Subaru OB 3.6 pull a Casita 13 ft Dlx ??? - Page 2 - Fiberglass RV


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Old 09-15-2013, 06:24 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by Perry J View Post
I've been a member for several years and often wonder how many new to RVs people go away confused, with more worries and less enjoyment from long answers to a simple question.

More answers should be as succinct as yours as yours Cam.

John
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Even when they are incorrect?

IMHO: After reviewing the posts in this thread it appears that the o.p. has been saved a lot of possible problems by reading the range of correct and not so correct answers. McKenna's comment in post #14 tells the story.

In as much as posts, including mine, are generally limited to opinions and experiences, it behoves the reader to do due diligence with replies.

Or, one could ask the "Professionals" at the local RV shop, most of which have never seen an FGRV, and run the risk of getting the (often) wrong answers from that source and not recognizing the difference.

The question was very complex and the range of answers addressed just that complexity.
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Old 09-15-2013, 07:06 AM   #16
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Don't Give Up.....

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Originally Posted by McKenna Lynn View Post
The Little Guy T@b Trailer has a tongue weight of 180lbs. I assume once loaded, that weight would also exceed the Outback max of 200 lbs ??
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As mentioned, there ar a lot of list members happily towing with Suburu's, you just have to be careful in what you select.

At the lowest FGRV weight end are the Hunters/Campsters and a restored one of these might be of interest. We even stayed well withing the towing limit's of your vehicle with our 13' Lil' Bigfoot, but our 13' front bath Scamp would be a bit tongue heavy.

Again, there are a lot of opportunitites out there and you now have better knowledge to help you make a selection that is appropriate and safe for your vehicle.

Above all, keep asking questions.....
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Old 09-15-2013, 07:28 AM   #17
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Lynn
I could just make the 2011 Outback towing specs. with a Scamp 13 front bath with brakes. It towed great and I got 22 mpg. Towing anything any larger I doubt will meet their specs.
You are right, Subaru and the dealers push the 2700lb towing capability but with the 200lb. tongue weight limit you can't safely tow that much.
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Old 09-15-2013, 08:31 AM   #18
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McKenna, you can still have your dream. Just be cautiously selective about which trailer you choose. As mentioned, a Scamp 13 has a lighter hitch weight than a Casita 13, and a no-bath 13 also has a lighter hitch weight than a front bath 13.

Thomas, truth and reality can be frightening sometimes. Better to face the truth and reality early in the process, though. At least no one came on here and simply posted, "no!" as the answer. Really the better answer is a qualified "maybe, it depends".
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Old 09-15-2013, 08:53 AM   #19
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................... Really the better answer is a qualified "maybe, it depends".
Of course, but it is much easier to tell people that they need to just buy a much bigger tow vehicle rather than to optimize an existing vehicle. As long as the individual axle and combined vehicle ratings are adhered to, there is no reason that a vehicle designed as a soccer mom shuttle can't be upgraded to tow safely.

I spent a whole career as an automotive engineer and I know how the sausage is made. Someone complains about a harsh ride and the choice is to make the rear springs extra soft to please the 95% who do not tow, at the expense of the 5% who do tow. That is how you end up with a 200 pound tongue weight limit. Sure they could offer a rear spring upgrade, but that would cost money to please relatively few. Thus, it is up to the owner to optimize towing performance or buy a pickup truck, where competitive forces drive towing optimization by the manufacturers.
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Old 09-15-2013, 09:27 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by McKenna Lynn View Post
After looking at the list, it seems my Outback can't tow practically a thing. And once loaded tongue weight would be well over the max of 200 for the Outback. I was very ignorant buying the Subaru, thinking I was getting a hefty vehicle. I really wanted an Escape 15', Casita, or Scamp, but doesn't look like it will work once loaded with gear. Thanks......
My Scamp 13' weighs about 1500 lbs on the axle and 165 lbs tongue weight. For a grand total of 1665 lbs. However that's without A/C, shower, and toilet.

It was weighed on the way out on a camping trip so it was loaded for camping.

FYI I believe that most of Fredrick's list is fully loaded trailers.
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Old 09-15-2013, 09:57 AM   #21
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I looked at tongue weights in Fredrick's post trailer-weights-in-the-real-world
Something to keep in mind when using that list is the type of scale used to get those tongue weights. If I remember correctly, the scale only reads in 20 pound increments, and so a measured weight of 200 pounds could be listed as 180 pounds or 220 pounds. In addition, the scale error would need to be added to those values. Most scales have the best accuracy when measuring values closer to the midrange of the scale capability. Measuring 200 pounds with a scale designed to measure 5000 or 10000 pounds of may introduce a significant error as a percentage of the weight being measured.
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Old 09-15-2013, 10:14 AM   #22
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Something to keep in mind when using that list is the type of scale used to get those tongue weights. If I remember correctly, the scale only reads in 20 pound increments, and so a measured weight of 200 pounds could be listed as 180 pounds or 220 pounds. In addition, the scale error would need to be added to those values. Most scales have the best accuracy when measuring values closer to the midrange of the scale capability. Measuring 200 pounds with a scale designed to measure 5000 or 10000 pounds of may introduce a significant error as a percentage of the weight being measured.
One also has to take into account that the weight of the tongue and the weight of the trailer will vary during any camping trip. Propane will be use can make almost a 20 lb difference in tongue weight. Canned food will be consumed and water used. 20 lb increments is close enough.
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Old 09-15-2013, 10:20 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by Andy B View Post
Something to keep in mind when using that list is the type of scale used to get those tongue weights. If I remember correctly, the scale only reads in 20 pound increments, and so a measured weight of 200 pounds could be listed as 180 pounds or 220 pounds. In addition, the scale error would need to be added to those values. Most scales have the best accuracy when measuring values closer to the midrange of the scale capability. Measuring 200 pounds with a scale designed to measure 5000 or 10000 pounds of may introduce a significant error as a percentage of the weight being measured.

FYI... 20 lb increments would be 10 lbs NOT 20 lbs.
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Old 09-15-2013, 10:45 AM   #24
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FYI... 20 lb increments would be 10 lbs NOT 20 lbs.
The following quote from trailer weights in the real world, post #201

"Since my wheel-weighers display weight in 20 pound increments, "Tolerance" is +/- 20 pounds, making the margin of error 40 pounds."

Variability of propane and water weight will occur regardless of the accuracy of the measurement. The point I was trying to make is that if someone is worried about 220 pounds vs 200 pounds then the tongue weight values in the list should be considered very rough estimations.
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Old 09-15-2013, 11:03 AM   #25
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Amen. Some here get their kicks out of scaring people, rather than guiding them in a direction that is both functional and safe. Any idiot can horse around a little camper with a big pickup.

It's a sad day when a 3450 pound vehicle can't tow a 1500 pound camper.
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I subscribe to the thought that a lot of people, even if they are not Dx'ed as "Idiots" per the DSM-IV (or whatever is current) , can't safely drive a large pick-up anyway... period. Much less one that is towing anything....

For the most part, vehicle manufacturers see the "Small" towable RV market (meaning us) as a very small niche market, and the market share that wants that comfortable ride and high MPG's, is who they cater to, we are just peons in the bigger picture.

Hardly any self respecting mid 40's family guy, who goes to the desert or river every weekend with his toys would get caught dead with a compact anything parked in his driveway. After all, wouldn't the guys he watches Sunday football with start to question his masculinity it he didn't have something big?????

Go to any RV show, 95% of whats being shown as a towable RV can't be towed with anything less than that big truck. Our 17' Coleman Hybred, CT-171, is called a "Lightweight" @ over 4000 lbs. Of the 7 available vehicles, it can only be pulled with the GMC Denali (Suburban) the family is keeping for just that use.

Bottom line: Most of us are well over 50 and/or retired and we just really don't count anymore.
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Old 09-15-2013, 12:44 PM   #26
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It's a sad day when a 3450 pound vehicle can't tow a 1500 pound camper.
Quote of the day TG!

......and add salt to the wound. A smaller, lighter, Hyundia Elantra 4cyl, economy sedan has a 3,000lb tow rating. Jesh!
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Old 09-15-2013, 12:49 PM   #27
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Market Share

Bottom line: Most of us are well over 50 and/or retired and we just really don't count anymore.[/QUOTE]
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I receive a P.M. that pointed out that we are a big market share in certain markets, some of them being:

Walk-in bath tubs
Burial Insurance
Medi-Gap Insurance & medical supplies
Stair Climbers
Certain medications (think Blue Pills)
Retirement communities
Anything to do with being irregular, having to pee, or not being able to pee.
Certain on-line dating services
and most television ads that play between about 3:30 am and 6:00 am

But still not a biggie in the automotice market as Lincoln, now trying to reinvent themselves, learned the hard way.

Don't Ya just love how these threads always stay on topic ?????
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Old 09-15-2013, 12:54 PM   #28
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Towing with Outback 3.6

Ok...now I am considering an Escape 15 ft/bath (195 tongue/ 1750 dry) vs. Scamp 13 ft w/ front bath (160 tongue/1600 dry). Outback rated 200 tongue and 3000 dry. Could I do these if I packed light and didn't carry water on the road? I am assuming the Escape is nicer, And pricier. But would be pushing the limit before the Scamp. I am new to this and not an experienced at towing.
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