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08-16-2017, 01:20 PM
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#21
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Senior Member
Name: bill
Trailer: 2013 Escape 19
The Mountains of North Carolina
Posts: 4,137
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacqueline in BC
The 4 passengers are likely to grow in weight, does this mean that we will need to upgrade our truck soon? Which truck would give us the most room to grow? We like the Toyota Tundra crewmax but the payload is only 1240lbs, which is only 190lbs more than the Tacoma! Not the headroom that we are hoping for.
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Yes, that is exactly what it means. Just because someone else does it, does not make it right or appropriate. You know the limit, and you will be over it. Any dealer or personally installed options also deduct from the payload. The payload figure is based on how the truck left the factory. Add a bed liner, running boards, side steps, larger tow mirrors, bed cap, or whatever, and it just gets progressively worse.
Check payload figures carefully! I have an F150, with loads of towing capacity. But the payload limit is relatively low at 1495 pounds. Why? Because my truck is loaded with factory options: heated and air-conditioned seats, six way power seats for driver and front passenger, leather, tailgate step, etc..... In my case I bought my truck used. But the higher you go model wise, the worse it gets. 4WD deducts too! Around here, everyone wants 4WD but they really only need it a couple of days a year. Most don't realize the penalty in towing capability.
A stripped down F150 from the year of my truck (2010) would have a payload rating of over 2000 pounds. Deluxe truck = lower payload.
My truck has a tow rating of 9,800 pounds. There is absolutely NO WAY I could tow a trailer that weight without exceeding my payload limit.
And to go with a tongue weight of 715 pounds, you will need a WDH, which will add additional weight!
Ford's payload limit assumes a full tank of gas, but no driver or passengers (or anything else).
Here in the litigious USA: http://www.hardworkingtrucks.com/imp...-in-lawsuits/#
Hopefully Canada is better in this regard. Still by most definitions, exceeding a stated limit of your TV is negligence. Using the defense of "I read on the internet where someone else was doing it" is not going to fly.
Or this from another site: "When asked about towing liability issues, Dean Holleman, Vice President and Managing Attorney of Boyce Holleman & Associates in Gulfport, Mississippi, says, “Any person who tows a trailer would be responsible to know that the towing vehicle has certain limitations which should not be exceeded.
“If the accident is caused by the vehicle being used to tow something it was not designed to tow, this could be an act of negligence by the driver, and under the theory of negligence that person most probably would be held liable,” Dean says.
He also says that while some vehicle owners may argue the tow ratings and the proper setup of their vehicle isn’t clearly noted or easy to find, he feels “most vehicles do have proper warnings and posting of limitations of towing weight.”
When it comes to negligence or the failure of the driver’s “duty to tow only that which the vehicle is designed to tow,” Dean and other attorneys we spoke with about this issue agree: If there’s an accident and the towing vehicle isn’t properly configured for the trailered weight, the injured person or persons will probably win any ensuing lawsuit."
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08-16-2017, 01:30 PM
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#22
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Senior Member
Name: J Ronald
Trailer: Casita 17 ft. Liberty Deluxe
North Carolina
Posts: 236
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4WD units have a lower load capacity than 2WD units. 4WD hardware weighs 200lb to 400lb which uses up payload. Unless you really need 4WD do not buy it, just more hardware to haul around.
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08-16-2017, 01:55 PM
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#23
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Senior Member
Trailer: 2004 13 ft Scamp Custom Deluxe
Posts: 8,520
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeBreez
While the Chevy and Ford generally have higher capacities, the payloads for all the trucks mentioned vary considerably based on how they are equipped. The crew cab models tend to be toward the bottom of their ranges..
2017 Tundra: 1,440 to 2,080 lbs
2017 F150: 1,621 to 2,329 lbs
2017 Ram: 1,230 to 1,923 lbs
2017 Silverado: 1,740 to 2,020 lbs
Just for comparison, my 2002 V-8 Tundra 2WD extended cab is 1,938 lbs, but the low end of the range for that year is 1,366.
Agreed!
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My 2001 Ford Ranger has a stock payload rating of 1640 lbs, plus aftermarket half leafs, Rancho shocks and upgraded tires.
Even with the improved payload, the box is still only 38"X72"X16" deep with a cover. Accidental overload is not likely!
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08-16-2017, 02:01 PM
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#24
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Senior Member
Trailer: 2004 13 ft Scamp Custom Deluxe
Posts: 8,520
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J Ron
4WD units have a lower load capacity than 2WD units. 4WD hardware weighs 200lb to 400lb which uses up payload. Unless you really need 4WD do not buy it, just more hardware to haul around.
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I'm thinkin' unsprung weight doesn't diminish payload. But you've got it about right even though the extra axle and shaft would make the truck even heavier.
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08-16-2017, 02:30 PM
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#25
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Senior Member
Name: J Ronald
Trailer: Casita 17 ft. Liberty Deluxe
North Carolina
Posts: 236
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Do not know what is unsprung weight or how this does not count as payload. Engine, transmission and all of the drive line has to carry the load. Everything sits on the springs except wheels, tires and axels.
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08-16-2017, 02:37 PM
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#26
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Senior Member
Trailer: 2004 13 ft Scamp Custom Deluxe
Posts: 8,520
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steve dunham
My daughter runs an insurance agency .
When I bought my Casita the insurance company wanted to know the make , length , value , Vin # , the trailers GVWR and what I had for a tow vehicle.
According to what I was told the insurance company uses the GVWR of the trailer to establish if your tow vehicle is adequate.
They don't care how light you pack the GVWR is the GVWR.
They have no intentions of weighing your trailer .
If your trailer has a GVWR of 3500 lbs then you need a vehicle rated to tow 3500 lbs.
The same goes for tongue weight.
You can try fooling yourself but I am not sure you will fool the insurance company or a smart lawyer !!
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That's interesting, My insurance company has never asked any questions about any of the many trailers we have owned, until we wanted comp and collision on our 13D of course. They certainly have never asked what I would tow it with.
Do you have to report to them if you rent or borrow a trailer?
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08-16-2017, 02:42 PM
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#27
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Senior Member
Name: Steve
Trailer: 2018, 21ft escape— 2019 Ram 1500 Laramie
NW Wisconsin
Posts: 4,500
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Quote:
Originally Posted by floyd
That's interesting, My insurance company never asked any questions about any trailer, until we wanted comp and collision on our 13D. They certainly never asked what I would tow it with.
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I have comp and collision on our trailer
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08-16-2017, 02:55 PM
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#28
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Senior Member
Trailer: 2004 13 ft Scamp Custom Deluxe
Posts: 8,520
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J Ron
Do not know what is unsprung weight or how this does not count as payload. Engine, transmission and all of the drive line has to carry the load. Everything sits on the springs except wheels, tires and axels.
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Pretty much... so you do know what unsprung weight is !
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08-16-2017, 05:11 PM
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#29
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Member
Name: Jacqueline
Trailer: Bigfoot
British Columbia
Posts: 31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raz
My 2012 crewcab 4wd Frontier has a cargo capacity of 1268 lbs. Seems odd a Tacoma would be so much less. Any chance this is a 2004 or earlier Tacoma?
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It's actually a 2012 Tacoma. We were under the impression that the truck would have a higher payload until we read the door sticker.
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08-16-2017, 06:02 PM
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#30
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Senior Member
Name: Charles
Trailer: Scamp 16
Ohio
Posts: 295
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I would rather have an extra 400 lbs worth of 4X4 than 10,000 lbs of wrecker pulling me out of a bluegrass festival after a rainstorm
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08-16-2017, 06:19 PM
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#31
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Senior Member
Name: bill
Trailer: 2013 Escape 19
The Mountains of North Carolina
Posts: 4,137
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacqueline in BC
It's actually a 2012 Tacoma. We were under the impression that the truck would have a higher payload until we read the door sticker.
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This is so sad and so true. Some car dealers will say anything, knowing full well there is a sticker on the door that tells all. RV dealers can be even worse. It's buyer beware out there. Many of us, me included, learned the hard way how to pick tow vehicles.
My first RV, a 22 foot fifth wheel, the RV dealer told me my half ton truck would pull it "easy". I ended going up mountain passes at 29 MPH, and stopping at the top of every hill to cool down. Ive paid the tuition in tow vehicle selection.....
I see many people on here in full denial mode on how their TV is plenty good. One bad experience and most of us change our tune. Having extra capacity in reserve is a good thing. Imagine taking another adult couple with you on a trip instead of a couple of children.
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08-16-2017, 08:02 PM
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#32
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Senior Member
Name: Mike
Trailer: Bigfoot
Alberta
Posts: 211
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pay load
Your toyota can pull the bigfoot .payload is the load in the box.Tow rating is what you need on your Toyota it is 6400 lbs . slould be no problem .Happy Trails
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08-16-2017, 08:15 PM
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#33
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Senior Member
Name: Steve
Trailer: 2018, 21ft escape— 2019 Ram 1500 Laramie
NW Wisconsin
Posts: 4,500
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MAP 56
Your toyota can pull the bigfoot .payload is the load in the box.Tow rating is what you need on your Toyota it is 6400 lbs . slould be no problem .Happy Trails
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So when you tow with a Toyota the tongue weight of the trailer mysteriously disappears ?
Sorry but it just ain't so !!
Payload includes weight of driver , passengers , cargo , options
hitch , and tongue weight of trailer .
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08-16-2017, 08:49 PM
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#34
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Senior Member
Name: Mike
Trailer: Bigfoot
Alberta
Posts: 211
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pay load
the bigfoot 17 toung weight is about 230.lbs i know mine is more as i have replaced the 2 20 lbs tanks with 2 30 lbs tanks . what size trailer is it.
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08-16-2017, 09:01 PM
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#35
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Senior Member
Name: Steve
Trailer: 2018, 21ft escape— 2019 Ram 1500 Laramie
NW Wisconsin
Posts: 4,500
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MAP 56
the bigfoot 17 toung weight is about 230.lbs i know mine is more as i have replaced the 2 20 lbs tanks with 2 30 lbs tanks . what size trailer is it.
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If you read the OP's post (Post #1 )
The tongue weight of the OP's trailer = 375 lbs
The OP's hitch weight = 75 lbs
Total weight ( Tongue + Hitch) = 450 lbs
All 450 lbs is payload . Now to that 450 lbs add the weight of 4 passengers , cargo and 2 bikes . There lies the problem.
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08-16-2017, 10:04 PM
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#36
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Senior Member
Trailer: Escape 17 ft
Posts: 8,317
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MAP 56
the bigfoot 17 toung weight is about 230.lbs i know mine is more as i have replaced the 2 20 lbs tanks with 2 30 lbs tanks . what size trailer is it.
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Wow.
The tongue weight of my Escape 17B is 320/340 lbs.
Not sure how you get only 230 lbs. on a Bigfoot.
__________________
What happens to the hole when the cheese is gone?
- Bertolt Brecht
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08-16-2017, 10:14 PM
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#37
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Senior Member
Name: Steve
Trailer: 2018, 21ft escape— 2019 Ram 1500 Laramie
NW Wisconsin
Posts: 4,500
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glenn Baglo
Wow.
The tongue weight of my Escape 17B is 320/340 lbs.
Not sure how you get only 230 lbs. on a Bigfoot.
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Maybe his 2 -- 30 lb propane tanks are full of helium ?
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08-16-2017, 10:28 PM
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#38
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Senior Member
Name: Jack
Trailer: 2015 Casita 17FD
Rapides Parish La.
Posts: 140
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glenn Baglo
Wow.
The tongue weight of my Escape 17B is 320/340 lbs.
Not sure how you get only 230 lbs. on a Bigfoot.
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...probably from the manufactures "skid" sheet.............
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08-16-2017, 10:29 PM
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#39
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Senior Member
Trailer: Escape 17 ft
Posts: 8,317
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I use a Sherline tongue scale.
__________________
What happens to the hole when the cheese is gone?
- Bertolt Brecht
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08-17-2017, 04:11 AM
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#40
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Senior Member
Name: Charles
Trailer: Scamp 16
Ohio
Posts: 295
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I use a Walmart bathroom scale.
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