Dawn Trailer - Fiberglass RV


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 05-12-2015, 06:34 PM   #1
Senior Member
 
honda03842's Avatar
 
Name: Norm and Ginny
Trailer: Scamp 16
Florida
Posts: 7,300
Dawn Trailer

This is a description of a trailer designed for fulltiming, a go anywhere trailer for two people to live 'home comfortable'.

A few people have asked me to post what I proposed to Scamp. My goal was to base the design on an extended Scamp 16 to minimize tooling for them. It was a compromise. In the posts that follow I will define what I consider to be the ideal trailer without the Scamp compromises.

I encourage suggestion and correction. It's the little paper mind game I play all the time, forever sketching trailer floor plans and ideas.

I thought of this trailer initially from the perspective of what we want, however the design also contains what I've hear others want.
__________________

__________________
Norm and Ginny

2014 Honda Odyssey
1991 Scamp 16
honda03842 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-12-2015, 06:41 PM   #2
Senior Member
 
David B.'s Avatar
 
Name: Dave & Paula Brown
Trailer: Lil Snoozy
Arizona
Posts: 1,722
Registry
Norm, was there supposed to be an attachment or something with your posting? You have me hooked and I am looking forward to hear/seeing your desired trailer.
Dave & Paula
__________________

__________________
David B. is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 05-12-2015, 06:56 PM   #3
Senior Member
 
honda03842's Avatar
 
Name: Norm and Ginny
Trailer: Scamp 16
Florida
Posts: 7,300
Hi Dave. I'm just going to post a little at a time. I don't really have any suitable pictures but will sketch it at some point. I'll probably do a couple of sections a day.
__________________
Norm and Ginny

2014 Honda Odyssey
1991 Scamp 16
honda03842 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-12-2015, 07:51 PM   #4
Senior Member
 
honda03842's Avatar
 
Name: Norm and Ginny
Trailer: Scamp 16
Florida
Posts: 7,300
Shape and Layout

When I originally proposed most of these ideas to Scamp I would have used the basic Scamp shape. If I were starting myself I would choose a new shape, yet aerodynamic, mostly for the marketing and efficiency purposes.

I admit to liking the rounded Scamp shape. Though there are some issues with the Bonair Oxygen, it shape pleasingly catches your eye. Some trailers catch your eye, like the Alto, but are not pleasing but only different. The Oxygen is different and attractive. Though the Oxygen is not an ideal shape for this solution it is not a bad first order approximation.

Dawn would be about Oxygen size with inside dimensions about 16 feet long, 7 feet wide and 6’4” high. Outside it would be about 19.5 feet.

There are three basic areas in the trailer, the front living area, the center kitchen/bathroom area and the rear configurable 'room'.

The living are makes up half the trailer. This area is the living, dining and sleeping area. I know it sounds like a lot. It’s used as a fixed configurable area. Push a button and the bed appears.

The bathroom/kitchen area are the trailer’s core. It is 5 feet long and centered over the axle. Everything of significant weight is within 2.5 feet of the axle, utensil drawer, black tank, canned food storage. grey tank, fresh water, hot water fridge, stove, shower, and toilet. My experience that low and axle centered weight adds to stability.

The configurable rear room can be set up for storage, as a desk, a work area or with bunks, small but flexible space. It could possibly be owner configurable.
__________________
Norm and Ginny

2014 Honda Odyssey
1991 Scamp 16
honda03842 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-13-2015, 06:43 AM   #5
Senior Member
 
honda03842's Avatar
 
Name: Norm and Ginny
Trailer: Scamp 16
Florida
Posts: 7,300
This was supposed to be the second post...

By home comfortable I mean a trailer thatís comfortable as your home a great bed, real shower and comfortable seating supported by adequate systems for dry camping in four season weather. Other than a little more cost, thereís no reason for the trailer not to be comfortable. Iím going to call the trailer Dawn for now.

When we travel we are usually out exploring the area during the day. In the evening weíre usually home and find the general seating long term to be marginally comfortable. Improving this is a focus. There will be comfortable seating for four adults in a two person loveseat and in two small easy chairs.

Dawn would have a walk around queen sized bed. By walk around I mean you can get out of bed on either side. As well itís mattress will be home like.

Though we are happy in our 44Ē bed and donít mind getting up for each other during the night, thatís not the case for many.

The bathroom will have a home style shower with standing headroom, independent from the toilet and sink, comfortable for an adult.

These Ďhome comfortableí additions are designed to improve the extended camping experience. Many of the little foibles of a small trailer are easy to live during short term trips but can become trying for some over time. For us I believe the most significant is lack of comfortable seating.

Another for some is lack of good organized storage. In a typical home there is usually plenty of storage space, though often not well used. In a trailer we typically have less stuff but not really good places to put it. In Dawn there will be plenty of well defined storage space.
__________________
Norm and Ginny

2014 Honda Odyssey
1991 Scamp 16
honda03842 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-13-2015, 08:45 AM   #6
Senior Member
 
Name: JD
Trailer: Scamp 16 Modified (BIGLY)
Florida
Posts: 1,045
I am working along similar lines with the old Scamp we are completely rebuilding. Of course we have less space to work within the confines of the 6.6' X 13' space.
one of the main issues for Connie (She Who Must Be Obeyed) is not crawling over each other in the middle of the night. Toward this end I am designing two bunks in the rear along each wall. If they are each 30" wide that leaves approximately 18" walkway in the middle.
This space is light, but storage underneath and over head.
I found that the Ikea Lonset foundation (30" 1/2 of the 60" queen set) is very comfortable. We tried the twin for our guest room and it sleeps wonderfully.

This is not available in the US, but I want to add this feature.

This is very much a work in progress. Here id the basic floor of the bath in the front center where the headroom is greater than the side.

To get a better idea here is a pictuer from the rear with the wall and kitchen cabinets kinda in place.

By the way the sink is an Ikea unit as well.
__________________
redbarron55 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-13-2015, 08:51 AM   #7
Senior Member
 
Name: Ken
Trailer: No Trailer Yet
US
Posts: 1,564
Nice work JD thanks for sharing your photos.
__________________
Ken C is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-13-2015, 09:48 AM   #8
Senior Member
 
honda03842's Avatar
 
Name: Norm and Ginny
Trailer: Scamp 16
Florida
Posts: 7,300
JD.

Certainly I believe there's room for Layout improvement within the Scamp shell. I considered twins but Ginny would be unhappy.

When I was looking at the Scamp Prime design, my approach was to have a manually pull out bed at the rear of the Scamp, not a Murphy bed but with the philosophy of a Murphy bed allowing the space to be a comfortable bed that could be rapidly set up with little effort, yet provide a comfortable sitting area when not sleeping. It was just possible.

My attention was to convert to the Scamp's side bathroom to a stand alone shower with the toilet moved forward to the front wall, eliminating the front couch. The balance of the couch was to be converted into a front kitchen, stove and sink. The shower would have been smaller than what I propose for the Dawn trailer but adequate though with stand up head room.

Moving the stove and sink forward in the Scamp Prime results in ample kitchen storage since the underneath counter cabinets are empty. This opens up the rear of the trailer for living space.

Another disadvantage of the Scamp is the shape of it's stepped roof line. Though the stepped roof line reduces frontal area and adds stiffening to the trailer, it reduces the space in overhead cabinets, another reason I like the general shape of the Oxygen.
__________________
Norm and Ginny

2014 Honda Odyssey
1991 Scamp 16
honda03842 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-13-2015, 10:36 AM   #9
Senior Member
 
Name: JD
Trailer: Scamp 16 Modified (BIGLY)
Florida
Posts: 1,045
I agree on the roof of the Scamp. That was the reason I moved the bath to the front center to get headroom for a 6' wife. She did not care for the side bath at all!
She suggested the twin bunks and for night access with out crawling over one another so it was non-negotiable.
Still a lot to work out in the details, but I am getting closer.
We plan to use the beds like recliners to eat and watch TV etc. A table will be made for the space in between. We don't plan to cook a lot and I have added a "closet" by the door for the refrigerator and microwave convection oven so we can brown, toast and microwave. (Connie is not big on this particular item, but time will tell.)
We are working with what we have in the Scamp. Fitting things in with no square corners and really straight lines is a challenge. Especially in fitting junctions with walls and cabinets etc. Have jigsaw, will travel reads the card of a man!
A problem I am dealing with is what to do with the space to the driver's side of the new bath. This "corner" would make a good space for something with the plumbing, but I need to make a curved (complex) door for access if I mount the Macerating pump there for the black/gray water drain system I am planning. Any ideas on how to do this? I think I can fabricate a door using the part of the side cut out and some creative fiberglassing.

JD
__________________
redbarron55 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-13-2015, 11:11 AM   #10
Senior Member
 
Carol H's Avatar
 
Name: Carol
Trailer: 22' Airstream Formerly 16' Scamp
British Columbia
Posts: 11,731
Registry
Quote:
Originally Posted by honda03842 View Post

Outside it would be about 19.5 feet.
Woooo! Norm never though I would hear you say you want a trailer of 19' + in length!

It seems to me the Escape 19' & 21' & Bigfoot 21' would appear to have most of what you are asking for with the exception of the walk around bed which is why Scamp did not respond as they know those two manufactures have a pretty strong market share in those sized fiberglass trailers.

The only walk around bed I have ever seen in a smallish fiberglass trailer is in the Bigfoot 25'. Suspect the reason for that is its tough to fit a walk around full sized bed in a trailer that is only 7' wide as you have proposed. I know Escape ended up having to add an extra 4" onto the width of the 19' (its 7' wide outside) in order to fit a bed into the 21' (7' 4") that had one side access even though they were not wanting to add extra width originally and the Bigfoot with clearance on both sides of the bed is even bigger at 8' wide.

Would love to see a sketch up of your proposed layout to see how you fit everything in.
Carol H is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-13-2015, 11:37 AM   #11
Senior Member
 
Glenn Baglo's Avatar
 
Name: Glenn ( second 'n' is silent )
Trailer: 2009 Escape 17B '08 RAV4 SPORT V6
British Columbia
Posts: 4,369
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carol H View Post
Would love to see a sketch up of your proposed layout to see how you fit everything in.
And, don't forget to include the wheel wells. Almost every attempt to redesign existing trailers that I've seen, forgets about wheel wells. Once you have those in the right place, you find that they impact on placement of appliances, bathroom etc.

And, there is weight and balance, from side to side and back to front.
__________________
What happens to the hole when the cheese is gone?
- Bertolt Brecht
Glenn Baglo is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 05-13-2015, 11:52 AM   #12
Senior Member
 
Carol H's Avatar
 
Name: Carol
Trailer: 22' Airstream Formerly 16' Scamp
British Columbia
Posts: 11,731
Registry
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glenn Baglo View Post
And, don't forget to include the wheel wells. Almost every attempt to redesign existing trailers that I've seen, forgets about wheel wells. Once you have those in the right place, you find that they impact on placement of appliances, bathroom etc.

And, there is weight and balance, from side to side and back to front.
Good point and if I am not mistaken it is why Escape ended caving in and building a 21' trailer rather than simple modifying the 19' to accommodate all the things their customers where asking for.
Carol H is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-13-2015, 12:07 PM   #13
Senior Member
 
honda03842's Avatar
 
Name: Norm and Ginny
Trailer: Scamp 16
Florida
Posts: 7,300
Carol,

I'm not familiar with the Big Foot line, though they are large enough or heavy enough to support a real usable interior. Not being critical of the Big Foot, but they are heavy trailers. My goal is to build a trailer that could be towed by a Honda CRV...just kidding... but lighter than a Casita 17. By the way Ginny would roll her eye for teasing you.

I'm not opposed to 19 or 21 foot trailers. Actually my proposal to Scamp fit within a slightly modified Scamp 16. It required that they add an integrated "bumper box' to the Scamp 1 effectively making it 18 feet long.

An Escape 19 or 21 to my knowledge both require some level of crawling out or crawling over, not my personal experience except for what I read on this site.

Both Escapes have wet showers, I prefer a larger less effort shower though for us we're happy with camp ground showers. We do meet many people, for reasons beyond me, will not use a campground shower. For us if the campground shower has wet and hot water we're happy using it and all but one have though there was one in Quebec where the shower was french beautiful but he water was brown...

Most trailers other than med. to large 5th wheels and big 'stick builts' do not have what I call comfortable seating. I personally like a real couch or real easy chairs. At night we're usually in the trailer for 3 hours a night reading or writing. There have been numerous people on the site that seek more comfortable seating.

The proposal is different in that it's small but contains multi-use space in front and back. My thought is that it's not a problem if it's quick and easy to convert. Dinner for four and the coffee table pops up into a table for four, by the way storage built into the bottom of the coffee table.

The back is designed to be multi-purpose, countered storage area, large work desk, private area, two substantial bunks, and a sewing area, pretty much the space can be configured to the owner's need.
__________________
Norm and Ginny

2014 Honda Odyssey
1991 Scamp 16
honda03842 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-13-2015, 12:19 PM   #14
Senior Member
 
honda03842's Avatar
 
Name: Norm and Ginny
Trailer: Scamp 16
Florida
Posts: 7,300
Weight distribution

Quote:
Originally Posted by Glenn Baglo View Post
And, don't forget to include the wheel wells. Almost every attempt to redesign existing trailers that I've seen, forgets about wheel wells. Once you have those in the right place, you find that they impact on placement of appliances, bathroom etc.

And, there is weight and balance, from side to side and back to front.
Glenn.

Usually the wheel wells are the first thing I sketch in after the shell.

I believe in weight low and weight over the axle. The trailer's core, including the fresh, grey, black and hot water tanks, fridge, can pantry are all within 2.5 feet of the axle.

We owned a trailer with this core configuration. It tracked beautifully.
__________________

__________________
Norm and Ginny

2014 Honda Odyssey
1991 Scamp 16
honda03842 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Where can I get an awning like Danny and Dawn's John Linck General Chat 16 03-19-2014 08:57 PM
What Dan and Dawn and this site did for us! johnsoba General Chat 12 05-18-2006 09:51 AM

» Upcoming Events
No events scheduled in
the next 465 days.
» Virginia Campgrounds

Reviews provided by


Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 05:02 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.