2014 Subaru Forester- 1500 lb towing - Page 5 - Fiberglass RV


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Old 02-23-2013, 02:43 PM   #57
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Originally Posted by Brian B-P View Post
I agree that this math is correct. Now add the times that 75 mph turns into 60 mph of less due to other traffic, or curves, or sections of reduced speed limits, or anything else.

The point is that higher-speed travel is so far from maintaining constant high speed that it often has much less advantage the basic calculation would suggest. Personally, I often travel (even with the Boler or the motorhome) at substantially higher speed than I really should because I'm pressed for time... and I recognize that a peak cruising speed 15% over the speed limit saves me nowhere near 15% of the travel time - maybe half that, at best.

Of course, if a trip is down a continuous strip of high-speed highway in light traffic, it can be closer to the ideal time saving. I've never heard of 1000 kilometres of such conditions, but there are lots of places I have yet to drive.
It's about 15 minutes from my house to I35, and maybe 20 minutes from I 35 to my parents. There is no need to slow down the whole time on interstate, which accounts for 600+ miles of the trip.
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Old 02-23-2013, 02:47 PM   #58
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Originally Posted by Francesca Knowles View Post
You "averaged" my speed so I presume you did the same with yours...

If 75 will be your average speed while towing your Scamp, I think I'm the only one that will be getting there at all. And I think it matters not how much you air those ST's over their limit to "accommodate" the higher speed...

Francesca
See what I wrote above. Nothing to average. A very small part of the drive is 55 mph or more, maybe 5 blocks total that are under 55. I get there every time, with much heavier trailers. The scamp is a joke for the pickup.
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Old 02-23-2013, 02:52 PM   #59
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Originally Posted by Bobbie Mayer View Post
I would not want to pull a 2000 lb trailer with my Forester up mountains. Wind would probably make it more, not less, stable at the higher weight. But I like being able to go uphill fast. I already feel it when I'm pulling the trailer and don't want more weight. However, if I lived where there were no mountains, it would probably be fine.

I don't think being slower makes it more of a hazard as the semis are already crawling, but I agree that it is a problem when you are between the speed of semi and fast cars and pull out to pass the semi. Especially pulling out with a trailer.

I do expect the Outback to have a lower rating when they come out with the new model, but I don't think they are redoing it for 2014. It isn't bigger than the Forester anymore, just fancier now. Hard to tell them apart from the outside.
Again, semis here are going nowhere near as slow as 55 mph, we don't have mountain grades, that's the difference. In your case though, I fully agree with you. On those grades, one should expect slower traffic. Where I drive, the trucks rarely lose more than 5mph on hills.

Again, each to their own, I just choose not to do it. My ideas of what's good are different than others, that's all. If I ever had to drop into second (or third for all but a few extreme grades) to pull hills, I would consider that a problem.
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Old 02-23-2013, 04:30 PM   #60
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Again, semis here are going nowhere near as slow as 55 mph, we don't have mountain grades, that's the difference. In your case though, I fully agree with you. On those grades, one should expect slower traffic. Where I drive, the trucks rarely lose more than 5mph on hills.

Again, each to their own, I just choose not to do it. My ideas of what's good are different than others, that's all. If I ever had to drop into second (or third for all but a few extreme grades) to pull hills, I would consider that a problem.
A couple of weeks ago we ascended to Monteagle TN. at the speed limit, blowing by semis like they were sitting on jacks, with our 4CYL Escape and our 13Scamp . There are very few more challenging grades in the U.S. Interstate system, where BTW...even 45MPH is considered safe for those around you!
I do wish those who participate in these discussions would learn to differentiate between the terms "Rating" and "Capacity".
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Old 02-23-2013, 04:51 PM   #61
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The most common cause of trailer accidents is the trailer coming off the ball.
I once looked at the web site on trailer accidents and read the cause of each trailer accident for one state. The majority were the trailer coming off the ball.
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Old 02-23-2013, 06:56 PM   #62
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Originally Posted by Francesca Knowles View Post
It seems passing strange to me that the Outback can tow more than the Forester, but according to the published specs, it can!
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Originally Posted by Carol H View Post
Why strange. Its a bigger/heavier vehicle with a different engine - with more power.
According to every source I've found, the base engines for the new Forester and continuing Outback are the same engine (2.5 L four), with the same power (okay, the Forester is 3 hp lower, presumably due to a different exhaust system). Carol, were you referring to the optional larger engines (H6 in the Outback, turbo 4 in the Forester)? The tow rating difference shows up even with the identical base engines, so it must be related to something like engine cooling, or the ability to handle hitch weight (due to the Outback's longer wheelbase and likely higher rear suspension capacity).
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Old 02-23-2013, 07:05 PM   #63
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Originally Posted by honda03842 View Post
The most common cause of trailer accidents is the trailer coming off the ball.
I once looked at the web site on trailer accidents and read the cause of each trailer accident for one state. The majority were the trailer coming off the ball.
I agree, if you're gonna tow a trailer,ya gotta be "on the ball".
so keep your "Eye...."
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Old 02-23-2013, 07:10 PM   #64
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Back on topic, although tongue weight/sway is a very relevant topic IMHO when discussion towing with the Forester or Outback due to their limited tongue weight of 200 lbs.
I agree that tongue weight is a meaningful limitation with these Subarus, perhaps more than the overal trailer weight rating.

I note that the 2014 Forester has a lower hitch weight limit (80 kg or 176 lb) than the longer 2013 Outback (91 kg or 200 lb), but with the substantially lower trailer weight this represents a much higher fraction (12% of 680 kg / 1500 lb for the Forester; 7.4% of 1224 kg / 2692 lb for the base-engine Outback) of the max trailer weight.
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Old 02-23-2013, 07:23 PM   #65
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When we're retired, I'll buy into the "getting there is half the enjoyment" philosophy. When we're restricted to how much traveling we can do by how much time we can get off work, then 600 mile travel days are going to be moderately common. When we visited Yellowstone a couple of years ago (from Ottawa) we tried to stay 2 nights in each place we stopped, so we'd have a chance to look around. But that just guaranteed that every day we traveled, it was a long day...
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Old 02-23-2013, 07:55 PM   #66
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Its interesting that we have all sorts of talk about tow vehicles that can accelerate with a trailer, or tow up hills. It seems to me that it is equally, if not more important, the tow vehicle's ability to stop. Even the J standard that Toyota is using doesn't mention stopping ability. It seems to me that the J standard should include a test that demonstrates the ability of a tow vehicle and tug to go from 60 to 0 within a set time period.
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Old 02-23-2013, 08:15 PM   #67
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Originally Posted by glamourpets View Post
Its interesting that we have all sorts of talk about tow vehicles that can accelerate with a trailer, or tow up hills. It seems to me that it is equally, if not more important, the tow vehicle's ability to stop. Even the J standard that Toyota is using doesn't mention stopping ability. It seems to me that the J standard should include a test that demonstrates the ability of a tow vehicle and tug to go from 60 to 0 within a set time period.
I'm pretty sure it does have a stopping requirement with no trailer brakes.

Quote:
Braking Requirements
The test vehicle and trailer must stay within a 11.5-foot wide traffic lane during stopping tests. The parking brake must be capable of holding the rig on 12-percent up and down grades.
Stopping distance requirements from an initial 20 mph without use of trailer brakes are:
  • In 35 feet or less with a TWR of 3000 pounds or less and no trailer brake requirement.
  • In 45 feet or less with a TWR of 3000 pounds or less and a trailer brake requirement.
  • In 80 feet or less for TWRs above 3000 pounds.
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Old 02-23-2013, 08:20 PM   #68
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While the H6 engine would give the Outback more power, you are right Brian I had forgotten that they do now have the same engines on the base models since 2011? put as you say for what ever reason the Outback has a tiny bit more power.

They do though have different transmissions so that may also be a part of why the difference in ratings along with the wheelbase and difference in rear suspension. Only Subaru knows for sure as to why!

As they have been beefing up the Forester more and more in power and size over the past few years and added a smaller cross over vehicle to the line up last year to take the place of what was the original smaller lower powered Foresters market, as well as the rumors of the disappearance of the Tribeca next year, one is left to wonder whats the marketing plan. Doesnt make sense to me that they now have two vehicles the Forester and Outback in the line up so close in specs and size. I am kind of wondering if or when they take the Tribeca off the market if they are going to beef up the standard power on the Outback and return things back to the way they were for years with the Outback had more power than the Forester.... we will just have to wait and see.
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Old 02-23-2013, 08:32 PM   #69
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Even the J standard that Toyota is using doesn't mention stopping ability. It seems to me that the J standard...
Many of the SAE standards start with "J"... including all of the towing-related standards I've seen. This one is J2807, hitches are covered by J684, trailer wiring connections by J1239, and so on. If not giving the number, when the specific standard is apparent by context, "SAE standard" might be a more appropriate term.
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Old 02-23-2013, 08:32 PM   #70
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Just have to face it. Consumers looking for a compact, fuel efficient tow vehicle for a small, lightweight trailer are a miniscule part of the market. When those companies consider towing, they are probably thinking a 4' x 6' utility trailer for weekend hauls to the dump.
The main consumer demand is for a cute ute with great fuel economy, a 600W 12 speaker sound system, heated seats and steering wheel and 32 cup holders.
Just going to have to move up in size and price.

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