Hitch help! - Page 4 - Fiberglass RV


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Old 09-17-2007, 11:51 AM   #43
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I need to stop reading this thread. Maybe I'm kind of weird, but I keep getting this strange image popping into my head. The image looks something like this.
Please don't take offense.
Laura, I have a suggestion.

Put the hitch on the car. Any old hitch would do for this experiment, but whatever you want is a better bet. Then RENT or borrow a trailer that weighs about what the one you want to tow weighs, and see how your car handles it.

Bobbie
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Old 09-17-2007, 12:07 PM   #44
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Reading through this thread, it seems to me the overwhelming consensus is to get a 13' or a different TV. The folks giving the advice are very talented and knowledgeable, so if it were me I'd follow the advice. If one wants to go against the consensus then the old caveat applies "at your own risk." Just my two cents, nuff said....
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Old 09-17-2007, 12:24 PM   #45
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Maybe I'm kind of weird, but I keep getting this strange image popping into my head.
LMAO
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Old 09-17-2007, 08:28 PM   #46
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Maybe I didn't see what you are trying to point to...but none of those links show me a WDH that would fit a 1.25 in (class 2) hitch receiver. Neither does anything I saw give me an adjustable ball mount for a 1.25 (class 2) receiver.

What am I missing?

No, it's what I was missing -- The need for the 2" modification was to put a WDH on the Subie.

There's a message here in that the aftermarket folks aren't making the equipment needed to allow the Subie to exceed its stated tow capability...
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Old 09-17-2007, 10:20 PM   #47
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I don't know how this relates to the trailer you bought, but my guess it's gonna be pretty darn close.
From a Scamp group where this gentleman weighed his 16' Scamp. His concern was with tires. But it is the weight of the trailer and points out that you'll probably be exceeding the max tow weight and tongue weight of the Subie.

I took the 16' Deluxe side dinette to our local farm coop to get a dry weight on it. It has the
following options (besides all the options that come with the deluxe) : 3 speed fan, sink and
stove covers, vinyl flooring, step and 2" receiver hitch, TV antenna and cable, furnace,
awning, group 27 battery, 2 propane tanks, and roof A/C. The dry weight came out at 2340#
- in the range of what I was expecting. So with the 100# of fresh water added we have
around 560# for food, clothes and etc before we would run into the load limit of the C tires
(given a 10% tongue weight). I think that D rated tires are on my not too distant buying list.

Eric
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Old 09-18-2007, 01:58 PM   #48
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I'm not sure that's the case, Brian. I'm not an engineer (although I did sleep in a Holiday Inn Express last night... ) but as I understand the concept, it doesn't mean less stress on the most loaded frame connection points; it means stress leverage applied in different directions. Unibodies are designed and reinforced with specific force vectors in mind. In the case of a trailer hitch assembly, it would be designed to carry load in a downward vector. The sheetmetal around the hitch points may not be designed to handle load in an UP vector which is what a WDH does.
A typical hitch mounting system has (at least) two fastening points on each side; one significantly forward of the other. Since even the rearward point is well forward of the hitch ball, in a weight-carrying (no WD system) configuration, the hitch frame pushes up on the car at the forward points, and pulls down on the rear points with lots of force - the total of the hitch weight plus the upward force.

A WD system - properly used - will reduce the upward force at the forward points, and thus reduce the downward force at the rear points. Apply it hard enough to get to zero vertical load at the forward points, and the rears are just holding the hitch weight... this is an easier situation for the structure.

Keep cranking on more WD force and the forward points will start being pulled down, with even less downward force on the rear points. I expect that some of that would be just fine, but too much would be bad.

Go too far, and you'll be ripping the front mounts out downward and crushing the rear mount points upward. I think Roger's right - this may not be handled well by a structure which is not designed for it. This is what I meant by over-application of the WD system... and I suspect you have to go this far before you've made the structure's like tougher.

The forces in a straight weight-carrying configuration are much easier to anticipate, and that would be one reason but (not the only one) for the manufacturer to not allow the WD mode... it gives them a known situation.

The change from nice load distribution to twisted the wrong way happens faster (i.e. with less WD action) if the mounting points are closer together - the WD system as a better leverage advantage over the mounts.

The rearward and forward mounting points in my Sienna (which does allow WD) are a reasonable distance apart (as far as in some pickup trucks); the same points in a RAV-4 (no WD allowed) are closer together. I looked briefly at a Forester today, and could not see the mount points buried up behind the bumper cover... my guess is that they're quite close together.
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Old 09-18-2007, 03:01 PM   #49
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So, is this a case of the WDH badly missadjusted?


Click image for larger version

Name:	CART.jpg
Views:	10
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ID:	10134


And the hitch weight on this application?


(Come on, you knew somebody had to post this...)
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Old 09-18-2007, 03:36 PM   #50
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So, is this a case of the WDH badly missadjusted?


Attachment 10134


And the hitch weight on this application?
(Come on, you knew somebody had to post this...)


Kind of looks that way don't it.
Very good Steve.
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Old 09-18-2007, 03:44 PM   #51
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I have days like that.
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Old 09-18-2007, 07:33 PM   #52
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So, is this a case of the WDH badly missadjusted?
Nah, that's the need for a WDH... gotta push those front hooves back down!
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Old 09-19-2007, 11:35 AM   #53
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AH HA! My DH went to an expert (read: a buddy from work) who sent us to look at these gizmos.

http://www.airsafehitches.com/receiver_hitches.html



Now that looks like it would work. Waddya think?
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Old 09-19-2007, 12:50 PM   #54
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Now that looks like it would work. Waddya think?
I think that the interchangeable ball platforms and WD system head mounts only mount to the "Class 5" and higher products, not the Class 1 & 2 version which fits the 1.25" receiver box, so this does not provide a way to [b]mount a WD system to a 1.25" receiver. (The Receiver Specifications section table says "no" for the weight distribution bracket on the lower models).

The [b]air cushion hitch idea is appealing (and is available from several companies), but by itself would not address any limitation of the Subaru Forester for towing the Scamp 16', and the extra length to the ball will exacerbate the problems of excessive hitch weight on a small tow vehicle.

By the way, the "[b]classes" listed by this company are their own special fiction - the VESA and SAE standards which define hitch classes only go up to Class 4, which ends at 10,000 lb, not Air Safe's 8,000 lb. Some other companies use "Class 5" to mean greater than 10,000 lb, but this is the first time I've seen anyone invent classes up to 9.

The 20 lb [b]weight of the smallest unit is lighter than I would have guessed, but still a further compounding of an excess weight problem. For someone with the hitch weight capacity to spare, the air cushioning might be nice.
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Old 09-19-2007, 01:00 PM   #55
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I believe this note will be reply number 55 and it's still not looking like a good tow/trailer combo.

(I've nothing constructive to add. Just noting the churning going on.)
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Old 09-19-2007, 02:08 PM   #56
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I called the Airhitch folks. They confirm that it does NOT improve tongue capacity. It may even decrease tongue capacity due to moving the hitch out from the rear axle slightly. It ONLY improves ride and handling.

Sigh.....

For now I think we will have to accept that we will be right on the line with the towing capacity. We will just have to trust the Subie's good engineering and expect increased wear on the suspension and tranny. The best strategy then, is to drive slow, and go weight it a couple times and make sure we know how to load it to the best tongue weight.
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