Sway bar and electric brakes needed on 13’ Scamp? - Fiberglass RV
Journey with Confidence RV GPS App RV Trip Planner RV LIFE Campground Reviews RV Maintenance Take a Speed Test Free 7 Day Trial ×


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 04-07-2018, 11:39 AM   #1
Senior Member
 
Hopper's Avatar
 
Name: carla
Trailer: Scamp
Indiana
Posts: 122
Sway bar and electric brakes needed on 13’ Scamp?

I have a 13’Scamp being towed with a Honda H-Rv 4 cyl. AWD. I am going to Utah NP, will I need sway bar & electric brakes? Or just a sway bar?
Right now it has nothing.
Hopper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2018, 11:51 AM   #2
Senior Member
 
John in Michigan's Avatar
 
Name: John
Trailer: 1979 Boler 1700
Michigan
Posts: 2,048
Registry
brakes for sure and keep the tongue weight 10-15% of total trailer weight to minimize swaying
John in Michigan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2018, 12:03 PM   #3
Senior Member
 
John in Michigan's Avatar
 
Name: John
Trailer: 1979 Boler 1700
Michigan
Posts: 2,048
Registry
Also all the usual precautions:

- check your trailer weight and tongue weight
- check your vehicle has sufficient tow weight capacity and tongue weight capacity for the trailer
John in Michigan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2018, 02:06 PM   #4
Senior Member
 
Jon in AZ's Avatar
 
Name: Jon
Trailer: 2008 Scamp 13 S1
Arizona
Posts: 11,912
Registry
See my full reply in your other thread. The Honda HR-V is not rated to tow a trailer. Nothing.

Perhaps a moderator could merge the two threads.
Jon in AZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2018, 06:37 AM   #5
Senior Member
 
Name: bob
Trailer: Was A-Liner now 13f Scamp
Missouri
Posts: 3,209
towing

I think hopper needs an advisor such as a good mechanic to guide her in her towing practice and her tug selection!

bob
k0wtz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2018, 09:05 AM   #6
Senior Member
 
Name: Tony
Trailer: Boler
BC
Posts: 198
Good advice Bob, there are too many variables to deal with in this sort of forum.
If you are a neophyte with trailer towing, and or have a marginal tow vehicle, having anti sway and trailer brakes will help.
The most common thing that drivers do poorly is oversteer, your hands on the wheel should not be waving around like they are holding flags, they need to be steady.
The use of trailer brakes is a learned skill, they need to be set up properly for the load and terrain, and the controller needs to be at hand for manual application.
My latest tow vehicle came with a controller that is almost impossible to reach, and not useable in panic situations.
Hope this helps.
Tony.
__________________
We're lost but we're making good time.
Eggcentric is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2018, 09:52 AM   #7
Senior Member
 
Hopper's Avatar
 
Name: carla
Trailer: Scamp
Indiana
Posts: 122
All info from those of you on here with experience, speaks volumes to those of us with less experience.
Hopper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2018, 10:02 AM   #8
Senior Member
 
Name: bill
Trailer: 2013 Escape 19
The Mountains of North Carolina
Posts: 4,136
Registry
As mentioned on the other thread, the HRV is a Honda Fit based SUV. It’s not meant for towing.

Towing can work until the moment it doesn’t work. At that point the white knuckle experience will be enough. Hopefully it doesn’t involve a crash.

I had such an experience with my first trailer. When I got home, I parked the trailer and didn’t tow again until I had a capable tow vehicle. As much as people struggle going up a big hill, it’s going DOWN the other side of that big hill that scares me. Having a trailer pushing you down the hill, not being able to slow it down, all can get scary. Applying just trailer brakes can act like tossing out an anchor, ending sway.
thrifty bill is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2018, 01:37 PM   #9
Senior Member
 
Hopper's Avatar
 
Name: carla
Trailer: Scamp
Indiana
Posts: 122
Got it!
Hopper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2018, 02:02 PM   #10
Senior Member
 
Name: bob
Trailer: Was A-Liner now 13f Scamp
Missouri
Posts: 3,209
not trying to hurt anyones feelings

Carla I have done some dumb things like buying a huge Suzuki cavalcade motorcycle and I didn't even have a license for a m/c. or ever been on such a machine!

I bought a 1968 converted eagle bus it weighed out at 26000lbs I had never driven anything this big and I knew nothing about double clutching a transmission.

I went clear to south Carolina to get that thing! i knew nothing about air brakes either!

learning to d/clutch keep you speed in reason slowing down made for a very scary weekend with that thing. i really never got good with it and after i had my heart surgery i got out of that game i didn't want to hurt someone.

we want to keep you safe and for you to avoid mistakes. above all don't listen to a car salesman he could care less about you and your money! i am sure there are a ton of people here concerned about you.

bob
k0wtz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2018, 02:04 PM   #11
Senior Member
 
Name: bob
Trailer: Was A-Liner now 13f Scamp
Missouri
Posts: 3,209
bill one thing i remember from bus groups was whatever gear you went up the hill was the one you went down the hill. keep that in the correct gear going down you will be ok but don't dare shift up you will get in trouble every time!




this has helped me many times.


bob
k0wtz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2018, 02:22 PM   #12
Senior Member
 
Hopper's Avatar
 
Name: carla
Trailer: Scamp
Indiana
Posts: 122
Thank you Bob !
Hopper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2018, 02:41 PM   #13
Senior Member
 
Trailer: Scamp 16 ft Side Dinette
Posts: 1,279
NO!
You should NOT need either, if you know how to drive.
Wayne Collins is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2018, 04:39 PM   #14
Senior Member
 
Hopper's Avatar
 
Name: carla
Trailer: Scamp
Indiana
Posts: 122
I am getting a lot of mixed feed back on my car & Scamp...It is interesting to me that there appears to be so many mixed opinions.
Hopper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2018, 04:44 PM   #15
Senior Member
 
Glenn Baglo's Avatar
 
Trailer: Escape 17 ft
Posts: 8,317
There is one opinion that counts and it's in your vehicle's instruction manual, as noted in previous posts. I would ignore posts that tell you to ignore the manual.
__________________
What happens to the hole when the cheese is gone?
- Bertolt Brecht
Glenn Baglo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2018, 10:21 PM   #16
Senior Member
 
John in Santa Cruz's Avatar
 
Name: John
Trailer: Escape 21, behind an '02 F250 7.3 diesel tug
Mid Left Coast
Posts: 2,937
lets look at it another way.

yes, you can probably add a tow hitch, and yes, you probably can physically tow a 2000 lb trailer some distance.

BUT, if you tow it any significant distance, your CVT transmission will fail prematurely, and the fact that you're towing when the owners manual says NO, the warranty will undoubtably be void.

and if you are in any sort of accident involving the trailer, the insurance companies on both sides will probably decline any claims as your vehicle is deemed not suitable for towing.


on another note. Honda says the curb weight is 2900 to 3100 lbs depending on trim and 2WD vs AWD. and the GVWR is 4000 lbs (2wd) or 4100 lbs (AWD). so that means your effective total payload is 1000 lbs. your trailer tongue weight should be counted as double towards this, because its hanging off behind the rear axle. So, an optimally balanced 2000 lb trailer will have a 200 lb tongue weight, but its not hard to end up with 300 lbs ...subtracting 600 lbs from your 1000 payload will only leave 400 lbs for passengers and cargo. my wife and I would exceed that by ourselves.
John in Santa Cruz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2018, 10:58 PM   #17
Senior Member
 
Glenn Baglo's Avatar
 
Trailer: Escape 17 ft
Posts: 8,317
My RAV4 is rated to tow 3,500 lbs.
The hitch I had installed in order to use a weight distribution hitch is rated much higher, but I'm still limited to 3,500 lbs. The weak link in the chain.
Attached Thumbnails
WDHitch capacity.jpg  
__________________
What happens to the hole when the cheese is gone?
- Bertolt Brecht
Glenn Baglo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2018, 12:12 AM   #18
Senior Member
 
Raspy's Avatar
 
Name: John
Trailer: Roamer 1
Smith Valley, Nevada
Posts: 2,879
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wayne Collins View Post
NO!
You should NOT need either, if you know how to drive.
I'm sure she already knows how to drive. The question she asked was about trailer brakes and a sway bar.

Suggesting she does not need brakes, when she might be towing with a very light vehicle in conditions that you have no knowledge of, is irresponsible.

There is no way you can predict what long downgrade she might might find herslf on or what traffic problem she might find around a blind corner during a rainstorm. These have NOTHING to do with knowing how to drive.

In fact, knowing how to drive, while towing, means being prepared for the unexpected and having an adequate tow vehicle.

I suggest that anyone encouraging her to go ahead with a severely underrated tow vehicle should volunteer to help cover the cost of any accident that results. It's just far too easy to encourage others, that you don't know, to go ahead with unsafe practices. The question is, why do that?

Please review thrifty bills's excellent post.
__________________
I only exaggerate enough to compensate for being taken with a grain of salt.
Raspy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2018, 05:50 AM   #19
Senior Member
 
Jon in AZ's Avatar
 
Name: Jon
Trailer: 2008 Scamp 13 S1
Arizona
Posts: 11,912
Registry
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hopper View Post
I have a 13’Scamp being towed with a Honda H-Rv 4 cyl. AWD. I am going to Utah NP, will I need sway bar & electric brakes? Or just a sway bar?
Right now it has nothing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hopper View Post
Yes, I now have a group that is assisting me. I will fill everyone in on my final plan. Thank you
For your advise. Lots of variables to consider. I am going with a Grand Cherokee as tow vehicle. That rules out some of the variables. I am meeting with my RV repair guy tomorrow to see if we can do the electric brakes on the axel that is on. I will proceed forward from there.
Carla, I think you have made a wise decision to go with the larger tow vehicle. Do review the towing information in its owner's manual for any special information and warnings. Since that all-important issue is now addressed, I will turn to the original question regarding brakes and a sway bar.

I would advise yes to both, with trailer brakes being far and away the more important of the two. While you could probably get away without brakes (assuming a larger tow vehicle like the GC and a small trailer like a 13' Scamp), reasons for brakes include (1) the GC owner's manual likely says you should have them over a certain trailer weight (typically 1000 pounds, which your Scamp will exceed), (2) they will decrease stopping distances in an emergency, (3) they will give you more control descending hills (lots of those out here, along with mountains and canyons), (4) they will help keep trailer and vehicle in a straight line in a panic stop, especially on a slippery surface, (5) they will reduce wear on the vehicle's brakes (brake jobs are expensive!), and (6) applying trailer brakes alone using the controller is the most effective way of stopping trailer sway should it occur. Glad to hear you are already looking into the brakes.

The sway bar is not as important, but it is inexpensive, so I feel it's worth the small extra investment and trouble. It is not a substitute for a properly hitched and loaded trailer (level with 10-15% tongue weight), which should not tend to sway under a wide range of normal driving conditions. What it does is give you an extra measure of safety in an usual situation, like an emergency lane change or a sudden gust of wind from the side as you come out of a road cut. Once your trailer is fully prepped and loaded for the trip, I would recommend testing it first with the sway bar removed, to make sure your set-up is stable, then hook it up.

The best safety device you have, though, is as Wayne suggests: you, the driver, applying good, conservative, defensive driving skills. Think ahead, keep your speed down (no more than 65 mph pulling a trailer; some states are even lower), maintain extra following distance, keep two steady hands on the wheel (no jerky steering corrections), check mirrors often and stay aware of traffic around you, use lower gears on hills (both up and down), check equipment regularly (hitch, tire pressure, lug nuts)...

I know forums like this can be confusing and contentious. You seem to be doing a good job of sorting through all the rhetoric and making wise choices. Best wishes pulling your Utah road trip together! Make reservations early- national parks in Utah can get pretty crowded.
Jon in AZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2018, 06:39 AM   #20
Senior Member
 
Name: Gordon
Trailer: 2015 Scamp (16 Std Layout 4) with '15 Toyota Sienna LE Tug
North Carolina
Posts: 5,155
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon in AZ View Post
...(6) applying trailer brakes alone using the controller is the most effective way of controlling trailer sway should it occur....
Most effective? Perhaps.. but surly not the BEST way. Too much trailer braking at highway speed can be worse than a little sway. IHMO the best way for all but the most experienced drivers to control sway is to let up on the gas pedal while keeping both hands on the wheel. (Do not use tug brakes of course). Its the best method in part because it takes some practice and a light touch on the manual trailer brake control to effectively use it to control unexpected sway, and it has to be done quickly while the driver is also dealing with many other things going on. Computerized sway control that automatically applies trailer brakes without driver intervention is the exception.

My concern is that a driver who has never used or practiced using the trailer brakes to control sway may apply to much braking and make a bad situation quickly worse, when all they needed to do was slow down a little. If one thinks that can effectively use the trailer brakes to control sway then they probably think so because they have the experience, so this does not apply to them. I have tried using the trailer brakes alone and it will not be the thing I do when things first start to feel unstable.
gordon2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
brakes, scamp


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Are Electric Brakes Needed for Scamp 13? Oski Towing, Hitching, Axles and Running Gear 53 08-08-2018 07:33 AM
Wanted Weight Distributing Hitch and Sway Bar with adjustable ball mou Rick A Classified Archives 1 11-29-2006 11:28 AM
Trailer Brakes And Sway Bar davefryg Problem Solving | Owners Helping Owners 29 11-02-2006 09:59 PM

» Upcoming Events
No events scheduled in
the next 465 days.
» Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 08:35 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.