Quick Question about Towing - Page 2 - Fiberglass RV


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Old 06-23-2015, 11:46 PM   #15
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It is not only if it can, it is if it is allowed. An overweight trailer can easily take control of the TV and then if someone is injured...

Proper Tow Vehicles A Must!


#8 - Apparently that is a European site. We all know in Europe, customs and laws are completely different than the US.
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Old 06-24-2015, 05:08 AM   #16
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Tail Wagging the Dog???????

We towed a Scamp 16 or equal, fully loaded for travel for 7 years all over North America and the tail never wagged the dog.

The CRV loaded weighed about 4000 pounds and the trailer weighed about 2400 pounds, the tongue weighed 300 pounds. The trailer had brakes and was properly loaded. The rig was consciously driven at realistic speeds.

Tail wagging the dog... sounds like a mindless dog.
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Old 06-24-2015, 10:10 AM   #17
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The 2012 Civic is about 3000 lbs with a 103" wheelbase, and either 140 HP or 200 HP depending on engine. The larger engine would be well capable of towing a 13'er. The wheelbase is rather short, so a longer trailer than that would be unwise.

The big limiting factors IMO are:
1. the sufficiency of the transmission and the cooling system
2. the strength of attachment between hitch mount and the vehicle's underside

A hitch bolted to thin sheet metal, when subjected to repeated stresses from towing, can fatigue the sheet metal and start to tear it. Attachment failure could lead to a detached trailer careening across traffic (worst case scenario, killing someone). We had a report here from a member (I forget who) who discovered the sheet metal on his Jetta was tearing, and he promptly upgraded to a larger vehicle. However, a custom-fabricated hitch receiver with more and better attachment points could overcome this issue... but such an installation is not cheap.

200 HP is plenty, and even 140 HP (although marginal) would do ok in the flatlands with a 13'. But HP tells us nothing about the torque rating of the transmission. Also it tells us nothing about the sufficiency of engine and transmission cooling. Auxiliary coolers can be added aftermarket, but an owner should do his homework about what to add and whether the tranny can handle the load.

Brake size on the tow vehicle is another issue, but I personally feel that trailer brakes would minimize or negate the issue. Trailer brakes would be a must-have. Since many 13'ers have been built without brakes, a person buying a used 13 should either look for one with brake mounts on the axle or else plan to replace the axle with a new one including brakes.
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Old 06-24-2015, 11:04 AM   #18
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As someone mentioned about tow capacity, I pull a 1750lb Scamp with a Nissan Frontier 4cyl with a cap of 3500lbs. NO WAY would I pull more than the 1750 I'm pulling now. Why? First of all, I live in the "hills of Tennessee". And if you've never pulled up long grades around here, you have NO idea as to how your TV will have to rev to pull some of these roads. It's nothing for me to drop to 3rd gear and have the engine revving for extended periods. Again, that's towing nearly HALF of my TV's rated "capacity".

Pulling the same with an automatic small car like the Civic? I wouldnt mistreat a vehicle THAT badly. I have a Corolla rated at 1500lbs. I believe the Civics are around 1000 lbs. You're not going to pull much of a trailer with that rating. Dont forget your luggage, passengers, etc?

We know it's not what you want to hear, but your best bet is to check out the area on this forum (cant remember where it's at) and check the specs that are listed. Quite phenomenal (thanks to Norm who started it) of the data collected! You can make some really good comparisons off of that information. My final advice is, over-rate your tow vehicle but NOT what you're going to be pulling....it CAN be dangerous.
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Old 06-24-2015, 11:14 AM   #19
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Originally Posted by Roger C H View Post

#8 - Apparently that is a European site. We all know in Europe, customs and laws are completely different than the US.
???????

There is a blog about a guy who owned a BMW 3 series sedan and towed a 22' trailer in Europe. He moved to North America and imported his rig with him. He reported that there was no differences in towing in NA from Europe.
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Old 06-24-2015, 12:02 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Darral T. View Post
As someone mentioned about tow capacity, I pull a 1750lb Scamp with a Nissan Frontier 4cyl with a cap of 3500lbs. NO WAY would I pull more than the 1750 I'm pulling now.
Thnxs for your post and data Darral. It goes to show that the tow rating is a very inaccurate way of measuring a vehicles towing prowess/abilities.

I have found through research and experience that some of the best tow vehicles are ones with the "1,000 lb" tow rating. Many just seem to have "the right stuff". Note these vehicles many require special towing options and or special set up.
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Old 06-24-2015, 12:52 PM   #21
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Before...

Quote:
Originally Posted by honda03842 View Post
We towed a Scamp 16 or equal, fully loaded for travel for 7 years all over North America and the tail never wagged the dog.

The CRV loaded weighed about 4000 pounds and the trailer weighed about 2400 pounds, the tongue weighed 300 pounds. The trailer had brakes and was properly loaded. The rig was consciously driven at realistic speeds.

Tail wagging the dog... sounds like a mindless dog.
Before the thread gets out of hand, I wasn't suggesting that you tow with your Civic. I was suggesting you visit the Scamp Camp and talk to people who do tow with a similar sized and powered vehicle. There's much to learn there.

Mike,
You may be interested to know that a CRV has the same wheelbase as the Civic. We towed with it for 7 years in all kinds of places and never were 'wagged'.

As well the 'wagged' that started this was a F250. Certainly we don't know the details but the F250 can be a very capable tow vehicle, capable of huge loads, many big 5th wheels are towed by them.

Having a big tow vehicle can breed over confidence. I have now met two people with large tow vehicles who have lost control of their trailers, an appropriate tow vehicle is not a guarantee to what amounts to a rare situation.

Our 4 cylinder crossed mountain passes in the west and east for years ending with 250,000 miles of travel. Of course the engine reved, that's what Hondas do, it's part of their operating range and never a problem.

Of course some do not like high revs, me included, but mountain passes are a very small part of driving.

Take your time and talk to people who do what you want to do. There is much to learn and Scamp Camp is fun.
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Old 06-24-2015, 01:08 PM   #22
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Hello Everyone. I am new here. I am happy to be here. I am looking for something that can be towed by my 2012 Honda Civic. Does anyone have any suggestions?

The lighter the better? Or should I just forget it?

VintageTraveller
MK Carr
Honda says up to 1000 lbs towing capacity with your Civic. It's actually one of the selling points of that model, because many other Hondas show no towing capacity at all. at 1000 pounds, that pretty much eliminates any of the most common small fiberglass trailers in use today.

I would second what some others have already said. Look for the TRAILER you want, and one that will meet your needs. Once you have that squared away, you can match it up with the right tow vehicle. For most people, vehicles come and go - fiberglass trailers, not so much.
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Old 06-24-2015, 01:08 PM   #23
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I am a big fan of towing with a car because they work so well.

In many locations, generally speaking, the Civic is a top rated tow vehicle but one must beware the connection hardware and set up needs to be appropriate for the trailer size and weight.

Honda Civic | Tow Car Awards
Beware. This is a British site about European tow ratings. The 1500 kg equals 3307 lbs. The tested vehicle was diesel. Also, and I'm open to correction here, I believe European tow ratings are based on a trailer with brakes.

Note the handling characteristics listed here, particularly that the steering feels somewhat remote and that the car required constant steering adjustment in a cross wind.

You will also notice that all the cars in this test are towing a trailer with a relatively large frontal and side area. In towing with a small car, you have to consider wind resistance, more so than in a larger vehicle, not just in terms of mileage but in terms of it's effect on handling.
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Old 06-24-2015, 01:12 PM   #24
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You may want to be more specific in your question, say, "Is anyone towing with a 2012 Honda Civic?". Then more of the responses will be based on real life experience rather than opinion. Opinions are great, but nothing beats experience.
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Old 06-24-2015, 02:23 PM   #25
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Good day MK. Diesels are nice for towing but the gas powered cars work well too.
LOL yes Civic Diesels sold in the UK are great - especially as they are designed by the manufacture to tow - But equally important is that as you well know the Honda civic gas version sold here in North America IS NOT!!

Would be really nice if we could try and keep it real to North America and the accepted general towing standards that the vast majority of people follow when advising someone new to towing!

To the OP a great place to take a look at when considering what small fiberglass trailer may or may not fit your tow vehicles towing specs is the thread Trailer Weights In The Real World. Those weights are the trailers of members here who had their trailers loaded for camping and weighed.
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Old 06-25-2015, 03:20 PM   #26
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UK CRVs

The UK version of the CRV was designed to tow and so was the UK gas version of the CRV.

It's interesting that the UK 2.0L gas version and the 1.6L Diesel version of the CRV with manual transmission both have a 1700 kg (3740 pound) rating. The 2.0L gas version with automatic has a 1500 kg (3300 pound) rating.

Note that the UK gas version has a 20% smaller engine than the North American version.

As a side note, I tried to get Honda America to sell me a UK diesel CRV.

http://www.honda.co.uk/cars/cr-v/com...0000004_200001
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Old 06-25-2015, 04:30 PM   #27
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Wow, has this thread ever gone sideways.


The real bottom line for towing capacity is what is printed in your owners manual and that is not a figure than can be ignored, or changed via aftermarket modifications.


If you have any real doubt about the accuracy or limitations of that number, you need only ask two people if it may be exceeded without negative repercussions, first your insurance agent and then your attorney.


And, BTW, ignore any offers of hitches that claim a higher capacity than the manual, such as this (now discontinued) one from U-Haul suggesting that 2000 lbs is allowed.
U-Haul: Hitch for 2012 Honda Civic Front Wheel Drive
The owners manuals' value trumps all others.
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Old 06-25-2015, 04:45 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by honda03842 View Post
The UK version of the CRV was designed to tow and so was the UK gas version of the CRV.

]

And the relevance of the above to the fact the OP owns a Honda Civic and lives in the USA and owns a car built in the USA to US specs and not the UK?
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