Sawdust Toilet - Page 2 - Fiberglass RV


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Old 08-22-2015, 07:58 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by Sid View Post
A simple google search asking " can I place human waste in the trash" comes up with a resounding NO in Minnesota! The exception is baby diapers but other that if it is not explicitly illegal in your district it is viewed as irresponsible. Sawdust covers fecal material does not seem to meet the criteria of "treated waste". Rainwater runoff is a huge concern. I don't doubt while the garbage bag is in your possession it will not get punctured or ripped but you have no control over what happens once you toss it in the campground garbage can.
Please don't kill the messenger, do your own search.
Sid
Many of the public campgrounds in our area no longer supply trash bins. IE If you bring it in ,you haul it out. If the OP is willing to haul his waste home in his vehicle and dispose of it in the proscribed manner, I see no issue. Not my cup of tea but to each their own.
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Old 08-22-2015, 08:12 PM   #16
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Still looking for answers... if it's OK (or not OK) to dispose of doggie pooh-bags and where, and how is human waste different from kitty waste in kitty litter?

In the meantime, in looking for answers, I found this article about new technology (too expensive for Rv's but very interesting new methods)

This Is What A Toilet Looks Like When Bill Gates Is Involved | Co.Exist | ideas + impact

LP (still researching)
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Old 08-22-2015, 09:47 PM   #17
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OK, maybe I *am* OCD when it comes to research...

WARNING. This post may contain Too Much Information for some readers.

This topic interests me, because I researched it up and down several years ago. I was alarmed to read negative comments about disposal.

So, I went looking for LEGAL information about disposal. So far, I've found very little, except some references to state and national park rules that dry campers haul their stuff back out. But where/how to dispose? That's a bit more murky.

First of all, I found a few articles of interest.

This Is What A Toilet Looks Like When Bill Gates Is Involved | Co.Exist | ideas + impact

https://www.trails.com/how_838_homem...ng-toilet.html

Then some details on hardware. Not a disposal solution, but I like the outdoor structure they built... (for very remote campsites)


Just so you all know how thorough I can be, I read ALL 25 PAGES of user reviews on the "Double Doodie Toilet."

Some users complained of leaking bags, but the overall approval was so high, I suspect those who complained were guilty of user error.

The upshot of this seems to be "double bagging." One bag with bio gel, then sealed inside another bag with sturdy ziplocks (the double doodie bag combines these two and the gel), which is then disposed in regular trash.

In the 25 pages I read, I didn't find any information about this disposal being inappropriate or illegal. If there is something else out there on the web about disposal, I'd really like to know about it!

Some users said this product was too expensive, and that regular kitchen bags work as well. I'm not certain about this, but might consider it safe IF a bio gel (or kitty litter) were combined with the waste and then this bag were sealed inside another bag. There was also mention of adult diaper material being used as an absorbent.

Why am I so interested in this topic? A comment from one of these reviewers kind of summed it up: "This was a life-saver on my camping trip! Very simplistic and there were no leaks! It was nice not having to brave the porta potties in the dark after being heavily used throughout the day by drunk people."

Full confession: After my heavy research several years ago, I purchased a "Luggable Loo." When it arrived, I was a bit non-plussed by the big *advertisement* on the outside of the bucket. (I could have just ordered the snap on lid/seat, but hadn't discovered that yet). Tried removing the big label, but it was on too solidly. So instead decided to use a 3 gallon sized dry laundry detergent bucket from Costco, which seemed a bit more stealth and unobtrusive.

Camping blogs I looked into back then recommended sawdust or kitty litter. I decided kitty litter would be more "trashable," since sawdust seems more geared for those who are actually composting the waste. But I didn't want to carry a bag of kitty litter, and I didn't want to have to scoop something.

So, an empty Clorox 2 bottle fit the bill. Washed out and dried, it was easy to fill it with good quality kitty litter via a funnel. The bottle has a good handle, is unobtrusive, and litter can simply be poured via the spout.

This little setup stayed in the back corner of the tent, and was kept closed and covered with a towel. It made a handy stool for putting on boots. There was no aroma whatsoever. The contents were changed out regularly, double-bagged, and disposed of.

I believe the disposal they received met the regulations put forth by park services and other regulators I've been able to discover so far.

I do like this Double Doodie bag concept, and will probably try it, while adding diaper biogel to the litter mixture.

With apologies for possible TMI,

LP
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Old 08-23-2015, 01:44 AM   #18
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No offense to the OP or to anyone who disagrees with him, but it makes little difference if human waste is disposed of (mixed with sawdust) in the trash or if it goes down the sewer. In the sawdust case, it goes to a landfill, and biodegrades. If it goes down the sewer, its treated at the water treatment plant where it's separated from the water. The biosolids (processed sludge) that are left are given to farms as fertilizer, buried in landfills or incinerated. So, sewer disposal means eventual use as fertilizer or as landfill mass, and sawdust toilet waste as landfill mass.

I'm not speaking to the legalities, since they can differ greatly from place to place - just the fact that they both can wind up at the same place.
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Old 08-23-2015, 06:57 AM   #19
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I thought this crappy discussion deserved some real answers, so I spent the better part of an hour researching. Like Ellpea, I found solid info hard to produce. Although there were tons of laws on how a landfill should be constructed and how a waste company should transport and dispose of waste, I could find no federal laws that govern small scale disposal. The Forest Service, National Parks, and BLM have various rules and regs, some sites advocating 'cat holes', others 'pack it in, pack it out'; but when it comes to disposal, most say to 'dispose of in an appropriate fashion' or something along those lines. Drop toilets are often mentioned as sites for disposing of waste accumulated during a camp trip, along with requests to not dispose of waste in plastic bags down a vault or drop toilet. RV dump stations are mentioned often, but no plastic bags there either. The only place I could find specific laws regarding disposal of human waste on small scales was at the county/municipality level, and there it varied from one place to another. In example, King County (Seattle, WA) says:

Dispose of human fecal waste in the public sanitary sewer or in an approved on-site sewage disposal system.
Disposable diapers, adult incontinence products, and other materials contaminated with feces may be thrown out in the regular garbage if they are placed in a sealed plastic bag.


It would appear that one could drop a bag full of sawdust and human waste in any dumpster there (under the 'other materials contaminated with feces' phrase) and be perfectly legal.

Here's an interesting bag product that is apparently legally disposable in regular garbage containers and approved by parks, etc: RESTOP - Portable & Disposable Human Waste Solutions - Our Products

I've given up on excreting any solid answer through research because I'm tired of the whole stinking subject.
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Old 08-23-2015, 07:28 AM   #20
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After all this research and posts I still can't see how the sawdust toilet has any place in the RV world, much less how it is even equal to, much less better than a conventional porta-potty. Nor have I seen any creditable references to support the claims being made about supposed safety and legality of this method of disposing of human waste.


If the real reason is that it is a "Cheaper way out", lets call it that, and not attempt to disguise what it basically a bad idea, as the newest answer to waste disposal.


If someone is that strapped for cash, I have a porta-potty on my spares shelf I would be willing to donate just to keep these bags of excrement out of the trash at a campground.
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Old 08-23-2015, 09:01 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ellpea in CA View Post
In the meantime, in looking for answers, I found this article about new technology (too expensive for Rv's but very interesting new methods)

This Is What A Toilet Looks Like When Bill Gates Is Involved | Co.Exist | ideas + impact
This video speaks for itself. When Bill Gates gets involved, the product becomes too complicated, has too many subsystems that will continuously break down, require constant maintenance and be a sporting challenge for hackers. Maybe when there is a version 10.1, the users will get used to it... That's not how to save the Third World. The sawdust has at least a chance.
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Old 08-23-2015, 09:06 AM   #22
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Sometimes it is better to ask for forgiveness rather than permission....
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Old 08-23-2015, 09:47 AM   #23
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I just can't bring myself to think of our camping styles as having regressed to "Third World" standards.


And before complaining about the complexity of the Bill Gates loo, look at the computer/laptop/tablet/smartphone in front of oneself as this is being read. They sorta makes the loo in question look like an Ox Cart of technology.
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Old 08-23-2015, 09:58 AM   #24
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I think this could be a viable alternative to a porta potti and as the efforts of those who did a little research show, the rules and regs are somewhat vague and confusing. As people who foster dogs for an animal welfare group, we've certainly thrown our share of doggie poop bags into trash cans and those bags sure aren't very puncture proof. I've seen my share of dirty diapers just tossed into dumpsters too. There's all kinds of pathogenic, toxic stuff leaking out of garbage dumpsters. I think the key to this is to make sure the waste is securely sealed with a double bag system. It's not a system I would personally like to use, but I can see that it would work. And this particular woman would not faint away at using it or seeing the contents. Just think of some of the Sani Cans or vault toilets you've probably used! At least with a sawdust/kitty litter toilet, you have control over its maintenance and use.
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Old 08-23-2015, 10:30 AM   #25
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I sometimes feel like I am asking the same question...


Porta-potties are self contained, use only a small amount of water, use no non-degradable consumables, such as plastic bags, do not require keeping a large bag of sawdust available for use, are designed to be disposed of in the existing waste disposal stream and have no risk of contaminating solid waste disposal containers.


Can anyone tell me, in the RV application world, how the sawdust toilet is even equal to, much less better than, the existing Porta-Potty systems in common use?


If Not, I rest my case.....
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Old 08-23-2015, 11:34 AM   #26
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Bob, I don't understand the need to attack the OP. He was simply sharing an idea he was excited about. You either like it, or you don't.

To me, the biggest picture here is that this forum is meant for sharing ideas and information. I don't believe constructing attacks against others are necessary or warranted, for in life there is plenty that is not our cup of tea. There are ways to share thoughts and feelings to the counter that encourage further helpful understanding, and if you will, human brotherhood.

I feel that the tone you've used here is hurtful and unnecessary. With responses such as these new forum members will shy away from getting the help they need, or in sharing their excitement with little mods or ideas they have. I have been helped here by countless kind people, who when I was going down the wrong path with an idea or repair, gently counseled me toward other options and sensible reasons why I might consider those.

I appreciate the OP's sharing and excitement, and thank him for doing so. Our purpose here is to do the greater good, and if something strikes you as not quite right, it might ought to be spoken with kindness.

Sincerely,
Wendy


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Old 08-23-2015, 12:30 PM   #27
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Great response Wendy
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Old 08-23-2015, 12:36 PM   #28
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The OP made statements that he indicated that his idea was a commonly used, safe, effective and legal method of waste disposal for RV'ers. I commented that, in 50 years of camping, that I had never heard of it, and asked for some supporting evidence for those claims. If there had been some presented, that would have been the end of the discussion.


When an individual makes the authoritarian blanket statement that this method of waste disposal is "Legal", one has to remember that they is addressing the residents of 50 states where disposal laws will differ considerable between and within each of those states. Already several have chimed in as to why it's not a good idea and is not allowed in some areas.


I am only being critical of the idea and the claims, not of the person making them.


But then again, no one has been able to answer my basic question of "why is this idea even as good as, much less better than, what is already in common use?".
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