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Old 05-09-2019, 03:24 PM   #21
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Name: Jann
Trailer: Casita
Colorado
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[QUOTE=Rzrbrn;741465]I rec'd my EMS unit from Amazon. I found a place to mount it but this spot requires adding about 4 to 6 feet of additional 10 gauge wire. Please bear with me, I am not electrically knowledgeable.

There is almost no slack in the power cord which is 10/2. The BF company clarified and said the power cord is called 10/2 but is really 3 wires of 10 gauge wrapped in orange colored plastic. At any rate it does indeed have 3 wires. Phew, who knew...

So my plan now is to cut the power cord, use wing nuts to spice in 2' to 3' of 10 gauge wire wire, the other end into the EMS box, wire the other 2' to 3' of 10 gauge wire into the outgoing EMS connectors, then wire the other end of the new wires back into the orange power cord, again using wing nuts.

So that is 6 wire nuts. Do I really have to use a junction box to house these wire nut connections? I have no room in the area where I have to cut the power cord and there is no slack in the power cord. This is where the junction box has to go, as far as I can determine at this time.

I suppose I might be able to squeeze in a junction box and screw it to the floor, but this area also houses a number of water lines and water line connectors.

Can't I just wire nut and then tape each, and not put in a junction box?

This has turned from a simple plug and play installation to a real... well...it's like having a white head pimple right on your butt...and the only place to sit is on a wooden church pew...

I am really thinking about packing the whole thing up and sending it back to get an external EMS unit.[/QUOTE
I would get the external unit and then you don't have to cut wires that could come back to bite you later. Also you wouldn't have to worry about the protector catching fire if it gets shorted out. We've been to 3-4 classes on fire safety at rallies and they showed protectors that shorted out. They can easily set a fire when mounted inside. We've used the external ones for years and they work great. We've had one go bad and just bought a new one to plug in. Simple, easy, safe. Make sure you get the 30 amp or 50 amp depending on whatever your set up is. Most trailers are 30 amp. Only the bigger motorhomes or 5th wheels are 50 amp.
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Old 05-09-2019, 03:25 PM   #22
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Name: Henry
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Thanks Jann
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Old 05-15-2019, 10:27 AM   #23
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Name: David
Trailer: Casita
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I said in a previous post on this same subject that I would never put a hardwired surge protector in a closed space in any R/V. The reason I said that is that I have had nearby and direct lightning hits on two separate occasions. The damage was extensive and costly in both cases. In both cases I had surge protectors installed to protect sensitive equipment. In both case the surge protectors were destroyed beyond repair. In both cases I had damage to other less sensitive equipment (air conditioners. power tools, etc) that weren't protected. In both cases the surge protectors caught fire and burned causing serious damage to the surrounding areas. The damage would have been worse but people were available to put out the fires.

So go ahead and put that surge protector in your R/V right under the beds. But I strongly recommend you always sleep with a fire extinguisher under your pillow.
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Old 05-15-2019, 11:45 AM   #24
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I would NOT use wirenuts in a trailer at all!!!!

I would not splice a short piece of wire onto an existing piece at all, instead, I would replace the whole existing piece end to end, probably simplest to disconnect the wire from the exterior power inlet socket, assuming you have one...
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Old 05-15-2019, 11:47 AM   #25
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Name: Henry
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I sent back the internal hardwired surge protector and bought the portable Progressive Industries EMS-PT30X.

But these things are not waterproof, only water resistant. A number of owners have stated that some of these will have water infiltration in a heavy rain. I am talking about the expensive EMS series. So cover with a plastic bag or bucket. Maybe sit in on a stool if the pedestal is so low that this will be on the ground.

Thanks everyone for your input.
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Old 05-15-2019, 01:18 PM   #26
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Name: Bob
Trailer: Bigfoot
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protection for Bigfoot 25RQ

If it is of any use, I just, about 3 weeks ago, put one of these surge protectors in my 2007 25RQ. My input cable was screwed to the floor, and went into a 4x4 box, also on the floor, where it was spliced onto the use cable. I split the three wires by taking off the wire nuts, then placed the surge protector on the floor about 15 inches away, where there was a good place. Then the input cable from the protector was input to the 4" junction box already in the trailer, and wire nutted to the input cable end. The output from the protector was also run to the 4x4 box, and wire nutted to the original trailer output. Simple, easy, and safe. Bob
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Old 05-15-2019, 01:37 PM   #27
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Name: Jann
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Originally Posted by Casita Greg View Post
I don't know why so many are afraid of mounting their EMS unit inside their trailer. There is absolutely no difference to it hanging on an external power pedestal or hard-wired mounted inside the trailer. It's there to do what it is designed to do, wherever you put it. All this silly paranoia about having it blow up in the trailer is more fear and hype than fact. I've done electrical work for over 40 years, and I installed an internally mounted a 30 amp EMS unit inside my trailer. I am very happy with it, and it does everything I want it to.

The main reason I opted for a hard-wired one, which I mounted behind a locked hatch, is because those portable units often tend to "grow legs" and walk away when you aren't in your campsite. Behind the locked hatch it is out of sight and out of mind. People don't look at taking something they don't see to begin with.

And yes, to be installed to code anyway, you do need to mount an electrical junction box wherever wires are connected together, (i.e. no open exposed wire nuts/tape knots,) are allowed by the RVIA, NFPA Standard 1192, and the NEC. All non low-voltage wire connections, (read: 120 vac connections,) must be made in an approved enclosure, such as a switch or outlet receptacle box with blank cover for example.

If you don't have room for a J-box, then perhaps replacing the entire conductor with a one piece wire of sufficient length. Use the replaced section for those shorter additional runs so it isn't wasted.
You obviously have never had one get hit with lightning or a power surge that made it blow up. Yes they can and do sometimes blow up. We've been to several big rallies to classes where a man called Mac the Fire Guy out of Oregon did them. He had some surge protectors that had caught fire and had pictures of a large motorhome that was burned inside the box the protector was in from the protector getting hit. I personally was almost hit with a fireball that came out of our wall in our house when lightning hit the electric and blew up a small surge protector on our wall behind our fridge. The fridge survived but the protector was blown into pieces when the fireball came out and through our room. It also burned our wall and fried our ADT panel since it wasn't on a surge protector. ADT is now on a surge protector as well as everything else in our house. So no there is no fear mongering in the fact that they can blow up.
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Old 05-15-2019, 01:40 PM   #28
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Stuff blows up when hit by lightening. Not sure what that has to do with surge protector.
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Old 05-15-2019, 01:46 PM   #29
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Name: Jann
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Stuff blows up when hit by lightening. Not sure what that has to do with surge protector.

The surge protector takes the hit and stops the electric from going into your electrical system. Once the surge protector is hit it is no good. That is the way they are designed to do. That is the whole purpose of a surge protector. If your trailer got a direct hit your trailer would be toast but if the power pole you are plugged into gets hit or a massive surge happens then the surge protector saves your trailer and electrical system. Usually the electric line is what is hit. We got hit one time with a small surge in a lightning storm and our converter was shorted out. We have used a surge protector since.
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Old 05-15-2019, 01:56 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by Jann Todd View Post
You obviously have never had one get hit with lightning or a power surge that made it blow up. Yes they can and do sometimes blow up. We've been to several big rallies to classes where a man called Mac the Fire Guy out of Oregon did them. He had some surge protectors that had caught fire and had pictures of a large motorhome that was burned inside the box the protector was in from the protector getting hit. I personally was almost hit with a fireball that came out of our wall in our house when lightning hit the electric and blew up a small surge protector on our wall behind our fridge. The fridge survived but the protector was blown into pieces when the fireball came out and through our room. It also burned our wall and fried our ADT panel since it wasn't on a surge protector. ADT is now on a surge protector as well as everything else in our house. So no there is no fear mongering in the fact that they can blow up.
I guess what you're saying is that you are afraid of mounting an EMS unit inside your trailer for fear of it blowing up. On the rarest of chances that you would ever encounter a direct hit from a lightning strike, I guess that the lightning strike wouldn't have any effect on your trailer's converter, which would be directly in the surge path, or would it? FWIW, all the RV/trailer converters I have ever seen are all mounted inside the trailer. I've seen more converters burn up, and not even from lightning, than I ever have EMS units or "surge protectors" as well, (which, BTW, are a totally different animal than an EMS unit.)
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Old 05-15-2019, 02:05 PM   #31
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Name: Jann
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Originally Posted by Casita Greg View Post
I guess what you're saying is that you are afraid of mounting an EMS unit inside your trailer for fear of it blowing up. On the rarest of chances that you would ever encounter a direct hit from a lightning strike, I guess that the lightning strike wouldn't have any effect on your trailer's converter, which would be directly in the surge path, or would it? FWIW, all the RV/trailer converters I have ever seen are all mounted inside the trailer. I've seen more converters burn up, and not even from lightning, than I ever have EMS units or "surge protectors" as well, (which, BTW, are a totally different animal than an EMS unit.)
Usually you don't get a direct hit from a lightning strike. It usually hits the ground or surges in the electric line at the post and that is where the protector needs to be. In the case of a surge protector blowing up it is not safe to be in the RV. No the converter should not be damaged if you have a protector since it blows and stops the surge instantly. I just call them all surge protectors. We have one that will shut down in a brown out, surge, etc. But if it takes a hard hit it most likely would be toast as it is suppose to be. I call it a surge protector but we have an EMS unit since it does more than handle surges. They both take care of surges but the EMS unit handles open lines, to much or to little voltage, reverse polarity, etc.
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Old 05-17-2019, 07:59 AM   #32
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Soft/Flexible CORD like the shore cord on your trailer, intended for temporary use, is described as 10/3 because all three wires in it are insulated, Black/White/Green

CABLE such as Romex or similar, designed for permanent installation at both ends and secured along its routing, is described as 10/2 w/grd because it has two insulated wires, and a bare ground, which is not counted as a wire.

Cord and cable are two different things, designed for different uses.

Charles
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