|
|
10-14-2011, 06:06 PM
|
#101
|
Senior Member
Name: jim
Trailer: 2022 Escape19 pulled by 2014 Dodge Ram Hemi Sport
Pennsylvania
Posts: 6,710
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by honda03842
The first picture shows the thru hull fitting. This fitting is normally used on fiberglass boats. It is filled with Lexal.
The second picture is intended to show the thickness of the panel (really the thinness). That is my Scamp door key beside the edge of the panel. The edge can also be seen behind the thru hull fitting.
|
Norm,
Can you give us some more detail on the thru hull fitting, source and cost and how it works, thanks
|
|
|
10-14-2011, 06:47 PM
|
#102
|
Senior Member
Name: Norm and Ginny
Trailer: Scamp 16
Florida
Posts: 7,517
|
Thru hull fitting
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpaharley2008
Norm,
Can you give us some more detail on the thru hull fitting, source and cost and how it works, thanks
|
I have a second one and will take some pictures of it in the morning and get the manufacturer's name and post them on the site.
I bought one from West Marine that I didn't like and got a bag of different ones from a nephew who owned a marine electronics company.
It is very low profile, I'd say a 1/4 inch thick and about an 1.75 inches in diameter. The thru hole into the hull is 1 inch in diameter. It was designed for two coax cables, 180 degrees apart.
It is white plastic. I sprayed it with white gloss to protect it from the Sun.
The three screws are stainless and came with it. I feeled the space under the cap with Lexel, a non silicone caulking compound.
I will say we've had tons of rain and no leaks.
__________________
Norm and Ginny
2014 Honda Odyssey
1991 Scamp 16
|
|
|
10-15-2011, 06:58 AM
|
#103
|
Senior Member
Name: Norm and Ginny
Trailer: Scamp 16
Florida
Posts: 7,517
|
Thru hull fitting Information
The fitting is By Glomex, RA 140. You can see the cutout where the wires enter the fitting. I have four wires going into the single opening. At 180 degrees from the open position is a cutout, by design, that can be opened for additional wires or coax.
It's a British Company with an American Distributor. I think it's about $10. The fitting does come with three stainless steel screws.
Glomex - The best in Marine Antennas - GAMMA PRODOTTI
The adhesive I used is by Lexel, I used the clear type in a handy plastic tube. I also use it to replace rivet caps. Note it will not stick to silicon based products.
Lexel® - The superior alternative to silicone.
Hope this helps
__________________
Norm and Ginny
2014 Honda Odyssey
1991 Scamp 16
|
|
|
10-15-2011, 01:47 PM
|
#104
|
Senior Member
Name: Norm and Ginny
Trailer: Scamp 16
Florida
Posts: 7,517
|
PWM Solar Controller
I installed the PWM Solar Controller that I owned and bought a MPPT-15 Controller that I should have in a week. They are virtually identical in size so it will be easy to swap them out. With my new Watt meter I should be able to switch between the two and see the difference in power delivered to the battery between a standard Pulse Width Modulator (PWM) controller and the newer Maximum Power Point controller (MPPT).
I mounted it on top of our new over the couch closet, now loaded with a dozen of our sweaters and pullovers and a couple of dress outfits (I'm ready to go).
The controllers are very easy to install. From left to right on the controller: two wires from the solar panel(s) and two wires to the battery.
There are two pictures. The first shows the PWM controller. Note the first two light monitors the Solar Panel and the second monitors the battery. In the picture they are both green but actually the second one is blinking indicating the battery is fully charged. If the second light is not blinking but green, the battery is charging. If the second light is yellow, the battery is low.
The second picture shows the whole closet. Just below the left hand corner of the closet I installed a cigarette lighter outlet to allow us to power a small inverter or our small compressor.
__________________
Norm and Ginny
2014 Honda Odyssey
1991 Scamp 16
|
|
|
11-09-2011, 01:42 PM
|
#105
|
Senior Member
Name: Norm and Ginny
Trailer: Scamp 16
Florida
Posts: 7,517
|
MPPT Solar Controller Test
I initially installed the PWM Solar Controller that I already owned and recently replaced it with a MPPT Solar Controller. From a far they both seem to do the job. The MPPT Controller was $25 or so.
I did notice that the MPPT Controller, while charging the battery, caused the LED lamps to brighten and dim as it pulsed the current. Really not too much of an issue because we're unlikely to be running the lights during the time that the controller's operational.
As well I received the watt meter to compare the operation of the two controllers. I choose a clear day and put the watt meter in the controller's output to the battery. I was looking to see if the current increased to the battery with the MPPT Solar controller. Maximum battery current was about 1.8 amps with the MPPT Controller and 1.3 amps with the PWM Controller. This was a rather significant difference.
The watt meter has the ability to store peak current during any time period. Of course some of the difference in peak current might be due to timing and lighting conditions. However it seemed to me that in watching current flow the MPPT Controller always produced higher readings.
To make sure the controllers were working at high capacity during the test I was drawing about 4 amps from the battery. I had one incandescent and 8 LEDs bulbs on. I hope to do a more thorough test when I get to a more southern climate and have a little more time. We leave next Wednesday.
As well the Scotch High Bond Exterior tape I used to hold the panels down seems to be working. First, we had 3 inches of wet snow the other day with no ill effects. Second, every day water condenses on the Scamps roof, frosting it with a thin layer of ice each night. It takes about half a day for it to evaporate. Again no ill effects. Third, The tape, because the panel is fastened to a curve surface, is continually under stress. Again there appears to be no ill effects, no signs of lifting or separating.
I have only driven the trailer a short distance since installation so I can not see that the panels will not be sucked off the roof at a later date but so far so good.
__________________
Norm and Ginny
2014 Honda Odyssey
1991 Scamp 16
|
|
|
11-09-2011, 02:10 PM
|
#106
|
Senior Member
Trailer: Eggcamper
Posts: 138
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by honda03842
The fitting is By Glomex, RA 140. You can see the cutout where the wires enter the fitting. I have four wires going into the single opening. At 180 degrees from the open position is a cutout, by design, that can be opened for additional wires or coax.
It's a British Company with an American Distributor. I think it's about $10. The fitting does come with three stainless steel screws.
Glomex - The best in Marine Antennas - GAMMA PRODOTTI
The adhesive I used is by Lexel, I used the clear type in a handy plastic tube. I also use it to replace rivet caps. Note it will not stick to silicon based products.
Lexel® - The superior alternative to silicone.
Hope this helps
|
Thanks Norm -
I like the looks of both of these products - I bookmarked for later reference - I still have a solar install ahead of me on our new RV.
I also like your new controller - why not get maximum charge from X amount of sunlight ;-)
Bill
__________________
'Do not go where the path may lead, go instead where there is no path and leave a trail.' - - Ralph W Emerson
|
|
|
11-09-2011, 08:11 PM
|
#107
|
Senior Member
Trailer: 2008 21 ft Bigfoot Rear Bed
Posts: 629
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by honda03842
I initially installed the PWM Solar Controller that I already owned and recently replaced it with a MPPT Solar Controller. From a far they both seem to do the job. The MPPT Controller was $25 or so.
I did notice that the MPPT Controller, while charging the battery, caused the LED lamps to brighten and dim as it pulsed the current. Really not too much of an issue because we're unlikely to be running the lights during the time that the controller's operational.
As well I received the watt meter to compare the operation of the two controllers. I choose a clear day and put the watt meter in the controller's output to the battery. I was looking to see if the current increased to the battery with the MPPT Solar controller. Maximum battery current was about 1.8 amps with the MPPT Controller and 1.3 amps with the PWM Controller. This was a rather significant difference.
The watt meter has the ability to store peak current during any time period. Of course some of the difference in peak current might be due to timing and lighting conditions. However it seemed to me that in watching current flow the MPPT Controller always produced higher readings.
To make sure the controllers were working at high capacity during the test I was drawing about 4 amps from the battery. I had one incandescent and 8 LEDs bulbs on. I hope to do a more thorough test when I get to a more southern climate and have a little more time. We leave next Wednesday.
As well the Scotch High Bond Exterior tape I used to hold the panels down seems to be working. First, we had 3 inches of wet snow the other day with no ill effects. Second, every day water condenses on the Scamps roof, frosting it with a thin layer of ice each night. It takes about half a day for it to evaporate. Again no ill effects. Third, The tape, because the panel is fastened to a curve surface, is continually under stress. Again there appears to be no ill effects, no signs of lifting or separating.
I have only driven the trailer a short distance since installation so I can not see that the panels will not be sucked off the roof at a later date but so far so good.
|
Great looking installation, congratulation. MPPT is 38.5% better than PWM, that is really good. I followed Morningstar recommendation to install a fuse between the charge controller and the batteries and used the breaker with integrated manual switch. When the trailer is in storage I disconnect the charge controller from the batteries.
George.
|
|
|
11-10-2011, 07:42 AM
|
#108
|
Senior Member
Name: Norm and Ginny
Trailer: Scamp 16
Florida
Posts: 7,517
|
Fuse
Thanks George,
I did not install a fuse. I guess the purpose of the fuse is to prevent the battery from sending a current surge back thru the controller. Certainly no current surge from the controller could be a problem since the maximum from our panels is around 5 amps.
George, what size fuse did you use?
As to disconnecting for storage, we never have our trailer in storage and that's a good thing. We keep our trailer powered at all times when we're home and never put it into storage. Though we do most of our traveling from September thru May, we also travel occasionaly during the summer.
Thanks for your thoughts
__________________
Norm and Ginny
2014 Honda Odyssey
1991 Scamp 16
|
|
|
11-10-2011, 11:58 AM
|
#109
|
Senior Member
Trailer: 2008 21 ft Bigfoot Rear Bed
Posts: 629
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by honda03842
Thanks George,
I did not install a fuse. I guess the purpose of the fuse is to prevent the battery from sending a current surge back thru the controller. Certainly no current surge from the controller could be a problem since the maximum from our panels is around 5 amps.
George, what size fuse did you use?
As to disconnecting for storage, we never have our trailer in storage and that's a good thing. We keep our trailer powered at all times when we're home and never put it into storage. Though we do most of our traveling from September thru May, we also travel occasionaly during the summer.
Thanks for your thoughts
|
Hi Norm,
The Morningstar manual called for 25A fuse. Rather high trigger amperage indicated that the breaker/fuse should most likely be protecting wiring in case of the controller meltdown. I couldn’t find a 25A surface mount switchable breaker and opted for a 40A one. My wiring is heavy enough to survive 40A short.
George.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00...00_i00_details
http://www.delcity.net/store/Switchable-Mid!Range-Circuit-Breaker-!-32-V/p_742604.a_1
|
|
|
11-18-2011, 08:26 AM
|
#110
|
Senior Member
Name: Norm and Ginny
Trailer: Scamp 16
Florida
Posts: 7,517
|
Solar Panel Test
This was our first drive with the Solar Panels taped to the roof. It only represents 1% of this year's trip. Both panels stayed firmly stuck to the roof.
We used Scotch Exterior High Bond Tape on all four edges of each panel. Neither temperature nor weather seemed to have any effect on the tape so far though we haven't seem particularly warm temperatures beyond the self generated temperatures of the panels.
Though I've already posted this picture I thought it was important to put in the Solar Install thread. It clearly shows how thin the solar panels are (two 40 watt panels).
__________________
Norm and Ginny
2014 Honda Odyssey
1991 Scamp 16
|
|
|
11-18-2011, 11:33 AM
|
#111
|
Senior Member
Name: David
Trailer: 16 foot Scamp
Arizona
Posts: 323
|
I love those thin panels Norm! That is definitely the way to go. My guess is that heat, rather than cold will be the biggest challenge for the tape. It should take flexing in stride. The stuff you used is pretty amazing. I've used it before. Is there any possibilty of riveting the corners of those panals? I'd feel better having some mechanical attachment and someday I'd like to duplicate what you have done. It's the cleanest solar I have seen.
David
|
|
|
11-18-2011, 12:36 PM
|
#112
|
Senior Member
Name: Norm and Ginny
Trailer: Scamp 16
Florida
Posts: 7,517
|
Solar Panel Mounting
I've been reluctant to put additional holes thru the roof. On our last trailer we mounted traditional framed solar panels that weighed about 30 pounds each. They both leaked severely around the mounting points. I think the mass of the panels kept reopening the mounting point seals. Obviously the new panels are a lot lighter and wouldn't move, still ....
By the time we do half the trip we should be certain if this will be a permanent soultion. I'll keep people tuned in to the results.
__________________
Norm and Ginny
2014 Honda Odyssey
1991 Scamp 16
|
|
|
11-18-2011, 01:51 PM
|
#113
|
Senior Member
Trailer: No Trailer Yet
Posts: 1,578
|
Appreciate all this information. On your Glomex RA 140, as you screwed it in from the top, is the only bite for the screws the exterior shell? Or did also mount something on the inside of the trailer like a piece of wood for the screw to bite into? Thanks.
|
|
|
11-18-2011, 06:47 PM
|
#114
|
Senior Member
Name: jim
Trailer: 2022 Escape19 pulled by 2014 Dodge Ram Hemi Sport
Pennsylvania
Posts: 6,710
|
Norm,
Did you remove the polish where you mounted? Your roof looks so shiny, I'm wondering if the wax/polish has any effects on the adhesiveness of the tape?
|
|
|
11-18-2011, 07:34 PM
|
#115
|
Senior Member
Name: Norm and Ginny
Trailer: Scamp 16
Florida
Posts: 7,517
|
Screws and Glomex
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken C
Appreciate all this information. On your Glomex RA 140, as you screwed it in from the top, is the only bite for the screws the exterior shell? Or did also mount something on the inside of the trailer like a piece of wood for the screw to bite into? Thanks.
|
Initially I was simply going to fill it with Lexal and weigh it down until it dried but in the end I filled it with Lexal and drilled three holes into the shell and added the stainless screws. I suspect the Lexal is holding it all together. I also incased the wires in spiral wrap and Lexaled it down in the center of the spiral wrap. No wood on the inside.
__________________
Norm and Ginny
2014 Honda Odyssey
1991 Scamp 16
|
|
|
11-18-2011, 07:40 PM
|
#116
|
Senior Member
Name: Norm and Ginny
Trailer: Scamp 16
Florida
Posts: 7,517
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpaharley2008
Norm,
Did you remove the polish where you mounted? Your roof looks so shiny, I'm wondering if the wax/polish has any effects on the adhesiveness of the tape?
|
Jim,
After the fact I worried about the Red Max 3 but couldn't get the panel up to do any thing about it. As a result I carry the rest of the tape with me.
__________________
Norm and Ginny
2014 Honda Odyssey
1991 Scamp 16
|
|
|
11-19-2011, 10:19 AM
|
#117
|
Junior Member
Name: Bruce
Trailer: Homebuilt
California
Posts: 7
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by honda03842
I initially installed the PWM Solar Controller that I already owned and recently replaced it with a MPPT Solar Controller. From a far they both seem to do the job. The MPPT Controller was $25 or so.
I did notice that the MPPT Controller, while charging the battery, caused the LED lamps to brighten and dim as it pulsed the current. Really not too much of an issue because we're unlikely to be running the lights during the time that the controller's operational.
As well I received the watt meter to compare the operation of the two controllers. I choose a clear day and put the watt meter in the controller's output to the battery. I was looking to see if the current increased to the battery with the MPPT Solar controller. Maximum battery current was about 1.8 amps with the MPPT Controller and 1.3 amps with the PWM Controller. This was a rather significant difference.
|
My guess is the flicker of the lights is from the method of MPPT operation they chose for the controller.
From Wikipedia:
" Constant voltage method Main article: Constant voltage method
This method makes use of the fact that the ratio of maximum power point voltage to the open circuit voltage is often close to a constant value, with 0.76 being a common estimate. One problem with this method arises from the fact that it requires momentarily setting the PV array current to 0 to measure the array's open circuit voltage. The array's operating voltage is then set to (for example) 76% of this measured value. But during the time the array is disconnected, the available energy is wasted. It has also been found that while 76% of the open circuit voltage is often a very good approximation, it does not always coincide with the maximum power point. [5] Thus this method may not give as much efficiency as others, especially if conditions are highly variable or the physical behavior of the cell deviates from expectations. Its main advantage is that it is relatively simple to implement and thus usually less expensive."
Does the watt meter track amp-hrs? It would be interesting to see which controller has a better solar harvest. Boy, I'd sure have to eat some crow if the $25 controller does indeed work reliably in true MPPT mode!
Bruce
|
|
|
11-19-2011, 12:49 PM
|
#118
|
Member
Name: Don
Trailer: 17.5 Bigfoot
Ontario
Posts: 94
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by honda03842
We used Scotch Exterior High Bond Tape on all four edges of each panel. Neither temperature nor weather seemed to have any effect on the tape so far though we haven't seem particularly warm temperatures beyond the self generated temperatures of the panels.
|
Norm....thanks for all the info on your Solar install. I'm close to ordering one of those 80W flexible solar panels. Being new to all this.....I haven't quite figured out if you place the Scotch Brand tape under the edge of the panel [therefore it's double sided tape] or over the edge of the panel onto the roof surface, making it adhesive on one side only.
|
|
|
11-19-2011, 02:13 PM
|
#119
|
Senior Member
Name: Norm and Ginny
Trailer: Scamp 16
Florida
Posts: 7,517
|
Amp Hpurs
Quote:
Originally Posted by bdosborn
My guess is the flicker of the lights is from the method of MPPT operation they chose for the controller.
From Wikipedia:
" Constant voltage method Main article: Constant voltage method
This method makes use of the fact that the ratio of maximum power point voltage to the open circuit voltage is often close to a constant value, with 0.76 being a common estimate. One problem with this method arises from the fact that it requires momentarily setting the PV array current to 0 to measure the array's open circuit voltage. The array's operating voltage is then set to (for example) 76% of this measured value. But during the time the array is disconnected, the available energy is wasted. It has also been found that while 76% of the open circuit voltage is often a very good approximation, it does not always coincide with the maximum power point. [5] Thus this method may not give as much efficiency as others, especially if conditions are highly variable or the physical behavior of the cell deviates from expectations. Its main advantage is that it is relatively simple to implement and thus usually less expensive."
Does the watt meter track amp-hrs? It would be interesting to see which controller has a better solar harvest. Boy, I'd sure have to eat some crow if the $25 controller does indeed work reliably in true MPPT mode!
Bruce
|
Our watt meter does track amp hours. Unfortunately it came shortly bfore we left NE however when I get to FL I will get some time and repeat the experiment measuring amp hours and post the resukts.
__________________
Norm and Ginny
2014 Honda Odyssey
1991 Scamp 16
|
|
|
11-19-2011, 02:16 PM
|
#120
|
Senior Member
Name: Norm and Ginny
Trailer: Scamp 16
Florida
Posts: 7,517
|
Double sided tape
Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Dunsmore
Norm....thanks for all the info on your Solar install. I'm close to ordering one of those 80W flexible solar panels. Being new to all this.....I haven't quite figured out if you place the Scotch Brand tape under the edge of the panel [therefore it's double sided tape] or over the edge of the panel onto the roof surface, making it adhesive on one side only.
|
The tape is double sided. I put a piece of blue painters tape on the roof to define where I wanted the edge of the panwl. I then put the panel upside down and put tape on four edges.
I then lined it up with the blue tape and layed it down so one edge lined up with the tape.
I actually bought two 40 watt panels instead of one 80 watt panel.
__________________
Norm and Ginny
2014 Honda Odyssey
1991 Scamp 16
|
|
|
|
|
Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
|
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
|
|
|
Similar Threads
|
Thread |
Thread Starter |
Forum |
Replies |
Last Post |
Window AC install
|
slbran |
Modifications, Alterations and Updates |
12 |
06-27-2011 06:25 PM |
A new way to install AC
|
Jacob S. |
Modifications, Alterations and Updates |
12 |
02-21-2010 08:51 AM |
What to install?
|
Gwenn |
Problem Solving | Owners Helping Owners |
4 |
08-23-2007 11:37 AM |
A/C install
|
Legacy Posts |
Modifications, Alterations and Updates |
8 |
02-04-2006 06:27 AM |
A/C install
|
Legacy Posts |
Care and Feeding of Molded Fiberglass Trailers |
8 |
12-15-2002 08:49 PM |
|
» Recent Discussions |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
» Upcoming Events |
No events scheduled in the next 465 days.
|
|