Old,Newer or New

[redbarron55]

Originally Posted by gordon2

And I think Scamps had lighter frames in eailer years (some on thins fourm know more about that). As for Bolers, Ian Giles said this:

...the initial frames built in 1968 & ‘69 used 1.5”x3” 0.083”/0.109” or 12/14 gauge “C” channel. From 1970 and onward a rectangular box section frame was used made from 1.5”x3”, 0.0625” or 16 gauge rectangular tube,...

So there are some changes over the years that can make a big difference and are helpful to know. There are also smaller changes but usually not so critical, such as recent changes Scamp has made to the choice of roof vent and screen door.

And I think it goes without saying that when looking at a used camper, the care and maintenance of it is much more important than the year it was built, unless its one of the critical things such as a frame that is subject to breaking.

I think the later frames were 11 gauge when I rebuilt my Scamp I used 10 gauge or about 1/8".

[Montana Brad]

Thank you for all the help.I just got off a 12 hour road trip to look at a trailer.When I get time I will dissect the answers but for now I can see that there is some valid information here that may be useful to me as well as others.

Brad (alias BO

[julmar]

Originally Posted by RogerDat

I think design and layout transition years might be more of a problem. Workers get used to doing assembly, positioning, or final fitting in a certain way and then things change and that might take some adjustment in how they do the job.

Brand new models or manufacturers just getting started might have some bugs to work out. Some ideas just didn't work very well. Scamp prop open windows were short lived and replaced with more expensive crank open windows for a reason. Some new amenities or arrangements may prove to be a hassle over time and get improved without the original design failing, just being sub optimal. Say a weak converter or one that has less protection for the battery.

I agree one is more likely to hear about years, model, or feature to avoid due to an issue than "best" years to buy. Simply because small molded FGRV's don't change as often as stick built or auto models. There are just not a lot of options for bed or kitchen location in a small camper.

Example before the fire at Scamp the height was lower and width was less so bed was shorter. After the fire new molds added a bit of height and width (bed length) so tall people might want to avoid models from before the year of the fire, and I suppose early in the first year after the change in size they might have been going through some growing pains with installing the interior pieces.

Excellent well thought out post.

[floyd]

Originally Posted by gordon2

I have heard some people suggest that Scamps were better built some years ago, at least in the attention to detail dept. If true, it could be because of demand. In the lean years perhaps they were not so rushed to get as many trailers out the door. But now demand is at a peak (low gas prices and low unemployment). Perhaps you could find a correlation between the amount of time one had to wait on a build (the backlog) and the quality. Or perhaps a correlation between GDP and quality... looking for the times when they really had to make a top notch product for it to sell. In that case I would look for a well cared for camper from 2009 But, its just a theory of mine.

Well... Scamp built a new factory in 2006, better lighting , more room , more capacity, better working conditions, etc. You have simply heard wrong, demand has always exceeded production capacity and build quality today is true to the build philosophy of constant improvement over radical change.


Scamp has had a program of constant improvement since inception.
Hallmarks being such things as the introduction of reflectix and ratfur in 1986.
Over the years there have been such things as the introduction of the Deluxe interior, toilets, showers, the increase in axle ratings, improved option choices, brakes,etc. The recent change in door gasket design and the new door with an RV latch are a couple of more examples..
Other improvements which passed without fanfare include such things as increased hull and frame thickness.
The above in in no way a comprehensive list, and unfortunately change has been gradual enough and needs vary enough, that picking a particular year or range of years as the best is simply impossible.


Still a new Scamp is a great choice with options to satisfy even the most discriminating buyer. The only obvious exception being that Scamp remains available only in three manageable sizes, so those who suffer from three-footitis, must look elsewhere after a couple of steps!

[floyd]

Originally Posted by RogerDat

I think design and layout transition years might be more of a problem. Workers get used to doing assembly, positioning, or final fitting in a certain way and then things change and that might take some adjustment in how they do the job.

Brand new models or manufacturers just getting started might have some bugs to work out. Some ideas just didn't work very well. Scamp prop open windows were short lived and replaced with more expensive crank open windows for a reason. Some new amenities or arrangements may prove to be a hassle over time and get improved without the original design failing, just being sub optimal. Say a weak converter or one that has less protection for the battery.

I agree one is more likely to hear about years, model, or feature to avoid due to an issue than "best" years to buy. Simply because small molded FGRV's don't change as often as stick built or auto models. There are just not a lot of options for bed or kitchen location in a small camper.

Example before the fire at Scamp the height was lower and width was less so bed was shorter. After the fire new molds added a bit of height and width (bed length) so tall people might want to avoid models from before the year of the fire, and I suppose early in the first year after the change in size they might have been going through some growing pains with installing the interior pieces.

Good comment, except there has been no change in width, and only the 13 has increased in interior height.
If you are over 6ft in height, you could use the extra 2-1/2" as the post fire 13 is 6'3" inside.(same as the 16) If you insist on a Standard interior,the wider bed stepped up to (54") to as an option in mid year 2008, which matches the width of the Deluxe.

[floyd]

Originally Posted by Borrego Dave

Scamp used to sell bare shells, might still. You could always go check out a Prevost for interior fit and finish ideas.

Also as kits...
A long time ago

pulled by a Galaxy far far away!

[Montana Brad]

This has turned into a quality forum. More than I ever expected when it started!It may even be good enough to archive for the future.Great knowledge has been expressed here!

[Uplander]

Quality concerns about RVs in general are very real. If you subscribe to the free weekly email newsletter. RVTravel.com. you will discover the magnitude of the quality problems currently plaguing the RV industry. It is the only place you will find the truth on this subject.....all other publications have been sanitized by the RVIA .....they paint a very rosy picture .....if a publication accepts advertising they never point out the shortcomings of their advertisers....never bite the hand that feeds you is their mantra.

Another problem is warranty service after the sale.....delays can take months. Where you buy a new unit is important...do your research.
Best of luck and Happy Camping in your retirement.

[Bill618]

We tug around a 1973 22 ft tandem Argosy. Do not go as much as I like to. A.C. unit does not work and I hate the heat and humidity in the mid west. Still in good usable shape. To me that is an OLD camper, Very old is a Canned ham from the 50's or 60"s.

Any thing used that you might buy, check the v tongue of the frame and the frame itself. Some were not very heavy and have rusted and or cracked and broke in half. Some have been welded. Watch for that in an older unit. Weak floors is another concern. We started camping in 1970 with parents in a puma popup. then a Jayco pop up Then they had a Trophy, Then They got to old to tow and spent the rest of their years as a seasonal and never towed it again.

Several construction types.

Fiberglass Casita, burro, Scamp, U haul Etc.
Stick and Tin. 40 plus brands
Newer composite units R pods. Livin lites Camplites.
Aluminum /steel framed walls composite Airstream

Several roof types as well. one piece aluminum, rubber tin etc.
Newer units no longer have a flat roof and shed water much better than their olders cousins do.

Floor plans etc. Depends on what you plan to do. Small toy boxes can haul a golf cart, Motor cycles, Electric mobility scooters, bikes etc. Can be pressed into moving services, swap meet trailers, storage units, Emergency prep, spare bedrooms for guests man caves or She sheds etc. When I decide to part with the old argosy that is what I plan to purchase in a composite toy box not larger than 24 feet long. probably and livin lite camplite Get too much bigger and difficult to park and more limits to camp site availability. If you plan to snow bird and park most of the time and live in it then another story. A much larger unit with tip outs and master bedroom like the big 5th wheels offer. Rent something if you are not sure, before you invest a lot of cash. Good luck Bill

[Civilguy]

Originally Posted by Montana Brad

This has turned into a quality forum. More than I ever expected when it started!It may even be good enough to archive for the future.Great knowledge has been expressed here!

Actually, Brad, this is a "thread".

The "forum" became quality the day I arrived on the scene, TYVM!

As regards trailer model years, Parkliner has retooled and built a new mold recently.

Escape has also went "generation 2" with slightly larger, boxier shells a few years back. The equipment has changed over the years with some initial teething problems on some items including windows, refrigerators, solar panel mounting, and some frame recalls. I was told they no longer offered the manual awning when we ordered; the electric awning has so far fulfilled my worst fears in that it collects water in the rain, and I believe that it can't be sloped to avoid this(*). They are changing the awning and window(?) options as of next January if I recall correctly.

(* on edit, the Dometic 9500 installation manual illustrates a method to increase the slope from a factory preset 5 degrees to up to 15 degrees. There are four possible angles from 5 to 15 degrees. The slope will then remain fixed at that angle unless you repeat the adjustment process.)

I think Scamp and Casita have been relatively static of late. I think Oliver's changes have also been relatively minor and incremental.

As regards the Airstream, they have a forum where they debate the changes implemented over the years. I have not observed any universal consensus.

One of my favorites from the aesthetic standpoint is a bit older; 1948 to be exact. Also, you might look into the Bowlus Road Chief if you'd really like something a bit more high-end.

[LyleB]

I have had my new Scamp 16 for two days now. So far the only "flaw" that I have found is that one of the cabinet roller latches needs to be tweaked when I get home. I'm still in MN, heading back to MI in an hour or so.

Generally, I find the fit and finish quite good so far. No rain yet, and have not used the water system do to freezing temps at night. I do like some of the new, unexpected touches, such as LED porch lights with inside switches, nice LED reading lights, inside controls for both the fridge and water heater, converter with integrated battery tender, very configureable fridge - even as far as removing the freezer compartment, and, finally, the close to top of the line MaxAir fan with remote and thermostate control.

Over all, completely happy thus far.

[thrifty bill]

Many companies have made small incremental improvements every few years, even though their models have not changed. A new Casita for example is much different than a 20 year old version in many, many ways.

Now anything built in northern Indiana, personally I am reluctant to buy new, as they have problems finding and keeping employees and quality has dropped IMHO. As someone who managed factories throughout my career, there is no substitute for an experienced, stable, workforce. While training is important, no training program can offset high turnover.

[steve dunham]

We have owned 3 different fiberglass trailers
( Scamp , Casita , SOB ) over the last 10 years
0ne thing we have discovered is that a higher price point does not automatically equate to higher quality .
Our Scamp was the lowest priced trailer we’ve owned but definitely not the lowest in build quality .
The build quality of our Casita was very good and any problems we have encountered have been minor .

[LyleB]

Well, I'm in Bessemer, MI (western UP), holed up for a pretty substantial snow storm. The roads were terrible, found a campground still open with electric hook-up and water available in the laundry building. The furnace works Well! My new Scamp is getting put through her paces, no problems. May have to get plowed out in the AM. Just glad to be off the roads at this point.

[Jon in AZ]

I'm guessing you're enjoying the extra 3' about now!

[MyronL]

Always on the lookout for the trailer unusual, be it fiberglass or sticky, so when I saw that new to me Palace Royal I had to do a double-take. What a beauty!

Speaking of double-takes...seen today in the WalMart parking lot in town. Had to take this picture of a vintage Avion. No idea how old or how long. Can you imagine trying to park this baby in (any) campground?