Towing without overdrive - Page 2 - Fiberglass RV


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Old 05-27-2013, 02:35 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by Thomas G. View Post
Most of the heat generated in an automatic transmission is in the torque converter. Manual transmissions use a clutch, which doesn't generate heat under steady driving, instead of a torque converter.
Hummm if the above is correct how come we see people time and time again telling people they need to get a transmission cooler installed and why do most manufactures include a transmission cooler in the truck towing packages?
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Old 05-27-2013, 02:37 PM   #16
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Jim ; Have you looked at the 2014 Ram 1500 with the ECO 3.0 Ltr turbo charged diesel engine and an 8 speed automatic transmission. 240 HP- 420 lbs of torque- 30 MPG highway If it lives up to the hype in may be the way to go . They have not published the tow ratings but 420 lbs of torque should be able to get any fiberglass trailer up and moving. I would think the mileage while towing would be in the low 20's
Not yet, seems inviting. Mine is 2009 and came with a lifetime power train warranty, hard to pass on.
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Old 05-27-2013, 02:44 PM   #17
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Hummm if the above is correct how come we see people time and time again telling people they need to get a transmission cooler installed and why do most manufactures include a transmission cooler in the truck towing packages?
Because automatics make up about 80% of vehicles produced.
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Old 05-27-2013, 02:50 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by cpaharley2008 View Post
Because automatics make up about 80% of vehicles produced.
Thats true currently but again we still have people here telling people over and over to get a trans cooler and many of the manufactures include them in their towing packages -even on manual shifts.

So my question again is why is that?
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Old 05-27-2013, 02:52 PM   #19
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Economics, easier to include a $35 part than to add later. As far as the advice given here by others re: coolers on standard shift,, we all know if it is on the internet it must be true
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Old 05-27-2013, 03:24 PM   #20
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I believe automatics with tow packages get the extra cooler - I think for standards the extra cooler is deleted. With a standard the clutch is either in or out (unless you're a bad driver and ride it), but with an automatic, there are a number of clutches and friction making devices to do all the automatic shifting. The automatic makes lots of heat through continual friction-induced (slipping) clutches. I've owned standards all my life, and towed some heavy stuff. Once I replaced a clutch/pressure plate because the previous owner rode it all the time, but only once in going on 45 years. I've had automatic transmissions crap out on me twice for no good reason (cars, not tow vehicles)!

For towing, you definitely want a tranny cooler if ya got an auto tranny.

Frank
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Old 05-27-2013, 03:32 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by cpaharley2008 View Post
Economics, easier to include a $35 part than to add later. As far as the advice given here by others re: coolers on standard shift,, we all know if it is on the internet it must be true
yup must be.

thanks Frank I do full understand the situation with automatics as I pull with one .... it was just the blank Must add cooler statement we all to often see here that made me ask.
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Old 05-27-2013, 03:59 PM   #22
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Yup Carol, just about every tow vehicle you see is AT these days. Things have changed a lot since my 1st truck! My next TV will be AT and with much higher tow capability. When I got my Canyon in 2009, we were still camping in tents. A lot.

Gee, how quickly things change as ya get older...

Frank
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Old 05-27-2013, 06:01 PM   #23
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Old 05-27-2013, 06:05 PM   #24
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Old 05-27-2013, 07:06 PM   #25
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Suggest you read the manual for your vehicle to determine if you should tow in overdrive or not. Doesn't much matter what other people do.
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Old 05-27-2013, 07:31 PM   #26
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because it the right and logical thing to do for that type of application, auto trans greatest enemy is heat (Quick death), and at's do not cost 350 dollars to have one rebuilt anymore, guessing more like 3 to 5 thousand dollars. if towing, an auto trans cooler and a heavy duty radiator is like adding the lowest cost insurance you can buy to protect your tranny and engine. this why the auto/truck industry recommends these items.

this is why the fleet/leasing industry recommends both items as well, I used to do car/truck specification building and design according to our clients corporate fleet needs. if we under specified the items they needed, and there were broke down cars/trucks all over the country, we would not be in business today, and our clients down time would destroy corporate profits...etc

you may be able to get more info from NAFA - national association of fleet admimistrators.

manufacturers know more of what we need, for our safe journeys out there on the road, than the majority of the customers do. do some over spec, yes. do many under spec - no,not many - to much liability exposure,
or loss of business and reputation

look I have not been this industry since the early 80's... the industry has come a long way since then, and has been by improving designs and safety concerns. no spell check




Quote:
Originally Posted by Carol H View Post
Thats true currently but again we still have people here telling people over and over to get a trans cooler and many of the manufactures include them in their towing packages -even on manual shifts.

So my question again is why is that?
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Old 05-27-2013, 08:12 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by Glenn Baglo View Post
Suggest you read the manual for your vehicle to determine if you should tow in overdrive or not. Doesn't much matter what other people do.
Glenn,
If everyone followed that doctrine, then half of our posts would not appear.
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Old 05-27-2013, 08:45 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by cpaharley2008 View Post
I drove with the trans mission in normal drive on the way out and checked my mileage at every fillip. I was getting between 10.5-11.5 mpg consistently with the engine cruising around 2400rpm under load and 1800rpm cruising. I used mid range and E-90 gas mid range. There were strong headwinds going out and returning.
My return trip I engaged my "Tow Mode" which locks out the overdrive and changes the shift points. Surprising I averaged 11.5-13.5 mpg on the return trip. Other than Missouri in lieu of Iowa, I went thru the same states. I noticed the rpm stayed at 2200 under load and would occasionally drop back to 1800 while cruising.I also noticed it did not shift into the higher rpm range as often as the trip going.
If the engine speed was the same (1800 rpm) at the same speed, in or out of tow mode, then one of the following must be true:
  1. the transmission was not getting into the overdrive gear in in normal drive mode, or
  2. tow mode doesn't lock out overdrive,
since it was apparently in the same gear in either case.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpaharley2008 View Post
This 200 rpm difference gave me a 20% increase in my mileage, which in my case was about $100 savings.
The 200 rpm difference (between 2400 and 2200) at the same road speed will be in the same gear, without and without the torque converter lockup clutch activated. It is normal for tow modes to more aggressively engage this clutch, epwhich prevents torque converter slip and thus reduces heat generation and fuel consumption. It is normal for an unlocked converter to slip 10% like this, which really is 10% of the fuel burned being wasted. This has nothing to do with overdrive.
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