Axle-Less AxleLess Suspension - TIMBREN

[likeair2me]

Well done! You should be able to take that Scamp ANYWHERE with that kind of lift. Please post some pictures of the assembled setup as well as a shot of the camper with the extra lift. So many members like to get off-road" and the extra lift would make it so much easier.

Believe me... I stared at that Timbren setup for a long time, but it was just more cost effective for me to go with a standard axle. The only time I go off road is when I pull in my driveway.

[Lookabill]

I guess I really didn't check the price of a replacement axle. But this set up was 450 for the axel and then install. Had a friend weld it in and add some more reinforcement. So it seemed like a good price. I thought that the other axle was like 900 to 1200 alone. Install was 500. So all in at 950.

[redbarron55]

I think that I remember that the 3500 lb Flexiride axle with the adjustment for 3000 no extra charge when it was made was around $550 plus freight freight with self adjusting brakes.
The carry through square tube is 3" so that would be the total added material in the middle of the floor.
As I see it the difference in the center clearance would be that 3" and the overall clearance would depend on the angle of the trailing arms as installed.
However ground clearance was not an issue for me, but rather not really knowing the ride height of the trailer with the larger wheels and tires I installed at the rebuild time.
For rough service I would be more concerned with the twisting flex on the side rails of the scamp.
These older scamps used light tubing for the frames and need all of the strength of the you can get.
The loads are the wheel offset from the frame X 1/2 the total weight of the trailer plus the impact loading. With the standard axle the loads are bending loads on the main cross beam and they are designed to transfer that load and carry the trailer weight on the beam.
My thoughts are that the stresses might well break out the weldments on the frame to suspension connections.
You might want to keep a good look out on this area.

[Lookabill]

I''ll check the stress points for sure, but the original owner put in some 1 1/2 *3 rectangle tubing under the existing frame for the scamp. So in effect making a subframe that is welded to the original, and cross braced at the front and rear, of the scamp, as well as the through bar in the timbren system. So, only time will tell how she holds up. Just wanted to give a little hope to the folks that want to try something new. And use a different product on the scamp.

When I was looking for the new axel there were many people looking at the timbren system. This was a few years ago, and I now just got around to install. Anyway if anyone wants to give it a go, let me tell you it will work, but for a longer term quality test, well........you'll have to wait! And see!

[redbarron55]

What that extended height of the frame does is make the twisting moment larger.
With an additional 3" depth, if it so not side braced to take the twisting loads. will increase the stress on the frame, not reduce it.
The added square tubing will increase the bending moment fore and aft, but not appreciable affect the loads from the wheels not being directly under the frame.
Think of that distance as an added lever bending the bottom of the frame outwards.
If the intent is to improve the travel over rough "Roads" and improve ground clearance I would suggest that since there is a cross-brace that it be installed between the pivot points of the "Axles and have a triangulated brace from the added three inch square tube and also that the ends of the square tubes be welded closed to increase the strength of the assembly.
Think of the loads from the trailer and the bouncing being applies at the axle x the distance to the pivot point as a pry bar twisting the unit.
This twisting might be many times the weight of the entire trailer is extreme conditions which could be envisioned on the rough trails you suggest.
The 1977 Scamp would have thin wall tubing and it might be difficult welding to it without producing stress risers and weak points.
If I were you I would consider adding bracing to relieve the twisting loads on the frame and if they are added as triangulating braces to a cross bar that might be 3" square you would keep most of the center clearance you have now.

[Lookabill]

It is braced in front and in the rear, going the width of the trailer. And there is a gusset welded to the timbren mount points. So the original frame is parallel tubing going the length of the trailer. Now there is two braces going perpendicular to that at the front and rear to make a # looking frame. Should be plenty strong for what it is. Like I said time and use will tell.

[redbarron55]

Sounds good to me.
I thought about the Timbren units, but decided on the Flexiride for simpler installation for my purposes.
If it meets your needs it sounds great!
I looked into the rubber springs for an application on a motorglider and used a European unit in that case.

[Lookabill]

[Lookabill]

[schwinney2000]

I used a set of 2K Axle-less on my Boler EXTREME project.

[buff30]

That new frame looks good.

I used the axle-less 3500HD with 4 inch built in lift and off road spindles on my Scamp 19. I have only pulled it around the house so I can't report on the ride.

[schwinney2000]

Hi Gene, your Scamp looks awesome!!

I made a costly mistake on my axle-less setup, ASR2000s01 do not include brake flanges and use 2k bearings and races. The spindle length will not accommodate brake flanges to be welded on as an after thought. I bought weld on brake flanges, 7" brake drums and brakes that could not be used because of the short spindle length... now for the tricky part!
So I thought I ll just get a ASR2000s02 with the Flanges and use the 7" brake parts - except that ASR2000s02 use a 3500lb spindle and none of the 7" brake parts will work.... so 10" brake hubs and brakes it is. I know that 10" brakes and 3500lb spindles will be far better, but chucking another grand at the suspension didn't help the budget at all. As an upside my utility trailer will be getting a sweet 2k suspension upgrade!

Another thing to be warned about is not all Tmbren spec drawings are correct. For example the first drawings I downloaded indicated empty distance and deflection distance as being 2-5/8, when they are actually 3 7/8 and 2 7/16. That is a huge discrepancy - so a word of warning download the latest drawing rev from Timbren

[Glenn Baglo]

U should spend some money on 'a's and 'e's.

[buff30]

When I was doing my research I talked to Timbren directly. You can order just the spindles from Timbren. Then you just got 4 bolts per side to swap.

[schwinney2000]

I emailed Timbren.ca about my problem and they never got back to me. I also contacted etrailer and tdot but they don't sell spindles separately. I had time constraints so I had to bite the bullet and pick up another set.