What Cars Do You Drive? - Page 6 - Fiberglass RV


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Old 09-28-2015, 02:39 PM   #71
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Trailer: 2015 Escape 19 "Past Tents" 2015 F150 Lariat Ecoboost Crew Cab
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What Cars Do You Drive?

Quote:
Originally Posted by rdickens View Post
Robert,

You mentioned a 9 mpg hit when towing.

Could I ask what your in-town, highway, and towing mpg numbers are and what your towing speed typically is?

For our 2014 Ford Escape 2.0L Ecoboost FWD, we are getting 32-34 on the highway,
about 23 mpg towing a Scamp13 at ~60 mph, and ~24-25 mpg in town.

I have considered an F-150 2.7L Ecoboost whenever we upgrade our other car.

Also, about how many miles do you have on your F-150 and how has your reliability been?

Just curious .... 😉

Ray


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There are a ton of variables Ray, not the least of which is the length, width and height of both the trailer and the tow, the drivetrain, wheelbase, axle ratio, as well as the terrain and average speed, so take these numbers for what they're worth:

Highway mpg = 26.1 mpg average
City mpg = 20.2 mpg average
Towing mpg = 16.2 mpg average

Currently 6800 miles on the truck, so no real impressions of durability, since it is so far flawless.



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Old 09-28-2015, 03:17 PM   #72
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Name: Sergey
Trailer: 2014 Scamp 16 layout 4
SW Florida
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One more variable.

Speed affects MPG a lot. Here are numbers showed by on board computer of 2013 F-150 5.0L 2WD (not towing), each leg about 10 miles:

55-60 MPH - 22 MPG
70 MPH - 19.5 MPG
45MPH - 25 MPG

Average MPG when towing 16' Scamp on 8K miles cross country drive at 60-65 MPH is about 16.5 MPG.
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Old 09-28-2015, 04:13 PM   #73
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Name: Ray
Trailer: 2017 Scamp 16 Deluxe
Missouri
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Thanks Robert & Sergey!

That is useful information!

At some point in the future, we might possibly consider a 16/17 foot trailer.

I understand that the less aerodynamic a trailer is, the bigger the part that
speed plays with reduced MPG. (That is one of the implications of those
speed versus horsepower charts for the Airstream trailers.)

I also know that the additional weight and slightly higher-off-the-ground
characteristics of some/all of the larger 16/17 FGRV trailers likely means
that our current 23 mpg towing fuel economy will take a significant hit.

For our current longer-distance and shorter-duration travel , we are
enjoying the economy of our current rig (Scamp13 + 2014 Ford Escape
2.0L FWD).

In the future, if our travel becomes shorter-distances and/or longer-durations,
we might succumb to the dreaded 3-feet-itis bug?

Thanks again!

Ray
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Old 09-28-2015, 04:25 PM   #74
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Trailer: Scamp 16
Florida
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Ray,

One thing about a Scamp 13 and a Scamp 16 is that they have virtually the same frontal area. To listen to some they weigh almost the same... and may.
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Old 09-28-2015, 04:55 PM   #75
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The Scamp site lists a difference of about 500 lbs between base 13's and 16's


Scamp 13' 1200-1500 lbs
Scamp 16' 1750-2000 lbs.


And the 16' has than much more room for stuff....
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Old 09-28-2015, 05:46 PM   #76
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500lbs will make no noticeable difference in mileage assuming the same aerodynamics and frontal area.

I have towed our 23 empty at 3,700lbs and loaded ready for travel at over 4,500lbs. 16mpg (imp gals) either way. Not bad considering dual axles and 15" wheels/tires.
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Old 09-28-2015, 06:15 PM   #77
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Ray except for hills, towing's mostly about frontal area not weight. Hills are about speed up the hill.
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Old 09-28-2015, 07:47 PM   #78
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Name: Wendy Lee
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I tow with a 2007 chevy express 1500 with a 4.3 vortech 6 cylinder. Purchased new to me this year as it has a wheelchair lift inside for my brain injured brother. Probably lousy mpg in this tank, but it does tow nicely and lots of room for camping stuff! I've never measured mpg while towing but honestly I don't seem to fill up any more than I did with my 2002 S10 with same motor.

Sorry no data to back this up, just gut sense I guess. But it doesn't matter to me much really because

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Old 09-28-2015, 09:42 PM   #79
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Name: Ray
Trailer: 2017 Scamp 16 Deluxe
Missouri
Posts: 504
Thanks all ....

When Scamp starts making the Scamp16 Layout4 with a 54" bed, we
might be tempted?

My wife wanted a trailer that could be pulled with our/her 2011 Honda
CRV with the automatic transmission, be able to take grandkids on
camping adventures, and travel long distances without too much expense.

It might be a little difficult to find a later model, 54" bed, Scamp13 that
weighs as little and tows as easily as ours.

The automatic-transmission Honda CRV does an "adequate" job of
towing our Scamp13 and we currently enjoy the option of towing with
either the Ford Escape or the Honda CRV. While the Ford Escape
would hardly notice an additional 500 pounds, I'm afraid that the
CRV automatic transmission might be working pretty hard to handle
the additional weight in the mountains (Colorado Rockies, Tennessee
Smokies, or ???) or maybe even in the Ozark hills?

Sadly, Scamp doesn't yet have a "standard configuration" 16 foot trailer
that is capable of doing what we have already done in our Scamp13
(i.e. sleep 3 grandkids + myself + DW) . I think that you'd really need
both the 54" bed and the sofa/bunk-beds configuration to sleep that many.
We slept 5 in our Scamp13 with 54" bed

(I've been told that Scamp might build a Scamp16 Dlx Layout A with
the front sofa/bunks instead of the standard front dinette, but that would
be a special order and the Deluxe would be extra expense. I've been told
(I suppose this could be wrong?) that the wood interior of the Deluxe
would also add some unwanted additional weight. ???? )

Besides the additional 3 feet of fiberglass exterior walls and 3 additional
feet of OSB flooring, there would be some additional interior fiberglass
walls for the bathroom (or storage room?), additional cabinets, and
possibly the added weight of a hot water heater, blackwater tank, etc.
With the additional room, there would be the opportunity/temptation
to haul additional stuff inside the trailer. So .... all considered, I think
that an additional 500 pounds would not be an unrealistic estimate
of the difference in weight between the Scamp16 and our Scamp13.

Because the Scamp16 sits higher, it would present a little more in
the way of "effective" frontal area unless I could come up with a good
air deflector.

Also, with smaller wheels or ???, I might have a chance to get our
Scamp13 inside our garage with a 7 foot door. With a Scamp16, I
think that the garage would be out of the question without the
expense of changing to an 8 foot garage door.

My sister and BIL have a Scamp16 SD (Layout 6). We're jealous of their
additional storage space; they are a little jealous of our larger bed and
our ability to sleep more grandkids. Trade-offs .. trade-offs

Maybe someday .........

Ray
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Old 09-29-2015, 05:44 AM   #80
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Trailer: Scamp 16
Florida
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Ray, I assume you have a transmission cooler. One interesting thing comparing a Scamp 13 to a Scamp 16, is that much of their weight they have in common. Their axles, tires, most of their frame, propane tank, battery, grey tank, appliances, dinette, bunks. Even the fiberglass weight is not linear with length, as you increase the length, the ends are a constant.

There is a 4" difference in height. I guess we don't notice it because we have no roof air conditioner and Scamp 13s with an air conditioner are taller than our Scamp 16.

I'm surprised Scam does not offer the 54 inch bed in layout 4. AS well I believe Floyd has mentioned the weight difference between the Deluxe and standard unit. I'm not sure I understand the large listed difference.

Ray, wishing you safe travels,
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Old 09-29-2015, 06:09 AM   #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rdickens View Post

My sister and BIL have a Scamp16 SD (Layout 6). We're jealous of their
additional storage space; they are a little jealous of our larger bed and
our ability to sleep more grandkids. Trade-offs .. trade-offs

Maybe someday .........

Ray
Ray, in the interest of science why not borrow one of your relatives 16's for a test pull. Thinking most of us would be interested in the towing difference between the two, with the same TV.
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Old 09-29-2015, 10:11 AM   #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by honda03842 View Post
Ray, I assume you have a transmission cooler. One interesting thing comparing a Scamp 13 to a Scamp 16, is that much of their weight they have in common. Their axles, tires, most of their frame, propane tank, battery, grey tank, appliances, dinette, bunks. Even the fiberglass weight is not linear with length, as you increase the length, the ends are a constant.

There is a 4" difference in height. I guess we don't notice it because we have no roof air conditioner and Scamp 13s with an air conditioner are taller than our Scamp 16.

I'm surprised Scam does not offer the 54 inch bed in layout 4. AS well I believe Floyd has mentioned the weight difference between the Deluxe and standard unit. I'm not sure I understand the large listed difference.

Ray, wishing you safe travels,

Current specs for Scamp show a 2200 lb axle for the 13' and a 3500 lb axle for the 16', which may account for the differences in height.
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Old 09-30-2015, 07:07 AM   #83
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Name: Ray
Trailer: 2017 Scamp 16 Deluxe
Missouri
Posts: 504
Norm -
Yes. We installed the automatic transmission cooler on the CRV in the same
week that we installed the hitch and the brake controller.

Like you, I don't understand why Scamp doesn't offer the 54" bed in the
Scamp16 Layout 4. There are some who think that the 54" bed might make
even more sense in the Scamp16 trailer than the Scamp13. There are also
a few who think that configuration might be close to our "ideal trailer".
Wayne, at Scamp trailers, told me that I should not expect to see the
54" bed in a Scamp 16 Layout 4 any time soon.

Wayne -
Maybe next summer, I might try to do a test pull of my sister's trailer.
I have absolutely no doubt the Ford Escape would handle a 16 foot
trailer just fine. It would probably be a difficult pull for the Honda CRV.

Towing the Scamp13 with the CRV, we often needed to put the
automatic transmission into the "D3" mode which locks out the
top gears and puts the engine at about 3500 rpm at highway towing
speeds. (My wife, who is used to "normal" highway driving, says that
it sounds like the CRV engine is racing all the time while towing in "D3".)

I'm sure that a manual transmission in the CRV would provide much
more control of engine rpms and be a better towing situation.

Coming back from California on Interstate 80, I put the Ford Escape
transmission in "S" (sport mode) to keep the engine in the 2250 rpms
range as we came over Donner Pass. While 18-wheelers were slowly
laboring up the mountain in the right lane, we set the cruise control
on 60 mph,passed them in the left lane, and never slowed down at all
as we went up and over the mountain.

The differences in the two cars is as follows:

CRV ==> torque= 163 lb-ft @ 4400 rpm hp = 180 hp @ 6800 rpm
Escape ==> torque= 270 lb-ft @ 3000 rpm hp = 240 hp @ 5500 rpm

Turbocharged engines (like the Ford Ecoboost) and diesel engines
generally have much higher torque at lower rpms. That seems to be
a good recipe for more power and better fuel economy while towing.
See the following thread:
Towing a 16' Scamp with small diesel

I bought the Ford Escape with the idea that we might tow a 16 foot
trailer some day. Still TBD.

Ray
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Old 09-30-2015, 07:54 AM   #84
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Florida
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Ray,

I wonder if the inner cabinets of a Scamp 13 and Scamp 16 are the same height. It seems to me it would be easy to configure a layout with the 54" bed. I wonder what the reasining is at Scamp?
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