Broken Frame

[ruscal]

Reinforcing the frame at the bend before it breaks is a good idea for people who put many miles on their rigs. That is a structurally awkward joint for the frame members. It has to absorb millions of fatigue cycles while resisting twisting and bending. That is a hinge point that is supported by the trailer body up to that bend where it then cantilevers out to the hitch. By adding reinforcing before failure you would extend life to the trailer, or maybe move the failure point to a different spot if not done correctly. I have not done our Scamp due to not traveling far from home and having good pavement where we go. It's a 2003 with low miles.
Russ

[Jon in AZ]

Originally Posted by Bruce Thomas

Sourcing a wheel or light after30 years isn't a compromise...flimsy trailers are though. Thing is, all they compromise is your safety and investment.

I hardly think a lightweight frame that fails after 27 years of use, environmental exposure, and, likely, neglect constitutes reckless endangerment of anyone's safety or investment. Regular inspection, maintenance, and, if indicated, repair of a trailer frame is part of prudent ownership of an older trailer.

In any case, reinforcing a Scamp frame is no more trouble than the fiberglass work required to fit a new taillight unit into a U-Haul. And any competent welder can do it.

[floyd]

Originally Posted by ruscal

Reinforcing the frame at the bend before it breaks is a good idea for people who put many miles on their rigs. That is a structurally awkward joint for the frame members. It has to absorb millions of fatigue cycles while resisting twisting and bending. That is a hinge point that is supported by the trailer body up to that bend where it then cantilevers out to the hitch. By adding reinforcing before failure you would extend life to the trailer, or maybe move the failure point to a different spot if not done correctly. I have not done our Scamp due to not traveling far from home and having good pavement where we go. It's a 2003 with low miles.
Russ

Your Scamp is made from a stronger tubing than early trailers so I doubt you have anything to be concerned about. I have seen several broken frames over time on several makes of trailer but the problem is rare , even on older intrinsically weaker frames. My 2004 Scamp13D runs a higher than required tongue weight and has much higher than average towed miles on it with no sign of any frame issues.
Of course anything put together sooner or later falls apart.
There are many other issues which also deserve diligence and regular inspection before every trip, of course this is true of the TV as well...
(Yes... even if you drive a pacific rim icon!)
Another factor which in fairness should be addressed....
Everyone knows someone who seems to have a special talent which gives them the supernatural ability to destroy an anvil with a rubber mallet.

[redbarron55]

I think that the frame should have had a beam between the bent knees tying them together and reducing the flex along with reinforcement plates on the outsides.
Also gussets add a lot of strength with little extra weight.


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[floyd]

Originally Posted by redbarron55

I think that the frame should have had a beam between the bent knees tying them together and reducing the flex along with reinforcement plates on the outsides.
Also gussets add a lot of strength with little extra weight.


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Have you done that yet?

[redbarron55]

When I rebuilt my Scamp 16 I reentered the front to extend the frame bad I did add the cross brace and reinforcements.
I was there due to cracked frame members on my 1986 Scamp.
The new front was made from heavy gauge steel tubing with a lots of modifications to add strength and stiffness.
Some weight as well.
Of course the new front bath etc did not save any weight either.


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[Bruce Thomas]

Originally Posted by Jon in AZ

I hardly think a lightweight frame that fails after 27 years of use, environmental exposure, and, likely, neglect constitutes reckless endangerment of anyone's safety or investment. Regular inspection, maintenance, and, if indicated, repair of a trailer frame is part of prudent ownership of an older trailer.

In any case, reinforcing a Scamp frame is no more trouble than the fiberglass work required to fit a new taillight unit into a U-Haul. And any competent welder can do it.

you keep thinking a frame repair isn't tougher than a tail light conversion that doesn't need to be done ..they could be put anywhere...frames are critical. Most of these people don't weld and hafta hire that out.

[Timber Wolf]

Just to add something to the discussion for archival purposes. IMHO, if you are changing the axle on an older Scamp and have a Welder involved anyway, go ahead and at least add a strip of 3/16" or 1/4" by 1 1/2" to the bottom of the front frame sections. It is cheap insurance and will probably take care of things for the life of the trailer (if you do it before it breaks). Again, IMHO. I am not an Engineer and did not stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night. Just an old Farm Boy type Welder/Fabricator that has been to the Rodeo a time or twelve.

[Bruce Thomas]

That'll help for sure. When I look at some of these frames they remind me of those folding bed frames. In their defense, some last many years. Scamps seem to be hit or miss with it.

[honda03842]

In our case I'm sure some of the life issues relate to travel amounts and roads driven. Our frame failed on the road to Harbour Breton in NL. Ginny called it the road from he'll. 260 miles of pothole filled road (not filled potholes) with a 25 year old trailer.

I agree that it could have been stronger design. I'm very happy with our Scamp. I wish I had thought ahead a little. For non weekend campers, for people who drive really rough roads, we may need a little pre-stiffening of the frame.

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[ruscal]

Norm,
You and Ginny are like a mobile testing laboratory! You can put a lifetime of use on a trailer in just a few seasons. Observation of how your frame failed is really valuable to the designers of these products. Scamp should be giving you new product to put to test. I formerly designed mountain bikes which we developed from the ground up. We employed roughly 20 gung ho racer types to use the bicycles in any way they desired. They were not payed, but given equipment. We attended many races, events, and recreational rides. I would periodically interview the individual riders to get feedback on handling traits and durability issues. I kept a file on each design, and dealt with improvements and reworks of the designs due to failures or ill handling. The failures provided very valuable feedback. You could examine the failure of a joint using magnification to see the tearing direction of the metal and design a logical reinforcement to add strength. Often that logical reinforcement would shorten the life of the frame not strengthen it due to a misunderstanding of how to apply strength. We kept trying until we got the result we wanted. It was a real eye opener learning how to use the materials in the best way. Simply adding more metal does not always have a positive effect. What I know about fabricating metal I learned in this way, not in a classroom. No finite stress analysis or engineering training background, so don't believe anything I have to say. I started welding when 15 yrs old building everything I could. I just ate it up. Go karts, bikes, trailers, hot rods, tools and fixtures, repairing all sorts of construction equipment, structural steel, architectural, off road vehicles, etc. The function of all those projects could be improved upon at a later date due to all learned along the way. I'm 70 now and still learning new things every day. I just can't remember what I learned yesterday. We learn by our mistakes and shortcomings. Scamp improved their frame somewhere along the line, and they may feel it is pretty well sorted out for the normal customer. They hadn't met Norm yet, Nor had they seen Ginny's "Road From Hell". Ha ha.

[floyd]

Originally Posted by ruscal

Norm,
Scamp improved their frame somewhere along the line, and they may feel it is pretty well sorted out for the normal customer. They hadn't met Norm yet, Nor had they seen Ginny's "Road From Hell". Ha ha.

Notice that Norm and Ginny's trailer is over 25 years old.

[honda03842]

Originally Posted by floyd

Notice that Norm and Ginny's trailer is over 25 years old.

Floyd, I rarely if ever complain about our Scamp. It's been a great rig for our travels. A rig is a little like a marriage, no one or nothing is perfect. It's always what you do with what you have, it's what being happy is all about.

Of course a 25 year old any thing has warts, part of the reason I love her. Even with warts she takes me every where I want to go. I read of people complaining about the 'Rat Furs' , (Marine Fabric, it's a crime we allow people to speak negatively of the Scamp's inside surface). Our marine fabric is 25 years old, been more places than most people can claim and still looks great.

It's true, newer rigs may look sharper, more modern,.... but this one has taken us everywhere. I accept it's little failings, fix them and keep traveling.

When we think of cozy, of a comfortable safe place, it's our Scamp.

Yes Floyd 25, years old and I sit on a little bay in NL this morning, hand slicing Newfie bread with a monster iceberg sitting on our immediate shore. (Go to NL Caravan to see the latest pictures.)

[floyd]

Originally Posted by honda03842

Floyd, I rarely if ever complain about our Scamp. It's been a great rig for our travels. A rig is a little like a marriage, no one or nothing is perfect. It's always what you do with what you have, it's what being happy is all about.

Of course a 25 year old any thing has warts, part of the reason I love her. Even with warts she takes me every where I want to go. I read of people complaining about the 'Rat Furs' , (Marine Fabric, it's a crime we allow people to speak negatively of the Scamp's inside surface). Our marine fabric is 25 years old, been more places than most people can claim and still looks great.

It's true, newer rigs may look sharper, more modern,.... but this one has taken us everywhere. I accept it's little failings, fix them and keep traveling.

When we think of cozy, of a comfortable safe place, it's our Scamp.

Yes Floyd 25, years old and I sit on a little bay in NL this morning, hand slicing Newfie bread with a monster iceberg sitting on our immediate shore. (Go to NL Caravan to see the latest pictures.)

My purpose in mentioning the age of your trailer was in response to ruscal's comment about the frame improvement. I was only suggesting that your trailer may predate that change.
As you know I have had both old and new fiberglass trailers and loved them all.

My present trailer was bought new in 2004 and is 12 years old.
If God should see fit that I remain on this earth long enough, I will surely be using it long after it is 25. Warts and all!
It is the time and experience which brings fondness and the realization of its true value.
No slight intended... to the contrary in fact!

BTW... It is a little like a marriage as you say.
This Sunday, Debbie and I will celebrate 45 years of wedded bliss.
She, starting out perfect and beautiful, has only improved every day.
As for me? Well... let's just say its what she must do with what she has!
We're still happy and blessed.

[redbarron55]

My old Scamp is mostly useful as an indicator for what to look for as problems in newer trailers at 31 years.
The problem areas are the left side at the bend and where the under door sideways tube attaches in front of the doorway.
The left cracks because of the flexibility from the right door area.
The cracking where the under doorway tubes attach is very hard to see with the floor over it.
The thicker tubes in the later trailers will hold up better, but I think th r you will eventually Crack with long usage.
Just check regularly or go ahead and reinforce if you have welding done on something else.
Make sure you have the plates tapered to keep from installing new stress risers to replace the old ones!

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[floyd]

Originally Posted by redbarron55

My old Scamp is mostly useful as an indicator for what to look for as problems in newer trailers at 31 years.
The problem areas are the left side at the bend and where the under door sideways tube attaches in front of the doorway.
The left cracks because of the flexibility from the right door area.
The cracking where the under doorway tubes attach is very hard to see with the floor over it.
The thicker tubes in the later trailers will hold up better, but I think th r you will eventually Crack with long usage.
Just check regularly or go ahead and reinforce if you have welding done on something else.
Make sure you have the plates tapered to keep from installing new stress risers to replace the old ones!

Sent from my SCH-I605 using Fiberglass RV mobile app

I made it a habit to buy old fiberglass trailers for years, many if not most of them were Scamps approaching or surpassing the 30 year mark.
Not one prospect had a cracked or repaired frame. That is not to say that I haven't seen broken tongues and cracked frames...
I have, on several makes, including Scamp, but I certainly don't expect my frame to fail enough to warrant any prophylactic reinforcement, which would cost me little more than the electricity and a few hours of my time. In fact I welded on an impact skid device to protect the front plumbing. It has struck the pavement more than once with the frame absorbing the impact.
Inspection ? Of course, along with all the other points. It is much easier to fix anything while in the shop, pretrip, than on the shoulder of some lonely road at night, or worse on a busy interstate highway at rush hour!

[Markz]

Originally Posted by honda03842

The bend is a weak point in the frame. It should have been reinforced when built. Both sides will need to be reinforced. I would reinforce the frame all the way to Scamp's reinforcement (where the frame comes out from under the trailer). We added fishtales to the front side of Scamp's reinforcement piece as well.

Our reinforcement extends back from the front of Scamp's reinforcement to the point where the tubing doubles up.

All work was done from under the trailer.

Do you have any pictures to share? I am in the process of working on my frame and welcome your ideas on how to make it stronger.



Thanks.
Mark

[Raz]

Norm's frame thread. Before and after pictures and lots of analysis


https://www.fiberglassrv.com/forums/...ure-62700.html

[Markz]

Thank you!