09 RAV4 unstable

[Glenn Baglo]

Only one adding airbags ( as I recall ) is Derek, and then he got a WDH, and then a truck.

[dleverton]

I have a suggestion.
It sounds very much like insufficient toe-in to me. Toe out happens because rolling resistance on the front wheels acts rearward and causes the front wheels to splay outward (very slightly..a degree or two). Toe out causes instability just as you describe. As all cars toe out, the cure is to adjust the front wheels so they toe in slightly, enough to cancel the toe out. Car manufacturers measure the tendency of their cars to toe out and recommend a reasonable value of toe in to compensate and that is the figure the alignment shop will set. Unfortunately, as cars age and the control arm bushings develop more slop, the amount of toe out increases and the recommended value of toe in becomes insufficient. To measure toe out dynamically is a difficult measurement and requires a rolling road, so the suspension shop not having that equipment, just adjusts according to the manufacturers specs. Adjusting toe in is very easy, can be done in your drive way in 20 min if your handy, or could be easily done by a local mechanic. Too much toe in will increase tire wear, but that takes many many miles. I would start by adjusting your toe in to a value perhaps twice what the manufacturer suggests and see if the instability goes away. If it does, that is for sure the issue, but I would then back off the double toe in until the problem comes back. At that time you will know what value it should be set to.
If that works for you then I would invest in new control arm bushings and then go back to the manufacturers setting.


Sent from my iPad using Fiberglass RV
Doug L

[Carol H]

Originally Posted by Glenn Baglo

Only one adding airbags ( as I recall ) is Derek, and then he got a WDH, and then a truck.

Humm I though maybe Jon did as well.... could be wrong ... might have to search back on Derek's original thread on the topic to see who it was.

[redbarron55]

Recall Number: 13V383000Recall Date: 08/28/2013
Component: SUSPENSION:REAR

Problem Summary: TOYOTA IS RECALLING CERTAIN MODEL YEAR 2006 THROUGH 2011 RAV4 AND 2010 LEXUS HS250H PASSENGER VEHICLES MANUFACTURED FROM OCTOBER 2005 THROUGH SEPTEMBER 2010. IF THE NUTS FOR ADJUSTING THE REAR WHEEL ALIGNMENT ARE IMPROPERLY TIGHTENED DURING SERVICE, THE REAR SUSPENSION ARM (REAR TIRE ROD) MAY DEVELOP UNWANTED MOVEMENT AND RUST LEADING TO THREAD DAMAGE AND EVENTUAL FAILURE. FAILURE OF THE REAR TIRE ROD WILL CAUSE AN ABRUPT CHANGE IN THE VEHICLE'S ALIGNMENT.

Consequence: FAILURE OF THE REAR TIE ROD COULD CAUSE A LOSS OF VEHICLE CONTROL, INCREASING THE RISK OF A CRASH.

What Owners Should Do: TOYOTA WILL NOTIFY OWNERS, AND DEALERS WILL INSPECT THE TIE RODS AND REPLACE ANY THAT HAVE RUST OR CORROSION ON THE ALIGNMENT ADJUSTMENT THREADS. ALL OF THE REAR TIE RODS WILL THEN BE ENCASED IN AN EPOXY TO PREVENT FUTURE ENVIRONMENTAL DAMAGE. DUE TO LIMITATIONS IN PARTS, THE RECALL REMEDY WILL BE LAUNCHED IN PHASES FROM SEPTEMBER 2013 THROUGH FEBRUARY 2014. ALL OWNERS WILL RECEIVE NOTIFICATION OF THE RECALL, WITH MOST RECEIVING SECOND NOTIFICATIONS WHEN PARTS ARE AVAILABLE IN THEIR AREA. IMPORTANT: THIS RECALL SUPERSEDES TOYOTA AND LEXUS RECALL 12V-373. ALL VEHICLES THAT HAVE BEEN INSPECTED AND REMEDIED UNDER THE PREVIOUS RECALL NEED TO BE RE-INSPECTED AND HAVE THE APPROPRIATE REMEDY APPLIED.

Also check on the toe-in specs as above. Insufficient toe in can easily cause "darting".

[Glenn Baglo]

Already had my RAV4 in for that recall TWICE.
As original owner, I get all the recall notices applicable to my vehicle.

[Carol H]

Originally Posted by Glenn Baglo

Already had my RAV4 in for that recall TWICE.
As original owner, I get all the recall notices applicable to my vehicle.

Believe the OP has said her recalls have also been addressed as well.

[Doug in Sacramento]

I have a 2011 Rav4 V6 with front wheel drive towing a 16' Scamp and don't have any issues. I put Firestone air bags in the coil springs to level things out but no towing or other driving problems.

[Doug in Sacramento]

I just saw the comment about the Limited model. Mine is a Limited and it works perfectly with the airbags.

[melissab]

Well I think we have solved the unstable, floaty, driving on ice feeling of the Rav! We put different tires on it that have a stiffer side wall. Now I can get into traffic with either the wheel straight or turned and the torque steer no longer controls the vehicle instead of me. I was never able to take advantage of the horsepower available when merging on to highways or scooting across busy roadways b/c the Rav had a mind of its own. I've even driven it in the rain and its just as stable now as on dry pavement. I'm soo happy! After 3 yrs of feeling like this thing was trying to kill me and countless trips to dealerships and auto repair shops always finding nothing wrong it turned out to be too soft of sidewalls on the tires which the dealer we bought it from had put on in the first place! I got 40K miles out of those tires before replacing them and that was 40K miserable every day driving miles and even worse towing miles. Now my Rav drives and towes like everybody else on here says theirs does. Thank you so much for all the input, thoughts, advice etc. Glad to finally have it solved!

[Raz]

Thanks for posting. Too many don't bother. Glad you found the solution. Others with similar issues will appreciate it. Raz

[Mike Magee]

Woohoo! What model name of Continentals were the tires you replaced, and what kind are your new ones?

[frankcfx]

The Rav 4 Limited I have has three row seating and a V6. None of which they now have this year. They also have a 3000#+ tow rating.

[frankcfx]

The Recall locks the adjustments, camber I believe. They put epoxy on the adjustment collars and rod threads.

[Mary F]

Originally Posted by melissab

Well I think we have solved the unstable, floaty, driving on ice feeling of the Rav! We put different tires on it that have a stiffer side wall...

Interesting the dealer put on the wrong tires. Glad you found the solution, and thanks for sharing.

[Mike Magee]

Mary, not necessarily the "wrong" tires, since they were the right size. More likely just cheap tires. My used Lexus GX came with new Bridgestone Dueler H/T tires put on by the Lexus dealer, and they do not perform very well either. I looked them up on Tire Rack and their ratings are quite low, which verifies my perception of them. For another $30/tire they could have put on some tires with much better traction and less sidewall squirm.

[Mary F]

Right size, but still the wrong tires. IMHO.

[Mike Magee]

Originally Posted by Mary F

Right size, but still the wrong tires. IMHO.

I understand. From that standpoint, the Bridgestones on my GX are the wrong tires, too.

I was hoping to hear back from Melissa about which tires turned out to be the right ones for the Rav.

[melissab]

Hi Guys! Sorry was out of town and just got back to this. I will have to ask Hubby the exact model of tire that came off my Rav. They were Continenals I think the Cross Contacts but Im not sure. They were the proper size etc. What I replaced them with is the Sumitomo HTR Enhance. Just took a 350 mile round trip and WOW what a difference!! The Continentals were supposedly SUV tires too as Hubby initally thought they were passenger tires and thus the softer side wall. I will verify from him they were Continetals. Whatever they were they were awful with the torque steer of the very peppy V6 Rav4!

[Mike Magee]

Sumitomo, I'm not at all familiar with them. You have me curious, I'll have to look them up. Thanks.

[melissab]

Ok I asked Hubby what came off the Rav and they were definately Continentals and is pretty sure it was their Cross Contact LX model. "Contact" was definately in the name just wasnt sure about the "Cross" part of it. They look to have since been discontinued (were put on 3 yrs ago) so the chances of somebody getting a hold of a set unless used is probably pretty slim. But anyway at least if suddenly your vehicle starts acting out of character after replacing the tires thats the first thing I'd check. When I bought the vehicle the tires had already been installed so it never occured to me that could be the issue and it didnt show up in a short test drive around the block.


Mike, we've had Sumitomos in the past on both sports cars, vans and SUVs and have had excellent luck with them.