Do you have a SMALL SUV with a factory towing package?

[Paul Kaplan]

Trying to figure our the right tow vehicle is certainly a challenge.

I was hoping to tow my 13' Scamp with bath, with my 4 cyl Saturn- some say I can, others say no way... so confusing. So Im looking into trading it in for something more substantial.

Anyone have any experience with the Jeep Liberty? It seems like the least expensive tow vehicle that will tow up to 3500#.

[James Harper]

we have a 16 ft fiberstream pull with a '94 Rodeo with a 3.2 V6 (manual trans) dont even know its there...took it to Big Bear a couple weeks ago..made it up going the speed limit all the way ...

[Booker B.]

My thought on trailer brakes.

Just got back after our first big trip - 3000 miles (4500k) through BC to Alberta and back with our 2005 Subaru Forester pulling a Trillium 1300. Our trailer has electric brakes and I had a Prodigy controller installed the day we left.

I am now completely sold on trailer brakes - at no point in the Rockies did I feel that I could not stop quickly and safely if needed. Driving through Vancouver and Calgary with this rig was a snap.

[DanPatWork]

Trying to figure our the right tow vehicle is certainly a challenge.

I was hoping to tow my 13' Scamp with bath, with my 4 cyl Saturn- some say I can, others say no way... so confusing. So Im looking into trading it in for something more substantial.

Anyone have any experience with the Jeep Liberty? It seems like the least expensive tow vehicle that will tow up to 3500#.

We tow our 16' Scamp with our 2006 Jeep Liberty. We've experienced no problems. If I had it to do over again I might not chose a Liberty, only because of the fuel economy. I'm sure there are other tow vehicles out there that will do the job and go farther on a gallon. I was really intrigued by the talk of the Mahindra trucks and suvs coming to the states. I think I heard about them here first.

[Victor Benz]

We tow our 16' 1978 Fiber Stream with a 1999 Toyota 4Runner V6 manual transmission and what appears to be a factory tow package. We do slow down in a headwind to conserve gas mileage, and some climbs I fail to downshift soon enough, giving me some headaches. I feel this is a completely safe, stable, and well suited combination, and would put it up against any other setup.

Vic

[Dlynne]

I retired our 1994 Rodeo 3.2 V6 auto (from towing) even though it only towed our 13' Casita Deluxe. It struggled in hilly states with only factory trainy cooler, etc. I bought the Rodeo new in 1994, but, with only 100,000 on it We retired the Rodeo to local travel because of its age & difficulty handling hilly terrain. Our new TV we purchased in 2007 was a new Honda Odyssey. We love towing our new 16' with the Odyssey. The Honda has great fuel economy when your not towing of about 27. The engine does work on the ''econo mode'' on flat terrain. You can also open the tailgate up when hitched up.

[Pamela H]

I think this is the most active topic in most rv forums with the cost of gas being over $4. It is interesting looking at posts from a year or so ago, when people were still on the lower side of $3/gal. While tow capacity/vehicle choice is a personal choice, gas economy can not be ignored with gas prices on on what seems to be an upending spiral. We have seen all types of opinions, but the reality is that if you never have rolled backwards because you have exceeded your tow capacity, and have no power to go forward, it truly is an exciting moment. At that time, you only have a lick and a prayer to hope that your brakes work. We used to tow with a ford aerostar, and loved it. It was rated for 5500 lbs, and on a very steep driveway, not even in high altitude, we rolled backwards After much research, we found that you shouldn't exceed 80% of the rated tow capacity at sea level. If the tow capacity is 5000 lbs, don't tow greater than 4000lbs. Your transmission will also thank you. (Yup, we burned that out also, at another time... We just purchased a very used suburu to tow our 13' burro, and we own a 2500 suburban. The suburban will be kept to tow the airstream and horse trailer, but our goal is to use the 13' frequently, and we needed another higher mileage car for around town. I think if you are looking to be economical, to replace a late model vehicle with another late model vehicle is a costly proposition. Fuel economy is hard to balance when you take as much as a $10k lost on a vehicle. But why not buy an inexpensive older vehicle to get that higher fuel economy, and to get the tow rating that you are looking for?

If you are looking to tow 2000 lbs, using the 80 % rule, a vehicle that pulls 2500 lbs will pull your 2000 lbs. We used to have a class C rv, and loved it until we had to do ALOT of engine maintenance on a vehicle we almost never used. (did alot of local camping.) I think all (or most) of us are here because we are seeking smaller and more economical trailers so that we can downsize our tow vehicle. I loved the class C RV, but hated the fuel economy, (7 mpg), the maintenance costs-which tend to be higher if you don't drive the vehicle...(fuel pump failed, squirrels in the carburator, mice chewing the wiring, chewing the metal heat ducts, you name it.)

We opted for a non-bathroomed burro because we almost always use facilities at campgrounds. A porti-potty, at $70 is a far cheaper solution than black water tank repairs, gray water leaks, leaks around the toilet seats, water damage, and the additional weight requirements.

But, as always, this alway is a personal choice. You have to decide your level of comfort. But, why not buy a tow vehicle as a second vehicle, if you can buy an older one that has been well maintained? Just a thought.

Pam

[Booker B.]

We struggled for months deciding what to buy to pull our 13' Trillium. The vehicle had to have a 2000lb minium tow capacity as our trailer realistically weighs 1700-1800lbs loaded. The vehicle had to have 4wd as it was replacing our aging 91 4x4 toyota. It had to seat 4 comfortably as we have two boys. It had to be used as I don't buy want to eat the car depreciation. It would also be nice to have reasonable gas economy.

In the end there are very few vehicles that fit that bill - we like the nissan and toyota quad cabs but there back seats were small. Nissan pathfinders fit the bill but they feel like a giant brick on the road and the gas mileage is terrible. It came down to a Ford escape or Subaru Forester for us and I just don't have much trust in domestics.

[dsheets70]

We struggled with what to tow our scamp with. While our Ford Ranger 3.0L towed adequately, comfortable towing was not the case. The weight of the 13 ft scamp was enough to load the ranger quite heavily. Perhaps springs would have alleviated this, but we needed something to haul people at our destinations as well as cargo. So we went with a GMC Envoy 4.2 L6 engine. It was works great and has plenty of towing capability for future trailer upgrades. They claim the Envoy can tow well over 5000lbs. The only down side is the milage. Which is between 11-16mpg towing and 18-21mpg without trailer.

On a side note I know that GM has taken a beating in the past for not being able to compete with Toyota, and Honda, etc. But one thing I do like about the Envoy is that it is a very comfortable vehicle to ride in. The drawback is that the envoy only comes with a 4 speed transmission. To me this is a significant oversight by GM, but in all a terrific vehicle for towing and comfort.

[Paul Kaplan]

On a side note I know that GM has taken a beating in the past for not being able to compete with Toyota, and Honda, etc. But one thing I do like about the Envoy is that it is a very comfortable vehicle to ride in. The drawback is that the envoy only comes with a 4 speed transmission. To me this is a significant oversight by GM, but in all a terrific vehicle for towing and comfort.

Appreciate the insight. I seem to be leaning towards the Suburu for the mileage aspects of it.

[Marc]

We have an 01 CR-V and in the very short time I tried towing with it, it is too small for towing a trailer such as the Jubilee...You are supposed to keep it out of overdrive when pulling, and on the highway at 100 KM/H 4300 RPM is not too appealing. Also, it is above the rated weight of what it can tow.

I would worry about a car towing a trailer like this - could the frontal area of the trailer affect the way it pulls, like pulling a giant barn?

[Roy in TO]

could the frontal area of the trailer affect the way it pulls, like pulling a giant barn?

Yes, my Ranger manual states frontal area limits.

[dsheets70]

Appreciate the insight. I seem to be leaning towards the Suburu for the mileage aspects of it.

Be carefull, I've been all over the Subaru website and I can't find any reference to tow capacity.
I found a tow rating unofficially on the web of 2400lbs for the Forrester. In the case of towing safety comes before mileage. The Envoy may not be the TV for you (way over in safety margins), but get tow capacity in writing from Subaru.

[Paul Kaplan]

Be carefull, I've been all over the Subaru website and I can't find any reference to tow capacity.
I found a tow rating unofficially on the web of 2400lbs for the Forrester. In the case of towing safety comes before mileage. The Envoy may not be the TV for you (way over in safety margins), but get tow capacity in writing from Subaru.

The Outback can tow 2700 lbs per their website and brochures.

[Booker B.]

Yep, my 2005 Subaru Forester has a large section in the Manual about towing. 1000lbs without trailer brakes, 2400lbs with trailer brakes, 200lb maximum tongue weight. One of the things that sold me on the Forester was it winning a European RV magazine TV of the year - in Europe my 2005 is rated at 3500lbs.

[Daniel V.]

Slightly off topic, but I've recently read an interesting thread somewhere about the difference in tow ratings between North America and Europe. It suggests that European trailers are balanced differently (with less tongue weight), are often narrower, and that more advanced sway control devices are more commonly available, allegedly allowing smaller vehicles to tow more. Maybe someone can confirm this, but I'd say the general approach to towing in Europe may be different enough to affect the statistics and explain (at least partially) the different tow ratings. Who knows...

[Byron Kinnaman]

If you go back a few years and compare Ford ratings for manual transmissions, you will find that all of a sudden they dropped. Probably got tired of clutch jobs, but that's just a guess on my part.

I'm wondering if part of the reason for the change has to do with lugging down the engine. An automatic transmission will shift down maybe before some drivers will.
Just a thought.

[Pete Dumbleton]

As a former owner of a tow vehicle with a marginal manual transmission, the stressful times on the clutch were not so much being in the proper gear, but situations like stuck in very slow traffic on steep hill, or backing over rough ground at rustical campsite.

I wound up slipping the clutch a lot because you just can't let it all out backing a short trailer like a 13'. Things would have been a lot better had I had a granny gear in first and reverse -- I did change the rear differential ratio and that improved matters significantly.

[Suz]

Yep, my 2005 Subaru Forester has a large section in the Manual about towing. 1000lbs without trailer brakes, 2400lbs with trailer brakes, 200lb maximum tongue weight. One of the things that sold me on the Forester was it winning a European RV magazine TV of the year - in Europe my 2005 is rated at 3500lbs.

If these are the correct numbers, then it's not enough vehicle for a 16' Casita Deluxe (bathroom) - especially the tongue weight.

FWIW I have an '02 Envoy with the orig I-6 Engine and the 3.42 axle ratio. This lower ratio is ample for towing the 16' and I have found (from talking to other owners) that it gets better gas mileage than the higher ratios. Certainly better than the V-8s. Actually, they make an awesome towing pair.

[Booker B.]

No, I would not recommend pulling much more trailer then a 13' trailer. There are quite a few members who have pulled 15' Surfsides/Trillium 4500's with their Subaru but they are not much heavier then the Trillium 1300's and generally do not have bathrooms.