Please tell us your Motivation - Page 11 - Fiberglass RV


Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 05-07-2012, 04:28 PM   #141
Senior Member
 
Carol H's Avatar
 
Name: Carol
Trailer: 22' Airstream Formerly 16' Scamp
British Columbia
Posts: 11,731
Registry
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cam A View Post
The conservatives tended to have a larger part of the brain that processes fear and identifies threats. They might be more inclined to integrate conservative views into their politics." The results of the study showed that conservatives had a larger amygdala,[8] an almond-shaped structure of brain involved in processing memory of emotional reactions.[9] Liberals had increased grey matter in the anterior cingulate cortex,[8] a comma-shaped structure of the brain that plays a role in a wide variety of autonomic functions, such as regulating blood pressure and heart rate, as well as rational cognitive functions, such as reward anticipation, decision-making, empathy[10] and emotion.[11][12] .
LOL CAM that's a intresting bit of research sure to generate a new topic!! Funny enough when it comes to the topic at hand I fall into the conservative category, but I have often voted liberal! Yup thats a big political party in my county. Most who know my life style and recreational chooses and hobbies would also suggest I fall into the liberal category not to mention the various personality tests I have had to take for various jobs and management positions etc that suggest that as well ...... oh and I have never had a blood pressure issue either.

Suspect the bottom line is I am more liberal in my decision making process when I am making decision that the end result good or bad only impacts myself & I fall strongly into the conservative category when the decision I am making can impact someone else in a damaging way.
__________________

Carol H is offline  
Old 05-07-2012, 04:42 PM   #142
Senior Member
 
Trailer: Bigfoot
Manitoba
Posts: 604
My input is just an attempt to figure out why this topic seems so virulent on the forum. I see the basic problem not as how one votes, but as physical brain differences with greater tolerance of uncertainty versus enhanced perception of threat. If it were a logical issue, people would be swayed by logic.
__________________

__________________
Cam A is offline  
Old 05-07-2012, 07:11 PM   #143
Senior Member
 
Name: george
Trailer: FunFinder
Missouri
Posts: 455
And here is another example of how "the same model in different markets" have different equipment. I am using a 2006 Frontier to tow the camper. In the rest of the world, they call this model "Navarra", and if you saw them side by side, they look nearly identical. Underneath however, the engines are different ( like in GB and Euro, you can get a sweet 3.0 V6 turbo diesel ), but even parts like the differential are different. Here in the US we get ( the very stout ) Dana 44 9.8" gearset, and limited slip is applied at the end of the axle using the ABS. In europe, it's a totally different final drive ( incorporating limited slip ala "positraction" ).
Obviously the strength of the differential would be a consideration in the manufacturers tow rating. So is our Dana 44 better, or is the one they use over there better ? Ha ! ......anything I would say would just be a wild guess !
__________________
gmw photos is offline  
Old 05-07-2012, 07:15 PM   #144
Senior Member
 
Ed Harris's Avatar
 
Name: Ed
Trailer: 1982 Fiber Stream and 2002 Casita Freedom Deluxe,The driveway is a Dark & Lonely Place now!
Missouri
Posts: 1,776
European and U.S. 2011 Volkswagen Jetta: The Differences

Another popular vehicle for the justifying here.

Rear axle entirely different among other things.
__________________
Ed Harris is offline  
Old 05-07-2012, 07:17 PM   #145
Senior Member
 
cpaharley2008's Avatar
 
Name: jim
Trailer: 2016 2ndGen Escape19 Prairie Schooner pulled by 2014 Dodge Ram Hemi Sport
Pennsylvania
Posts: 6,398
Registry
I wonder if it is a case of economics. One can take a tour of the Harley Davidson plant here in York, Pa where all the bikes are assembled for shipment throughout the world. They have a color coding system, dependent upon country destination, for each bike as it moves thru assembly, some parts are identical, some are not. Are they the same, definitely not, even the motors are different.
__________________
cpaharley2008 is offline  
Old 05-07-2012, 07:24 PM   #146
Moderator
 
Name: RogerDat
Trailer: 77 Scamp 13
Michigan
Posts: 3,080
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cam A View Post
My input is just an attempt to figure out why this topic seems so virulent on the forum. I see the basic problem not as how one votes, but as physical brain differences with greater tolerance of uncertainty versus enhanced perception of threat. If it were a logical issue, people would be swayed by logic.
Both sides use logic, one uses logic for why it is "ok" to do what they do/did the other side uses logic for why it is "better" to not do that. Not really the same question or issue. They argue past each other on different subjects.

Is it better and safer to have equipment designed for the task, of course. Does that mean that pushing beyond "rated" capacity won't work? Nope.

One side uses the logic of it works and here is why it is OK. The other side uses logic of why it's not a good idea. Both have sound logic and facts to back them up.

One side points out the risks or logical holes (are US cars the same as Europe?) as a logical counter argument. But really their logic boils down to it's not as safe or good for the equipment. Liability, brake and drive train wear and tear. Which gets countered by I'm a safe driver that knows the limits of my equipment and have had no problem with brakes or drive train. Which gets countered by just because it worked does not mean it's "right".

See how that works? Both are logical but do not prove or disprove the argument of the other side.

Most folks are not going to go along with what they do is "wrong" or a "bad" decision. People tend to defend their decisions with vigor. Especially if it works (but even if it doesn't too). Same for what they think, if they think pushing the limits is "unsafe" for everyone they will be passionate, even though they can really only "prove" that it is less safe not unsafe. Hence the virulent nature of the debate. I would say it is really pretty civilized as these things go, passionate yes but civil.

People do what works for them. And for some liability exposure don't work, for others getting a different TV don't so there you are. And logically both can make their case.

I did not own a car for a couple of years, really could not afford one so I rode my motorcycle through Michigan winters 10 miles each way to and from work. Did I make it ok. Yep, through snow up over my foot pegs. Was it less than safe? Do ya think! And I could make most of the same logical arguments made here on this topic for both sides of that activity.

When I finally could get a car (yeah heat) did I think it was better? You bet, but I would still defend my "less good" actions as logical and correct. And my sister will just as passionately argue that I was an idiot back then.
__________________
RogerDat is offline  
Old 05-07-2012, 07:46 PM   #147
Senior Member
 
Name: Dave
Trailer: Bigfoot 25 RB and Bigfoot 21RB
British Columbia
Posts: 1,143
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpaharley2008 View Post
I wonder if it is a case of economics. One can take a tour of the Harley Davidson plant here in York, Pa where all the bikes are assembled for shipment throughout the world. They have a color coding system, dependent upon country destination, for each bike as it moves thru assembly, some parts are identical, some are not. Are they the same, definitely not, even the motors are different.

It IS economics - pure & simple. Again, just comparing Canada vs US specs: The US smog laws are WAY tougher - so the US cars get a US-spec engine & driveline that is quite costly to produce relative to the ones that can be used in Canada. In most cases, those powertrains are much more expensive

Canada's safety laws are far more stringent than US ones. Hence the bumpers, seats, seat attachments, seat belts and seat belt attachment points are far more expensive to produce. Very few manufacturers are so magnanimous as to put an expensive US-spec engine into a car that will not require it, nor to put the higher-cost safety gear into a US car.

Canada has a list of cars that can be imported, a list of ones that cannot be imported due to failure to comply with Canadian safety standards and a list of ones that can be modified to meet Canadian standards

If considering buying a car or truck, take a "boo' at a couple of little stickers under the hood. It should have BOTH the Canadian DOT and US DOT certifications, plus "this vehicle is in compliance with..." stickers from both countries. Otherwise, you are running a degree of risk when you cross the border, as you may not be able to get your prized toy serviced during your trip.
__________________
BCDave is offline  
Old 05-07-2012, 09:27 PM   #148
Senior Member
 
jen b's Avatar
 
Name: jen
Trailer: 1980 13 ft. burro
Pennsylvania
Posts: 848
Registry
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ed Harris View Post
European and U.S. 2011 Volkswagen Jetta: The Differences

Another popular vehicle for the justifying here.

Rear axle entirely different among other things.
I suspect that anybody considering a Jetta for towing is looking at the wagon, which retains the independent rear suspension. The sedan models to me seem unpleasant to drive around in even without a large object being dragged behind, as they've americanized the suspension but(t) good.
__________________
jen b is offline  
Old 05-07-2012, 09:27 PM   #149
Senior Member
 
841K9's Avatar
 
Name: Logan
Trailer: 1976 Scamp 13'
Wisconsin
Posts: 230
Quote:
Originally Posted by BCDave View Post
The US smog laws are WAY tougher - so the US cars get a US-spec engine & driveline that is quite costly to produce relative to the ones that can be used in Canada.
Unless you buy an EX US government vehicle. Many of them are emissions exempt.

I love loopholes.

__________________
841K9 is offline  
Old 05-07-2012, 09:40 PM   #150
Senior Member
 
Mike Magee's Avatar
 
Name: Michael
Trailer: Li'l Hauley
Oklahoma
Posts: 5,142
Cautiousness covers a wide spectrum. It's not black or white, totally cautious or totally careless. Each person falls somewhere along a line in between the two extremes.

I consider myself fairly cautious, though not as much as my wife. Yet I am open to the possibility of towing with underrated vehicles... cautiously open. And I'm not bothered by those who feel that such towing should not be done; but I do hope they won't be overly dogmatic... or get so wound up that they feel like blowing a head gasket over the issue. I would say: relax, it's just a discussion among friends, and the people seeking advice will hear all of us (both extremes and everything in between) and make their own decisions.
__________________
How much time do we have left? 2 Chr. 7:14
Mike Magee is offline  
Old 05-07-2012, 10:06 PM   #151
Senior Member
 
floyd's Avatar
 
Name: Floyd
Trailer: 2004 13 ft Scamp Custom Deluxe
IllAnnoy
Posts: 6,044
Registry
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cam A View Post
OK, hate me if you must, but this needs to be said. This seems to be the single most contentious issue that occurs and re-occurs on this forum, coming the closest to violating the "elegance of behaviour" that we all cherish so much on this forum. Some budding Psychology Phd student should do a thesis on it. Why is it that some have a relaxed “that’s about right” attitude to towing weights, while others seem to feel personally threatened if others do not follow the rules to the letter? Why does a discussion of fact turn so emotional?

Turns out many skilled folks have and it has to do with how your brain works. No amount of logical discourse will alter the basic viewpoints, since those viewpoints seem to arise from physiological factors.

According to a 2011 study[4] by cognitive neuroscientist Ryota Kanai's group[5] at University College London published in Current Biology, people with different political views have different brain structures.[6] The scientists performed MRI scans on 90 volunteer young adult people's brains.[7] According to ABC, "Scans revealed that the liberal students tended to have a larger region of the brain that processes conflicting information. That, say the authors, might make for tolerance to uncertainty in more liberal views. The conservatives tended to have a larger part of the brain that processes fear and identifies threats. They might be more inclined to integrate conservative views into their politics." The results of the study showed that conservatives had a larger amygdala,[8] an almond-shaped structure of brain involved in processing memory of emotional reactions.[9] Liberals had increased grey matter in the anterior cingulate cortex,[8] a comma-shaped structure of the brain that plays a role in a wide variety of autonomic functions, such as regulating blood pressure and heart rate, as well as rational cognitive functions, such as reward anticipation, decision-making, empathy[10] and emotion.[11][12]

Nation & World | Brains of liberals, conservatives may work differently, study finds | Seattle Times Newspaper

http://www.psych.nyu.edu/amodiolab/P...atureNeuro.pdf

So, let the discussion continue, since information exchange is, after all, what this forum is about. But, please, let’s keep it civil.
Did you mean to say "Let's keep it SYBIL"??
__________________
floyd is online now  
Old 05-07-2012, 10:19 PM   #152
Senior Member
 
Robin G's Avatar
 
Trailer: 2007 Casita
Posts: 3,440
Since watching this post from the 2nd responce I honored Ed's request to allow everyone to explain their motivation. (till, now)


I just got to ask, Ed have you read a explanation that would change the way you tow? Do the explanations make you want to change your tow vehicle?
__________________
Robin G is offline  
Old 05-07-2012, 10:22 PM   #153
Moderator
 
Frederick L. Simson's Avatar
 
Name: Frederick
Trailer: Fiber Stream
California
Posts: 8,151
Registry
Send a message via AIM to Frederick L. Simson
Resistance is futile

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ed Harris View Post
I am trying to understand clearly EXACTLY what is the motivation for towing beyond a vehicles rated towing numbers.

It would be ideal if there would be no social commentary about the conditions driving the ratings and whether ratings are legitimate or realistic or fair but I appreciate that this may be too much to ask.
Here we are, 11 pages later...
Did you get an understanding from all of this, Ed?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cam A View Post
So, let the discussion continue, since information exchange is, after all, what this forum is about. But, please, letís keep it civil.
What I "understand" is this metaphor:

Even when we all have heard the story of Pandora's Box, a lot of us are compelled to open "the box" for ourselves.

Why? Because we can. There can be no lock on the box. Think of all the ratings and laws, and stories of the lawsuits and tragedies as nothing more than warning stickers on the box. This discussion is but more warning stickers.

Some people are content with not opening the box. Others believe that the reason the box exists at all is to be opened. When the former tries to put a lock on the box, the latter obtains bolt-cutters or hack saws or whatever else is necessary.

As a moderator I could close this thread. Another one like it will be started in due time. Because we can.
__________________
Frederick - The Scaleman
1978 Fiber Stream 16 named "Eggstasy" & 1971 Compact Jr. named "Boomerang"
Frederick L. Simson is offline  
Old 05-07-2012, 10:27 PM   #154
Senior Member
 
Robin G's Avatar
 
Trailer: 2007 Casita
Posts: 3,440
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frederick L. Simson View Post
Here we are, 11 pages later...
Did you get an understanding from all of this, Ed?


.


Frederick, We must have been thinking the same thing at the same time, well almost the same time! Guess I type faster........ minus the metaphor.

Which I will say is something I always ask, the I do it's. Just cause it can be done should it? hmmmmm they have never answered that!
__________________

__________________
Robin G is offline  
Closed Thread


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


» Upcoming Events
No events scheduled in
the next 465 days.
» Virginia Campgrounds

Reviews provided by


Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:33 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.