Swaying Scamp

[floyd]

"other than slowing down"


.................................................. .................................................. ...


So, what if slowing down is the correct answer?

Often it is speed and driving habits which cause problems.


What year is your truck?
Perhaps you need to look at the settings for electronic vectoring and sway control along with increasing the truck's tire pressure when towing.
How much stuff do you carry in the truck box?

Check your shocks to see if they are dry.

[floyd]

About the video...

Kudos to the driver of the truck which pulled over to check on the occupants of the rolled over vehicle.
Strange that it was an empty open trailer, maybe the hitch ball was too high.

[Raspy]

Ken,

The trailer in that video had WAY too much rear overhang and may have been carrying something like long metal roofing panels. Look closely at the distance from the wheels to the hitch, compared to the wheels to the rear end.

Putting taller tires on will slightly lower the front of the trailer, but it will slightly raise the trailer, which is not good. Wear patterns that show under inflation are a good clue. Under inflated tires can definitely contribute to sway.

The "rule" of 10-15% tongue weight must be applied to specific trailers, and not as a general rule for everybody. For instance, my trailer has about 7% tongue weight, as listed by the factory, and it is perfectly stable. A longer tongue, for instance, reduces tongue weight, but increases stability. So just use common sense. No motorcycles, generators, or cargo boxes on the trailer's rear bumper. Place heavy items forward. Use a sway control device on trailers that are known to be unstable, etc. And make sure your tow vehicle has heavy duty tires that are inflated properly. Use a short stinger.

Some sway is normal and not a problem, such as when a truck passes going the other way. it's when the trailer will not settle down, or becomes more unstable on it's own, that something must be done. And always be ready to apply the trailer brakes manually. That will fix the problem in an emergency, if applied in time. Practice that maneuver and get good at it. The crash in that video could have been prevented if the driver applied the trailer brakes manually before things got serious.

I clipped out a view of that trailer crash to show the rear overhang.

[AC0GV]

Originally Posted by thrifty bill

My recommendation remains the same. Get real data at the nearest public scale. Only then will you know where you are at as far as total trailer weight and tongue weight..

My 16' deluxe as built.

[Ken Morton]

The tires were worn on both edges, as if they had been running under-inflated, but I checked the pressure regularly.

[dheffernen]

Hello Ken,

Your discussion caught my eye because I too have a 16 foot scamp trailer deluxe I purchased in 2016, so it’s about three years old. And guess what, I had the exact same problem for over a year. And like you it did not go away with a sway bar or emptying the water tanks. I finally solved the issue, and it boiled down to tire pressure and tire ratings. I know the trailer axle is rated at 3500 pounds, but the tires were not. They were rated 1360 pounds each, for a total of 2720 pounds. I’ve since sold the original tires and purchased new ones that are rated for the axle capacity. I followed up by increasing the tire pressure by about 10 pounds. I did this because my tires were also wearing on both outside edges. The new tires have a stronger sidewall and with the higher pressure, the trailer now toes without an issue at freeway speed. I hope this information is helpful!

On another note, I discussed the problem with Scamp numerous times. After being into it for More than a year, I found out from Scamp that they had changed from the tire they put on my Scamp to a class D weight rating tire for all new 16 foot scamps. And because of that, I actually got Scamp to pay for my new tires. Because, they obviously know/knew there was something wrong/inadequate with the tires they were putting on the 16 foot scamps back in 2016.

So in conclusion, now I not only enjoy my Scamp trailer when camped, but I also feel safe towing it around!

[Ken Morton]

Hi Dan,
Our pickup and trailer are stored in another state for the winter, so I can't check on anything right now. The truck and trailer both now have larger tires than original. I have always watched pressure on all 6 tires carefully. As well as weighing the trailer and re-weighing the tongue in the spring, I will see if the tires can be inflated to higher pressure than recommended by Scamp. I really do think the Scamp is designed for lower speeds, but driving 55 when everyone else is doing 75 isn't especially safe either! Thanks.

[AC0GV]

Originally Posted by Ken Morton

I really do think the Scamp is designed for lower speeds, but driving 55 when everyone else is doing 75 isn't especially safe either! Thanks.

My 2017 Scamp 16' came with 60 MPH tires.

[Glenn Baglo]

Originally Posted by AC0GV

My 2017 Scamp 16' came with 60 MPH tires.

I'd replace them with Carlisle Radial Trail. All speed rated 81 MPH.

[Ken Morton]

I don't know offhand what speed my original tires were rated for, but 60 mph is unrealistic for modern traffic.

[Jon in AZ]

A lot of trailer tires are rated for 65 mph. I’ve never seen one with a 60 mph rating, but it could be some off-brand. Ratings are for sustained driving, so no harm in a brief run up to 70 mph to pass.

Still the newer models with 81 mph ratings seem like a good thing to me. It’s not that I would ever tow a trailer at a sustained speed anywhere near 80 mph, but margin is a good thing.

[Jon in AZ]

Originally Posted by Glenn Baglo

I'd replace them with Carlisle Radial Trail. All speed rated 81 MPH.

The other important thing is the load rating. A Scamp 16 should have D-rated tires, not C-rated. Carlisle is one of the only companies that makes a D-rated ST tire in a a 13” size.

[Glenn Baglo]

Originally Posted by Jon in AZ

The other important thing is the load rating. A Scamp 16 should have D-rated tires, not C-rated. Carlisle is one of the only companies that makes a D-rated ST tire in a a 13” size.

Why would a Scamp need D rated tires? My Escape 17B came with C rated tires. I replaced them with D rated tires and later questioned my decision. The rating ( as I understand it ) is determined by the amount of weight the tire can support and C rated did what was required.
As I understand it, the D rated tire, inflated as recommended, would result in a harsher ride for the trailer.
I also have read that you don't need to inflate the tire to its 65 psi max, which would compensate to some degree.

[Jon in AZ]

Glenn, the difference might be the size. 13” C-rated tires are rated for 1360#, giving a combined axle rating of 2720#. Typical Scamp 16’s run 2500-2600#, and some heavily optioned deluxe models approach 3000#. That puts axle weights in the 2300-2700# range. Not a lot of margin, especially as side dinette layouts are notorious for running heavy on the curb side. Tires are the one place you do want a healthy margin IMO. Scamp now supplies D-rated tires on all new 16’ers.

[thrifty bill]

Originally Posted by Glenn Baglo

I'd replace them with Carlisle Radial Trail. All speed rated 81 MPH.

+100 I put these tires on both my Trillium in 14 inch size and my Escape in 15 inch size.

The stock Carlisles lasted over 60,000 miles on my Escape and still looked good. So good in fact that the tire shop asked to keep them as spares. I replaced them before a trip to AK. I didn't want to have to deal with tire replacement on the trip.

FWIW: I bought all of my Carlisle tires at Walmart dot com. I paid anywhere from $49 to $53 per tire.

I've never towed at 80 MPH. But keeping up with even the slow lane traffic on the highway can mean sustained 70 MPH.

[redbarron55]

I have to agree with the tire replacement with a D rated 81 mph tire.
I replaced my Loadmaster Chinese tires (bias ply) with Carlisle 205r14s during our last trip and moved the tire pressures up.
The towing was OK before, but better with the new Carlisle radial tires and higher pressures.
The mileage was better as well.