Questions about solar power - Page 9 - Fiberglass RV


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Old 03-12-2014, 10:51 AM   #113
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Raz, at about 2000mHz. If you're curious, there's a classic article written by a home-made solar advocate from 2000 that details how a desulphinator is built and how it operates.

http://www.alton-moore.net/graphics/desulfator.pdf
Good article. The authors circuit is a simple current pulse generator running just above the AM radio band. How he determined that was the resonant frequency of the battery isn't made clear. Unfortunate. With his circuit, desulfation appears to be a very slow process. I wonder how much faster the commecial units are. Thanks for the link, Raz
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Old 03-12-2014, 11:54 AM   #114
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"How he determined that was the resonant frequency of the battery isn't made clear."

Sigh, isn't that the truth. Worse (at least for me) is I keep finding that same 2000mHz figure, but can't find a definitive source showing how it is derived. Perhaps it was established by experimentation?

None of the commercial desulphinators work quickly, by the way. My guess is, if they worked quickly, they'd cause the battery to heat up.
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Old 03-12-2014, 02:23 PM   #115
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"How he determined that was the resonant frequency of the battery isn't made clear."

Sigh, isn't that the truth. Worse (at least for me) is I keep finding that same 2000mHz figure, but can't find a definitive source showing how it is derived. Perhaps it was established by experimentation?

None of the commercial desulphinators work quickly, by the way. My guess is, if they worked quickly, they'd cause the battery to heat up.
2 MHz. Not 2000 MHz. Two thousand MHz is microwaves i.e. Upper cell phone frequency I think. This gadget will produce harmonics all over the HF band. In fact you might need an FCC license to use it.

When I was an engineering student one of the most interesting things was that the same differential equations appear through out the disciplines. For example the equation for a spring and damper is the same for a series RLC circuit. Resonance is one solution of that equation. The battery resonance might be electrical or mechanical. I've added it to my Internet research list. . Raz
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Old 03-12-2014, 03:24 PM   #116
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50 hours into our dry camping test, the battery meter reports 80 ah consumed, 71% state of charge. Water tank a little more than half full. So far so good.

Note 80 ah would indicate we should have a state of charge of 64%. I believe the meter is right, it is taking into account the peukert exponent for the battery (1.24). Since we are drawing the battery at much less than the C20 rate, the effective capacity is greater.
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Old 03-12-2014, 03:45 PM   #117
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My PD 4045 has a similar function. I believe they increase the voltage to boil the electrolyte in an attempt to make it homogeneous, mimicking the mixing effect of a moving vehicle. I believe it is preventative and will not remove already existing crystals. Newer chargers are using high frequency pulsing to reverse sulphate crystals. If anyone knows the magnitude and frequency that is being used, I'd love to know. Raz
I bought a PulseTech 12v battery maintainer, it's spec's are as follows:

Desulfating Pulse Peak Amplitude: 2 Amps
Desulfating Pulse Frequency: 18kHz to 37kHz
Pulse Rate Time: 20mS at 2 second intervals

I bought it out of interest. The company seems pretty confident it works however I'm always skeptical. I haven't used it yet as I maintain my 6v batteries with a 6v BatteryTender in the winter months.
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Old 03-12-2014, 04:53 PM   #118
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I bought a PulseTech 12v battery maintainer, it's spec's are as follows:

Desulfating Pulse Peak Amplitude: 2 Amps
Desulfating Pulse Frequency: 18kHz to 37kHz
Pulse Rate Time: 20mS at 2 second intervals

I bought it out of interest. The company seems pretty confident it works however I'm always skeptical. I haven't used it yet as I maintain my 6v batteries with a 6v BatteryTender in the winter months.
That's two orders of magnitude lower in frequency. Ultrasonic. That's what I was guessing i.e. Ultrasonic cleaners but the resonance idea has me curious. I'm going to chew on it. If it's electrical resonance I think I can measure it. Raz
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Old 03-12-2014, 08:28 PM   #119
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"2 MHz. Not 2000 MHz."

Conversion error. My bad.
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Old 03-13-2014, 10:40 AM   #120
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50 hours into our dry camping test, the battery meter reports 80 ah consumed, 71% state of charge. Water tank a little more than half full. So far so good.

Note 80 ah would indicate we should have a state of charge of 64%. I believe the meter is right, it is taking into account the peukert exponent for the battery (1.24). Since we are drawing the battery at much less than the C20 rate, the effective capacity is greater.

A follow up to this after 68 hours, soc= 57%, 120 ah consumed. I found a discharge time calculator here http://planetcalc.com/2283/ that indicates the state of charge is being calculated as if the battery had a steady 2.8 amp drain (actual average consumption is 1.7 amps per hour). Anyway this calculator says my battery capacity at THIS 2.8a RATE is 305 amp hours - about 50% more than the C20 rate. How about that!

I've been checking the consumption every morning and evening and find it is steadily rising, from 1.1 ah/hour the first night to 2.0 ah/hour the third night. I believe this is due to ice buildup on the evaporator coils. It has been six days since it was last defrosted and it was pretty frosty. I just defrosted it again and will know by this evening if the power consumption has dropped back to the previous level.
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Old 03-13-2014, 12:00 PM   #121
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I've been checking the consumption every morning and evening and find it is steadily rising, from 1.1 ah/hour the first night to 2.0 ah/hour the third night. I believe this is due to ice buildup on the evaporator coils. It has been six days since it was last defrosted and it was pretty frosty. I just defrosted it again and will know by this evening if the power consumption has dropped back to the previous level.
Build up of ice around the freezer compartment on my old fridge has a negative impact on its ability to perform well also. One of the side benefits of running without the fridge plugged in after dry camping for a number of days is it gives an opportunity for the frost to recede.
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Old 03-13-2014, 12:24 PM   #122
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I believe this is due to ice buildup on the evaporator coils.
Why do you suppose there is so much ice build up so quickly? Do you think it needs more ventilation?
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Old 03-13-2014, 12:42 PM   #123
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This raises the possibility of putting solar panels on awnings:
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Old 03-13-2014, 12:49 PM   #124
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Why do you suppose there is so much ice build up so quickly? Do you think it needs more ventilation?

It was the ice. Second hour after defrost consumption is back to 1.4 amps per hour. It used 2.0 amps per hr last night.

Don't know why it built up so fast. We are in Fl where it is always somewhat humid. Yesterday was very humid with a few periods of rain.

There is no ventilation inside. Are you suggesting a little fan might help?
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Old 03-13-2014, 12:53 PM   #125
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This raises the possibility of putting solar panels on awnings:

Those look like the panel I bought. I thought about the awning but the support struts aren't that stable, particularly in the wind.

With a strong awning the panel could be held on with Velcro. It's only supposed to weigh 3 lbs.
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Old 03-13-2014, 01:06 PM   #126
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The panels I'm looking at will self-adhere to the roof of the Snoozy. Those were on the canopy of a sailboat - 100W semi-flexible monocrystalline solar panels.

Carol says she has frost problems on her fridge, and since hers is (at least) dual, it has to be vented, so I'm not sure it is the ventilation. Maybe a seal isn't sealing properly? Just going over the possibilities. Trying to eliminate problems before my eventual build:-)
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