No interest in towing

[steve dunham]

I am in the market for a new truck . so I called the dealer that I purchased my last truck to inquire about stock on hand . When I asked if they had any 1/2 ton trucks on hand with the factory integrated brake controller. I was told NO but one is on order (The dealer sells Ram and Chevy and has over 400 trucks in stock) They contend that very few of their customers for cars and 1/2 ton trucks are concerned about towing and if they want to tow a travel trailer buy a 3/4 ton truck which is "designed" to tow. They have tons of 3/4 ton trucks on hand and most if not all have the factory trailer brake controller. The auto dealer & their customers and the members of this forum evidently live in different universes, with different realities

[MC1]

For sure Steve. It is clear the auto makers are still trying to push large, high profit vehicles on folks even when they don't need them.

As one who is interested in playing a part in saving the planet, and making somewhat of an effort with that in mind, I will not fall for their marketing scheme.

[steve dunham]

The sorry thing is that I can purchase a 3/4 ton Ram truck (Loaded) for the same or the less money than the 1/2 ton Ram truck with the Eco Diesel engine . The 1/2 ton truck is classified as a commuter vehicle (Grocery Getter) and the 3/4 and 1 ton trucks as work trucks . Please excuse my venting but I find vehicle shopping very frustrating

[Wallo]

I never ask a salesperson what I should buy. They'll try to convince you that you can only tow with a Freightliner. Rarely will you get a salesperson with your best interests in mind. Do your homework. Determine what you will be towing and estimate how much it will weigh when loaded. Is a certain vehicle brand more to your liking? Is gas mileage important? 2 or 4 wheel drive? Extended cab/4door? Once your list is complete, prioritize the list and search for vehicles that check all/most of the boxes. In my case the priorities were to tow 3500#, gas mileage, cost of vehicle. Some brands were thrown out without consideration because of personal preference. It came down to 3 vehicles. I bought the one that claimed the higher gas mileage, but was just a tad higher in price because of it's resale value and two year free maintenance. That offset the price difference. Good luck!!

[Bob Miller]

For all that, apparently GM has realized that there is a market for smaller trucks and is bringing back their mid-sized version, aka Canyon/Colorado, including a diesel, next year. Hopefully they will do something about what was a modest towing ability in the earlier versions. Here's a bunch of links:
https://www.google.com/search?source....0.ExLqMIYAJoo

[Paul O.]

Remember, the car dealers are not in business to advise you. They are there to sell you stuff. Do your best research (online, not in the dealer lot) and then ask for just what you want and the best price right up front. Nothing more, nothing less. If they recognize that you know what you want, they will respect it and spare you the sales pitch. That is as close as you can get to a direct factory sale at this day and age. At least that was my experience when buying the Tacoma to pull my Scamp 5th.

[Timber Wolf]

Just in case some truck industry big-wig reads this thread, I will be in the market for a mid-sized yet small-trailer-towing (Scamp 16) capable pickup truck in the next year or so. I am not looking for a fully loaded boulevard crusier, just a nice (a/c, power windows & locks) comfortable, dependable (work) pickup truck. Kind of like what I have had one or another example of in the driveway for the last 38 years or so.

[Bob Miller]

Originally Posted by Timber Wolf

Just in case some truck industry big-wig reads this thread, I will be in the market for a mid-sized yet small-trailer-towing (Scamp 16) capable pickup truck in the next year or so. I am not looking for a fully loaded boulevard crusier, just a nice (a/c, power windows & locks) comfortable, dependable (work) pickup truck. Kind of like what I have had one or another example of in the driveway for the last 38 years or so.

See Post #5, it's the only hope on the horizon.....

[Frederick L. Simson]

Originally Posted by steve dunham

I called the dealer that I purchased my last truck to inquire about stock on hand . When I asked if they had any 1/2 ton trucks on hand with the factory integrated brake controller. I was told NO but one is on order...

The auto dealer & their customers and the members of this forum evidently live in different universes, with different realities

We (molded lightweight towables) are a niche market, much like Tesla is. Our sought after product is not mainstream, which is why it is mostly sold factory direct, somewhat like Tesla is. The manufacturers of our product are small, privately held companies, (like Tesla) and not gigantic global publicly traded corporations. When sold new, our product is generally more expensive than the conventional "competition", just like Tesla is. We generally have to put one on order when buying new...

I think my dream rig would be a 17' Oliver towed by a Tesla Model X.

[steve dunham]

Originally Posted by Paul O.

Remember, the car dealers are not in business to advise you. They are there to sell you stuff. Do your best research (online, not in the dealer lot) and then ask for just what you want and the best price right up front. Nothing more, nothing less. If they recognize that you know what you want, they will respect it and spare you the sales pitch. That is as close as you can get to a direct factory sale at this day and age. At least that was my experience when buying the Tacoma to pull my Scamp 5th.

I know what I want ! No dealer has steered me in any Direction!. Cost is a reality of life ! The dealer stocks vehicles he/she believes will sell in the shortest amount of time and with the biggest return on their investment.. Try buying a new truck with 2 wheel drive in the Midwest , they are almost non existent and trying to sell a used 2WD truck is worse. Because most 1/2 ton trucks are used as commuter vehicles , luxury , comfort ,styling and MPG rank well above towing on the pecking order . The trucks in the lots all have the 20" low profile tires at a premium price and a reduced tow rating . The standard 17 '' tires which are made for towing have to be special ordered, I do not like the fact that you have to pay more to get less.
Bob M , I talked to my local Chevy dealer . He says GM has been talking about a 1/2 ton diesel for years and that GM is waiting to see how the 1/2 ton Ram diesel sells before committing to a diesel option

[Bob Miller]

The press reports seem to see it as a sure thing, at least for starters. GM continues to build that line in several other countries so it's more of a question of how much it will cut into sales of full size trucks vs. start-up costs.

But don't be surprised if they hit the showroom floors with a Made in Brazil sticker on them and Canyon becomes the Ipanema and the Colorado's new moniker is the Sugar Loaf..... and the advertising slogan is "Tall and Tan and Young and Lovely" lololo

[Roy in TO]

Originally Posted by Bob Miller

... there is a market for smaller trucks and is bringing back their mid-sized version, aka Canyon/Colorado, including a diesel, next year. Hopefully they will do something about what was a modest towing ability in the earlier versions.

I'm hoping one of the manufacturers will do it. At least that way we'll know if our perception of demand is different from the marketing gurus.

[Badger]

Not to knock this thread off it's tracks but I have a very newby question. Can you drop the tailgate on a pickup with the trailer attached without some kind of hitch extender. or a swivel jack? If not it seems like a mid-sized SUV might be more useful.

[steve dunham]

Originally Posted by Badger

Not to knock this thread off it's tracks but I have a very newby question. Can you drop the tailgate on a pickup with the trailer attached without some kind of hitch extender. or a swivel jack? If not it seems like a mid-sized SUV might be more useful.

I can not lower my trucks tailgate when towing with a standard ball hitch
I can lower the tailgate when using a WD hitch

[Roy in TO]

When standing, usually yes. Most trailers have about 3' from the front of the A frame to the body. The rest depends on how much you have on the tongue.

On edit, I get what Steve is saying. One might have a problem using the bumper hitch vs a receiver hitch.

[steve dunham]

Originally Posted by Roy in TO

When standing, usually yes. Most trailers have about 3' from the front of the A frame to the body. The rest depends on how much you have on the tongue.

On edit, I get what Steve is saying. One might have a problem using the bumper hitch vs a receiver hitch.

I can not open my tailgate using a bumper mounted ball hitch or by using my receiver hitch without an extender. My WD hitch extends back just far enough so I can drop the tailgate and miss hitting the front trailer jack

[Bob Miller]

Originally Posted by Badger

Not to knock this thread off it's tracks but I have a very newby question. Can you drop the tailgate on a pickup with the trailer attached without some kind of hitch extender. or a swivel jack? If not it seems like a mid-sized SUV might be more useful.

I can't imaging making the decision on a tow vehicle based on if one could or could not open the tailgate when hitched. Especially if you are looking at the difference between a pick-up and any other vehicle.

As it turned out, I could with my GMC Sonoma + Hunter/Scamp/Bigfoot combinations but I seldom did, if only because there was to much stuff in the bed.

I "think" that my 2dr Blazer is called a Mid-Size SUV and it has a tailgate as big as the one on the Sonoma.

Part Two: Hitch extenders almost always create problems and seldom solve them.....

[Roy in TO]

Originally Posted by Roy in TO

The rest depends on how much you have on the tongue.

Originally Posted by steve dunham

I can not open my tailgate using a bumper mounted ball hitch or by using my receiver hitch without an extender. My WD hitch extends back just far enough so I can drop the tailgate and miss hitting the front trailer jack

I think we are saying the same thing.
The OP does not have a trailer yet, so it might be something to consider when looking at both trailers and tugs. Newer P/U's and 4x4's seem to be higher. Some trailers have a fixed jack at the apex of the A frame.

[Bob Miller]

As an added idea, if this is a critical issue, one can do as I do with the Hunter to prevent the jack from scraping. I remove the jack every time I hook up the trailer, 3 nuts and about 1 minute time.

I threaded cap screws through the jack pad from the bottom and they stick up like studs. Then I just remove the 3 nuts with a 9/16" box wrench and lift off the jack.

[thombiz]

Badger, whether you can drop the tailgate depends on the tow vehicle, the hitch, and the trailer. I had an '09 Tundra with an Andersen WD hitch and a '97 Airstream 25' Excella and could not drop the tailgate without hitting the electric jack. This was a problem because I store my Honda generator in the back of the truck, and it was difficult to lift out of the truck with the tailgate up. The answer was to contact Andersen and get a new 3" longer stinger for the Andersen hitch. Cost about $60, but it worked perfect.

I sold the Tundra and the Airstream, and now have an '06 Tundra, a Husky WD hitch, and a 21' Bigfoot with a manual jack. With this setup, the stock stinger works perfect. No problems letting the tailgate down.