Tie down bolts and frame - old Trillium - Page 2 - Fiberglass RV


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 09-05-2015, 07:38 AM   #15
Senior Member
 
Name: Don
Trailer: Trillium
Ontario
Posts: 172
I just had my Trillium off the frame. All my bolts were rusted and two were almost rusted through. Replaced them with stainless steel. Bolt, washer, lock washer and nut. Well worth it.
Now here is my problem. The tray that the porta potty sits on. How is it attached? my final bolt to replace sits under it and It can't get at it. Anyone removed this "shelf/tray" before?
__________________

__________________
Don ravinerat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2015, 07:21 PM   #16
Senior Member
 
Name: Randy J.
Trailer: Trillium
Ontario
Posts: 147
I will use regular steel bolts, partly because I don't want to set up a possible galvanic situation with the frame and partly because, as Tom from Trillium Parts tactfully suggested, I don't need them to last another 40 years!

Why are you removing the body from the frame? Are you concerned about frame rust? So far as the floor goes, shouldn't the fiberglass shell be protecting the wood floor? In an ambitious moment I have thought about separating the frame and having it painted. But Krown Rust proofing seems to seep everywhere and I'm pretty sure it must have gotten between the tube frame and the body. Anyway, any pictures of how the heck you do it would be interesting!

Someone was asking how to remove toe porta-poti garage. I've long since removed ours because it stunk to high heaven - no bolts, just some screws - and have no plans to replace it. We carry Old Stinky (when we must!) in a sealable tote.

Randy
__________________

__________________
Randy J. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-08-2015, 06:59 AM   #17
Senior Member
 
Name: Don
Trailer: Trillium
Ontario
Posts: 172
I replaced my bolts with SS on the recommendation of the trailer place. Anything I do to the trailer will last the length of time I own it for sure.

We removed the body from the frame so not to damage the Fiberglass when welding the new axle on. I got to have a good look at the frame and it is solid. I will be able to remove the body for painting of either the frame or the body when the time comes. I was thinking on using the bed liner stuff for the frame but I will look into that later.

I got the little shelf out and it was held in by 4 little screws. I've just got it sitting in there right now. I'll have to see if it bounces too much
__________________
Don ravinerat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-10-2015, 03:44 PM   #18
Junior Member
 
Name: Steve
Trailer: Trillium 1300 (1980)
Ontario
Posts: 13
Registry
Bolt specs

First off, ours is a 1980 Trillium 1300. That means that the frame is different from many of the earlier years; there are gussets welded to the "upcurve" right under the forward edge of the body to prevent the cracking often seen in earlier frames. Also, and I'm not sure if this is just on the later models or not, the forward two body-to-frame carriage bolts are not through the frame like the four in the back, but rather through a heavy steel angle bracket welded to the side of the frame when it was built.

So bearing in mind that other versions of the trailer may be different, here are the specs of the bolts I removed:

4 at rear: 5/16" mild steel carriage bolts 5" long, 18tpi, with square-punched backer plate on top and split washer and 1/2" nut on bottom.

2 at front: 3/8" mild steel carriage bolts 2 1/2" long, 16tpi, with square-punched backer plate on top and split washer and 9/16" nut on bottom.

Of the six, 3 were very badly corroded and reduced to a fraction of their original diameter, in all cases near the head where the damage was not visible. Likely this is due to exposure to wet plywood in the floor sandwich brought on by leaky window seals (fixed).

In other parts of this thread one user noted that his backer plates were round-drilled. In my case all six were machine punched with a square hole that matches the carriage bolt sub-head. This makes nut tightening down below easy: no spin up above. Maybe the square holes are on the newer Trills?

One user mentions installing the bolts with the nuts and washers on the top. I chose not to do this. My concern? I have seen split washers snap in the past. It's not common, but it happens. When it does, there is a danger of having the nut come loose. (At least until it is rust-seized ).

If this happens in the original configuration, the bolt will probably stay put. If things are upside down from the original, and the nut "walks" off from a failed washer and vibration, the carriage bolt or hex bolt will fall out on the road. Remember that the load on these bolts is almost always "in shear", meaning they act to stop the body from sliding on the frame. I figure a bolt in the hole is worth a hundred on the road.

I ended up replacing mine in exactly the same configuration the manufacturer used, and I used the same type of mild steel carriage bolts. I did use some high-end caulk under the backer plate and around the bolt shafts where they went through the floor. On the rest of the bolt, I applied a generous coating of bearing grease.

My plan is to remove the body and clean and paint the frame next year. When I do, I may reattach using stainless. If I don't get to it, well, I'm pretty sure these will last longer than I will.

As other users have said: if you haven't done this yet, there's still time before the snow flies. It took less than a day.
Attached Thumbnails
01 carriage bolts removed.jpg   02 square-punched backer plate.jpg  

__________________
pogophile is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-10-2015, 04:45 PM   #19
Senior Member
 
Name: Don
Trailer: Trillium
Ontario
Posts: 172
All 6 of mine are 5/16 x 5" with a square hole punched backer plate. Washer, loc washer and nut. 1974 Trillium.
__________________
Don ravinerat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-10-2015, 05:19 PM   #20
Senior Member
 
Name: Randy J.
Trailer: Trillium
Ontario
Posts: 147
Well, thank you all - for all of that! Tom of Trillium Parts (some of you may know him - the original Trillium guy!) suggested just using the same size steel bolts from Home Depot. I haven't pulled the other bolts yet but suspect some of you are right about the "square punched" square washers. The washer that broke off with the carriage bolt head is too corroded to see for sure and can't be re-used. Don't know where I would get a replacement square punched, unless I somehow do it so at least that one will have to be a hex head (maybe my wife will consent to hold the wrench on the top side I'll ask the hardware store to at match the specs of the bolts I buy to the ones I take out.

Glad to hear the fellow who removed the body found the frame in good shape - also reassuring for the rest of us.

Randy
__________________
Randy J. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-10-2015, 08:24 PM   #21
Junior Member
 
Name: Steve
Trailer: Trillium 1300 (1980)
Ontario
Posts: 13
Registry
don't throw out that backer!

Randy -

A couple of mine were also very badly corroded at the backer plate. But I was able to knock the remnant out of the plate by placing the plate so it spanned a couple of 2x4 edges, then smacking the non-head side of the corroded bolt with a hammer a couple of times. Out popped the ruined carriage bolt, and most of the corrosion with it. A wire brush removed most of the rest from the backer, and I was able to reuse the plate with no problem. Those plates are heavy steel, about an eighth of an inch thick.
__________________
pogophile is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2015, 07:14 PM   #22
Senior Member
 
Name: Randy J.
Trailer: Trillium
Ontario
Posts: 147
Backers

Well, I have re-used two of the backers, mainly because of limited space near the wheel wells. The others I have replaced at least for now with some washers from Brofasco and a buildup washer as the tech at Carl Cox RV advised. The washer is at least as thick as the original plate and covers the same area. I did keep the little squares and may in fact have someone cut some duplicates if I run accross a suitable piece at a scrap dealer.

I do have a theory however that the square plates are a different metal than the original carraige bolts which may have created a mild galvanic process, given moisture that would wick up the threads. That might explain why two of my bolts were pretty well in tact except right at the plate where they rusted right through. Then again, they probably didn't expect that old farts like me would be keeping these things on the road after 40 years!

Just for interest, galvanic action would certainly explaine why the original plain steel screws that held the aluminum windows to the wooden frame dissintegrated. The worst galvanic corrosion occures when a small steel piece is used to secure an aluminum large piece. I replaced these with stainless steel - still dissimilar but tougher - and coated them.

Randy
__________________
Randy J. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2015, 03:24 AM   #23
Senior Member
 
Trailer:
Posts: 787
Having worked in the marine industry, I think galvanic corrosion is often overstated as a risk - it does assume the parts are sitting in an electrolyte all or most of the time. That may be true on a boat in a harbour, but I don't think trailers are subject to the same conditions.

To utterly prevent galvanic corrosion, the mating surfaces between dissimilar metals can be coated with an anti-corrosion jointing compound such as Duralac. This can be hard to get in the US and seems ridiculously expensive, though a single toothpaste tube will last most people all their life. We used this to fix aluminium sail track onto carbon masts with stainless steel rivets, so a similar application.

__________________
Andrew Gibbens is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2015, 02:05 PM   #24
Senior Member
 
Name: Randy J.
Trailer: Trillium
Ontario
Posts: 147
Thanks. The "right stuff" is very expensive. And as you say, I'm not heading to sea. But this seemed easy, needed or not: I just dipped the tips of the window screws in some RV silicone before screwing them in. The sealant spreads up the threads and forms a thin washer under the head as it tightens, reducing metal to metal contact. I also coated the frame bolts with bee's was (toilet seal, works great!) and put high-end silicone between the floor, the floor plate, and the bolt head.
__________________
Randy J. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2015, 05:14 AM   #25
Raz
Senior Member
 
Raz's Avatar
 
Name: Raz
Trailer: Trillium 2010
Vermont
Posts: 4,064
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew Gibbens View Post
Having worked in the marine industry, I think galvanic corrosion is often overstated as a risk - it does assume the parts are sitting in an electrolyte all or most of the time. That may be true on a boat in a harbour, but I don't think trailers are subject to the same conditions.
I think for most folks you're right. But every year we spend a few weeks camped very close to the ocean. The hardware stores only carry galvanized and stainless hardware, no plated steel. I was told the galvanized is good for a year. After noticing some corrosion on the window mechanisms on the trailer I decided to do a thorough cleaning of the truck and the trailer every time we get home.

My 2010 was made by "Trillium Tom". It came with six 7/16" stainless bolts. All go through angle iron welded to the frame. Progress? Raz
__________________
Raz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-08-2015, 07:28 PM   #26
Senior Member
 
Name: Randy J.
Trailer: Trillium
Ontario
Posts: 147
One thing I've realized in this whole discussion about what's just the right bolt is that - in my case at least - they're easy to get at and remove/replace. And yet I'd towed Little Green around for three years blissfully unaware that all mine were weak and two rusted right through. Me, an old technical guy, with no maintenance plan! So I have one now. I plan to check the torque every spring and again during the season. I'll pull the bolts after two years (I used plain steel ones, again at Tom's suggestion and coated 'em with bees wax) to see how they're doing. If they're just fine I'll wait another five. Seaside? Maybe more. I'm also adding inspections of my gas lines and electrical to the plan.

Randy
__________________
Randy J. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2015, 12:07 PM   #27
Member
 
Name: Duane
Trailer: trillium
New Brunswick
Posts: 88
Hi I just read your post regarding the frame bolts. For my Trillium I put in new galvanized 5/16"carriage bolts with a liberal coating of bee's wax on each. Don't over tighten the bolts. I bought 6 lock nuts and used these with flat washers and snugged them up. The floor won't stand much pressure before it begins to crack . My trailer is a 1976 and the original mild steel bolts were still intact but weak from age.
__________________
getaway1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2015, 01:47 PM   #28
Senior Member
 
Trailer:
Posts: 787
May I, ever so politely, be devil's advocate and ask why the frame bolts are such a concern? Has an egg ever come off its frame due to bolt failure? I can see that bolt failure might encourage unwanted flexing but then rotting of floor plywood seems a bigger risk to overall structural integrity.

I just wonder if this is an issue that just provides the opportunity for some worrying? Like exiting the trailer without first checking if a tiger has escaped from a nearby zoo and will eat you when you step outside - is this more or less of a risk than frame bolt failure?
__________________

__________________
Andrew Gibbens is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
trillium


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Awning Tie Down Straps? iplumb General Chat 11 08-15-2013 01:02 PM
Loose frame bolts and deterioration of floor. Ak Ron Problem Solving | Owners Helping Owners 35 06-07-2013 04:52 AM
How do you tie things down inside the camper lpk49 Modifications, Alterations and Updates 40 05-26-2013 12:00 AM
A Home Brew Tie Down System for the Pickup Raz Problem Solving | Owners Helping Owners 6 04-25-2013 08:50 AM
Floor to frame bolts Tom U Problem Solving | Owners Helping Owners 0 05-10-2009 03:02 PM

» Upcoming Events
No events scheduled in
the next 465 days.
» Virginia Campgrounds

Reviews provided by


Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 01:30 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.