are some important considerations though. Primarily that the heat exchanger doesn't leak, then the gas valve has to work. If it doesn't work it can be replaced. It may take some shopping though. I found a gas valve that will work on my furnace for about $100, but the ports are in different places, so some tube bending is required. I suspect that you have to match up the btu input. I recently purchased a furnace that has the same basic design, and the same input btu's. I will try to use the gas valve off that.

Since they are so difficult to remove, find someone who will work on it while it is installed in your trailer.

Carole, I find it difficult to believe that a licensed furnace service person would get in trouble for repairing an appliance that was CSA approved in it's day. That is like saying that a mechanic would loose their license for working on a Model T because it doesn't meet current crash standards.

Please leave the CO argument alone. This style of furnace is no more likely to develop a leak, or cause CO poisoning then any current design. The reason they no longer meet CSA standards is all about surface temperature.
I am not a pipe fitter so I can not speak to heating appliances. I do know that as an electrician that defects were found in parts manufactured by certain manufacturers and the UL listing for that part or assembly was rescinded.
I was not allowed by law to repair or install that assembly. You were supposed to replace the defective assembly with an approved assembly or red tag and render the assembly unusable . As a licensed electrician, I was not about to violate the law and expose myself to the liability for violating the law just too save the customer a couple of bucks. The part I mentioned was a circuit breaker with a history of exploding under fault. A friend of mine was badly burned by one of these breaker .
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Old 04-15-2015, 04:01 PM   #23
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I believe we were discussing repairs to old furnaces, not new construction.
Yes we were but as stated only answering a question you asked as it applies to an electrician and old equipment not necessarily new construction.
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Old 04-15-2015, 04:30 PM   #24
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Sorry I caused a war of words. All I wanted was some information about the unknown furnace that was in my scamp 13.

Thanks to those who firnished that information to me. I was able to get the lower panel off this afternoon. It was just stuck...and my large hammer took care of that!

The control panel within the furnace panel is quite dirty, and looks like it hasn't been used in years. Since I have no plans to camp in cold weather, I am forgoing any thought of restoring the furnace at this time.

However, I do want to refinish the front panels of the furance so it won't look so tacky! Has anyone here actually removed the upper outer panel of this type of furnace?

It appears that the upper outer panel is attached with two screws on the lower edge of the panel. Is there additional screws, or (hopefully) is the upper part of the panel held by retaining clips?

Can anyone help me with this? Also, does anyone have a manual for this furnace?

Bill
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Old 04-15-2015, 04:39 PM   #25
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This is a thread that has that image. Suburban GT6-3A furnace help, please.
Thanks RogerDat! I had overlooked your message!

Bill
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Old 04-15-2015, 06:23 PM   #26
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If you post the exact Mfg's name and model number it will help in finding a manual.
There should be a sticker inside the cover somewhere
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Old 04-15-2015, 06:51 PM   #27
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Update on post #14
Technician called and based on the pic I sent he wants to order a new power block and postponed for a couple of days. Will follow up on LP furnaces when he comes.
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Old 04-15-2015, 08:22 PM   #28
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If you post the exact Mfg's name and model number it will help in finding a manual.
There should be a sticker inside the cover somewhere
At the moment, getting the cover off is the problem!

However, Rachel in her early message wrote that the model number was GT6-3A.

I'd hate to make a mistake and damage the cover, that's why I am asking for some help. It's been my experance that everything is simple when you know the answers..

Bill
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