Tires

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by Francesca Knowles

In my view it's important to understand the basic differences in form/function of such special purpose tires if one's to make a reasonably informed decision, hence the utility of posting links/explanations of such differences.

I agree... I was only commenting on the desire of another member to compare between brands within a tire type.

Originally Posted by Francesca Knowles

After understanding of function is achieved, decisions as to brand are best made according to the recommendations of experienced professionals.

Sure, if those professionals are unbiased. Unfortunately, tire retailers usually carry a limited selection of brands, and will understandably tend to recommend the brands which they carry, or even those which they have in stock or sell most profitably.

Don't you find it strange that the very best tire for your vehicle just happens to be the one sold by The Tire Guy?

[SilverGhost]

Sooooooo, most of you don't trust the people who designed your trailers? Or do the rules you follow for your car and truck get thrown out when applied to the trailer?
[/soap box]

I had some mandatory training on tyres in part because of some wheels coming off cars going down the hiway. This was back when I work for Wally World tyre center. At that time the manufactures the guy represented recommended useful life of tyres is about 6 years. This was directed towards cars and SUVs, but could be applied towards trailers.

So I researched my tyres, weight of my trailer, and decided the trailer's recommended pressure is correct for the load I carry. I will replace them at about 6 years based on the tyre manufactures recommendation. Also I understand the wear caused by under and over inflation, as required of my job.

Interesting side note; look at the tyre label on a pre 2004 VW or Audi. They will list tyre size and inflation pressure based on speed and load. Touaregs continued to have this label for several more years.

Jason

[Francesca Knowles]

I run vehicle-manufacturer recommended tires on everything I own, and that includes the 21st century equivalent of the original tires recommended by my trailer's maker.

And I refuse to shop "tire manufacturer specific", which would include doing business with any tire vendor limited to a single brand. The "tire man" I do business with is Les Schwab, whose golden reputation all over the West can in my opinion be relied upon as a first cut in making tire decisions. Les Schwab sells many brands, but it doesn't sell products whose poor performance is likely to result in a whole bunch of customers having to seek recourse in its very liberal guarantees of satisfaction.

And as the second cut, the excellent training/supervision of their employees and their well-founded advice has been 100% dependable, especially here at the Port Townsend store where I've been buying tires since 1980.

Francesca

[floyd]

Originally Posted by Francesca Knowles

I run vehicle-manufacturer recommended tires on everything I own, and that includes the 21st century equivalent of the original tires recommended by my trailer's maker.

And I refuse to shop "tire manufacturer specific", which would include doing business with any tire vendor limited to a single brand. The "tire man" I do business with is Les Schwab, whose golden reputation all over the West can in my opinion be relied upon as a first cut in making tire decisions. Les Schwab sells many brands, but it doesn't sell products whose poor performance is likely to result in a whole bunch of customers having to seek recourse in its very liberal guarantees of satisfaction.

And as the second cut, the excellent training/supervision of their employees and their well-founded advice has been 100% dependable, especially here at the Port Townsend store where I've been buying tires since 1980.

Francesca

OEM tires are generally an adequate and safe option.
However...I NEVER run vehicle-manufacturer recommended replacement tires on anything I own. I shop all available options and choose from what will work best for my use.
In fact... my present truck and car each got replacement tires on the day they were purchased new.
This is not so much a safety issue as it is a performance issue.
On my Scamp for example I chose to replace the demonstrably adequate "B" rated Marathons with "C" rated Carlisle radials just for the added margin of capacity and longevity.

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by SilverGhost

Sooooooo, most of you don't trust the people who designed your trailers? Or do the rules you follow for your car and truck get thrown out when applied to the trailer?
[/soap box]

The people who designed my trailer are long gone. Their companies failed, or moved on to other lines of business.

My trailer's manufacturer did not say to inflate the tires to their maximum, although the 32 psi which they specified for the F78-14 tires (which they incorrectly showed as "F-78 x 14") may have been the maximum for those tires, and would be about the pressure required to handle the trailer's weight. I would not go below that recommendation with those tires, as I would not go below Toyota's recommendation for my Sienna's tires... no difference.

Although a great deal of good work and even innovation go into the design of our trailers, it is almost all related to the coach and not the chassis. The suspensions, brakes, wheels, tires, and couplers (everything that forms the running chassis other than the simple frame which connects them) are commodity parts which the trailer manufacturers use with little design effort. The trailer manufacturers need not be any more knowledgeable about tires than a kid working in a tire store with one day of training in looking up specs; they are in an entirely different league from that of even the least capable automotive manufacturer.

[Hambone]

I also usually upgrade if i can from manufacturer recommendations, whether in size/width even (god forbid) air pressure. also upgraded Scamp to 14 in radials

[Francesca Knowles]

Originally Posted by Brian B-P

If there is something to be known about tires of any kind, for any application, it is likely that Michelin knows it... and there is a good chance that they invented it. If I must blindly believe either Carlisle or Michelin based only on the source, I would certainly go with Michelin.

I thought you'd be interested to read that despite its business decision not to make trailer tires for smaller vehicles, Michelin does indeed subscribe to the notion that trailer tires are different in function and design.

You'll find their brief description of a trailer tire's form/function at this link. It's remarkably similar to Carlisle's, by the way...but since Michelin's said it now I s'pose we can all accept it as a fact.

Whew!

Francesca

[carlkeigley]

I just received the June/2013 issue of Trailer Life magazine.
There is an article on trailer tires on page 50. I tried to find
the online issue to link but haven't found it yet.

Here is an article I did find on one of their links.
===============================
Q: I have a tire question that I’ve had about six different answers on from RV dealers. We have a fifth-wheel trailer with a dry weight of 7,794 pounds and its tires came filled with nitrogen gas. The tire size is ST225/75R15 with a 65-psi-cold tire pressure printed on the tire. I have two questions: Can I mix the gas with air? (There is no one in the area who carries the gas.) How much air/gas pressure should I keep in the tires? (I had work done on it at a large RV service center and it now has 52 psi in all tires; previously, it had 62 psi.)
David Miller, Anchorage, Alaska

A: It doesn’t matter whether there is nitrogen or air in the tires; use the same pressure regardless. You can mix them as well, although the straight air will dilute the claimed advantages of using nitrogen. You may be able to find nitrogen at a local welding or industrial gas supplier if your local tire shops don’t have it available. In order to determine what pressure to use in the tires, you need to weigh the fully loaded trailer (both axles) and divide the weight by the number of tires. Then look this weight up in a load-inflation table, which is available on tire dealers’ and manufacturers’ websites. Until you know how much weight is actually on the tires, to be safe, you should run the pressure that is listed on the sidewalls.
— Ken Freund

Another Tire Question

[Daniel A.]

You will do better using nitrogen it is more stable than air.

Heat is a killer for any tire and pressure changes except with nitrogen.

[Jared J]

Air is 78% nitrogen, anyway. Pressure most certain does change with nitrogen and heat. The difference is so small between nitrogen and air, it's not worth mentioning on a camper or normal car. I ran it racing, and even with tires so hot you could hardly touch them, the best it did over air was 7 psi less.



Might as well fill them with helium, you can tow a heavier trailer then.

[carlkeigley]

I run nitrogen in my new car.
I doubt I will run it when I have to buy new tires.
My garage charges $60 for nitrogen fill.

[Daniel A.]

Originally Posted by Jared J

Air is 78% nitrogen, anyway. Pressure most certain does change with nitrogen and heat. The difference is so small between nitrogen and air, it's not worth mentioning on a camper or normal car. I ran it racing, and even with tires so hot you could hardly touch them, the best it did over air was 7 psi less.



Might as well fill them with helium, you can tow a heavier trailer then.

I disagree with your view nitrogen is far more stable than air.

[Glenn Baglo]

Originally Posted by Daniel A.

I disagree with your view nitrogen is far more stable than air.

I'm going to invest in nitrogen futures.

[Jared J]

Originally Posted by Daniel A.

I disagree with your view nitrogen is far more stable than air.

I didn't say it wasn't more stable, did I? I said it did no good worth measuring on a plain car or trailer. I'll stand by that. If it makes a 7 psi difference in tires so hot you can't touch, it's not doing a thing on a trailer tire. Well, maybe if you towed at 150, or your camper did wicked burnouts.

[SilverGhost]

The main advantage of NitroFill for tyres is the removal of moisture and oxygen. The oxygen likes very much to react with eveything it touchs - hence oxidation (rust). The moisture will expand and contract much more with temperature, especially if it changes state (vapor, liquid, solid) and will help along oxygen's work.

But, if you have a decent air drier on your air compressor the difference between with or without nitrogen is small. Definitely not worth paying extra for, but I'll take if if it's free.

Jason

[carlkeigley]

Originally Posted by SilverGhost

The main advantage of NitroFill for tyres is the removal of moisture and oxygen. The oxygen likes very much to react with eveything it touchs - hence oxidation (rust). The moisture will expand and contract much more with temperature, especially if it changes state (vapor, liquid, solid) and will help along oxygen's work.

But, if you have a decent air drier on your air compressor the difference between with or without nitrogen is small. Definitely not worth paying extra for, but I'll take if if it's free.

Jason

Ditto

[carlkeigley]

338 wheeler................how'd you like to replace these?

https://sites.google.com/site/linkfo...ws/338-wheeler

[floyd]

Originally Posted by Daniel A.

You will do better using nitrogen it is more stable than air.

Heat is a killer for any tire and pressure changes except with nitrogen.

The whole myth about nitrogen advantage started in days of yore at the race track. Portable air compressors condense water which gets into the tires.Water affects tire performance and destabilizes tire pressure at track speeds. Racers started bringing nitrogen because it is dry in the tank. Dry air performs better.
Whole air from a stable source with an air dryer works just as well as nitrogen alone. For those who disagree, I suggest that you continue to pay for nitrogen. Heck, some places charge for air anyway and besides, those little green caps display your dedication to good car care.
(and they ARE kinda...Uh...Green!)

I once heard of a guy who sold watered down Kool-Aid at the track with the claim that when the race car was rubbed down with it before a session it would reduce lap times by as much as a couple of seconds. Even after the hoax was exposed some driver's still believed in the stuff and swore by it!

[Darwin Maring]

According to Aircraft manufacturers the reason they inflate their tires with nitrogen is because they run cooler than regular air.

[Byron Kinnaman]

Originally Posted by floyd

The whole myth about nitrogen advantage started in days of yore at the race track. Portable air compressors condense water which gets into the tires.Water affects tire performance and destabilizes tire pressure at track speeds. Racers started bringing nitrogen because it is dry in the tank. Dry air performs better.
Whole air from a stable source with an air dryer works just as well as nitrogen alone. For those who disagree, I suggest that you continue to pay for nitrogen, heck some places charge for air anyway.
I once heard of a guy who sold watered down Kool-Aid with the claim that when the race car was rubbed down with it before a session it would reduce lap times by as much as a couple of seconds. Even after the hoax was exposed some driver's still believed in the stuff and swore by it!

Is this the modern day 100 mpg carburetor?