Scamp Axle - Leading vs Trailing - Page 3 - Fiberglass RV


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Old 08-16-2013, 09:17 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by ruscal View Post
It seems that a trailing arm design would overcome bumps in the road better than a leading type, due to the direction of travel when compressing. ..........
If the starting position of the axle was near 0 degrees (level) then the differences between leading and trailing link would I think be minimal. Just speculating about this.
Russ
To some extent I too think this is the case in my own speculation. If you think about it a wheel barrow acts much like I expect a leading arm would, you can push it over most bumps but if you need to go over a curb you have to pull it over.

The down angle going forward makes it so the tire "runs into" the curb. For that matter leading or trailing arm can get trashed cutting a corner too tight and hitting the curb.

I'm guessing a trailing arm can handle some unknown amount greater bumps or pot holes than a leading arm. I think tire size has a lot to do with it also, bigger tire has an easier time rolling over bumps. I'm staying with 13 inch so I can continue to use the rear spare tire bolts. Trailer is pretty much all original so I am more inclined to stay pretty stock with my changes.

I'm going to try and get under the trailer and see if I can find and read the axle model plate. Might be some info on there that would let me know what the original axle configuration was.

Of the two bump shock vs. scraping on steep inclines I'm more concerned about the scaping. But have wondered if 10 degree might be better, I would only be giving up 1" of height. 0, 10, and 22.5 are each adding about an additional inch to my current low rider axle.
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Old 08-16-2013, 09:28 PM   #30
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I'm going to try and get under the trailer and see if I can find and read the axle model plate. Might be some info on there that would let me know what the original axle configuration was.
This is a Torflex, right? If so, the start angle is visible if you remove the wheel. Assuming you know what series (size range) it is, and the rubber isn't cut down to a lower capacity, everything else is visible dimensions.
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Old 08-16-2013, 09:43 PM   #31
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This is a Torflex, right? If so, the start angle is visible if you remove the wheel. Assuming you know what series (size range) it is, and the rubber isn't cut down to a lower capacity, everything else is visible dimensions.
It's whatever was original equipment on scamp 13 in 1977. I think I have heard some say Al-Ko might be what they used back then. If it is there should be a model/serial plate on it.

Have not gotten under it to look for identification of axle. Had shoulder surgery a couple of months ago and it's taken awhile to heal up to the point where getting under trailer was a possibility. I get arm in wrong position or pull/push at the wrong angle and it pretty much puts a damper on my enthusiasm for getting any work done for awhile.

Have also read here that you can figure out original articulation by looking at the square in center of arm and figuring out what the arm would have been at if the shaft was in a certain postion. Got the gist of it but not the details.
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Old 08-16-2013, 10:14 PM   #32
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FYI I did the leading - trailing swap on my boler American.
Replacing an Axle - leading arm to trailing arm

Excellent price on the axle, once you get it done and are satisfied you will have to post the location. Now that Canada has raised it's duty free limits to $800 after 48 hours it is definately worth the trip to MI.
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Old 08-16-2013, 10:44 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by Roy in TO View Post
FYI I did the leading - trailing swap on my boler American.
Replacing an Axle - leading arm to trailing arm

Excellent price on the axle, once you get it done and are satisfied you will have to post the location. Now that Canada has raised it's duty free limits to $800 after 48 hours it is definately worth the trip to MI.
I did read that post and have been following it. Axle price is a little better but most of the difference in labor is I expect due to the extra work involved in switching from leading to trailing. There was a fair amount of fabrication and welding in doing that job.

Still waiting to find out a price from Al-ko on axle with direct copy of the original bracket based on shops measurements.

Not too worried about leading axle with brakes since dexter and al-ko both make them but would have been nice to have heard if any of the older 16 ft Scamps came that way.
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Old 08-19-2013, 09:27 PM   #34
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Axle is ordered !!!
Not sure when it will be available, mostly depends on when Al-Ko gets it done. Trailer place makes runs down to Elkhart fairly often, if it's done they will pick it up.

Interesting side note on leading axle and brakes. The guy at Al-Ko said they would NOT do brakes on a low angle leading arm such as a 0 degree. No information on the why, just that they would not, since I was getting 22.5 degree down angle brakes were OK. Don't know about 10 degree.

Also was told there is no toe-in on these axles. Camber yes. Enough positive camber so that under rated load the axle flexes out to zero camber, over loaded yields a negative camber and inside tread wear.
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Old 08-19-2013, 11:32 PM   #35
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Interesting side note on leading axle and brakes. The guy at Al-Ko said they would NOT do brakes on a low angle leading arm such as a 0 degree. No information on the why, just that they would not, since I was getting 22.5 degree down angle brakes were OK. Don't know about 10 degree.
The horizontal or up (I would have to think more about which) arm angle maximizes the lift reaction to braking. Remember the trailer axle is like a car's rear axle: you want braking to pull down to counteract braking dive, not push up to make it worse. The steady-state load tranfer is the same either way - this is about transient reactions and body movement.

I wouldn't expect the angle to matter that much within the range we're talking about, but they're the ones building the axles...
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Old 08-20-2013, 01:23 AM   #36
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.... The steady-state load tranfer is the same either way - this is about transient reactions and body movement.

I wouldn't expect the angle to matter that much within the range we're talking about, but they're the ones building the axles...
I'm thinking that what your saying makes sense to my limited understanding, it's about how it moves from it's initial location to the steady state. And how that transition impacts handling, or braking.
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Old 08-22-2013, 12:37 AM   #37
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I'm starting to look at brake controllers it looks like the P2 is the best bet, unless I want to spend $20 more for the diagnostics of the P3. I could go down to the primus and save $30 from the price of the P2 and it still seems like a good product.

Anyone have experiences with any of these they would like to share? Or an alternative brand?
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Old 08-22-2013, 07:38 AM   #38
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.............
Anyone have experiences with any of these they would like to share? Or an alternative brand?
I have been using the Primus for about 18 months and think that it works great on my little 13 footer. It has adjustable, proportional, accelerometer based braking, which is the key attribute I want in a controller. Maybe if I had a P2 or P3 I'd be even happier, but whatever advantages they offer, I have not missed them.

When I think of the spectrum of trailers with electric brakes, on one end I see triple axle equipment trailers hauling bulldozers and on the other extreme end, I see 13 foot FG campers. So, for me, basic need, basic controller.
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Old 08-22-2013, 02:14 PM   #39
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....
When I think of the spectrum of trailers with electric brakes, on one end I see triple axle equipment trailers hauling bulldozers and on the other extreme end, I see 13 foot FG campers. So, for me, basic need, basic controller.
Thanks for the feedback. One of the things that is sort of frustrating is trying to separate the really important features from the marketing hype so as to avoid the tendancy to purchase way more "features" than one needs due to lack of experience.
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Old 08-22-2013, 02:40 PM   #40
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Thanks for the feedback. One of the things that is sort of frustrating is trying to separate the really important features from the marketing hype so as to avoid the tendency to purchase way more "features" than one needs due to lack of experience.
Yea, I'd be interested to hear what I'm missing.

I know that my camera and smart phone have about a thousand features that I don't use, but somehow I muddle on.
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Old 08-22-2013, 06:29 PM   #41
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When I think of the spectrum of trailers with electric brakes, on one end I see triple axle equipment trailers hauling bulldozers and on the other extreme end, I see 13 foot FG campers. So, for me, basic need, basic controller.
Tom, I assume that you mean basic in features, rather than in core functionality. A timer-based control isn't just basic, it's bad.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RogerDat View Post
Thanks for the feedback. One of the things that is sort of frustrating is trying to separate the really important features from the marketing hype so as to avoid the tendancy to purchase way more "features" than one needs due to lack of experience.
My opinion, as a descending-order list...
  • Really important: proportional to degree of vehicle braking, such as by measuring acceleration (not timed)
  • Important: works well (electronic accelerometers rather than pendulum)
  • Valuable: easy-to-use controls and displays to set gain, manually apply brakes, turn any features on and off, show status (e.g. connected to trailer brakes)
  • Good: features such as "boost", holding while stopped
  • Nice: convenient mounting and electrical connections
  • Not important: fancy displays (but remember that easy-to-use was "valuable")
  • Almost irrelevant: price (the best is a couple percent of a decent trailer more expensive than junk)

I think Tom's Primus provides all of the characteristics that I listed, although I am not familiar with the controls and displays. At a glance, it looks like an original Prodigy in this respect.
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Old 08-22-2013, 06:31 PM   #42
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Smile

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas G. View Post
Yea, I'd be interested to hear what I'm missing.

I know that my camera and smart phone have about a thousand features that I don't use, but somehow I muddle on.
Didn't you know? You can ask your phone what you're missing by not having the latest brake controller!
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