2012 Frontier Gooseneck setup - Page 2 - Fiberglass RV


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Old 06-29-2014, 03:24 PM   #15
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And no one asked Frog49 how much weight his Super Hitch added either.....
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Old 06-29-2014, 04:26 PM   #16
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All this tow capacity palaver aside, great job on adapting a hitch that meets your needs to, well, you needs.
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Old 06-29-2014, 06:12 PM   #17
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HOLD IT

I started this thread to show a removable hitch that could be made in your shop - an alternative to a full time bolted in hitch, and it turned into a contest over how much a Nissan Frontier can haul and trailer weight.

BOB - I really didn't worry about hitch weight as it would be comparable to any other bolt in - I can carry it 1 handed - guestimate 50 - 60 lbs.

T/W - Thank You - it works great

Donna - I did a farmer Brown method of calculating the tongue weight, I put a piece of tape on the fender well in line with the rear axle. I asked 2 of my buddies who weighed approx. 460 lbs to get in the truck. The truck settled 1.5". OK get out of the truck! I then lowered the the trailer over the ball, truck went down a hair over 1", maybe 1 1/8". My 4th grade math tells me this is approx. 340 lbs. Yes, I understated it a little, but when loading the trailer I pack towards the rear, behind the axle. Where you put your "stuff" makes a big difference. Will make the effort to get a more accurate reading in the future.

Carol - If you are having hesitations about pulling a 5th wheel with your Frontier - don't buy one. I am no expert on trucks, but I have been driving Nissans when they were Datsuns, over 40 years, I have used and abused them and have never had one break on me with less than 252,000 miles. I am confident my current Frontier will handle my 5th wheel just fine.

As my grandfather used to say - John, do you want to carry those cinder blocks to the barn or do you want to put them in the wagon and pull them? I feel the same way about my truck and trailer
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Old 06-29-2014, 06:26 PM   #18
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Tell you what John. You live in Washington State, right? One of these days maybe we can meet at a gathering in the Pacific NorthWET... there's at least five that happen between Oregon and Washington. I'll bring my Sherline tongue scale and we'll weigh the tongue of you 5er. Then you'll know "for certain." Deal?
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Old 06-29-2014, 06:44 PM   #19
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Hi Donna
Its a deal
We will see you in Oct at Silver Falls - #B2
Have been trying for Bullards Beach but too late - hear of any cancellations?
Thanks
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Old 06-29-2014, 06:55 PM   #20
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Being able to easily remove the fifth wheel hitch is a real advantage if one wants to use their truck to haul things in the truck bed .Removing some of the fifth wheel hitches I've seen takes 2 people and is a real PITA . I like your idea of bolting the hitch rail to the frame and not just the truck bed .From what I see your hitch looks like a well thought out and executed design
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Old 06-29-2014, 07:01 PM   #21
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Hi Donna
Its a deal
We will see you in Oct at Silver Falls - #B2
Have been trying for Bullards Beach but too late - hear of any cancellations?
Thanks
Remind me to bring the Sherline to Fall NOG! The only reservation for the Oregon Gathering I know about is a Friday/Saturday (lots of us stay Sunday too): Cancellations and Looking for Sites - Casita Travel Trailer Forum - Page 2

and someone posted a C Loop (C 50) reservation they cancelled on June 10, so I don't know if it's still available: Cancellations and Looking for Sites - Casita Travel Trailer Forum

Best bet is to keep a sharp eye on the Cancellations thread!
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Old 06-29-2014, 07:04 PM   #22
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John.. as you will see, Farmer Brown's methodology doesn't work here. WAG's about weights, MPG, MPH, and almost everything else, is sure to come under fire, if for not other reason than to put a stop to incorrect statements that may be taken by others as being correct, leading to a series of further incorrect and/or unsafe decisions being made by others.

This is one of the reasons that so many are adamant about manufacturers stated towing limits etc. As it appears that you may have been fed incorrect information by Nissan about how much your truck can carry, you too are a victim of misinformation that you then pass on to others.

Now, your work is very skillfully done and is to be admired. However suggesting that anyone here can make it in their own shop misses that it is beyond the scope of about 99% of those on the site, either in skills sets and/or access to the tools and materials required. And not to mention, you basically bad-mouthed the other hitches being used, as far as known here without issues, without anything to justify that opinion.

And yes, most of us already know how to pack out FGRV's to maintain optimal balance and tongue weight.
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Old 06-29-2014, 07:14 PM   #23
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HOLD IT

Carol - If you are having hesitations about pulling a 5th wheel with your Frontier - don't buy one.
LOL As I indicated I already own one! Bought the model with the highest payload I could find so that I can upgrading to a larger/heavier trailer in the not to distant future.

I am not knocking the idea you came up with and chosen to share, simple questioning the actual logistics of it on the truck its been put on and the trailer its towing.

I am with Donna, join us down at one of the Oregon meets and I and I am sure a few others will buy you a beer if it turns out that the tongue weight of your loaded Scamp 19' comes in at 250/300lb as you believe it does using a bit more accurate of method of weighing it than the farmer Brown approach. It is BTW certainly the most creative method I have read here to date of determining tongue weight.
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Old 06-30-2014, 07:24 AM   #24
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Now, your work is very skillfully done and is to be admired. However suggesting that anyone here can make it in their own shop misses that it is beyond the scope of about 99% of those on the site, either in skills sets and/or access to the tools and materials required.

Bob, what do you base your 99% figure on? WAG? I personally have the skills and tools to do projects like this and have in fact done so several times over the years. Perhaps that puts me in his actual pier group and better qualified to assess his work. This is good work, and I know it when I see it. I will tell a couple of related stories from my own experience.

Several years ago (decades actually) I built a dropped receiver hitch on the back of a “Heavy Half(ton)” Chevy 4X4 pickup truck over a few evenings at VoTec School Welding class. It was a beastly affair made out of 6” channel iron and such. It was attached to the truck’s frame with four ¾” bolts. We were all standing around at the end of class one evening admiring it when somebody pointed out it was a tad over-built. I replied “I did not set out to build the weak link”.

Fast forward a few years (still many years ago now) and I was building a complete rear bumper and hitch on the back of yet another Chevy 4X4 truck. It too was quite over-built out of 4”X6” heavy wall rectangular tube. Got done and I bragged on it a little and then apologized for bragging on my own work. One of my classmates said “Don’t apologize just because you know good work when you see it, even if you did it yourself”.

For crying out loud, people are pulling Scamp 16s with Honda CRVs and defending the action and frog49 is being questioned about pulling a Scamp 19 with a real pickup truck? Quibbling about 100 pounds or so tongue weight difference on a 5th wheel/gooseneck hitch? Just in case somebody does not know THERE IS HUGE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN TOWING WITH A 5TH WHEEL OR GOOSENECK HITCH INSTEAD OF A BUMPER MOUNT. And the 5th/goose is "better"
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Old 06-30-2014, 08:29 AM   #25
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Of course it's a WAG... or my opinion, or whatever, it's what life hereabouts is based upon.

After reading and posting here for about 7 years, one gets a handle on the general abilities found in the group. While it's natural for some to assume that they are among peers in terms of technical skill sets, abilities & available facilities, that may be misleading.

Again, as a WAG, I can't remember reading more than about a dozen posts in the past several years where the authors had the abilities and facilities mentioned in Frog49's original post. Maybe it's not 99%, maybe it's 99.5%, maybe it's a few less but, in any case those skills are, by far, found only in the minority of group members.

The weight discussions started out when Frog49 posted his "Farmer Brown" obtained weight figures that were "improbable" at best, followed by statements about his vehicle's capacity that also seemed out of line from known information.

Realizing that in incorrect statements posted on the internet live forever, and can be picked up as being "correct", days >> weeks>>> months & even years later, they will almost always elicit a corrective response, both for today as well as much later.

But how does one define a "Real" pick-up? Is there a criteria or is that a personal value judgement/opinion? i.e. a W.A.G.

BTW: I don't think that anyone criticized the quality of Frog49's work, but I hope your arm is feeling better, that must have hurt....
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Old 06-30-2014, 10:41 AM   #26
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Hi Everyone
Here is my 5th wheel towing solution - I did not want the hitch that just attached to your bed floor and wheel wells. I found an almost unused 5th wheel hitch on Craigslist with the bed rails and frame brackets. I traded away the horseshoe plate and cut off its mounting brackets. I had a piece of 3" X 5" X 1/4" angle - cut it to fit in the top U shaped bracket, drilled a 1" hole for a 6000# rated ball - and welded the angle to the bracket, installed the ball. About 1 hour time.
I next tack welded some 1/4" square tube to the bed rails with the uprights installed so I wouldn't have to keep measuring them for correct spacing when mounting to the frame rails. I originally had the ball centered over the axle but due to interference on the truck frame with the mounting brackets - moved the bed rails back approx. 2 1/2" After several 1/8" practice holes to verify I was in the right position - drilled through the truck bed with a 1/2" drill bit. I then installed the truck frame brackets hand tight to make sure everything fit - clamped them in position and drilled through the truck frame. Installed the mounting bolts. 1 frame bracket had to be notched to clear a shock absorber mount bolt - otherwise, everything good. Shims were placed between the frame brackets and bed rails so that the truck bed would not be squished. Cut off the 1/4" tubing. 2 coats of black Rustoleum. Spent more time getting the rails in position BRFORE drilling the BIG holes than actual work time. The top plate bolts to the 2 uprights and has about 3" up and down adjustment and about 2 fore and aft. 4 - 1/2" bolts ties them together. Rock solid!
I pull a Scamp 5th wheel with my Frontier - 4 cyl / 5 speed, Voyager brake controller. Average 16.8 - 18.3 MPG depending on mountains or flat. Truck only squats down less than 2" when hooked up.
I am sure this can be adapted to other vehicle makes.
My kinda guy. If ya want something ya can't get, make it! Very well done, thanks for sharing.

Frank
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Old 06-30-2014, 12:06 PM   #27
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For crying out loud, people are pulling Scamp 16s with Honda CRVs and defending the action and frog49 is being questioned about pulling a Scamp 19 with a real pickup truck? Quibbling about 100 pounds or so tongue weight difference on a 5th wheel/gooseneck hitch?
Yup there is someone doing that but they are doing it knowingly and as such are assuming the risk.

In this situation although the modification that have been made are very cool and something others here with 5th wheels can benefit from it appears the OP may have seriously underestimating the actual loaded weight of the tongue of their trailer as many new to towing and our small fiberglass trailers do. Not by a 100lbs as you suggest but by as much as 400lbs. In addition to that there may also be an over estimate on the pay load capacity of their "real" pick up truck as well, based on the capacity of other trucks with the same name but with a different engine, options & suspension - again something we have seen here many times.

Under estimating the trailers tongue weight by 400lbs on a "Real" full sized truck is as you say probable not going to be a big issue. But the OP's mid sized truck is only a 4 cyl. truck, with a payload most probable of only about 900lbs. Now add the weight of the hitch itself, the trailers tongue weight of 500/700lbs (from Real World Trailer Weights) and a couple of passengers and the family dog into the truck. See a possible problem with that?

The nice thing about this type of forum is we get to share information - the good and the bad. Although people may not want to hear the bad news they at least at the end of the day get to make an informed decision in regards to choosing to tow a trailer over the vehicles load ratings. Would it be better if people said nothing to those new to our little trailers or towing and let them find out the hard way they had made some errors in their weight calculations?

I by the way love the fact you called it a "real pick up truck" I own one of the same name but with a bigger engine and beefed up suspension and even my young great niece has started to mimic her grandfather and uncles in suggesting rather than buying a "girly truck" I should have bought a "Real truck". Glad I can now show her I am not the only one who thinks it is a "real truck"!
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Old 06-30-2014, 01:46 PM   #28
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Uncle! Uncle! I am making it official, I am sorry I ever used the term "real" to describe a pickup truck.
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